1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,460 The following content is provided under a Creative 2 00:00:02,460 --> 00:00:03,880 Commons license. 3 00:00:03,880 --> 00:00:06,090 Your support will help MIT OpenCourseWare 4 00:00:06,090 --> 00:00:10,180 continue to offer high quality educational resources for free. 5 00:00:10,180 --> 00:00:12,720 To make a donation or to view additional materials 6 00:00:12,720 --> 00:00:15,210 from hundreds of MIT courses, visit 7 00:00:15,210 --> 00:00:25,210 MIT OpenCourseWare@OCW.MIT.edu 8 00:00:25,210 --> 00:00:28,000 OLIVIER DE WECK: Seven miscellaneous topics, and you 9 00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:30,700 may be wondering, well, what are those? 10 00:00:30,700 --> 00:00:34,720 So I'd like to start with a general status update, 11 00:00:34,720 --> 00:00:36,610 and then we'll go over the master 12 00:00:36,610 --> 00:00:40,390 solution for the online quiz that you took this week. 13 00:00:40,390 --> 00:00:44,050 And then, I think, in about 10 minutes, 14 00:00:44,050 --> 00:00:47,020 we're going to have an interactive discussion 15 00:00:47,020 --> 00:00:50,210 with the INCOSE board of directors. 16 00:00:50,210 --> 00:00:55,300 And so, we'll probably not get through all the master solution 17 00:00:55,300 --> 00:00:57,970 discussion by the time they dial in, and that's OK. 18 00:00:57,970 --> 00:01:01,844 You know, we'll just have a 15, 20 minute chat with them. 19 00:01:01,844 --> 00:01:03,760 The reason we're doing this is because they're 20 00:01:03,760 --> 00:01:05,950 at MIT right now for a three day meeting, 21 00:01:05,950 --> 00:01:08,110 so INCOSE's the International National 22 00:01:08,110 --> 00:01:10,180 Council of System Engineering. 23 00:01:10,180 --> 00:01:12,760 And so we thought it would be a nice thing since, you know, 24 00:01:12,760 --> 00:01:16,090 this is a systems engineering class, to tie in with them 25 00:01:16,090 --> 00:01:18,160 and hear a little bit of their perspective 26 00:01:18,160 --> 00:01:22,270 on what's happening in industry and in, sort of, 27 00:01:22,270 --> 00:01:23,140 the bigger picture. 28 00:01:23,140 --> 00:01:25,690 And hopefully, some of you have got 29 00:01:25,690 --> 00:01:27,760 a couple of questions prepared, so we can have 30 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:29,080 sort of a dialogue with them. 31 00:01:29,080 --> 00:01:31,280 That's the general idea. 32 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:35,400 And then we have a presentation prepared. 33 00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:40,240 The Octanis I project will be presented from EPFL, to us, 34 00:01:40,240 --> 00:01:42,440 and I think you'll find it very exciting. 35 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:45,010 And so, as we listen to that presentation, 36 00:01:45,010 --> 00:01:49,500 put on your system engineering thinking hat, 37 00:01:49,500 --> 00:01:52,090 and then hopefully we'll have time for discussion as well. 38 00:01:52,090 --> 00:01:54,040 Let me just remind you briefly where we 39 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:56,260 stand in terms of the class-- 40 00:01:56,260 --> 00:01:59,030 in the V-Model, in particular. 41 00:01:59,030 --> 00:02:02,260 We made great progress, and we've essentially 42 00:02:02,260 --> 00:02:05,530 covered the whole left side, the bottom. 43 00:02:05,530 --> 00:02:07,780 And what we'll do starting next week, 44 00:02:07,780 --> 00:02:09,789 is really climb up on the right side. 45 00:02:09,789 --> 00:02:12,790 So next week's topic is System Integration 46 00:02:12,790 --> 00:02:14,590 and Interface Management. 47 00:02:14,590 --> 00:02:18,220 Then we'll cover Verification Validation, Commissioning 48 00:02:18,220 --> 00:02:19,250 and Operations. 49 00:02:19,250 --> 00:02:21,085 And then our final official lecture 50 00:02:21,085 --> 00:02:23,050 is Lifecycle Management. 51 00:02:23,050 --> 00:02:28,660 We do have a 12th lecture on Prototyping and Manufacturing. 52 00:02:28,660 --> 00:02:30,760 That window is optional because this 53 00:02:30,760 --> 00:02:34,120 is after the official end of classes at MIT. 54 00:02:34,120 --> 00:02:36,490 So you're not expected to participate, 55 00:02:36,490 --> 00:02:38,860 but you're invited to. 56 00:02:38,860 --> 00:02:41,620 So basically, the focus in the next month or so 57 00:02:41,620 --> 00:02:45,952 is covering the right side of V. 58 00:02:45,952 --> 00:02:49,700 So let me start talking about the midterm exam. 59 00:02:49,700 --> 00:02:52,120 And we'll sort of go question by question, 60 00:02:52,120 --> 00:02:56,580 and please stop me if you have any comments or questions. 61 00:02:56,580 --> 00:02:59,240 Let's make this interactive. 62 00:02:59,240 --> 00:03:03,830 So question one, if a complex electromechanical system has 63 00:03:03,830 --> 00:03:07,810 1,850 individual part numbers-- this is at the lowest level-- 64 00:03:07,810 --> 00:03:11,440 how many levels do you expect the drawing tree to have? 65 00:03:11,440 --> 00:03:14,230 Everybody provided the same answer, four, right? 66 00:03:14,230 --> 00:03:17,170 This is basically a straight application 67 00:03:17,170 --> 00:03:20,230 of the magic number seven rule. 68 00:03:20,230 --> 00:03:27,700 And in practice, not everybody will go exactly 69 00:03:27,700 --> 00:03:31,420 for four levels, but that's the basic idea. 70 00:03:31,420 --> 00:03:34,750 If you decompose the system with this human cognitive bandwidth 71 00:03:34,750 --> 00:03:38,830 in mind, for a system of that level of complexity, 72 00:03:38,830 --> 00:03:42,100 you should expect, roughly, a four layer decomposition. 73 00:03:42,100 --> 00:03:46,630 So I'm very pleased that everybody got this answer. 74 00:03:46,630 --> 00:03:50,830 But with the caveat that there may 75 00:03:50,830 --> 00:03:52,660 be deviations from this rule, and you 76 00:03:52,660 --> 00:03:56,050 can go for a flatter tree with fewer levels. 77 00:03:56,050 --> 00:03:58,840 But you have to be aware of the implications 78 00:03:58,840 --> 00:04:00,890 that that may have. 79 00:04:00,890 --> 00:04:02,560 OK, so that's great. 80 00:04:07,510 --> 00:04:09,100 The next question was-- 81 00:04:09,100 --> 00:04:11,170 OK, so you're attending a cocktail party-- 82 00:04:11,170 --> 00:04:14,590 and cocktail parties, I don't think that's-- that maybe 83 00:04:14,590 --> 00:04:15,940 that's very 20th century. 84 00:04:15,940 --> 00:04:19,300 I don't think we have cocktail parties anymore, so maybe more 85 00:04:19,300 --> 00:04:23,260 like a Google Hangout or the 21st century equivalent. 86 00:04:23,260 --> 00:04:25,840 But the basic idea here is, how would you 87 00:04:25,840 --> 00:04:27,910 explain what system engineering is 88 00:04:27,910 --> 00:04:31,780 to somebody who is not a technical person, not 89 00:04:31,780 --> 00:04:33,130 an engineer? 90 00:04:33,130 --> 00:04:35,510 And I think most of you-- 91 00:04:35,510 --> 00:04:38,770 I looked through all the answers, and most of you 92 00:04:38,770 --> 00:04:42,760 basically provided a definition of system engineering 93 00:04:42,760 --> 00:04:44,680 that we would use in this class, right. 94 00:04:44,680 --> 00:04:49,720 So it was like, OK, well, not quite what I was looking for 95 00:04:49,720 --> 00:04:51,730 but not incorrect. 96 00:04:51,730 --> 00:04:53,980 So I pulled out two examples that I kind of 97 00:04:53,980 --> 00:04:58,840 liked because they brought in analogies from other fields 98 00:04:58,840 --> 00:05:00,910 as to what system engineering is. 99 00:05:00,910 --> 00:05:04,720 So the first one here is, OK, so system engineering represents 100 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:09,400 a method but also a mindset that enables the design and so 101 00:05:09,400 --> 00:05:13,510 forth of successful systems, but systems engineering 102 00:05:13,510 --> 00:05:16,030 is like cooking a delicious cake. 103 00:05:16,030 --> 00:05:19,934 OK, so it's like cooking a delicious recipe. 104 00:05:19,934 --> 00:05:21,850 You've got your ingredients which is your part 105 00:05:21,850 --> 00:05:25,042 numbers, or your parts, right? 106 00:05:25,042 --> 00:05:29,040 You have a process that you're following. 107 00:05:29,040 --> 00:05:32,860 And at the end of it you should have something special, 108 00:05:32,860 --> 00:05:35,140 something delicious, something wholesome, 109 00:05:35,140 --> 00:05:39,100 something that is greater than the sum of the parts. 110 00:05:39,100 --> 00:05:41,960 I don't know if any of you watch the Food Channel? 111 00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:44,170 Anybody watching the Food Network here? 112 00:05:44,170 --> 00:05:45,250 Yeah? 113 00:05:45,250 --> 00:05:45,970 OK. 114 00:05:45,970 --> 00:05:48,160 We actually like to watch it. 115 00:05:48,160 --> 00:05:49,540 It's kind of fun. 116 00:05:49,540 --> 00:05:54,130 And what's fun is when you give the same ingredients to, like, 117 00:05:54,130 --> 00:05:55,750 half a dozen different people-- 118 00:05:55,750 --> 00:05:59,320 and same ingredients, same amount of time, 119 00:05:59,320 --> 00:06:04,150 and the result that comes out of it is vastly different. 120 00:06:04,150 --> 00:06:04,900 Now, why is that? 121 00:06:04,900 --> 00:06:06,790 Of course, you can say skills and so forth, 122 00:06:06,790 --> 00:06:09,950 but it is fundamentally, because those ingredients-- 123 00:06:09,950 --> 00:06:12,280 that details matter. 124 00:06:12,280 --> 00:06:16,450 The way in which the ingredients get combined. 125 00:06:16,450 --> 00:06:18,960 And you know, did you use the right heat? 126 00:06:18,960 --> 00:06:21,040 Did you did you take it off the heat? 127 00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:25,780 30 seconds too soon or too late, those little details 128 00:06:25,780 --> 00:06:29,590 make a huge difference to the final product, OK. 129 00:06:29,590 --> 00:06:33,850 And that's what I think what's cool about the Food Network 130 00:06:33,850 --> 00:06:36,820 and cooking in general. 131 00:06:36,820 --> 00:06:39,530 Cuisine, it's an art. 132 00:06:39,530 --> 00:06:42,410 It's not just follow the recipe. 133 00:06:42,410 --> 00:06:45,070 And so, I think that's a great analogy. 134 00:06:45,070 --> 00:06:46,520 I like that. 135 00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:48,680 And then the other one is-- 136 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:52,750 so you're talking to Cher, the singer, 137 00:06:52,750 --> 00:06:59,260 and explain to her that system engineering is like a concert. 138 00:06:59,260 --> 00:07:03,610 So in a concert you have all your specialists, right? 139 00:07:03,610 --> 00:07:05,200 You have your choir maybe. 140 00:07:05,200 --> 00:07:07,390 You have your strings section. 141 00:07:07,390 --> 00:07:09,370 You have your trumpets. 142 00:07:09,370 --> 00:07:11,230 And I think it's kind of similar. 143 00:07:11,230 --> 00:07:14,020 You could have great individual musicians, 144 00:07:14,020 --> 00:07:19,450 but if the conductor is not bringing everybody into harmony 145 00:07:19,450 --> 00:07:22,340 then you get a cacophony. 146 00:07:22,340 --> 00:07:25,120 It's not a great result. So a great orchestra 147 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:28,950 is not just a bunch of great individual musicians, 148 00:07:28,950 --> 00:07:32,500 but it's the idea that you're orchestrating-- 149 00:07:32,500 --> 00:07:35,050 there's something special that emerges 150 00:07:35,050 --> 00:07:38,860 if you synchronize everybody in a way-- and you motivate them, 151 00:07:38,860 --> 00:07:41,740 and you synchronize them, and something really special 152 00:07:41,740 --> 00:07:44,230 happens. 153 00:07:44,230 --> 00:07:46,630 I think that's another great sort of example 154 00:07:46,630 --> 00:07:49,360 of what we mean by system engineering 155 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:51,130 in the technical world. 156 00:07:51,130 --> 00:07:56,610 This idea of a conductor bringing everybody in harmony, 157 00:07:56,610 --> 00:08:00,930 and the end result is something really special. 158 00:08:00,930 --> 00:08:03,550 That's a little bit what I was looking for in this answer, 159 00:08:03,550 --> 00:08:05,050 and I like both of these examples. 160 00:08:08,830 --> 00:08:11,680 The third question was about the V-Model. 161 00:08:11,680 --> 00:08:15,670 And I think, based on what I looked through the answers, 162 00:08:15,670 --> 00:08:18,370 I think most people really understood that. 163 00:08:18,370 --> 00:08:22,900 And just to summarize, again, in a very, very simple way what 164 00:08:22,900 --> 00:08:24,640 the V-Model is all about-- so here's 165 00:08:24,640 --> 00:08:28,390 the V. If you wanted to really simplify it, 166 00:08:28,390 --> 00:08:31,330 we start at the upper left with a vision. 167 00:08:31,330 --> 00:08:35,000 You know, what is it that we're trying to accomplish? 168 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:37,100 And that's where you need to understand, 169 00:08:37,100 --> 00:08:39,580 who's the stakeholder, who are the customers, 170 00:08:39,580 --> 00:08:42,780 the thing that you're about to create doesn't exist yet. 171 00:08:42,780 --> 00:08:46,480 In some projects you actually start with an initial system, 172 00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:48,410 and you need to improve it. 173 00:08:48,410 --> 00:08:52,780 So you're starting with generation N of a product, 174 00:08:52,780 --> 00:08:56,770 and the goal is to create generation N plus 1, which is 175 00:08:56,770 --> 00:08:58,910 better in several dimensions. 176 00:08:58,910 --> 00:09:00,850 So that's possible, but let's just 177 00:09:00,850 --> 00:09:03,640 say we have a clean sheet situation. 178 00:09:03,640 --> 00:09:07,240 And you have a vision that you're developing. 179 00:09:07,240 --> 00:09:09,610 And then you [INAUDIBLE] 180 00:09:09,610 --> 00:09:11,316 TINA: Hi, Ollie, is that you? 181 00:09:11,316 --> 00:09:12,970 OLIVIER DE WECK: Aha, OK. 182 00:09:12,970 --> 00:09:15,580 TINA: All right, you are now connected on speaker 183 00:09:15,580 --> 00:09:17,830 with the INCOSE Board of Directors. 184 00:09:17,830 --> 00:09:20,850 OLIVIER DE WECK: Fantastic, can you hear me? 185 00:09:20,850 --> 00:09:21,630 GUEST SPEAKER: No. 186 00:09:21,630 --> 00:09:23,190 TINA: Yes, we can. 187 00:09:23,190 --> 00:09:24,840 GUEST SPEAKER: Loud and clear. 188 00:09:24,840 --> 00:09:26,910 OLIVIER DE WECK: All right, this is great. 189 00:09:26,910 --> 00:09:32,970 So I was just going over the midterm exam that we just had, 190 00:09:32,970 --> 00:09:39,870 and so I will stop doing that because we're very glad that we 191 00:09:39,870 --> 00:09:41,760 can spend time with you. 192 00:09:41,760 --> 00:09:47,130 So let's make this bigger on our end. 193 00:09:51,900 --> 00:09:55,230 And do you have a camera on your end, Tina? 194 00:09:59,730 --> 00:10:02,330 DAVID: Let's say no because of the demographics here, 195 00:10:02,330 --> 00:10:05,770 so we'll have to go on voice, Ollie. 196 00:10:05,770 --> 00:10:08,840 OLIVIER DE WECK: OK, Tina, can we see you? 197 00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:12,375 Can we see one of you at least? 198 00:10:12,375 --> 00:10:14,538 [INAUDIBLE] 199 00:10:15,880 --> 00:10:20,702 [INAUDIBLE] can stand there at look presidential. 200 00:10:20,702 --> 00:10:22,160 GUEST SPEAKER: We're working on it. 201 00:10:22,160 --> 00:10:24,760 TINA: How about I figure it out while you give the intro? 202 00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:25,593 DAVID: There you go. 203 00:10:25,593 --> 00:10:28,211 Thank you, Tina. 204 00:10:28,211 --> 00:10:29,570 GUEST SPEAKER: Multi-task. 205 00:10:29,570 --> 00:10:30,950 OLIVIER DE WECK: It would be helpful to see 206 00:10:30,950 --> 00:10:31,991 at least who is speaking. 207 00:10:37,600 --> 00:10:40,360 [SIDE CONVERSATION] 208 00:10:54,304 --> 00:10:55,970 DAVID: I know, we've got a problem here. 209 00:10:55,970 --> 00:10:57,570 TINA: All right, you stand over there. 210 00:10:57,570 --> 00:10:59,023 I'll point this to you. 211 00:11:01,127 --> 00:11:03,460 DAVID: Well, shall we go ahead and kick off here, Ollie? 212 00:11:03,460 --> 00:11:06,710 I know your time is valuable. 213 00:11:06,710 --> 00:11:07,570 OLIVIER DE WECK: OK. 214 00:11:07,570 --> 00:11:10,660 Ryan can we make the INCOSE Board 215 00:11:10,660 --> 00:11:15,860 of Directors the main screen here? 216 00:11:15,860 --> 00:11:17,480 Just give me one second on our end. 217 00:11:35,579 --> 00:11:37,370 GUEST SPEAKER: Ollie, can I suggest we just 218 00:11:37,370 --> 00:11:41,300 press ahead despite the desire to see David's shiny face? 219 00:11:44,490 --> 00:11:45,730 OLIVIER DE WECK: OK. 220 00:11:45,730 --> 00:11:49,640 All right, so David, it's great to talk to you. 221 00:11:49,640 --> 00:11:52,990 So let me just give you a little bit of background here. 222 00:11:52,990 --> 00:11:56,800 We have about 20 students here at MIT. 223 00:11:56,800 --> 00:11:58,930 Currently, we're taking the Fundamentals 224 00:11:58,930 --> 00:12:00,660 of Systems Engineering class. 225 00:12:00,660 --> 00:12:04,130 We're roughly midterm, a little bit past the midterm. 226 00:12:04,130 --> 00:12:07,780 And then we have about 20 students, maybe 15 students, 227 00:12:07,780 --> 00:12:10,660 and staff at EPFL in Switzerland, 228 00:12:10,660 --> 00:12:13,930 and we're teaching this class in the form of the SPOC, Small 229 00:12:13,930 --> 00:12:16,000 Private Online Course. 230 00:12:16,000 --> 00:12:21,850 And so, welcome to MIT, to the INCOSE Board of Directors. 231 00:12:21,850 --> 00:12:24,760 I know you've already had very productive times. 232 00:12:24,760 --> 00:12:28,630 And we're really excited to hear from you as to not just 233 00:12:28,630 --> 00:12:31,420 what is INCOSE, but where do you see 234 00:12:31,420 --> 00:12:35,990 Systems Engineering as a field of study and practice stand. 235 00:12:35,990 --> 00:12:38,480 You know, what are the exciting things happening? 236 00:12:38,480 --> 00:12:40,090 What are the challenges? 237 00:12:40,090 --> 00:12:43,480 And whatever you would choose to share with us. 238 00:12:43,480 --> 00:12:45,200 So, David. 239 00:12:45,200 --> 00:12:46,250 DAVID: Very good. 240 00:12:46,250 --> 00:12:47,070 Thanks, Ollie. 241 00:12:47,070 --> 00:12:49,340 And thank you for making the time available. 242 00:12:49,340 --> 00:12:52,690 It is always great to talk with the next generation. 243 00:12:52,690 --> 00:12:55,220 I'll give you just a few comments up front 244 00:12:55,220 --> 00:12:57,080 and then really open it up. 245 00:12:57,080 --> 00:12:59,540 For those who aren't familiar with INCOSE, 246 00:12:59,540 --> 00:13:02,550 it's the International Council on Systems Engineering. 247 00:13:02,550 --> 00:13:06,830 It's about 25 years old, about 10,000 members worldwide. 248 00:13:06,830 --> 00:13:09,200 And the value of INCOSE, fundamentally, 249 00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:13,760 is to serve as a connector across the systems community, 250 00:13:13,760 --> 00:13:16,490 across organizational boundaries, 251 00:13:16,490 --> 00:13:19,580 across geographic boundaries, so that we can connect 252 00:13:19,580 --> 00:13:23,270 the practice in the US to Europe to Asia and beyond-- 253 00:13:23,270 --> 00:13:25,010 they are applied differently-- 254 00:13:25,010 --> 00:13:28,700 and across domain boundaries, from military and aerospace, 255 00:13:28,700 --> 00:13:32,900 where we have our foundation, to automotive to medical devices 256 00:13:32,900 --> 00:13:34,790 and beyond. 257 00:13:34,790 --> 00:13:37,730 If you look at it as systems engineers, 258 00:13:37,730 --> 00:13:40,950 that's perhaps the most exciting thing of what's going on. 259 00:13:40,950 --> 00:13:45,350 If you look at how complexity continues to emerge and grow, 260 00:13:45,350 --> 00:13:48,200 the problems that we are being asked to tackle, 261 00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:51,330 the technologies at our disposal, 262 00:13:51,330 --> 00:13:54,290 the opportunities for wonderful outcomes, 263 00:13:54,290 --> 00:13:59,000 the dangers and risks of unintended consequences-- 264 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:01,070 the challenges that the world faces are, 265 00:14:01,070 --> 00:14:03,810 absolutely, System's challenges. 266 00:14:03,810 --> 00:14:06,380 And they are far beyond the traditional aerospace 267 00:14:06,380 --> 00:14:08,510 and defense domain. 268 00:14:08,510 --> 00:14:09,480 They are everywhere. 269 00:14:09,480 --> 00:14:13,730 I was with GM earlier this week, looking at automated driving 270 00:14:13,730 --> 00:14:15,410 and auto assist. 271 00:14:15,410 --> 00:14:19,100 I was with medical devices in iRobot yesterday. 272 00:14:19,100 --> 00:14:22,790 And wherever you look, whatever domain you work in, 273 00:14:22,790 --> 00:14:26,510 we see complexity, we see systems challenges, 274 00:14:26,510 --> 00:14:29,870 and we see tremendous opportunities for us, 275 00:14:29,870 --> 00:14:32,630 as professionals, but more than that, 276 00:14:32,630 --> 00:14:37,700 for systems professionals to have a profound positive impact 277 00:14:37,700 --> 00:14:39,170 on the world. 278 00:14:39,170 --> 00:14:42,590 So it's going to be a very challenging journey. 279 00:14:42,590 --> 00:14:45,830 We are still working to solidify our foundation 280 00:14:45,830 --> 00:14:49,080 to advance our theories, to advance our practice. 281 00:14:49,080 --> 00:14:52,680 But it is a very fruitful time, I think, as well. 282 00:14:52,680 --> 00:14:55,550 So those were the comments that I will offer at the start, 283 00:14:55,550 --> 00:14:58,940 and then open it up to the class to ask the questions 284 00:14:58,940 --> 00:15:01,100 of this board of directors. 285 00:15:01,100 --> 00:15:03,800 OLIVIER DE WECK: OK, David, that was great. 286 00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:08,410 And so, who wants to be first? 287 00:15:08,410 --> 00:15:12,510 Don't be shy-- either here at MIT or at EPFL. 288 00:15:12,510 --> 00:15:15,560 Sam, go for it. 289 00:15:15,560 --> 00:15:20,540 SAM: I was wondering when you're creating, I guess, 290 00:15:20,540 --> 00:15:24,800 INCOSE standards for systems engineering processes, 291 00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:28,340 what considerations do you take into account in order 292 00:15:28,340 --> 00:15:32,330 to make them applicable for such a wide range of disciplines 293 00:15:32,330 --> 00:15:32,895 or domains? 294 00:15:36,615 --> 00:15:38,490 DAVID: Introduce yourself for whoever speaks. 295 00:15:38,490 --> 00:15:39,906 PAUL: this is Paul Schreinmarkers. 296 00:15:39,906 --> 00:15:41,210 I'm the technical director. 297 00:15:41,210 --> 00:15:42,750 Thank you for asking. 298 00:15:42,750 --> 00:15:48,690 Well, actually, INCOSE is not a standard setting body, 299 00:15:48,690 --> 00:15:54,480 but we are supporting a lot of standards like ISO 15288. 300 00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:56,610 And what we at least try to achieve 301 00:15:56,610 --> 00:16:01,260 is that the standards are being applied in multiple domains 302 00:16:01,260 --> 00:16:04,110 as much as possible. 303 00:16:04,110 --> 00:16:06,530 Does that answer your question? 304 00:16:06,530 --> 00:16:08,240 SAM: Yeah, thanks. 305 00:16:08,240 --> 00:16:09,740 OLIVIER DE WECK: OK, and just so you 306 00:16:09,740 --> 00:16:14,750 know we do have 15288 as one of the-- 307 00:16:14,750 --> 00:16:17,420 in the class here, we covered, sort of, three standards. 308 00:16:17,420 --> 00:16:20,350 One is the System Engineering Handbook, the [? NASA, ?] 309 00:16:20,350 --> 00:16:23,981 of course, the INCOSE Handbook, and then 15288. 310 00:16:23,981 --> 00:16:25,730 So I think the students should be familiar 311 00:16:25,730 --> 00:16:30,200 with [? 15288, ?] so that was good. 312 00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:32,170 OK, can we have a question from EPFL? 313 00:16:44,330 --> 00:16:45,720 Are you still with us, guys? 314 00:16:49,376 --> 00:16:50,640 - Hello, do you hear me? 315 00:16:50,640 --> 00:16:51,856 OLIVIER DE WECK: Yes, good. 316 00:16:51,856 --> 00:16:53,040 - OK, yes. 317 00:16:53,040 --> 00:16:58,620 [INAUDIBLE] just have a question about the complexity of systems 318 00:16:58,620 --> 00:17:01,650 with new systems being more and more complex over time, 319 00:17:01,650 --> 00:17:05,579 would system engineers, or engineering itself, 320 00:17:05,579 --> 00:17:07,740 have to reinvent itself in the future? 321 00:17:07,740 --> 00:17:09,836 And what would be the direction? 322 00:17:09,836 --> 00:17:10,609 Thank you. 323 00:17:13,102 --> 00:17:15,060 ALAN HARDING: Hi there, it's Alan Harding here. 324 00:17:15,060 --> 00:17:18,450 I'm president-elect at INCOSE, but more importantly, I 325 00:17:18,450 --> 00:17:21,480 co-chair our system and systems working group. 326 00:17:21,480 --> 00:17:25,050 I think the answer is no to reinvention 327 00:17:25,050 --> 00:17:28,300 because I'm confident all the principles stand. 328 00:17:28,300 --> 00:17:30,950 But what we've been doing as a working group, 329 00:17:30,950 --> 00:17:33,770 is identifying where engineering a system and systems 330 00:17:33,770 --> 00:17:35,710 are different. 331 00:17:35,710 --> 00:17:39,270 We constructed a paper, which has been published, 332 00:17:39,270 --> 00:17:41,400 on the pain point to the system of systems, 333 00:17:41,400 --> 00:17:45,420 looking at the managerial and the technical differences, 334 00:17:45,420 --> 00:17:49,450 and therefore, helping people, when planning their work, 335 00:17:49,450 --> 00:17:52,170 see in which cases they can pick up their traditional ways 336 00:17:52,170 --> 00:17:53,200 of looking-- 337 00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:55,540 and where, if you, like, experienced practitioners, 338 00:17:55,540 --> 00:17:58,360 see problems or challenges in other areas. 339 00:17:58,360 --> 00:18:01,430 So that working group is helping develop-- 340 00:18:01,430 --> 00:18:04,015 so understand and develop the state practice 341 00:18:04,015 --> 00:18:06,810 for complex system of systems, and that's 342 00:18:06,810 --> 00:18:08,940 proved quite influential. 343 00:18:08,940 --> 00:18:12,930 And in fact, if you all using the latest edition of the SE 344 00:18:12,930 --> 00:18:16,490 handbook, in the section on system of systems, 345 00:18:16,490 --> 00:18:19,070 it does highlight those pain points. 346 00:18:19,070 --> 00:18:22,420 So they are there helping shape what people do. 347 00:18:22,420 --> 00:18:24,596 Hopefully, that's of use? 348 00:18:24,596 --> 00:18:25,970 OLIVIER DE WECK: Thank you, Alan. 349 00:18:25,970 --> 00:18:27,580 Very good. 350 00:18:27,580 --> 00:18:30,870 I think we've only mentioned system of systems in the class 351 00:18:30,870 --> 00:18:31,370 so far. 352 00:18:31,370 --> 00:18:34,040 We haven't really deep dived into that topic, 353 00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:36,230 but it's a great point. 354 00:18:36,230 --> 00:18:39,320 OK, and back to MIT. 355 00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:43,220 AUDIENCE: Hi, my question is about the systems engineering 356 00:18:43,220 --> 00:18:47,750 vision you have on the web site about 2025. 357 00:18:47,750 --> 00:18:52,490 What has been done about the protocols or languages that 358 00:18:52,490 --> 00:18:55,280 could be developed to facilitate the communication 359 00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:58,130 between the systems engineering professionals 360 00:18:58,130 --> 00:19:01,409 and different stakeholders? 361 00:19:01,409 --> 00:19:02,950 MIKE: That's a really good question-- 362 00:19:02,950 --> 00:19:06,040 you know, this idea of having the same language. 363 00:19:06,040 --> 00:19:09,250 By the way, I'm Mike Celentano, deputy technical director 364 00:19:09,250 --> 00:19:10,540 of operations. 365 00:19:10,540 --> 00:19:14,532 The idea of having a common language is really important. 366 00:19:14,532 --> 00:19:16,990 One of the things that I've struggled with in health care-- 367 00:19:16,990 --> 00:19:18,820 that's my industry-- 368 00:19:18,820 --> 00:19:23,560 is trying to convince people to speak the same language, 369 00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:25,510 and I've since given that up. 370 00:19:25,510 --> 00:19:27,790 What I'm teaching people now is to understand 371 00:19:27,790 --> 00:19:30,010 the other people's language, so that they 372 00:19:30,010 --> 00:19:31,330 can communicate better. 373 00:19:31,330 --> 00:19:33,520 And so when you go from domain to domain, 374 00:19:33,520 --> 00:19:35,710 it's important that you spend some time learning 375 00:19:35,710 --> 00:19:37,810 the language, a lot like it's important to learn 376 00:19:37,810 --> 00:19:40,540 how to say hello and goodbye in the language of the country 377 00:19:40,540 --> 00:19:41,890 that you're visiting. 378 00:19:41,890 --> 00:19:45,490 It's important to understand the domain that you're exploring, 379 00:19:45,490 --> 00:19:47,530 so that you can make the interpretation 380 00:19:47,530 --> 00:19:50,500 and help those people with systems engineering. 381 00:19:50,500 --> 00:19:53,640 Does that answer your question? 382 00:19:53,640 --> 00:19:54,957 AUDIENCE: Yes, thank you. 383 00:19:54,957 --> 00:19:57,290 DAVID: Ollie, if you don't mind, I'm going to follow up, 384 00:19:57,290 --> 00:19:59,360 and then Art will as well. 385 00:19:59,360 --> 00:20:01,460 What that question calls out, and what 386 00:20:01,460 --> 00:20:04,470 I think Mike's answer calls out, is 387 00:20:04,470 --> 00:20:08,090 there are two very important dimensions, in my opinion, 388 00:20:08,090 --> 00:20:09,590 of systems engineering. 389 00:20:09,590 --> 00:20:11,750 We are the glue to the project team, 390 00:20:11,750 --> 00:20:14,640 but we are the glue in two different dimensions. 391 00:20:14,640 --> 00:20:17,060 There is the engineering aspect of what we do, 392 00:20:17,060 --> 00:20:20,330 and there is very real engineering analysis that needs 393 00:20:20,330 --> 00:20:22,100 to occur at the systems level. 394 00:20:22,100 --> 00:20:24,290 We unify the subject matter experts, 395 00:20:24,290 --> 00:20:27,710 and we bring those understandings together 396 00:20:27,710 --> 00:20:31,160 whether it's in medical, whether it's in aerospace, regardless. 397 00:20:31,160 --> 00:20:34,730 But the other aspect that we cannot avoid as systems 398 00:20:34,730 --> 00:20:37,670 engineers, is the communication role. 399 00:20:37,670 --> 00:20:39,440 Because we are working with people 400 00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:42,480 who do not speak the same common language, 401 00:20:42,480 --> 00:20:45,590 whether that's speaking between aerospace and medical, 402 00:20:45,590 --> 00:20:47,990 or whether that's on an aerospace project 403 00:20:47,990 --> 00:20:50,360 speaking between computer science, 404 00:20:50,360 --> 00:20:52,640 reliability, mechanical, electrical. 405 00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:57,260 As systems engineers, we must embrace the communication 406 00:20:57,260 --> 00:21:01,070 aspect and the translator aspect that Mike called out, 407 00:21:01,070 --> 00:21:02,990 because each of us speak a different language 408 00:21:02,990 --> 00:21:04,920 for a particular reason. 409 00:21:04,920 --> 00:21:05,420 Art? 410 00:21:05,420 --> 00:21:11,240 ART: And to help in that regard, one of the products 411 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:15,230 that INCOSE has helped create is a systems engineering 412 00:21:15,230 --> 00:21:21,380 body of knowledge, which is available on a website, which 413 00:21:21,380 --> 00:21:23,780 Ollie is quite familiar with-- 414 00:21:23,780 --> 00:21:26,300 which has several hundred articles 415 00:21:26,300 --> 00:21:28,550 about systems engineering. 416 00:21:28,550 --> 00:21:31,120 But one of the projects that we are going to be-- 417 00:21:31,120 --> 00:21:34,250 and it's its domain neutral, so it's not 418 00:21:34,250 --> 00:21:36,830 tied to a specific business sector. 419 00:21:36,830 --> 00:21:41,630 One of the projects that we are expecting to begin in 2016 is 420 00:21:41,630 --> 00:21:45,890 to create a variant of that, in some fashion, 421 00:21:45,890 --> 00:21:50,270 for the health care community-- tying it to the unique way they 422 00:21:50,270 --> 00:21:52,160 talk about things-- 423 00:21:52,160 --> 00:21:55,130 their approaches, but tie it back to the common underlying 424 00:21:55,130 --> 00:21:56,400 principles. 425 00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:59,180 And if we are successful in that, as we expect, 426 00:21:59,180 --> 00:22:02,660 I can imagine us spinning up ones for transportation, 427 00:22:02,660 --> 00:22:05,720 for telecommunications, et cetera. 428 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:09,920 So that that can become a glue, in essence, for people 429 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:13,130 across many different business sectors. 430 00:22:13,130 --> 00:22:14,780 OLIVIER DE WECK: Very good. 431 00:22:14,780 --> 00:22:17,270 So I will make sure that we provide 432 00:22:17,270 --> 00:22:19,910 the link to the body of knowledge, which I know 433 00:22:19,910 --> 00:22:22,330 was a very big effort to put together. 434 00:22:22,330 --> 00:22:27,370 We'll provide that information for the students as well. 435 00:22:27,370 --> 00:22:29,530 TINA: Great, that's excellent. 436 00:22:29,530 --> 00:22:31,090 Unfortunately, for time, I'm going 437 00:22:31,090 --> 00:22:34,270 to have to ask Art to give us a wrap up. 438 00:22:34,270 --> 00:22:36,940 But let me just say one thing because I'm not sure 439 00:22:36,940 --> 00:22:39,520 how well you can see the video over here. 440 00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:45,400 But you guys are talking to a group of about 20 people 441 00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:46,400 from around the world. 442 00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:50,170 We have people here from France, Sweden, Australia. 443 00:22:50,170 --> 00:22:52,120 And the people that you just talked to 444 00:22:52,120 --> 00:22:58,840 are also senior engineering leaders that Airbus and BAE, 445 00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:03,130 and so they kind of arrange a broad spectrum here-- and also 446 00:23:03,130 --> 00:23:05,510 rose from different industries. 447 00:23:05,510 --> 00:23:09,610 So I'll hand it over to Art to give you a good summary, 448 00:23:09,610 --> 00:23:13,414 but I hope that you continue to keep in touch with this group. 449 00:23:13,414 --> 00:23:14,830 GUEST SPEAKER: Well, this is where 450 00:23:14,830 --> 00:23:18,430 I'm going to make my small pitch for membership. 451 00:23:18,430 --> 00:23:24,250 So as students, you have an opportunity for only 38 dollars 452 00:23:24,250 --> 00:23:30,340 US annually to be members of INCOSE, which gives you access 453 00:23:30,340 --> 00:23:34,420 to all of our products, which includes videos 454 00:23:34,420 --> 00:23:38,030 that are recorded every month, handbooks, 455 00:23:38,030 --> 00:23:39,940 all sorts of documents. 456 00:23:39,940 --> 00:23:41,920 And I'd really like to encourage you 457 00:23:41,920 --> 00:23:45,710 to consider that as an option. 458 00:23:45,710 --> 00:23:46,610 It's great. 459 00:23:46,610 --> 00:23:49,150 It's something like a quarter of what you'd have 460 00:23:49,150 --> 00:23:52,920 to pay as a full professional. 461 00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:55,869 And so I'm going to let it go with that. 462 00:23:55,869 --> 00:23:57,910 OLIVIER DE WECK: No, Art, I think that was great. 463 00:23:57,910 --> 00:23:59,920 And I'll just say from my perspective, 464 00:23:59,920 --> 00:24:03,760 I first got involved in INCOSE a little more than a decade ago, 465 00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:08,900 and I think both the industry-academic mix, 466 00:24:08,900 --> 00:24:11,120 the conferences-- you know, this is real. 467 00:24:11,120 --> 00:24:15,100 This is not a community that's living in a bubble, 468 00:24:15,100 --> 00:24:17,860 and so I would I would fully endorse, Art. 469 00:24:22,180 --> 00:24:25,800 All right, well, I think we're at the end of this interview. 470 00:24:25,800 --> 00:24:26,820 You know, this is cool. 471 00:24:26,820 --> 00:24:29,680 I mean, that technology has gotten to the point 472 00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:31,720 where, certainly, the audio part of this 473 00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:37,930 was very clear for all of us, and that's terrific. 474 00:24:37,930 --> 00:24:40,580 So we want to thank you for your time. 475 00:24:40,580 --> 00:24:43,420 Have a great continuation of your board meeting, 476 00:24:43,420 --> 00:24:46,905 and we're going to keep learning over here. 477 00:24:46,905 --> 00:24:48,000 DAVID: Very good. 478 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:49,189 Thank you so much, Ollie. 479 00:24:49,189 --> 00:24:50,230 GUEST SPEAKER: Thank you. 480 00:24:50,230 --> 00:24:53,720 OLIVIER DE WECK: Take care. 481 00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:57,290 All right, well, I hope you found that useful. 482 00:24:57,290 --> 00:25:01,490 And I'll provide you a link to the body of knowledge. 483 00:25:01,490 --> 00:25:04,980 I think that's one thing that we haven't sort of pointed out. 484 00:25:04,980 --> 00:25:07,830 So let's go back to-- 485 00:25:07,830 --> 00:25:09,140 EPFL, are you still with us? 486 00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:15,367 GUEST SPEAKER: [INAUDIBLE] 487 00:25:15,367 --> 00:25:16,450 OLIVIER DE WECK: OK, good. 488 00:25:16,450 --> 00:25:18,190 Thank you. 489 00:25:18,190 --> 00:25:21,520 So let me just sort of finish on the midterm. 490 00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:22,240 Yes, Veronica? 491 00:25:22,240 --> 00:25:24,896 VERONICA: [INAUDIBLE] can I ask, a question I would have 492 00:25:24,896 --> 00:25:26,077 asked to the board, to you? 493 00:25:26,077 --> 00:25:26,910 OLIVIER DE WECK: OK. 494 00:25:29,772 --> 00:25:30,666 VERONICA: Thank you. 495 00:25:30,666 --> 00:25:32,290 When I was looking over their web site, 496 00:25:32,290 --> 00:25:33,970 I see a lot about kind of communicating 497 00:25:33,970 --> 00:25:36,200 for the sake of engineers and everything else. 498 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:38,410 But I think that systems engineering, in particular, 499 00:25:38,410 --> 00:25:42,550 has an ability to shape the way that we kind of regulate 500 00:25:42,550 --> 00:25:43,490 policy developments. 501 00:25:43,490 --> 00:25:45,531 I feel like a lot of times scientific advancement 502 00:25:45,531 --> 00:25:48,250 is working against international regulatory standards, where 503 00:25:48,250 --> 00:25:49,990 I feel like an entity like INCOSE 504 00:25:49,990 --> 00:25:53,200 has an ability to kind of shape international collaboration 505 00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:55,570 in a way that can help scientists achieve more 506 00:25:55,570 --> 00:25:56,920 together. 507 00:25:56,920 --> 00:26:00,370 And so I was kind of wondering what the role they might have 508 00:26:00,370 --> 00:26:01,930 seen-- or what you might see as kind 509 00:26:01,930 --> 00:26:04,030 of an international collaboration, 510 00:26:04,030 --> 00:26:08,920 like that, taking, in terms of shaping the ways in which we 511 00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:12,340 engineer together-- not just the ways in which we kind of create 512 00:26:12,340 --> 00:26:14,260 in systems engineering naturally, but kind 513 00:26:14,260 --> 00:26:16,150 of more collaborative. 514 00:26:16,150 --> 00:26:18,250 OLIVIER DE WECK: I think it's a great question. 515 00:26:18,250 --> 00:26:20,440 And I think the system engineering is sort 516 00:26:20,440 --> 00:26:22,180 of evolving and broadening. 517 00:26:22,180 --> 00:26:24,700 The classic view of system engineering is you know, 518 00:26:24,700 --> 00:26:29,170 that's what a company or a big project 519 00:26:29,170 --> 00:26:32,680 that's producing a physical deliverable, a new airplane, 520 00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:38,320 a new computer, health care device, a new software system. 521 00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:40,210 That's the out-- you know, and then that's 522 00:26:40,210 --> 00:26:42,370 a capability that you put out into the market 523 00:26:42,370 --> 00:26:43,960 and to the field. 524 00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:47,820 And regulations and policies are given to you-- 525 00:26:47,820 --> 00:26:49,870 you know, their constraints, their requirements. 526 00:26:49,870 --> 00:26:53,230 I think what you're saying is, well, the policies, themselves, 527 00:26:53,230 --> 00:26:54,895 are something to be designed-- 528 00:26:54,895 --> 00:26:55,770 VERONICA: I think so. 529 00:26:55,770 --> 00:26:57,186 OLIVIER DE WECK: --and negotiated. 530 00:26:57,186 --> 00:26:59,860 And that's a broadening of the system boundary 531 00:26:59,860 --> 00:27:02,200 and the mandate for system engineering. 532 00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:06,760 And so here, at MIT, over the last 15 years or so, 533 00:27:06,760 --> 00:27:09,520 the word we've used for that is, engineering systems. 534 00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:11,560 So we kind of flipped the two words, 535 00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:14,710 and say that system engineering, in a more traditional sense, 536 00:27:14,710 --> 00:27:17,980 is scope, scope, smaller. 537 00:27:17,980 --> 00:27:21,730 And then when you internalize the externalities 538 00:27:21,730 --> 00:27:24,910 like economics, policy, and you consider 539 00:27:24,910 --> 00:27:27,970 that part of the design space as well, 540 00:27:27,970 --> 00:27:31,300 then you're in the world of engineering systems 541 00:27:31,300 --> 00:27:33,790 or complex sociotechnical systems. 542 00:27:33,790 --> 00:27:36,352 And so, absolutely, there's a-- 543 00:27:36,352 --> 00:27:39,790 and you heard the answer that Alan Harding, who's 544 00:27:39,790 --> 00:27:41,540 the President-elect of INCOSE. 545 00:27:41,540 --> 00:27:44,620 He will take over from Dave Long next year. 546 00:27:44,620 --> 00:27:47,480 When he started talking about system of systems-- 547 00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:49,420 well, you know, what our system of systems? 548 00:27:49,420 --> 00:27:52,390 For example, air traffic management. 549 00:27:52,390 --> 00:27:54,370 Let's take an example, air traffic management, 550 00:27:54,370 --> 00:27:55,970 air transportation. 551 00:27:55,970 --> 00:28:00,100 In North America, there's this project called next-gen-- 552 00:28:00,100 --> 00:28:02,080 right, next generation-- 553 00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:04,690 that's a very complex system of systems. 554 00:28:04,690 --> 00:28:08,370 And in Europe, the equivalent is a project called SESAR. 555 00:28:08,370 --> 00:28:11,690 It's essentially the Unified European airspace. 556 00:28:11,690 --> 00:28:14,590 Well, you've got-- it's not just about flight controllers, 557 00:28:14,590 --> 00:28:18,490 and radar stations, and GPS-enabled navigation. 558 00:28:18,490 --> 00:28:20,890 A lot of it has to do with policy. 559 00:28:20,890 --> 00:28:23,080 And how do you do the hand offs? 560 00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:27,730 Who is responsible to report any anomalies? 561 00:28:27,730 --> 00:28:29,830 How do you do backup operations? 562 00:28:29,830 --> 00:28:30,590 And so forth. 563 00:28:30,590 --> 00:28:33,820 So a good example when that came to the fore is-- 564 00:28:33,820 --> 00:28:36,340 I don't know if you remember the Icelandic volcano 565 00:28:36,340 --> 00:28:37,660 a few years ago? 566 00:28:37,660 --> 00:28:41,440 The volcano erupted, and then there was this big ash cloud. 567 00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:45,340 And then the question was, well, is it 568 00:28:45,340 --> 00:28:47,410 safe to fly through this ash cloud? 569 00:28:47,410 --> 00:28:49,720 And who actually has the authority 570 00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:54,414 to decide which part of the airspace is closed and is open? 571 00:28:54,414 --> 00:28:56,080 And then you've got the airlines saying, 572 00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:58,960 you know, open up the airspace because we're losing 573 00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:00,700 a lot of business every day. 574 00:29:00,700 --> 00:29:04,030 And the regulators are saying, wait, 575 00:29:04,030 --> 00:29:06,430 we need to be cautious here. 576 00:29:06,430 --> 00:29:09,220 So I think what you're saying is that's a system engineering 577 00:29:09,220 --> 00:29:11,490 problem that we could sort of address. 578 00:29:11,490 --> 00:29:13,750 And so things are moving that way, 579 00:29:13,750 --> 00:29:16,870 but I think our methodologies for doing 580 00:29:16,870 --> 00:29:20,000 that work in a rigorous way are not quite there yet. 581 00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:21,940 It's still evolving, but great question. 582 00:29:21,940 --> 00:29:23,440 VERONICA: Is that a type of advocacy 583 00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:27,160 that a group like INCOSE could move toward? 584 00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:29,710 I can see from their mission statement and everything, 585 00:29:29,710 --> 00:29:31,210 that's something they are doing now. 586 00:29:31,210 --> 00:29:33,552 But is that a place that you see that they could fill? 587 00:29:33,552 --> 00:29:34,760 OLIVIER DE WECK: It could be. 588 00:29:34,760 --> 00:29:37,180 And I think I think they're moving that way. 589 00:29:37,180 --> 00:29:38,040 VERONICA: Thank you. 590 00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:38,956 OLIVIER DE WECK: Yeah. 591 00:29:38,956 --> 00:29:41,140 OK, any other points anybody wants 592 00:29:41,140 --> 00:29:44,220 to add from the discussion? 593 00:29:44,220 --> 00:29:44,720 OK. 594 00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:46,330 AUDIENCE: Yeah, one question from our side-- 595 00:29:46,330 --> 00:29:47,413 OLIVIER DE WECK: Go ahead. 596 00:29:47,413 --> 00:29:49,630 AUDIENCE: --if I can. 597 00:29:49,630 --> 00:29:51,560 So I think that's a very good point, Veronica, 598 00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:54,620 in terms of how do you transfer this to policy or business 599 00:29:54,620 --> 00:29:56,097 management? 600 00:29:56,097 --> 00:29:58,430 Some time ago, I was trying to see if there are actually 601 00:29:58,430 --> 00:30:01,730 jobs or careers that are called systems engineer, 602 00:30:01,730 --> 00:30:05,900 but besides IT, there's really not a profession. 603 00:30:05,900 --> 00:30:09,260 For example, if you're doing this in the policy domain, 604 00:30:09,260 --> 00:30:12,890 could you just be the systems engineer of, say for example, 605 00:30:12,890 --> 00:30:15,036 the Swiss energy-- you know, what 606 00:30:15,036 --> 00:30:17,160 I'm working on currently-- kind of the Swiss energy 607 00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:19,650 transition-- you know, the systems engineer, 608 00:30:19,650 --> 00:30:20,920 and that would be your role. 609 00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:24,740 Are their careers and career names 610 00:30:24,740 --> 00:30:26,780 that are explicitly, like, designing the systems 611 00:30:26,780 --> 00:30:29,090 and engineering them? 612 00:30:29,090 --> 00:30:30,840 OLIVIER DE WECK: That's a question, right? 613 00:30:39,420 --> 00:30:43,540 Katya, I think the mic is off. 614 00:30:43,540 --> 00:30:44,315 Go ahead. 615 00:30:44,315 --> 00:30:45,761 AUDIENCE: Hear me now? 616 00:30:45,761 --> 00:30:48,066 OLIVIER DE WECK: Yes. 617 00:30:48,066 --> 00:30:50,960 AUDIENCE: Are there jobs that do this? 618 00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:52,930 Are there systems engineering jobs, 619 00:30:52,930 --> 00:30:55,224 or is that project management? 620 00:30:55,224 --> 00:30:56,890 OLIVIER DE WECK: That's a good question. 621 00:30:56,890 --> 00:31:02,560 So the job profiles of system engineers have been broadening. 622 00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:04,690 There is also, system architects. 623 00:31:07,370 --> 00:31:10,030 When we talk about concept generation here, 624 00:31:10,030 --> 00:31:13,400 concept selection, that's, in a sense, 625 00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:15,440 a specialty within system engineering 626 00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:16,920 known as system architecture. 627 00:31:16,920 --> 00:31:19,190 So you'll have more and more people hand you 628 00:31:19,190 --> 00:31:22,190 a business card that says, I'm the system architect. 629 00:31:22,190 --> 00:31:25,700 And what that means is they're in charge of the high level 630 00:31:25,700 --> 00:31:30,480 decisions, the upper left side of the V that's shown here. 631 00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:33,110 So system architect, system engineers. 632 00:31:33,110 --> 00:31:35,810 And there's also a very-- this didn't come up 633 00:31:35,810 --> 00:31:37,730 in the discussion with INCOSE, but there's 634 00:31:37,730 --> 00:31:39,890 a very active discussion going on right now 635 00:31:39,890 --> 00:31:44,120 between INCOSE, that has about 10,000 members 636 00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:47,990 and is 25 years old, and an organization 637 00:31:47,990 --> 00:31:52,340 called PMI, Project Management Institute, which is older 638 00:31:52,340 --> 00:31:55,800 and has about 400,000 members globally. 639 00:31:55,800 --> 00:31:59,450 And that's the people running big projects. 640 00:31:59,450 --> 00:32:01,640 So those job descriptions are still 641 00:32:01,640 --> 00:32:03,950 coming from different angles, but we 642 00:32:03,950 --> 00:32:06,500 do see this bigger discussion emerging. 643 00:32:06,500 --> 00:32:09,920 And I think the organizations that are enlightened, 644 00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:13,010 that really understand that these big system decisions are 645 00:32:13,010 --> 00:32:17,330 critical-- and that you can't just make those arbitrarily. 646 00:32:17,330 --> 00:32:20,680 You need people who actually think about the whole system, 647 00:32:20,680 --> 00:32:23,000 who model and simulate the whole system, who 648 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:24,590 look at different scenarios. 649 00:32:24,590 --> 00:32:26,660 You need dedicated people for that. 650 00:32:26,660 --> 00:32:31,250 Who not just have the education and the experience to do it, 651 00:32:31,250 --> 00:32:34,490 but have the job title to do it as well, and the authority. 652 00:32:34,490 --> 00:32:37,190 And so, I think we're seeing a transition 653 00:32:37,190 --> 00:32:41,420 to those new kinds of jobs, especially in the enlightened 654 00:32:41,420 --> 00:32:44,130 organizations. 655 00:32:44,130 --> 00:32:45,550 OK. 656 00:32:45,550 --> 00:32:46,130 Yes? 657 00:32:46,130 --> 00:32:47,380 VERONICA: One more, I promise. 658 00:32:47,380 --> 00:32:48,830 OLIVIER DE WECK: One more and then we'll move on. 659 00:32:48,830 --> 00:32:49,330 Yep? 660 00:32:49,330 --> 00:32:50,290 VERONICA: So when you say that someone 661 00:32:50,290 --> 00:32:52,539 needs to have a designated title of a systems engineer 662 00:32:52,539 --> 00:32:56,230 to really do it well, is there an advantage or disadvantage 663 00:32:56,230 --> 00:32:59,774 to having everyone be a systems engineer with a specialty, 664 00:32:59,774 --> 00:33:01,690 so that you're training an entire organization 665 00:33:01,690 --> 00:33:03,620 to think about the big picture? 666 00:33:03,620 --> 00:33:05,900 Because I can see pros and cons, but I'm wondering, 667 00:33:05,900 --> 00:33:07,781 is there a hard answer either way. 668 00:33:07,781 --> 00:33:09,280 OLIVIER DE WECK: My position on this 669 00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:11,350 is-- you remember, we talked a little bit 670 00:33:11,350 --> 00:33:14,230 about the value of system engineering, 671 00:33:14,230 --> 00:33:16,570 like how much should you invest in system engineering? 672 00:33:16,570 --> 00:33:18,760 And we'll come back to this at the end of term. 673 00:33:18,760 --> 00:33:21,820 But generally, you can see that there's 674 00:33:21,820 --> 00:33:26,140 empirical data that says you should spend roughly 10% to 20% 675 00:33:26,140 --> 00:33:28,090 of your budget-- 676 00:33:28,090 --> 00:33:30,760 maybe 15% is sort of the sweet spot-- 677 00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:34,510 on systems engineering, system architecture type activities, 678 00:33:34,510 --> 00:33:38,260 which happens to be 1 in 7. 679 00:33:38,260 --> 00:33:41,470 1 over 7, that's 15% roughly, right? 680 00:33:41,470 --> 00:33:45,310 So if you're going to, on average, decompose 681 00:33:45,310 --> 00:33:51,010 your systems into seven chunks at each level of decomposition 682 00:33:51,010 --> 00:33:55,300 then you need about one out of seven people-- 683 00:33:55,300 --> 00:33:58,060 or one out of eight or one out of seven people-- 684 00:33:58,060 --> 00:34:01,480 their primary focus should be on how the chunks fit together, 685 00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:03,811 not designing the individual chunks. 686 00:34:03,811 --> 00:34:05,560 And so there's a lot of empirical evidence 687 00:34:05,560 --> 00:34:09,850 that suggests that if you spend a lot less effort on system 688 00:34:09,850 --> 00:34:13,239 integration than about 15% of your total budget, 689 00:34:13,239 --> 00:34:15,190 you're going to have real problems. 690 00:34:15,190 --> 00:34:16,719 You will miss requirements. 691 00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:18,670 You'll have poorly managed interfaces. 692 00:34:18,670 --> 00:34:21,250 You'll have surprises during testing. 693 00:34:21,250 --> 00:34:24,639 If you spend a lot more than 15% on system engineering 694 00:34:24,639 --> 00:34:28,580 activities, the project will be very heavy, 695 00:34:28,580 --> 00:34:31,570 too much bureaucracy, too many processes. 696 00:34:31,570 --> 00:34:32,949 It gets slower. 697 00:34:32,949 --> 00:34:35,710 So we'll come back to that. 698 00:34:35,710 --> 00:34:38,920 But everybody should have some understanding 699 00:34:38,920 --> 00:34:42,010 of what system engineering is even if you're a subject matter 700 00:34:42,010 --> 00:34:45,699 expert specialty person, if you do cost modeling, 701 00:34:45,699 --> 00:34:50,320 or if you do control systems, propulsion, 702 00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:53,239 in the medical field, biocompatible materials. 703 00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:56,320 Whatever it is you do, everybody should know something 704 00:34:56,320 --> 00:34:58,000 about system engineering. 705 00:34:58,000 --> 00:35:01,750 But then you do need, that's my opinion, the dedicated people 706 00:35:01,750 --> 00:35:05,770 who really focus on the integration, the interfaces, 707 00:35:05,770 --> 00:35:08,260 how the chunks fit together. 708 00:35:08,260 --> 00:35:10,780 And if you don't have that for projects 709 00:35:10,780 --> 00:35:14,080 that are of a certain level of complexity, 710 00:35:14,080 --> 00:35:16,850 you're going to have big problems. 711 00:35:16,850 --> 00:35:21,060 OK, Katya, was that was that reasonable? 712 00:35:21,060 --> 00:35:22,110 All right. 713 00:35:22,110 --> 00:35:26,730 So let's move on here with the exam because we have a very, 714 00:35:26,730 --> 00:35:29,400 I think, exciting, interesting presentation to get to. 715 00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:32,520 So the V is essentially-- you have this vision. 716 00:35:32,520 --> 00:35:36,450 You then decompose requirements, subsystems. 717 00:35:36,450 --> 00:35:38,910 And then the bottom of the V is the details. 718 00:35:38,910 --> 00:35:42,270 Every little detail needs to be defined. 719 00:35:42,270 --> 00:35:45,960 And then the right side is we go and then integrate everything 720 00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:47,700 together, and we go to operations. 721 00:35:47,700 --> 00:35:53,460 So I think most of you really explained that quite well. 722 00:35:53,460 --> 00:35:57,060 Question four, what is the most important aspect 723 00:35:57,060 --> 00:36:00,405 of the V-model that is not shown explicitly in the V? 724 00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:05,670 There are two answers here, and I think both are correct. 725 00:36:05,670 --> 00:36:07,980 The iterative nature of design, we'll 726 00:36:07,980 --> 00:36:11,280 hear about this in the Octanis project. 727 00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:14,790 So the V-model does not imply that you're automatically doing 728 00:36:14,790 --> 00:36:16,710 a waterfall stage gate process. 729 00:36:16,710 --> 00:36:20,610 You're only doing trade studies once. 730 00:36:20,610 --> 00:36:22,530 You're only testing once. 731 00:36:22,530 --> 00:36:23,920 That's not what it means. 732 00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:26,970 It just means that there's a logical sequence 733 00:36:26,970 --> 00:36:28,920 to the activities, but you could actually 734 00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:32,670 spiral through the V multiple times, so the iterative nature 735 00:36:32,670 --> 00:36:33,240 of design. 736 00:36:33,240 --> 00:36:36,600 And then the possibility of schedule and cost overruns, 737 00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:40,650 this is the programmatic side, is not shown in the V-model, 738 00:36:40,650 --> 00:36:42,000 but it's implied. 739 00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:46,050 So both of these are correct, so this is very good. 740 00:36:46,050 --> 00:36:49,530 Question five, at which of the following milestones 741 00:36:49,530 --> 00:36:52,620 should the main concept, or architecture, of the system 742 00:36:52,620 --> 00:36:54,660 selected-- so here we have a little bit 743 00:36:54,660 --> 00:36:56,970 of a spread of answers. 744 00:36:56,970 --> 00:37:02,250 The correct answer here should be PDR, Polygyny Design Review. 745 00:37:02,250 --> 00:37:05,070 That's when the concept, the architecture, the high level 746 00:37:05,070 --> 00:37:08,910 decomposition of the system, the assignment of functions 747 00:37:08,910 --> 00:37:14,410 to those chunks at level one or level two, should be defined. 748 00:37:14,410 --> 00:37:17,560 SRR, it's too early. 749 00:37:17,560 --> 00:37:20,130 All you're trying to do at the SRR, System Requirements 750 00:37:20,130 --> 00:37:23,380 Review, is agree on what the requirements are, 751 00:37:23,380 --> 00:37:27,270 what the system should achieve, but not necessarily how 752 00:37:27,270 --> 00:37:28,770 that will be achieved. 753 00:37:28,770 --> 00:37:32,070 And then at CDR, I would say it's too late. 754 00:37:32,070 --> 00:37:35,160 The CDR is where you lay out all the details 755 00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:38,860 of how the system will be built, operated, the software. 756 00:37:38,860 --> 00:37:42,420 So that the high level design, the concept, the architecture, 757 00:37:42,420 --> 00:37:46,740 should have been decided and agreed upon way before the CDR, 758 00:37:46,740 --> 00:37:49,000 and it's the PDR where that's happening. 759 00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:53,980 So I think about 3/4 of you got it right here. 760 00:37:53,980 --> 00:37:58,074 The next one was a little subtle question. 761 00:37:58,074 --> 00:37:59,740 What are the following attributes should 762 00:37:59,740 --> 00:38:02,250 a set of requirements meet? 763 00:38:02,250 --> 00:38:05,460 And I put check marks here between what were the-- 764 00:38:05,460 --> 00:38:08,740 so there were multiple correct answers. 765 00:38:08,740 --> 00:38:11,820 The set of requirements means multiple, 766 00:38:11,820 --> 00:38:13,800 an ensemble of requirements, as opposed 767 00:38:13,800 --> 00:38:16,590 to just a single requirement in isolation. 768 00:38:16,590 --> 00:38:21,300 So, feasible, verifiable, and unambiguous, 769 00:38:21,300 --> 00:38:25,830 those three answers are correct for individual requirements. 770 00:38:25,830 --> 00:38:29,190 Each individual requirement should be feasible, verifiable, 771 00:38:29,190 --> 00:38:30,960 and unambiguous. 772 00:38:30,960 --> 00:38:32,940 But when you look at a set of requirements, 773 00:38:32,940 --> 00:38:36,830 that's when these other three come into play, 774 00:38:36,830 --> 00:38:38,530 absence of redundancy. 775 00:38:38,530 --> 00:38:41,460 So what this means is that you shouldn't replicate 776 00:38:41,460 --> 00:38:43,110 the same requirement, essentially, 777 00:38:43,110 --> 00:38:47,190 across multiple requirements in your requirements set. 778 00:38:47,190 --> 00:38:48,780 And one of the reasons for that is 779 00:38:48,780 --> 00:38:51,840 if you change a requirement then you might miss it 780 00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:52,910 somewhere else, right. 781 00:38:52,910 --> 00:38:57,390 This redundancy is-- keep it as simple, as straightforward 782 00:38:57,390 --> 00:38:58,950 as you can. 783 00:38:58,950 --> 00:39:01,380 Completeness, that basically means 784 00:39:01,380 --> 00:39:03,630 that the requirements set that you develop 785 00:39:03,630 --> 00:39:05,190 should cover all the requirements. 786 00:39:05,190 --> 00:39:08,640 You shouldn't have big holes and missing requirements. 787 00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:12,060 And then the last point is absence of conflicts. 788 00:39:12,060 --> 00:39:14,820 If you have requirements conflicts, essentially, 789 00:39:14,820 --> 00:39:19,510 what this means is there's no feasible solution. 790 00:39:19,510 --> 00:39:22,440 So if you think about optimization, 791 00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:24,450 you have an over-constrained problem. 792 00:39:24,450 --> 00:39:26,330 Basically, that's what that means. 793 00:39:26,330 --> 00:39:27,450 OK? 794 00:39:27,450 --> 00:39:30,500 Any questions about these two? 795 00:39:30,500 --> 00:39:35,250 AUDIENCE: Yes, I have a question for question five. 796 00:39:35,250 --> 00:39:37,870 I think the question is a little bit 797 00:39:37,870 --> 00:39:40,850 ambiguous because if the main concept is 798 00:39:40,850 --> 00:39:42,530 selected on the PDR-- 799 00:39:42,530 --> 00:39:47,330 on a timescale on the CDR, you have the main concept. 800 00:39:47,330 --> 00:39:52,860 So you can say that on the CDR, it's 801 00:39:52,860 --> 00:39:56,610 also the main concept selected already. 802 00:39:56,610 --> 00:40:00,000 OLIVIER DE WECK: Ah, I see what you're saying. 803 00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:02,790 Yeah, so maybe I should have said, 804 00:40:02,790 --> 00:40:07,110 what is the earliest milestone at which the concept-- 805 00:40:07,110 --> 00:40:09,750 that's really what I meant, is what's 806 00:40:09,750 --> 00:40:14,400 the milestone where the concept has to be agreed upon, and then 807 00:40:14,400 --> 00:40:15,450 of course, at the CDR-- 808 00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:20,930 unless you had to overturn your concept selection, 809 00:40:20,930 --> 00:40:23,060 which happens sometimes-- 810 00:40:23,060 --> 00:40:25,500 you should stick with the same. 811 00:40:25,500 --> 00:40:28,400 But the intent here was to say, this is PDR. 812 00:40:28,400 --> 00:40:30,160 OK, go ahead. 813 00:40:30,160 --> 00:40:32,980 AUDIENCE: For this question, number five, 814 00:40:32,980 --> 00:40:36,200 I think I got concepts of operations confused 815 00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:37,770 with the concept architecture. 816 00:40:37,770 --> 00:40:42,050 So just to be clear about that, the concept of operations 817 00:40:42,050 --> 00:40:46,880 is what the system does, and architecture 818 00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:49,996 just a list of the subsystems and what are the mass, energy, 819 00:40:49,996 --> 00:40:50,870 and information flow? 820 00:40:50,870 --> 00:40:51,920 Is that correct? 821 00:40:51,920 --> 00:40:53,170 OLIVIER DE WECK: That's right. 822 00:40:53,170 --> 00:40:56,060 The concept of operations, that's actually an SRR type. 823 00:40:56,060 --> 00:40:57,200 The concept of operations-- 824 00:40:57,200 --> 00:40:57,650 AUDIENCE: That's what I put. 825 00:40:57,650 --> 00:41:00,200 OLIVIER DE WECK: --how will the system be used, right? 826 00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:02,900 And then the concept, the architecture 827 00:41:02,900 --> 00:41:06,050 is, given this concept of operations, 828 00:41:06,050 --> 00:41:08,330 what are the functions that have to happen, 829 00:41:08,330 --> 00:41:10,910 and then which chunks in your system 830 00:41:10,910 --> 00:41:13,010 support or enable what functions? 831 00:41:13,010 --> 00:41:15,201 That's essentially what it is. 832 00:41:15,201 --> 00:41:16,464 Yep. 833 00:41:16,464 --> 00:41:20,870 OK, anything else? 834 00:41:20,870 --> 00:41:23,540 All right, question seven. 835 00:41:23,540 --> 00:41:26,040 I think most of you got this right. 836 00:41:26,040 --> 00:41:28,670 We're going to get to verification and validation 837 00:41:28,670 --> 00:41:31,880 in a lot more detail, but there is a distinction. 838 00:41:31,880 --> 00:41:36,150 Some people use verification and validation interchangeably. 839 00:41:36,150 --> 00:41:37,850 They think it's the same. 840 00:41:37,850 --> 00:41:39,530 It's different words for the same thing. 841 00:41:39,530 --> 00:41:41,810 That's not quite the case. 842 00:41:41,810 --> 00:41:43,970 So here you've got your verification loop 843 00:41:43,970 --> 00:41:45,080 and your validation loop. 844 00:41:50,360 --> 00:41:55,070 To put it very succinctly, in verification, 845 00:41:55,070 --> 00:41:56,900 you're answering the question, did you 846 00:41:56,900 --> 00:42:00,890 satisfy the requirements as they were written? 847 00:42:00,890 --> 00:42:02,390 That's the inner loop. 848 00:42:02,390 --> 00:42:04,370 You've got your requirements set, 849 00:42:04,370 --> 00:42:07,130 and then you do verification, or inspection, 850 00:42:07,130 --> 00:42:09,350 or there's different ways of checking that. 851 00:42:09,350 --> 00:42:12,440 But you check, do we meet the requirements 852 00:42:12,440 --> 00:42:14,200 as they were written? 853 00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:15,230 That's the inner loop. 854 00:42:15,230 --> 00:42:19,640 And then validation is the outer loop where you say, 855 00:42:19,640 --> 00:42:23,510 go back to the stakeholders, and then you say the CONOPS, 856 00:42:23,510 --> 00:42:26,450 right-- can we actually execute the CONOPS-- 857 00:42:26,450 --> 00:42:29,420 and does the system meet the expectations 858 00:42:29,420 --> 00:42:30,320 of the stakeholders? 859 00:42:30,320 --> 00:42:32,570 Does it deliver value to them? 860 00:42:32,570 --> 00:42:34,590 And so it's quite possible-- and there 861 00:42:34,590 --> 00:42:38,300 are examples of systems that actually successfully pass 862 00:42:38,300 --> 00:42:39,200 verification. 863 00:42:39,200 --> 00:42:42,080 You can check every requirements, say, yup, yup, 864 00:42:42,080 --> 00:42:43,740 yup, we can do that. 865 00:42:43,740 --> 00:42:46,760 And then you demonstrate the product, or the system, 866 00:42:46,760 --> 00:42:50,690 to the stakeholders, and they say, oh no, that's not at all 867 00:42:50,690 --> 00:42:52,340 what we were looking for. 868 00:42:52,340 --> 00:42:56,480 And then the question is, well, did you change your mind? 869 00:42:56,480 --> 00:42:58,510 You know, customer, beneficiary-- 870 00:42:58,510 --> 00:43:02,660 did you change the mind from today to when we started this 871 00:43:02,660 --> 00:43:08,510 project, or was there some error in translation going from 872 00:43:08,510 --> 00:43:09,246 the stake-- 873 00:43:09,246 --> 00:43:11,120 or the stakeholders didn't change their mind. 874 00:43:11,120 --> 00:43:14,480 You know, their use cases, their CONOPS, 875 00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:17,300 the value they want to get from the system 876 00:43:17,300 --> 00:43:19,310 hasn't changed since you started the project, 877 00:43:19,310 --> 00:43:21,380 but there was some error in translation 878 00:43:21,380 --> 00:43:24,410 between those high level stakeholder expectations 879 00:43:24,410 --> 00:43:25,990 and then the requirements. 880 00:43:25,990 --> 00:43:28,040 No, maybe you missed a requirement. 881 00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:31,250 So that's the key idea here between V and B, 882 00:43:31,250 --> 00:43:36,410 and we'll talk a lot more about this in the next few weeks. 883 00:43:36,410 --> 00:43:38,420 All right, now comes the one you've all 884 00:43:38,420 --> 00:43:40,730 been waiting for, I know. 885 00:43:40,730 --> 00:43:43,220 Question eight. 886 00:43:43,220 --> 00:43:45,490 So here's the rocket equation. 887 00:43:45,490 --> 00:43:49,520 Delta v, the change in velocity of a rocket that you can 888 00:43:49,520 --> 00:43:54,770 achieve is equal to gravity times the specific impulse 889 00:43:54,770 --> 00:43:57,770 times the log of your initial mass-- 890 00:43:57,770 --> 00:44:01,490 so this is your rocket on the launch pad-- 891 00:44:01,490 --> 00:44:06,080 and over M i, which is the final mass after the burn 892 00:44:06,080 --> 00:44:08,120 has happened. 893 00:44:08,120 --> 00:44:10,970 And so, one thing that's important 894 00:44:10,970 --> 00:44:13,340 is to define those masses. 895 00:44:13,340 --> 00:44:15,760 And we got a lot of emails. 896 00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:17,090 Right, [INAUDIBLE]? 897 00:44:17,090 --> 00:44:18,830 Would you say this was probably the most 898 00:44:18,830 --> 00:44:20,922 emails we've gotten all semester-- is 899 00:44:20,922 --> 00:44:21,755 about this question? 900 00:44:21,755 --> 00:44:24,080 AUDIENCE: Yeah. 901 00:44:24,080 --> 00:44:25,820 OLIVIER DE WECK: So a bunch of questions 902 00:44:25,820 --> 00:44:29,000 were just about the definition of mass fraction. 903 00:44:29,000 --> 00:44:30,620 What is the mass fraction? 904 00:44:30,620 --> 00:44:32,840 And there are really two different interpretations 905 00:44:32,840 --> 00:44:33,524 of it. 906 00:44:33,524 --> 00:44:34,940 And it turned out it didn't matter 907 00:44:34,940 --> 00:44:37,700 which one you used because the answer was the same. 908 00:44:37,700 --> 00:44:39,560 So the one that I'm showing you here 909 00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:46,060 is that the initial mass here is 1 plus alpha times M 910 00:44:46,060 --> 00:44:49,320 f, your mass of fuel, plus your payload. 911 00:44:49,320 --> 00:44:52,850 So in this case, alpha is the percentage 912 00:44:52,850 --> 00:44:55,430 of the mass that you're launching, 913 00:44:55,430 --> 00:44:57,080 the fuel and the payload-- 914 00:44:57,080 --> 00:44:58,580 that's made up of structure, which 915 00:44:58,580 --> 00:45:02,600 includes tankage, support structure, the engines 916 00:45:02,600 --> 00:45:04,220 themselves, et cetera. 917 00:45:04,220 --> 00:45:07,820 The other definition you could use which is equally valid, 918 00:45:07,820 --> 00:45:11,090 you just have to define it, is that alpha is only applied 919 00:45:11,090 --> 00:45:12,950 to the fuel mass, right. 920 00:45:12,950 --> 00:45:15,650 That you've got the fuel, which in this case 921 00:45:15,650 --> 00:45:18,830 is liquid oxygen, liquid hydrogen. 922 00:45:18,830 --> 00:45:21,500 And then you have your tanks and your engine. 923 00:45:21,500 --> 00:45:22,610 That's your mass fraction. 924 00:45:22,610 --> 00:45:24,830 And then the payload sits on top, 925 00:45:24,830 --> 00:45:28,290 and there's no overhead for carrying the payload. 926 00:45:28,290 --> 00:45:30,830 And either way, it didn't matter in this question 927 00:45:30,830 --> 00:45:32,670 because the answer was the same. 928 00:45:32,670 --> 00:45:36,440 So here the initial mass is 1 plus alpha times 929 00:45:36,440 --> 00:45:39,350 the mass of the fuel, which is unknown, 930 00:45:39,350 --> 00:45:44,780 and the mass of the payload, which is given, 20 metric tons. 931 00:45:44,780 --> 00:45:49,040 And then M1 is simply alpha times mass of the fuel and mass 932 00:45:49,040 --> 00:45:50,430 of the payload. 933 00:45:50,430 --> 00:45:53,780 So you can slightly rearrange-- there are different ways 934 00:45:53,780 --> 00:45:56,210 of solving this problem. 935 00:45:56,210 --> 00:45:57,440 A simple way is this. 936 00:45:57,440 --> 00:45:59,660 You just basically bring the constants 937 00:45:59,660 --> 00:46:01,410 over to the left side. 938 00:46:01,410 --> 00:46:07,760 So delta V over g i s p, and then basically, the right side 939 00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:09,080 has to be larger than that. 940 00:46:09,080 --> 00:46:13,670 So this is essentially your 1 plus alpha divided by alpha 941 00:46:13,670 --> 00:46:16,880 because the M f plus M p term falls out, 942 00:46:16,880 --> 00:46:18,860 if you formulated that way. 943 00:46:18,860 --> 00:46:21,080 So you can just plug in the numbers that 944 00:46:21,080 --> 00:46:22,970 were given in the problem, and you 945 00:46:22,970 --> 00:46:26,450 can see that the left hand side does not match the right hand 946 00:46:26,450 --> 00:46:28,500 side, right? 947 00:46:28,500 --> 00:46:32,010 And the conclusion from this-- 948 00:46:32,010 --> 00:46:34,110 some of you tried to solve for the fuel mass. 949 00:46:34,110 --> 00:46:35,610 You know, there's all kinds of ways. 950 00:46:35,610 --> 00:46:39,480 And it's super frustrating, and I know a lot of you 951 00:46:39,480 --> 00:46:42,210 spent a lot of time trying to solve this problem. 952 00:46:42,210 --> 00:46:46,350 And no matter what way, you get negative fuel mass. 953 00:46:46,350 --> 00:46:47,790 You get all kinds of weird things 954 00:46:47,790 --> 00:46:49,260 trying to make this work. 955 00:46:49,260 --> 00:46:55,550 The bottom line is infeasible requirement. 956 00:46:55,550 --> 00:46:59,150 It's not possible with the required-- 957 00:46:59,150 --> 00:47:02,960 this is an example of an infeasible requirement. 958 00:47:02,960 --> 00:47:08,120 And I did this on purpose to show you 959 00:47:08,120 --> 00:47:13,870 that just because somebody writes a requirement down, 960 00:47:13,870 --> 00:47:16,640 it doesn't mean it's feasible. 961 00:47:16,640 --> 00:47:20,960 So I think many of you got this and were frustrated by it, 962 00:47:20,960 --> 00:47:24,950 but I want to show you a real project where this happened. 963 00:47:24,950 --> 00:47:27,980 So you could then ask, well, what would we 964 00:47:27,980 --> 00:47:29,870 have to do to make it feasible? 965 00:47:29,870 --> 00:47:33,410 So some of you said, well, maybe we can achieve less delta V? 966 00:47:33,410 --> 00:47:37,070 Or we need even better propulsion, higher i s p. 967 00:47:37,070 --> 00:47:41,810 Or-- which is maybe a little bit more straightforward, what 968 00:47:41,810 --> 00:47:44,570 would be the mass fraction, the alpha, that you would have 969 00:47:44,570 --> 00:47:46,890 to achieve to make this work? 970 00:47:46,890 --> 00:47:50,360 And the answer is somewhere around 8%, 971 00:47:50,360 --> 00:47:52,970 depending on which definition of mass fraction you used, 972 00:47:52,970 --> 00:47:56,120 it's 7% to 8%. 973 00:47:56,120 --> 00:48:00,170 So it means that if you want to achieve single stage to orbit 974 00:48:00,170 --> 00:48:05,570 flight with no staging, which is the current way we do it, 975 00:48:05,570 --> 00:48:09,950 you have to get the mass fraction below 8%. 976 00:48:09,950 --> 00:48:14,820 And that includes everything, the tanks, the support 977 00:48:14,820 --> 00:48:16,890 structure, the engines. 978 00:48:16,890 --> 00:48:19,350 And that's really, really, really tough. 979 00:48:19,350 --> 00:48:23,400 So I know you were frustrated by this problem many of you, 980 00:48:23,400 --> 00:48:26,940 but let me tell you this story. 981 00:48:26,940 --> 00:48:29,710 Those folks were really frustrated. 982 00:48:29,710 --> 00:48:32,280 So there was actually a program here 983 00:48:32,280 --> 00:48:39,480 in the US in the late '90s that tried to as a small scale 984 00:48:39,480 --> 00:48:43,080 technology demonstrator demonstrate the technologies 985 00:48:43,080 --> 00:48:45,930 required to get to orbit with a single stage vehicle. 986 00:48:45,930 --> 00:48:50,460 And that program was called the X-33, run by Lockheed Martin-- 987 00:48:50,460 --> 00:48:53,340 so, single stage to orbit, reusable launch vehicle 988 00:48:53,340 --> 00:48:54,910 demonstrator. 989 00:48:54,910 --> 00:49:00,710 The target mass, this is your M 0, total mass, 130 metric tons. 990 00:49:00,710 --> 00:49:03,990 The target mass fraction was 0.1. 991 00:49:03,990 --> 00:49:10,350 And fuel was just the same as in this problem, LOX hydrogen. 992 00:49:10,350 --> 00:49:16,860 And the project basically was canceled in 2001 993 00:49:16,860 --> 00:49:21,810 after about $1.3 billion had been spent on it, 994 00:49:21,810 --> 00:49:25,350 and the thing that eventually really led to the cancellation 995 00:49:25,350 --> 00:49:27,300 was the fuel tank. 996 00:49:27,300 --> 00:49:29,850 There was a composite material fuel tank 997 00:49:29,850 --> 00:49:33,740 that was embedded inside the wing here, inside this body, 998 00:49:33,740 --> 00:49:35,910 has very complex shape. 999 00:49:35,910 --> 00:49:39,330 And those of you that know about-- hydrogen atoms 1000 00:49:39,330 --> 00:49:40,470 are very, very small. 1001 00:49:40,470 --> 00:49:47,890 It's very tough to contain hydrogen. It wants to leak. 1002 00:49:47,890 --> 00:49:50,130 Its natural tendency is to leak out. 1003 00:49:50,130 --> 00:49:53,220 So this composite fuel tank basically 1004 00:49:53,220 --> 00:49:57,210 couldn't be built and tested under pressure 1005 00:49:57,210 --> 00:49:59,190 to be leak proof, and they really tried. 1006 00:49:59,190 --> 00:50:02,430 They spent a lot of money on it, a lot of effort, 1007 00:50:02,430 --> 00:50:03,660 couldn't be done. 1008 00:50:03,660 --> 00:50:06,270 And so NASA concluded, you know-- 1009 00:50:06,270 --> 00:50:11,700 and the goal was to achieve, essentially, this mass fraction 1010 00:50:11,700 --> 00:50:14,940 of 10% or below. 1011 00:50:14,940 --> 00:50:18,720 And at that time, in the late '90s, early 2000s, 1012 00:50:18,720 --> 00:50:22,450 this was just not feasible with the state of technology. 1013 00:50:22,450 --> 00:50:25,900 And so, think about how frustrated-- 1014 00:50:25,900 --> 00:50:29,040 I know you spent an hour or so trying to solve this, 1015 00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:31,620 and we're not happy about it. 1016 00:50:31,620 --> 00:50:35,040 But think about how they felt. So the purpose of this-- 1017 00:50:35,040 --> 00:50:37,080 I think most of this midterm exam 1018 00:50:37,080 --> 00:50:42,227 was kind of a gift up until this question. 1019 00:50:42,227 --> 00:50:44,310 AUDIENCE: I was wondering about the mass fraction. 1020 00:50:44,310 --> 00:50:48,550 I read the text over there, and it says it's suborbital. 1021 00:50:48,550 --> 00:50:52,290 So was the plan to reduce the mass fraction even further 1022 00:50:52,290 --> 00:50:53,400 if this was a success? 1023 00:50:53,400 --> 00:50:55,260 OLIVIER DE WECK: Right, so this would not 1024 00:50:55,260 --> 00:50:58,110 have achieved orbital velocity. 1025 00:50:58,110 --> 00:50:59,580 So it's not a complete one to one 1026 00:50:59,580 --> 00:51:03,030 map because I gave you also a higher delta V, right? 1027 00:51:03,030 --> 00:51:05,820 I gave you 11 kilometers per second, 1028 00:51:05,820 --> 00:51:11,010 which is escape velocity, and you need to achieve about 7.5. 1029 00:51:11,010 --> 00:51:13,590 But with drag and gravity losses, 1030 00:51:13,590 --> 00:51:16,900 you really needed achieve about 9, 9.5. 1031 00:51:16,900 --> 00:51:22,050 So it's not a one to one map, but you sort of get the idea. 1032 00:51:22,050 --> 00:51:24,300 Any question about this at EPFL? 1033 00:51:28,621 --> 00:51:29,370 Did you hear this? 1034 00:51:29,370 --> 00:51:31,980 Was it was it fairly clear? 1035 00:51:31,980 --> 00:51:33,620 AUDIENCE: Yeah, I think everything 1036 00:51:33,620 --> 00:51:34,495 is clear on our side. 1037 00:51:34,495 --> 00:51:35,328 OLIVIER DE WECK: OK. 1038 00:51:35,328 --> 00:51:36,130 AUDIENCE: Thanks. 1039 00:51:36,130 --> 00:51:37,671 OLIVIER DE WECK: All right, so if you 1040 00:51:37,671 --> 00:51:40,100 want to read more about the X-33, 1041 00:51:40,100 --> 00:51:42,830 the Wikipedia article is pretty good and there's a lot. 1042 00:51:42,830 --> 00:51:46,120 So just to say, you know, I think 1043 00:51:46,120 --> 00:51:47,690 we're going to try this again. 1044 00:51:47,690 --> 00:51:49,730 I think there's going to be new efforts. 1045 00:51:49,730 --> 00:51:52,070 Composite materials have come a long way-- 1046 00:51:52,070 --> 00:51:55,980 composite manufacturing, 15 years later, 1047 00:51:55,980 --> 00:51:59,280 we might try this again pretty soon. 1048 00:51:59,280 --> 00:52:02,960 OK, question nine. 1049 00:52:02,960 --> 00:52:06,500 So this was a little bit of computation here. 1050 00:52:06,500 --> 00:52:09,650 So the intent of this question was 1051 00:52:09,650 --> 00:52:11,840 for you to think about competing objectives. 1052 00:52:11,840 --> 00:52:16,310 Right, the Pareto frontiers, we talked about this 1053 00:52:16,310 --> 00:52:18,030 in the concept selection. 1054 00:52:18,030 --> 00:52:23,480 So this is the idea of, you're designing a can or container 1055 00:52:23,480 --> 00:52:25,280 for containing liquids. 1056 00:52:25,280 --> 00:52:29,060 The shape is cylindrical as shown in red. 1057 00:52:29,060 --> 00:52:31,580 And so the two things you care about is volume. 1058 00:52:31,580 --> 00:52:34,880 How much liquid can you carry inside the can? 1059 00:52:34,880 --> 00:52:39,530 That's simply pi r-squared h-- 1060 00:52:39,530 --> 00:52:42,530 and then your surface area, which 1061 00:52:42,530 --> 00:52:44,780 you could say that's the cost of the container, right. 1062 00:52:44,780 --> 00:52:48,980 That's the amount of material you need to use, is 2 pi r. 1063 00:52:48,980 --> 00:52:50,840 Those at the top and bottom. 1064 00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:55,490 And then 2 r pi h, which is your circumference. 1065 00:52:55,490 --> 00:52:59,750 And if you then plot four different combinations 1066 00:52:59,750 --> 00:53:04,760 of radius and height, what is the volume and surface 1067 00:53:04,760 --> 00:53:07,280 area, which is shown in this plot here? 1068 00:53:07,280 --> 00:53:11,990 Surface area as the y-axis and volume on the x-axis. 1069 00:53:15,560 --> 00:53:17,570 The idea is you want to maximize volume 1070 00:53:17,570 --> 00:53:21,920 while minimizing surface area by changing 1071 00:53:21,920 --> 00:53:24,920 the radius and the height subject to these constraints 1072 00:53:24,920 --> 00:53:27,470 shown here, you should have gotten something that 1073 00:53:27,470 --> 00:53:29,570 looks like this blue curve. 1074 00:53:29,570 --> 00:53:33,050 This is the Pareto frontier, and the question was, well, 1075 00:53:33,050 --> 00:53:35,150 where's the Utopia Point? 1076 00:53:35,150 --> 00:53:38,660 The Utopia Point is down to the lower right. 1077 00:53:38,660 --> 00:53:41,330 Maybe you plotted it differently, and that's fine. 1078 00:53:41,330 --> 00:53:43,610 So you want as high a volume as you 1079 00:53:43,610 --> 00:53:50,100 can with minimum surface area, but the best you can achieve-- 1080 00:53:50,100 --> 00:53:52,200 there's nothing in this white space here. 1081 00:53:52,200 --> 00:53:56,090 The best you can achieve is this blue curve and above it. 1082 00:53:56,090 --> 00:54:00,750 And so then I'm plotting to a small and a big one. 1083 00:54:00,750 --> 00:54:04,160 So the Coca-Cola can is shown. 1084 00:54:04,160 --> 00:54:06,720 The soda can is in the lower left corner, 1085 00:54:06,720 --> 00:54:09,200 and you can see it's pretty much on the Pareto front. 1086 00:54:09,200 --> 00:54:14,120 And then this is the standard 55 US gallon oil barrels. 1087 00:54:14,120 --> 00:54:19,070 You know, if you go to like a junkyard or a refinery, 1088 00:54:19,070 --> 00:54:22,430 you'll see these barrels of oil. 1089 00:54:22,430 --> 00:54:25,082 Actually, it's not exactly on the Pareto front, 1090 00:54:25,082 --> 00:54:26,165 but it's very, very close. 1091 00:54:28,850 --> 00:54:31,270 So that was the intent here. 1092 00:54:31,270 --> 00:54:32,870 Any questions about this? 1093 00:54:32,870 --> 00:54:33,543 Yes? 1094 00:54:33,543 --> 00:54:35,709 AUDIENCE: Are you trying to determine whether or not 1095 00:54:35,709 --> 00:54:39,952 the oil and the soda can were on the Pareto front, 1096 00:54:39,952 --> 00:54:46,990 didn't that depend on how you defined the assumptions? 1097 00:54:46,990 --> 00:54:49,690 OLIVIER DE WECK: Not really, one of the key assumptions 1098 00:54:49,690 --> 00:54:53,860 that was given was that you should assume zero thickness. 1099 00:54:53,860 --> 00:54:56,120 Right, so it's just a volume versus surface. 1100 00:54:56,120 --> 00:54:58,890 There's no actual thickness. 1101 00:54:58,890 --> 00:55:00,342 AUDIENCE: In terms of the-- 1102 00:55:04,480 --> 00:55:07,590 I need to double check the-- 1103 00:55:07,590 --> 00:55:11,980 so when I looked at the height of the different cans, 1104 00:55:11,980 --> 00:55:14,710 were we supposed to leave the problem as defined 1105 00:55:14,710 --> 00:55:19,300 in terms of the original units? 1106 00:55:19,300 --> 00:55:21,880 If you updated the units as the maximum height 1107 00:55:21,880 --> 00:55:26,530 to be within a more reasonable range, not 2 meters versus 900 1108 00:55:26,530 --> 00:55:32,140 millimeters, neither point was on the Pareto front. 1109 00:55:32,140 --> 00:55:35,000 It just depended on how well you defined your upper limit to be. 1110 00:55:35,000 --> 00:55:35,390 OLIVIER DE WECK: Oh, I see. 1111 00:55:35,390 --> 00:55:36,730 AUDIENCE: And I was wondering if we were expected 1112 00:55:36,730 --> 00:55:38,680 to maintain the original upper limit, 1113 00:55:38,680 --> 00:55:40,440 or if we were allowed to change it. 1114 00:55:40,440 --> 00:55:42,564 OLIVIER DE WECK: Oh, if you change it, that's fine. 1115 00:55:42,564 --> 00:55:43,880 AUDIENCE: OK. 1116 00:55:43,880 --> 00:55:45,880 OLIVIER DE WECK: The basic idea of this question 1117 00:55:45,880 --> 00:55:49,170 was to understand what is a Pareto frontier. 1118 00:55:53,600 --> 00:55:56,910 And you know, to actually think about something 1119 00:55:56,910 --> 00:56:00,430 we use almost every day. 1120 00:56:00,430 --> 00:56:03,610 You know, we drink a soda or something like that, 1121 00:56:03,610 --> 00:56:07,240 and that shape is not a randomly selected shape. 1122 00:56:07,240 --> 00:56:09,160 It's actually based on a trade off 1123 00:56:09,160 --> 00:56:15,250 between volume and efficiency-- right, volume and surface area. 1124 00:56:15,250 --> 00:56:19,030 And here you go, here's where it falls on the Pareto frontier. 1125 00:56:19,030 --> 00:56:20,770 That's sort of the general idea. 1126 00:56:20,770 --> 00:56:22,870 Well, we haven't graded the exams yet, 1127 00:56:22,870 --> 00:56:26,900 but I think we'll be fairly generous on this question. 1128 00:56:26,900 --> 00:56:30,840 OK, so then the last one was really the-- 1129 00:56:30,840 --> 00:56:35,380 that's very recent happenings. 1130 00:56:35,380 --> 00:56:37,510 If you read the article, you realized, wow, 1131 00:56:37,510 --> 00:56:39,562 there's kind of a prehistory here. 1132 00:56:39,562 --> 00:56:41,770 This is not just something that happened a month ago. 1133 00:56:41,770 --> 00:56:46,000 There's a long history leading up to this emissions scandal, 1134 00:56:46,000 --> 00:56:52,070 and the key table in the article is this table shown here. 1135 00:56:52,070 --> 00:56:56,230 It's essentially these n o x numbers 1136 00:56:56,230 --> 00:56:59,410 for emissions where you had the different-- so these 1137 00:56:59,410 --> 00:57:00,520 are requirements. 1138 00:57:00,520 --> 00:57:03,010 These are regulatory requirements. 1139 00:57:03,010 --> 00:57:06,820 And a big part of the story is that the requirements-- 1140 00:57:06,820 --> 00:57:09,730 this is just for diesel engines, the supplies 1141 00:57:09,730 --> 00:57:15,610 for diesel engines in the US and in Europe are different. 1142 00:57:15,610 --> 00:57:18,670 And so you can see that the limit is essentially 1143 00:57:18,670 --> 00:57:20,750 the regulatory requirement. 1144 00:57:20,750 --> 00:57:23,920 The dyno shown in green here is demonstrate-- 1145 00:57:23,920 --> 00:57:27,220 this is verification. 1146 00:57:27,220 --> 00:57:30,220 Did you satisfy the requirement as written? 1147 00:57:30,220 --> 00:57:35,350 And you can argue that because these vehicles had software 1148 00:57:35,350 --> 00:57:38,320 in them, the purpose of the software 1149 00:57:38,320 --> 00:57:41,350 was to detect whether or not the vehicle is 1150 00:57:41,350 --> 00:57:43,240 being tested for emissions. 1151 00:57:43,240 --> 00:57:46,720 And the reason you can do it is because the drive cycles 1152 00:57:46,720 --> 00:57:48,160 are very tightly prescribed. 1153 00:57:48,160 --> 00:57:51,160 So if the vehicle is operating exactly 1154 00:57:51,160 --> 00:57:52,960 at the speeds and velocities that 1155 00:57:52,960 --> 00:57:56,830 correspond one to one to those test drive cycles, 1156 00:57:56,830 --> 00:58:00,190 the software knew, ah, I'm being tested for emissions. 1157 00:58:03,490 --> 00:58:06,520 And you know, it's like knowing that you're 1158 00:58:06,520 --> 00:58:08,230 being watched as a kid, and you're 1159 00:58:08,230 --> 00:58:11,950 behaving because you know you're being watched. 1160 00:58:11,950 --> 00:58:14,230 And then whenever you think you're not being watched, 1161 00:58:14,230 --> 00:58:15,700 you do something very different. 1162 00:58:15,700 --> 00:58:17,420 That's the general idea. 1163 00:58:17,420 --> 00:58:20,830 So the green was basically the dyno results 1164 00:58:20,830 --> 00:58:25,690 with the cheating, essentially, with the software embedded. 1165 00:58:25,690 --> 00:58:29,470 And then the West Virginia University results, 1166 00:58:29,470 --> 00:58:31,960 which were this independent testing, 1167 00:58:31,960 --> 00:58:36,760 showed that the actual emissions during regular operations 1168 00:58:36,760 --> 00:58:41,780 were about 30 times worse than this. 1169 00:58:41,780 --> 00:58:45,670 And the trade off here is, of course, with fuel efficiency. 1170 00:58:45,670 --> 00:58:47,950 That's the big trade off. 1171 00:58:47,950 --> 00:58:52,900 And so, we haven't read your answers yet to this question, 1172 00:58:52,900 --> 00:58:55,810 but it's extremely relevant to system engineering 1173 00:58:55,810 --> 00:58:58,000 and in particular, to the distinction 1174 00:58:58,000 --> 00:59:01,900 between verification and validation. 1175 00:59:01,900 --> 00:59:05,200 So you can argue that verification was passed here 1176 00:59:05,200 --> 00:59:08,170 because it passes the dyno test. 1177 00:59:08,170 --> 00:59:11,830 These are the regulatory tests that are prescribed, 1178 00:59:11,830 --> 00:59:14,290 but it fails, essentially, in the field 1179 00:59:14,290 --> 00:59:16,120 to satisfy the requirements. 1180 00:59:18,850 --> 00:59:22,390 And of course, Volkswagen has admitted 1181 00:59:22,390 --> 00:59:24,880 that they cheated in essence. 1182 00:59:24,880 --> 00:59:29,050 But I'll be very interested to see how the legal side of this 1183 00:59:29,050 --> 00:59:34,920 works out because if you interpret this very narrowly-- 1184 00:59:34,920 --> 00:59:39,130 and you cannot say that those vehicles failed their emission 1185 00:59:39,130 --> 00:59:43,740 standard tests because they've performed properly on the dyno. 1186 00:59:43,740 --> 00:59:47,370 So to what extent are these requirements, 1187 00:59:47,370 --> 00:59:50,790 these environmental requirements, which are very, 1188 00:59:50,790 --> 00:59:52,950 in a sense, narrowly defined in terms 1189 00:59:52,950 --> 00:59:57,040 of how these requirements are verified legally binding 1190 00:59:57,040 --> 01:00:00,570 in terms of being able to perform at those levels 1191 01:00:00,570 --> 01:00:03,570 outside of the drive cycle test cases 1192 01:00:03,570 --> 01:00:05,100 that are prescribed by law? 1193 01:00:05,100 --> 01:00:06,670 Did you see what I'm saying? 1194 01:00:06,670 --> 01:00:10,890 So even though morally, people generally 1195 01:00:10,890 --> 01:00:15,030 say that Volkswagen has cheated because they're essentially 1196 01:00:15,030 --> 01:00:17,580 reconfiguring the vehicle depending on whether it's 1197 01:00:17,580 --> 01:00:20,280 being tested officially or not. 1198 01:00:20,280 --> 01:00:24,660 But from a legal perspective, I'm 1199 01:00:24,660 --> 01:00:27,600 not sure this is fully done yet, so we'll 1200 01:00:27,600 --> 01:00:31,710 have to see how the lawsuits and all these things play out. 1201 01:00:31,710 --> 01:00:33,060 Go ahead [INAUDIBLE]. 1202 01:00:33,060 --> 01:00:34,950 AUDIENCE: Would you would you say that, 1203 01:00:34,950 --> 01:00:38,130 looking at it from the regulators perspective, 1204 01:00:38,130 --> 01:00:41,850 that they had set up an expectation that 1205 01:00:41,850 --> 01:00:43,660 didn't flow into a requirement? 1206 01:00:43,660 --> 01:00:48,400 And if it was a requirement, it was unverifiable until WVU-- 1207 01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:51,770 it was an unverifiable requirement in a sense. 1208 01:00:51,770 --> 01:00:53,520 OLIVIER DE WECK: That's one way to say it. 1209 01:00:53,520 --> 01:00:56,020 And you know, what is the response to this? 1210 01:00:56,020 --> 01:00:59,790 Well, one response could be that a whole bunch of more test 1211 01:00:59,790 --> 01:01:00,390 cases-- 1212 01:01:00,390 --> 01:01:02,910 you know, the actual drive cycles 1213 01:01:02,910 --> 01:01:04,440 that are going to have to be tested 1214 01:01:04,440 --> 01:01:05,580 are going to be much more-- 1215 01:01:08,420 --> 01:01:09,060 I don't know. 1216 01:01:09,060 --> 01:01:09,560 We'll see. 1217 01:01:09,560 --> 01:01:12,740 This is a big deal not just for Volkswagon, 1218 01:01:12,740 --> 01:01:16,760 but I think it's a very big deal in the bigger picture of how 1219 01:01:16,760 --> 01:01:20,390 do regulatory requirements and standards apply 1220 01:01:20,390 --> 01:01:25,960 to all kinds of products, and how do you check them. 1221 01:01:25,960 --> 01:01:29,310 Let's see real quick if there is a question at EPFL. 1222 01:01:29,310 --> 01:01:31,090 Any comments, questions? 1223 01:01:34,090 --> 01:01:36,400 AUDIENCE: Regulation, actually, in Europe, 1224 01:01:36,400 --> 01:01:38,920 it was forbidden and explicitly forbidden 1225 01:01:38,920 --> 01:01:42,296 to introduce a [? defect ?] device in the car. 1226 01:01:42,296 --> 01:01:45,460 OLIVIER DE WECK: Yeah, and there's penalties for that, 1227 01:01:45,460 --> 01:01:47,594 right? 1228 01:01:47,594 --> 01:01:48,710 AUDIENCE: Yes, exactly. 1229 01:01:48,710 --> 01:01:50,226 OLIVIER DE WECK: OK, good. 1230 01:01:50,226 --> 01:01:52,815 Nathan, you had a point? 1231 01:01:52,815 --> 01:01:54,190 NATHAN: I was wondering if you've 1232 01:01:54,190 --> 01:01:58,600 seen any analysis on like WVU doing tests on other vehicles 1233 01:01:58,600 --> 01:02:01,217 to compare what they show on their dyno results versus what 1234 01:02:01,217 --> 01:02:03,550 they're admitting in real life, even though it might not 1235 01:02:03,550 --> 01:02:05,150 be this extreme. 1236 01:02:05,150 --> 01:02:06,400 OLIVIER DE WECK: I don't know. 1237 01:02:06,400 --> 01:02:08,734 I don't know what tests they've done internally. 1238 01:02:08,734 --> 01:02:13,567 AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE] it's like a result [INAUDIBLE]---- 1239 01:02:13,567 --> 01:02:14,400 what do you call it? 1240 01:02:14,400 --> 01:02:18,880 The test being so different from the actual real life driving 1241 01:02:18,880 --> 01:02:21,570 because nobody accelerates from zero to 30 in 30 seconds. 1242 01:02:21,570 --> 01:02:23,660 That's what they've been testing. 1243 01:02:23,660 --> 01:02:25,290 OLIVIER DE WECK: Yeah. 1244 01:02:25,290 --> 01:02:28,050 So there's a real, real strong connection 1245 01:02:28,050 --> 01:02:29,550 here with system engineering. 1246 01:02:29,550 --> 01:02:33,000 And that was the purpose of this question, is to sort of push-- 1247 01:02:33,000 --> 01:02:34,920 this question was not a gift. 1248 01:02:34,920 --> 01:02:37,860 This sort of really required you to dig in, 1249 01:02:37,860 --> 01:02:39,420 and it was very timely, I think. 1250 01:02:42,360 --> 01:02:46,200 So cheat to meet requirements failed validation. 1251 01:02:46,200 --> 01:02:48,750 That's what I would say as a quick summary. 1252 01:02:48,750 --> 01:02:54,610 Any final questions, comments about the online-- 1253 01:02:54,610 --> 01:02:57,052 the quiz, the midterm quiz? 1254 01:02:57,052 --> 01:03:00,760 OK, we've had we've had our interactive discussion 1255 01:03:00,760 --> 01:03:02,690 with the INCOSE board of directors, 1256 01:03:02,690 --> 01:03:04,600 so hopefully you enjoyed that. 1257 01:03:04,600 --> 01:03:12,100 And we are now right on time to hand it over to Octanis. 1258 01:03:12,100 --> 01:03:16,170 And Rafael will present this-- 1259 01:03:16,170 --> 01:03:17,500 Rafael Fabian Tychui. 1260 01:03:17,500 --> 01:03:21,160 So essentially, you'll hear it's about the design manufacturing 1261 01:03:21,160 --> 01:03:24,280 and deployment of a rover for extreme environment-- 1262 01:03:24,280 --> 01:03:26,330 Antarctica, in particular. 1263 01:03:26,330 --> 01:03:29,830 And so, we look forward to Rafael's presentation. 1264 01:03:29,830 --> 01:03:31,870 And as you listen to Rafael, think 1265 01:03:31,870 --> 01:03:33,790 about what you learned in this class 1266 01:03:33,790 --> 01:03:35,920 so far, how does it connect. 1267 01:03:35,920 --> 01:03:38,950 And I think Rafael also tried to gear the presentation a bit 1268 01:03:38,950 --> 01:03:41,680 to the system engineering concepts. 1269 01:03:41,680 --> 01:03:43,105 RAFAEL: So I'm Rafael. 1270 01:03:43,105 --> 01:03:46,390 I'm just going to present myself quickly. 1271 01:03:46,390 --> 01:03:51,640 I'm studying here at my master's in nano and micro-electronics, 1272 01:03:51,640 --> 01:03:54,340 and I'm speaking on behalf of Octanis. 1273 01:03:54,340 --> 01:03:57,670 So just in case, the image quality wouldn't be perfect, 1274 01:03:57,670 --> 01:04:05,360 you can find this presentation at MIT and on tiny.cc/octanis 1275 01:04:05,360 --> 01:04:07,370 just to see the picture. 1276 01:04:07,370 --> 01:04:10,610 And well, Octanis is an association 1277 01:04:10,610 --> 01:04:13,730 that was just recently founded. 1278 01:04:13,730 --> 01:04:15,890 We have certain key values. 1279 01:04:19,340 --> 01:04:21,330 So fascination is one of them. 1280 01:04:21,330 --> 01:04:26,600 We set in-shop goals and then get very passionate about this. 1281 01:04:26,600 --> 01:04:29,510 We want to build affordable products, 1282 01:04:29,510 --> 01:04:34,260 so we use open source software, we 3D print parts, and so on. 1283 01:04:34,260 --> 01:04:37,040 We use off-the-shelf components. 1284 01:04:37,040 --> 01:04:42,280 And we want to do open design, so we share our code on GitHub. 1285 01:04:42,280 --> 01:04:46,410 We share our mechanical designs to the community. 1286 01:04:46,410 --> 01:04:49,850 And one point is also education, so we, ourselves, 1287 01:04:49,850 --> 01:04:53,420 want to learn from what we're doing 1288 01:04:53,420 --> 01:04:56,060 and want to make others benefit from our learning, 1289 01:04:56,060 --> 01:04:59,870 and try to help them, as well, with their projects. 1290 01:04:59,870 --> 01:05:05,630 And how we tackle things is kind of summarized in this statement 1291 01:05:05,630 --> 01:05:11,210 from Tom Chi from Google X. So we minimise the time to try 1292 01:05:11,210 --> 01:05:15,750 things and maximize the time of learning. 1293 01:05:15,750 --> 01:05:19,500 That means we iterate very fast. 1294 01:05:19,500 --> 01:05:20,880 We do a prototype very fast. 1295 01:05:20,880 --> 01:05:23,660 We go on with the idea, with a prototype, 1296 01:05:23,660 --> 01:05:26,360 with a sketch, a design, and so on. 1297 01:05:26,360 --> 01:05:27,250 And we try it. 1298 01:05:27,250 --> 01:05:30,920 If you fail, just move, try the next thing. 1299 01:05:30,920 --> 01:05:34,250 And you know, that's basically how it is. 1300 01:05:34,250 --> 01:05:40,970 And the first project that just emerged out of this procedure 1301 01:05:40,970 --> 01:05:45,750 is Octanis I, so that's what I'm going to talk about today. 1302 01:05:45,750 --> 01:05:48,570 So maybe quickly about the team-- 1303 01:05:48,570 --> 01:05:51,920 so the rule 7 plus minus 1-- 1304 01:05:51,920 --> 01:05:54,840 plus minus 2 applies here as well. 1305 01:05:54,840 --> 01:05:59,240 So we are eight members now working on that rover-- 1306 01:05:59,240 --> 01:06:03,720 from different fields, from engineering, physics, 1307 01:06:03,720 --> 01:06:06,560 life science as well. 1308 01:06:06,560 --> 01:06:10,950 And the story began actually when Sam was here as well. 1309 01:06:10,950 --> 01:06:13,360 For the QHN, just in case. 1310 01:06:13,360 --> 01:06:17,330 And Anna found about this competition or that call 1311 01:06:17,330 --> 01:06:22,610 from Ecuador that was about building-- 1312 01:06:22,610 --> 01:06:28,160 or sending a student project, or whatever, to Antarctica. 1313 01:06:28,160 --> 01:06:30,620 And they thought, well, let's [INAUDIBLE] take 1314 01:06:30,620 --> 01:06:35,740 this challenge, and we're going to put a rover on a weather 1315 01:06:35,740 --> 01:06:39,610 balloon, send it from South America to Antarctica, 1316 01:06:39,610 --> 01:06:43,370 deploy it there, let it drive around for one summer. 1317 01:06:43,370 --> 01:06:45,600 And let's see what happens. 1318 01:06:45,600 --> 01:06:48,350 And well, they started immediately 1319 01:06:48,350 --> 01:06:51,380 with doing simulations. 1320 01:06:51,380 --> 01:06:55,830 There's the online tool that allows to kind of predict 1321 01:06:55,830 --> 01:06:59,890 the optimal time for a trajectory in the air, so 1322 01:06:59,890 --> 01:07:02,390 a particle or an object in the air that 1323 01:07:02,390 --> 01:07:05,300 will have a desired trajectory. 1324 01:07:05,300 --> 01:07:08,630 And you can kind of find out the best moment in the year 1325 01:07:08,630 --> 01:07:09,810 to do this. 1326 01:07:09,810 --> 01:07:13,500 And it was actually demonstrated, kind of, 1327 01:07:13,500 --> 01:07:19,240 to show that this is possible to have this trajectory. 1328 01:07:19,240 --> 01:07:22,460 Well, I heard about this later, and they asked me 1329 01:07:22,460 --> 01:07:25,630 if I could do the electronics design of this-- 1330 01:07:25,630 --> 01:07:27,560 so the main board and so on. 1331 01:07:27,560 --> 01:07:30,450 And I was fascinated by the project, 1332 01:07:30,450 --> 01:07:32,952 so I joined immediately, but at the same time, 1333 01:07:32,952 --> 01:07:35,410 I saw all the challenges that we're going to have to solve. 1334 01:07:35,410 --> 01:07:38,750 So I thought about all the problems we have. 1335 01:07:38,750 --> 01:07:42,600 For instance, what happens if we lose the balloon in the ocean? 1336 01:07:42,600 --> 01:07:46,040 What happens if we run out of power and the temperature 1337 01:07:46,040 --> 01:07:48,030 drops-- 1338 01:07:48,030 --> 01:07:53,130 if an arm breaks, and you know, we cannot get up anymore? 1339 01:07:53,130 --> 01:07:55,850 But at some point, I just realized 1340 01:07:55,850 --> 01:08:00,380 that, well, all we do is we just send a balloon 1341 01:08:00,380 --> 01:08:03,020 with the rover to Antarctica, and we're 1342 01:08:03,020 --> 01:08:05,750 going to deploy it there, and it will drive it down. 1343 01:08:05,750 --> 01:08:07,490 And I think that that's something 1344 01:08:07,490 --> 01:08:10,010 we saw also in this class because I'm 1345 01:08:10,010 --> 01:08:15,800 following this class passively on WebEx and with the videos. 1346 01:08:15,800 --> 01:08:20,640 So yeah, the thing that you have to see 1347 01:08:20,640 --> 01:08:22,970 is the big picture as a system engineer, right. 1348 01:08:22,970 --> 01:08:25,310 You see the whole mission, and you 1349 01:08:25,310 --> 01:08:29,202 don't care about the details at this level. 1350 01:08:29,202 --> 01:08:30,910 But you're going to decompose the problem 1351 01:08:30,910 --> 01:08:34,160 into specific sub-problems and have groups of people 1352 01:08:34,160 --> 01:08:37,859 working on this, and that's it. 1353 01:08:37,859 --> 01:08:40,580 So it just looked easy to me. 1354 01:08:40,580 --> 01:08:42,979 In the end, we're just going to do it, 1355 01:08:42,979 --> 01:08:45,380 and we started with the first problem. 1356 01:08:45,380 --> 01:08:47,300 And just to give you an idea, that's 1357 01:08:47,300 --> 01:08:48,910 one of our last prototypes. 1358 01:08:48,910 --> 01:08:52,800 So that's how the rover is going to look like. 1359 01:08:52,800 --> 01:08:58,670 We see two struts with wheels on each side, solar panels 1360 01:08:58,670 --> 01:09:03,790 and 3D printed parts for 3D printed wheels and struts. 1361 01:09:03,790 --> 01:09:08,050 And you see the balloon in our logo. 1362 01:09:08,050 --> 01:09:10,949 And we're not going to do the balloon right now, 1363 01:09:10,949 --> 01:09:14,990 but the first mission will just be the rover itself. 1364 01:09:14,990 --> 01:09:18,380 And that slide basically summarizes the goal. 1365 01:09:18,380 --> 01:09:22,689 So the mission of Octanis I is to build a reusable autonomous 1366 01:09:22,689 --> 01:09:27,279 solar powered and open source for outdoors, and in this case, 1367 01:09:27,279 --> 01:09:31,819 for an extreme environment like Antarctica. 1368 01:09:31,819 --> 01:09:34,420 So let's go down to V-model, right. 1369 01:09:34,420 --> 01:09:37,370 We'll start with the stakeholder analysis. 1370 01:09:37,370 --> 01:09:40,430 In our case, it's pretty simple. 1371 01:09:40,430 --> 01:09:44,950 It's the Antarctic Institute from Ecuador, 1372 01:09:44,950 --> 01:09:48,520 which we contacted and showed our project, 1373 01:09:48,520 --> 01:09:53,410 and they were pretty happy about this, and I want to learn more. 1374 01:09:53,410 --> 01:09:54,880 So we presented our project. 1375 01:09:54,880 --> 01:09:57,670 We sent in a proposal and are right now, 1376 01:09:57,670 --> 01:10:01,410 writing the final documents for them. 1377 01:10:01,410 --> 01:10:03,400 And what we basically have to provide 1378 01:10:03,400 --> 01:10:08,980 is just the goals of the mission and the scientific findings 1379 01:10:08,980 --> 01:10:11,080 we're going to have, so we will produce a paper 1380 01:10:11,080 --> 01:10:16,630 at the end of this and write about what we found. 1381 01:10:16,630 --> 01:10:21,160 And further down, the V-models, will be the requirements. 1382 01:10:21,160 --> 01:10:25,800 So we can look at some Shall requirements. 1383 01:10:25,800 --> 01:10:29,950 So the power system of the rover shall provide 10 watts 1384 01:10:29,950 --> 01:10:35,540 on average, so we figured that out after 1385 01:10:35,540 --> 01:10:36,940 like riding on a power budget. 1386 01:10:36,940 --> 01:10:42,080 Should We want to drive around that will cost that much power, 1387 01:10:42,080 --> 01:10:47,260 and that will be that much time during the day, and so on. 1388 01:10:47,260 --> 01:10:50,656 So that was the number we came up with. 1389 01:10:50,656 --> 01:10:53,020 Oh, and the interior temperature shall not 1390 01:10:53,020 --> 01:10:56,890 drop below minus 20 degrees Celsius, 1391 01:10:56,890 --> 01:11:00,400 so about 10 Fahrenheit. 1392 01:11:00,400 --> 01:11:06,160 That's basically the point where you cannot charge the battery 1393 01:11:06,160 --> 01:11:12,110 any more because of the chemical composition of it. 1394 01:11:12,110 --> 01:11:13,810 So standard batteries, you shouldn't 1395 01:11:13,810 --> 01:11:16,270 go below minus 10 degrees. 1396 01:11:16,270 --> 01:11:19,840 That's really a hard requirement we have to provide. 1397 01:11:19,840 --> 01:11:23,050 The total weight shall not exceed 2.5 kilograms. 1398 01:11:23,050 --> 01:11:26,770 Basically, we look already for the mission, for the balloons-- 1399 01:11:26,770 --> 01:11:30,730 so it shouldn't be too expensive to put the helium-- 1400 01:11:30,730 --> 01:11:33,010 like, to buy the helium and so on. 1401 01:11:33,010 --> 01:11:36,480 And the rover shall be able to communicate to us 1402 01:11:36,480 --> 01:11:38,090 from any point of the Earth. 1403 01:11:38,090 --> 01:11:42,820 For that, they basically used the Iridium Network, 1404 01:11:42,820 --> 01:11:47,140 which you can pay like for a text message. 1405 01:11:47,140 --> 01:11:51,250 You can pay something and you can send your message 1406 01:11:51,250 --> 01:11:52,350 from any point as well. 1407 01:11:52,350 --> 01:11:55,630 There's a bunch of satellites covering the whole planet 1408 01:11:55,630 --> 01:11:57,850 basically. 1409 01:11:57,850 --> 01:12:02,260 And [INAUDIBLE] managed to climb the slope, a certain slope. 1410 01:12:02,260 --> 01:12:08,050 That's just to assure that we can not just 1411 01:12:08,050 --> 01:12:10,027 drive on flat terrain. 1412 01:12:10,027 --> 01:12:11,610 There's also some should requirements. 1413 01:12:11,610 --> 01:12:13,371 OLIVIER DE WECK: Rafael, quick question. 1414 01:12:13,371 --> 01:12:13,870 RAFAEL: Yes? 1415 01:12:13,870 --> 01:12:16,150 OLIVIER DE WECK: Where did the 14 degrees come from? 1416 01:12:16,150 --> 01:12:19,020 Did you do like a terrain analysis on Antarctica, 1417 01:12:19,020 --> 01:12:22,870 or how did you come up with 14 degrees as the requirement 1418 01:12:22,870 --> 01:12:26,670 for this hill climbing? 1419 01:12:26,670 --> 01:12:29,940 RAFAEL: We basically looked at the motors 1420 01:12:29,940 --> 01:12:33,990 we would have in mind to take, and then figured out 1421 01:12:33,990 --> 01:12:35,940 that that's basically what they can do. 1422 01:12:35,940 --> 01:12:37,117 And we tested it. 1423 01:12:37,117 --> 01:12:38,700 So I'm going to talk about this later. 1424 01:12:38,700 --> 01:12:45,450 We didn't do this up, down only, but we looked at what we have 1425 01:12:45,450 --> 01:12:46,400 and what we can do. 1426 01:12:46,400 --> 01:12:47,900 And that's what we figured out would 1427 01:12:47,900 --> 01:12:51,420 be a reasonable kind of choice, but yeah, good question. 1428 01:12:54,717 --> 01:13:00,410 So the should requirements cover reproducibility, 1429 01:13:00,410 --> 01:13:03,675 so any non-expert should also be able to build 1430 01:13:03,675 --> 01:13:09,570 this rover without being an engineer user as well. 1431 01:13:09,570 --> 01:13:12,780 The cost should stay below $1,000, 1432 01:13:12,780 --> 01:13:16,710 so the material costs only, of course, not the R&D. 1433 01:13:16,710 --> 01:13:19,840 The range should be around 1 kilometers a day. 1434 01:13:19,840 --> 01:13:23,310 That's kind in the order of magnitude of the Curiosity 1435 01:13:23,310 --> 01:13:26,150 Rover, so we're not stressed. 1436 01:13:26,150 --> 01:13:27,360 We don't have to go fast. 1437 01:13:27,360 --> 01:13:33,030 We have weeks or months to be there, so one kilometer per day 1438 01:13:33,030 --> 01:13:35,510 is just fine. 1439 01:13:35,510 --> 01:13:38,810 There should be for a scientific payload. 1440 01:13:38,810 --> 01:13:42,180 Room means physical space and also 1441 01:13:42,180 --> 01:13:46,080 certain conditions like temperature, humidity inside, 1442 01:13:46,080 --> 01:13:48,540 depending on the experiment. 1443 01:13:48,540 --> 01:13:51,740 And well, it should survive one Antarctic summer, 1444 01:13:51,740 --> 01:13:54,390 so that implies also the conditions 1445 01:13:54,390 --> 01:13:59,500 that we have there like the weather and the sun, 1446 01:13:59,500 --> 01:14:02,800 the radiation, and so on. 1447 01:14:02,800 --> 01:14:06,210 So with all of this done, we had our first diagram, 1448 01:14:06,210 --> 01:14:07,790 so pardon the [INAUDIBLE]. 1449 01:14:07,790 --> 01:14:11,170 Our representation is not what we learned in this class, 1450 01:14:11,170 --> 01:14:12,840 but that's what we had, right? 1451 01:14:12,840 --> 01:14:16,650 So this graph is mostly on the electronics. 1452 01:14:16,650 --> 01:14:18,400 It's focused. 1453 01:14:18,400 --> 01:14:21,379 There's a main board in the middle. 1454 01:14:21,379 --> 01:14:22,920 I'm not sure if you see that clearly, 1455 01:14:22,920 --> 01:14:27,090 but a main board with a bunch of sensors up here, 1456 01:14:27,090 --> 01:14:32,200 and also a camera, and RF modules for communications, 1457 01:14:32,200 --> 01:14:35,040 and maxillary board for the scientific payload, 1458 01:14:35,040 --> 01:14:36,336 for instance. 1459 01:14:36,336 --> 01:14:42,450 And we kept going with this, and we basically designed a PCB 1460 01:14:42,450 --> 01:14:43,620 with all these components. 1461 01:14:43,620 --> 01:14:46,400 And most of it worked as well. 1462 01:14:46,400 --> 01:14:50,200 We also thought about the mechanics of course. 1463 01:14:50,200 --> 01:14:56,310 This design is inspired from a NASA project that 1464 01:14:56,310 --> 01:14:59,400 was, in the end, abandoned because it was 1465 01:14:59,400 --> 01:15:02,290 too high in cost, but still-- 1466 01:15:02,290 --> 01:15:05,610 this manner of [INAUDIBLE] was kind 1467 01:15:05,610 --> 01:15:08,580 of having the same structure-- so two struts 1468 01:15:08,580 --> 01:15:12,570 that would allow to flip the rover entirely around if it 1469 01:15:12,570 --> 01:15:16,950 gets clipped by the wind, and also put it more flat 1470 01:15:16,950 --> 01:15:19,920 or align it to the sun, so that it 1471 01:15:19,920 --> 01:15:22,990 gets the maximum of the energy. 1472 01:15:22,990 --> 01:15:25,520 And yeah, that's what we had. 1473 01:15:25,520 --> 01:15:28,200 And we went out with our first prototype. 1474 01:15:28,200 --> 01:15:30,210 It's pretty cute, right? 1475 01:15:30,210 --> 01:15:33,390 We went to Sweden with that. 1476 01:15:33,390 --> 01:15:37,710 It has a bunch of cheap Chinese solar cells from the eBay. 1477 01:15:37,710 --> 01:15:41,320 And the rules and everything are already 3D printed. 1478 01:15:41,320 --> 01:15:43,520 Printed It has our first main board, 1479 01:15:43,520 --> 01:15:46,860 and it was just capable of driving around somewhere 1480 01:15:46,860 --> 01:15:48,800 on the snow. 1481 01:15:48,800 --> 01:15:51,660 And we [INAUDIBLE] testing the parachute, so [INAUDIBLE] 1482 01:15:51,660 --> 01:15:53,130 came back. 1483 01:15:53,130 --> 01:15:56,820 And it worked a few times, but in the end, 1484 01:15:56,820 --> 01:16:01,390 it had kind of an incident. 1485 01:16:01,390 --> 01:16:06,050 So we could really test it and analyze what happened, 1486 01:16:06,050 --> 01:16:09,170 and so really what we can improve 1487 01:16:09,170 --> 01:16:13,170 for the further iterations. 1488 01:16:13,170 --> 01:16:15,340 And I stopped before at the remodel. 1489 01:16:15,340 --> 01:16:18,420 I want to go down a bit deeper there and show everyone 1490 01:16:18,420 --> 01:16:19,230 a few examples. 1491 01:16:19,230 --> 01:16:21,936 So that that's the electoral power system. 1492 01:16:21,936 --> 01:16:25,920 And I want to summarize again, that the relevant requirements 1493 01:16:25,920 --> 01:16:29,400 that are 10 watts on average that should be produced 1494 01:16:29,400 --> 01:16:34,620 and the temperature that should be held inside the rover. 1495 01:16:34,620 --> 01:16:39,030 So we have this choice of having the small, one chip 1496 01:16:39,030 --> 01:16:42,900 solution on the left. 1497 01:16:42,900 --> 01:16:43,740 That was cheap. 1498 01:16:43,740 --> 01:16:45,156 It was easy. 1499 01:16:45,156 --> 01:16:48,192 It was reliable. 1500 01:16:48,192 --> 01:16:51,000 Or we could have that more complex system 1501 01:16:51,000 --> 01:16:53,980 where we have more flexibility. 1502 01:16:53,980 --> 01:16:59,490 We have, actually, more power output than the small chip, 1503 01:16:59,490 --> 01:17:04,410 and it's basically adaptable to what we need exactly. 1504 01:17:04,410 --> 01:17:08,370 And we, in the end, went for the second-- 1505 01:17:08,370 --> 01:17:14,100 for the right option mainly because of the power output 1506 01:17:14,100 --> 01:17:16,000 because the 10 wants imply-- 1507 01:17:16,000 --> 01:17:21,330 a few amps, actually, of output and a solar powered input 1508 01:17:21,330 --> 01:17:22,930 that would have to be managed. 1509 01:17:22,930 --> 01:17:25,200 And that's just not possible for the small chip 1510 01:17:25,200 --> 01:17:28,080 we had in our first prototype actually. 1511 01:17:28,080 --> 01:17:31,770 So we had a concept that was inspired 1512 01:17:31,770 --> 01:17:35,120 from the Swiss [? Cube ?] Satellite because I remember 1513 01:17:35,120 --> 01:17:38,560 going to work there for his masterpiece, 1514 01:17:38,560 --> 01:17:42,690 and he got inspired from his concept of having 1515 01:17:42,690 --> 01:17:47,000 this particular architecture that implies 1516 01:17:47,000 --> 01:17:49,250 having a shared VSS buss. 1517 01:17:49,250 --> 01:17:54,800 So you had your 3 volts that was feed [INAUDIBLE] 1518 01:17:54,800 --> 01:17:57,540 to your system, and directly to that, 1519 01:17:57,540 --> 01:18:00,390 connected to solar panels and the battery. 1520 01:18:00,390 --> 01:18:04,936 And if the power bus would drop below the 3.3 volts, 1521 01:18:04,936 --> 01:18:08,100 it will get regulated or stabilized by discharging 1522 01:18:08,100 --> 01:18:12,990 the battery or by solar power, but you cannot kind of steer 1523 01:18:12,990 --> 01:18:13,490 this. 1524 01:18:13,490 --> 01:18:16,700 And if it will be too high then 3.3 volts, 1525 01:18:16,700 --> 01:18:20,590 it will [INAUDIBLE] it again with charging the battery. 1526 01:18:20,590 --> 01:18:23,310 And that was basically the main concept 1527 01:18:23,310 --> 01:18:27,060 that he implemented then. 1528 01:18:27,060 --> 01:18:30,810 And the next steps, if you go further, 1529 01:18:30,810 --> 01:18:33,386 would be the component selection, the PCB design, 1530 01:18:33,386 --> 01:18:33,885 right. 1531 01:18:33,885 --> 01:18:36,460 The [INAUDIBLE] materials-- right now, 1532 01:18:36,460 --> 01:18:38,510 we're programming the framework. 1533 01:18:38,510 --> 01:18:41,400 And testing, that's also ongoing. 1534 01:18:41,400 --> 01:18:44,820 And at the same time, optimized for having cheaper 1535 01:18:44,820 --> 01:18:47,570 components-- components with the smaller footprint, 1536 01:18:47,570 --> 01:18:52,100 so you save space on your PCB and so on. 1537 01:18:52,100 --> 01:18:55,060 So that would be really at the bottom of the [INAUDIBLE] 1538 01:18:55,060 --> 01:18:57,370 right now. 1539 01:18:57,370 --> 01:19:01,800 Also, maybe, a good example that shows this trade space 1540 01:19:01,800 --> 01:19:06,700 exploration would be the mechanical design. 1541 01:19:06,700 --> 01:19:09,934 So the driving mechanism, that could be-- 1542 01:19:09,934 --> 01:19:11,850 well, wheels like we had it, but it could also 1543 01:19:11,850 --> 01:19:18,540 be like caterpillar or any other kind of mechanism. 1544 01:19:18,540 --> 01:19:23,580 The motors could be cheap ones from eBay for $3 a piece 1545 01:19:23,580 --> 01:19:27,016 or like high end Maxon motors we all love here in Switzerland, 1546 01:19:27,016 --> 01:19:29,150 right? 1547 01:19:29,150 --> 01:19:33,320 And well, you could print that with a 3D 1548 01:19:33,320 --> 01:19:35,190 printer, the structure. 1549 01:19:35,190 --> 01:19:37,920 Even the gears, you can print them out, 1550 01:19:37,920 --> 01:19:39,795 actually, yourself, with plastic. 1551 01:19:39,795 --> 01:19:41,115 It works actually. 1552 01:19:41,115 --> 01:19:43,350 Or you could select metallic parts. 1553 01:19:43,350 --> 01:19:44,910 We have also a few-- 1554 01:19:44,910 --> 01:19:48,930 like, the worm guy for instance, we need to take a metallic one. 1555 01:19:52,190 --> 01:19:56,340 In the end, we had a combination of all of these things. 1556 01:19:56,340 --> 01:19:57,930 So we had the struts. 1557 01:19:57,930 --> 01:20:01,753 We also have the Maxon motors that were sponsored luckily, 1558 01:20:01,753 --> 01:20:04,080 so the price isn't too high-- 1559 01:20:04,080 --> 01:20:08,790 and the metallic worm guy, as I said, 3D printed struts, 1560 01:20:08,790 --> 01:20:11,082 3D printed wheels. 1561 01:20:11,082 --> 01:20:13,430 And in the end, there was a trade off between costs, 1562 01:20:13,430 --> 01:20:18,510 reproducibility, reliability, the range of the robot as well, 1563 01:20:18,510 --> 01:20:22,750 and the maximum slopes you could do as well. 1564 01:20:22,750 --> 01:20:27,260 So what we could have done was this [INAUDIBLE] 1565 01:20:27,260 --> 01:20:32,370 metrics, or the further points, to optimize this design, 1566 01:20:32,370 --> 01:20:36,540 but we figured out that kind of without this, 1567 01:20:36,540 --> 01:20:39,950 we just decided, kind of, to take one of these options, 1568 01:20:39,950 --> 01:20:40,450 I think. 1569 01:20:43,110 --> 01:20:47,070 So that was what we learned from the prototype one. 1570 01:20:47,070 --> 01:20:49,890 And then the second one, we had a few adaptions. 1571 01:20:49,890 --> 01:20:52,750 So we changed our main microcontroller. 1572 01:20:52,750 --> 01:20:57,035 We changed the RF module to a standard that 1573 01:20:57,035 --> 01:20:59,370 is now emerging called LoRa. 1574 01:20:59,370 --> 01:21:02,450 And we also added that power system I talked about. 1575 01:21:02,450 --> 01:21:07,500 But mainly, it remained the same on that diagram. 1576 01:21:07,500 --> 01:21:10,920 And just to show you how we actually 1577 01:21:10,920 --> 01:21:15,115 are looking at that goal that we are having the rover that 1578 01:21:15,115 --> 01:21:17,630 is reproducible by someone. 1579 01:21:17,630 --> 01:21:19,450 This looks pretty much like a kit, right? 1580 01:21:19,450 --> 01:21:22,620 Its all 3D printed parts. 1581 01:21:22,620 --> 01:21:26,300 You can just assemble them, the solar cells and you 1582 01:21:26,300 --> 01:21:29,130 know, the structure to build the body. 1583 01:21:29,130 --> 01:21:35,090 And looking at this, you might see that it's not many parts. 1584 01:21:35,090 --> 01:21:39,300 It's almost, as we discussed, within the range 1585 01:21:39,300 --> 01:21:43,570 of a non-complex systems that could be managed by one person. 1586 01:21:43,570 --> 01:21:47,970 But in the end, for instance, the solar panels that are, 1587 01:21:47,970 --> 01:21:50,390 again, decomposable in separate parts. 1588 01:21:50,390 --> 01:21:56,010 We manufactured them ourselves taking blemished cells 1589 01:21:56,010 --> 01:21:58,990 from eBay, putting them into arrays, 1590 01:21:58,990 --> 01:22:00,550 soldering the connection. 1591 01:22:00,550 --> 01:22:03,930 So in the end, you have a lot of individual parts-- 1592 01:22:03,930 --> 01:22:06,320 also, all the parts on the PCB and so on, 1593 01:22:06,320 --> 01:22:11,330 so it quickly explodes in size. 1594 01:22:11,330 --> 01:22:13,270 The second prototype had more power 1595 01:22:13,270 --> 01:22:15,610 because of the solar cells-- 1596 01:22:15,610 --> 01:22:17,310 and also improved mechanical design, 1597 01:22:17,310 --> 01:22:21,540 so that the wheels were lighter and more stable-- 1598 01:22:21,540 --> 01:22:22,950 also, the struts and so on. 1599 01:22:22,950 --> 01:22:25,890 And we tested that again, this summer, on a glacier 1600 01:22:25,890 --> 01:22:28,800 here in Switzerland. 1601 01:22:28,800 --> 01:22:33,000 And to wrap that all up, just a few points, 1602 01:22:33,000 --> 01:22:36,180 we didn't maybe do like an industry 1603 01:22:36,180 --> 01:22:40,040 or like we saw it in this class. 1604 01:22:40,040 --> 01:22:43,120 So as I talked earlier about this before, 1605 01:22:43,120 --> 01:22:46,140 we mainly had this bottom up approach. 1606 01:22:46,140 --> 01:22:48,880 We also had a global vision, at first, 1607 01:22:48,880 --> 01:22:54,820 to define the subsystems and so on, but we didn't strictly 1608 01:22:54,820 --> 01:22:59,340 iterate from the top of the model to down part 1609 01:22:59,340 --> 01:23:02,610 because sometimes we just saw that great components-- 1610 01:23:02,610 --> 01:23:04,835 for instance, the RF module-- 1611 01:23:04,835 --> 01:23:08,780 that will provide us with all a lower power consumption, 1612 01:23:08,780 --> 01:23:10,920 a higher range, and was just perfectly 1613 01:23:10,920 --> 01:23:14,130 adaptive for our mission. 1614 01:23:14,130 --> 01:23:17,700 So we are stuck with this one, and integrated it 1615 01:23:17,700 --> 01:23:20,490 in the design, and built the rest of the components 1616 01:23:20,490 --> 01:23:22,330 around it. 1617 01:23:22,330 --> 01:23:25,775 There's also, of course-- we didn't have like formal PDR 1618 01:23:25,775 --> 01:23:30,960 or CDR because we were a small team and also because we're not 1619 01:23:30,960 --> 01:23:31,840 doing this-- 1620 01:23:31,840 --> 01:23:34,000 let's say, as a main-- 1621 01:23:34,000 --> 01:23:36,630 well, yes, it is kind of a main occupation, 1622 01:23:36,630 --> 01:23:40,970 but we're still studying next to it [INAUDIBLE].. 1623 01:23:40,970 --> 01:23:46,600 Also, we may change our design decision on the way, 1624 01:23:46,600 --> 01:23:51,510 not like the complete design but minor, minor things of it. 1625 01:23:51,510 --> 01:23:54,720 And we mainly focus on this approach 1626 01:23:54,720 --> 01:24:01,050 to do rapid prototyping and do a lot of iterations on one thing 1627 01:24:01,050 --> 01:24:04,260 instead of making first concept studies, 1628 01:24:04,260 --> 01:24:06,900 and then select the best one, and only then 1629 01:24:06,900 --> 01:24:12,750 really go to build it, and cut metal-- 1630 01:24:12,750 --> 01:24:15,360 that's [INAUDIBLE]. 1631 01:24:15,360 --> 01:24:18,360 That we can do because we basically 1632 01:24:18,360 --> 01:24:22,020 have all these low cost components, so it doesn't cost 1633 01:24:22,020 --> 01:24:25,420 us a lot to build one prototype because everything 1634 01:24:25,420 --> 01:24:29,000 is 3D printed, everything is electronics 1635 01:24:29,000 --> 01:24:33,920 that is pretty cheaply doable right now. 1636 01:24:33,920 --> 01:24:37,930 And yeah, we can do this. 1637 01:24:37,930 --> 01:24:41,760 And to motivate us, or to give us some pressure, 1638 01:24:41,760 --> 01:24:43,620 we set these artificial deadlines. 1639 01:24:43,620 --> 01:24:47,320 So we put the design freezes in our calendar. 1640 01:24:47,320 --> 01:24:49,650 So from this point on, we will not 1641 01:24:49,650 --> 01:24:52,950 change these parts of the systems any more. 1642 01:24:52,950 --> 01:24:57,330 That allows us to kind of move on on this 1643 01:24:57,330 --> 01:25:00,810 and get some things custom, for granted, 1644 01:25:00,810 --> 01:25:03,720 so we don't have to adapt other things because something 1645 01:25:03,720 --> 01:25:05,730 else changed again. 1646 01:25:05,730 --> 01:25:08,640 And we have these field tests like I talked about 1647 01:25:08,640 --> 01:25:11,220 in Sweden and on the glaciers, so that gives us 1648 01:25:11,220 --> 01:25:12,810 kind of pressure as well. 1649 01:25:12,810 --> 01:25:17,590 Because I remember before the week in Sweden, 1650 01:25:17,590 --> 01:25:22,560 we basically relayed in the lab, and we spent the night 1651 01:25:22,560 --> 01:25:26,700 to keep the 3D printer running. 1652 01:25:26,700 --> 01:25:30,030 And as soon as the part was done, put the next one on, 1653 01:25:30,030 --> 01:25:34,630 and you know, changing our-- 1654 01:25:34,630 --> 01:25:38,400 being there in shifts to keep it running. 1655 01:25:38,400 --> 01:25:41,430 And that was a great experience because you really have that 1656 01:25:41,430 --> 01:25:44,040 thing to be done because it cannot be 3D printed 1657 01:25:44,040 --> 01:25:45,272 in [INAUDIBLE] method. 1658 01:25:45,272 --> 01:25:46,980 OLIVIER DE WECK: Rafael, so why don't you 1659 01:25:46,980 --> 01:25:49,440 go one more minute because we want 1660 01:25:49,440 --> 01:25:52,360 to do a couple of questions also, yeah? 1661 01:25:52,360 --> 01:25:55,340 RAFAEL: Yeah, I'm almost done actually. 1662 01:25:55,340 --> 01:26:00,040 So how we structure all this data is basically on the Wiki. 1663 01:26:00,040 --> 01:26:04,260 That allows you to go deeper into the different parts, 1664 01:26:04,260 --> 01:26:07,430 and we use Trello for defining milestones. 1665 01:26:07,430 --> 01:26:08,980 It's an online tool-- 1666 01:26:08,980 --> 01:26:10,800 can use for free. 1667 01:26:10,800 --> 01:26:13,260 And the major systems engineering 1668 01:26:13,260 --> 01:26:17,790 challenges I saw here was especially the time management, 1669 01:26:17,790 --> 01:26:20,730 and human factor as well because you kind of need 1670 01:26:20,730 --> 01:26:23,317 to have this boundary between someone who's 1671 01:26:23,317 --> 01:26:24,900 doing the mechanical design, someone's 1672 01:26:24,900 --> 01:26:27,360 who is doing the electronics design. 1673 01:26:27,360 --> 01:26:30,000 Don't cross the boundary because that person 1674 01:26:30,000 --> 01:26:32,264 is an expert in his field. 1675 01:26:32,264 --> 01:26:33,930 And if you just come up with something-- 1676 01:26:33,930 --> 01:26:35,965 hey, why don't you do this with this? 1677 01:26:35,965 --> 01:26:37,590 First of all, it will annoy the person. 1678 01:26:37,590 --> 01:26:40,740 And second of all it's like, that person 1679 01:26:40,740 --> 01:26:42,400 has made a lot of thought in this, 1680 01:26:42,400 --> 01:26:46,440 and you shouldn't just come with your thing 1681 01:26:46,440 --> 01:26:49,150 you have done in five minutes. 1682 01:26:49,150 --> 01:26:50,150 Ask the right questions. 1683 01:26:50,150 --> 01:26:54,683 And [INAUDIBLE] thought, it's difficult to just put 1684 01:26:54,683 --> 01:26:57,450 the design on paper for components 1685 01:26:57,450 --> 01:27:00,200 you haven't even tested before. 1686 01:27:00,200 --> 01:27:06,070 So just like a few seconds left for this. 1687 01:27:06,070 --> 01:27:07,560 We go out to [INAUDIBLE] as well. 1688 01:27:07,560 --> 01:27:10,718 So we're going to test this rover in February 1689 01:27:10,718 --> 01:27:14,100 in Antarctica. 1690 01:27:14,100 --> 01:27:15,960 We can only send one person to there, 1691 01:27:15,960 --> 01:27:19,490 so we have this agreement within 30 days. 1692 01:27:19,490 --> 01:27:24,630 And they allowed us to send one person in February 2016 1693 01:27:24,630 --> 01:27:29,190 to Antarctica, and it's none of us who's going to go. 1694 01:27:29,190 --> 01:27:32,330 But it might be someone or someone else. 1695 01:27:32,330 --> 01:27:36,660 And you have that chance to go there, all expenses covered, 1696 01:27:36,660 --> 01:27:40,590 and you will be there as a field scientist, 1697 01:27:40,590 --> 01:27:44,400 collaborate with the bases, and basically produce 1698 01:27:44,400 --> 01:27:46,260 a paper at the end of this. 1699 01:27:46,260 --> 01:27:50,630 If you're interested, octanis.org/apply. 1700 01:27:50,630 --> 01:27:52,790 You'll find all the information's there. 1701 01:27:52,790 --> 01:27:56,370 And the deadline is tomorrow actually. 1702 01:27:56,370 --> 01:27:58,800 OLIVIER DE WECK: All right, just in time. 1703 01:27:58,800 --> 01:28:03,400 Thank you, let's give Rafael a hand. 1704 01:28:03,400 --> 01:28:07,720 OK, so we have like three to four minutes for questions, 1705 01:28:07,720 --> 01:28:10,800 so let's start with questions at EPFL 1706 01:28:10,800 --> 01:28:13,572 and then one question-- we'll go back and forth. 1707 01:28:17,765 --> 01:28:19,690 AUDIENCE: And just maybe a critical question, 1708 01:28:19,690 --> 01:28:24,270 why did you choose to switch from your first communication 1709 01:28:24,270 --> 01:28:25,400 [INAUDIBLE] after? 1710 01:28:28,354 --> 01:28:30,020 RAFAEL: [INAUDIBLE] thing we had before? 1711 01:28:30,020 --> 01:28:33,220 AUDIENCE: Yes, and why did you change? 1712 01:28:33,220 --> 01:28:37,270 RAFAEL: Before we had kind of a DIY component 1713 01:28:37,270 --> 01:28:41,380 that was called AHX 1 that there you basically had 1714 01:28:41,380 --> 01:28:43,900 to modulate the signal that you're 1715 01:28:43,900 --> 01:28:47,170 going to transmit yourself, and it was just way too complex. 1716 01:28:47,170 --> 01:28:50,830 The new component, you can just send zero commands 1717 01:28:50,830 --> 01:28:54,550 by [INAUDIBLE],, and it will just do its job. 1718 01:28:54,550 --> 01:29:00,320 And it's higher range, as well, and lower power consumption. 1719 01:29:00,320 --> 01:29:04,920 AUDIENCE: And how you shoot to have a [INAUDIBLE]?? 1720 01:29:04,920 --> 01:29:06,730 RAFAEL: Oh, sorry, yeah, that component's 1721 01:29:06,730 --> 01:29:10,660 only to communicate from the rover to the base, 1722 01:29:10,660 --> 01:29:13,460 so that will be like 20 kilometers. 1723 01:29:13,460 --> 01:29:19,131 For the coverage to the land, we'll use the Iridium network. 1724 01:29:19,131 --> 01:29:21,365 Any questions at MIT? 1725 01:29:21,365 --> 01:29:22,240 OLIVIER DE WECK: Sam? 1726 01:29:25,010 --> 01:29:26,710 SAM: This is really interesting, thanks. 1727 01:29:26,710 --> 01:29:28,510 So I was wondering, with your focus 1728 01:29:28,510 --> 01:29:32,860 on openness and affordability, I guess, do 1729 01:29:32,860 --> 01:29:37,060 you foresee any participation by the public in terms 1730 01:29:37,060 --> 01:29:42,280 of like prototyping and testing or even improving the design-- 1731 01:29:42,280 --> 01:29:45,540 and/or data analysis? 1732 01:29:45,540 --> 01:29:48,130 RAFAEL: Yeah, well, we're completely open, 1733 01:29:48,130 --> 01:29:51,880 so we are based here in [INAUDIBLE] in a place 1734 01:29:51,880 --> 01:29:55,575 called [INAUDIBLE] hacker space, maker space, 1735 01:29:55,575 --> 01:29:57,066 whatever you want to call it. 1736 01:29:57,066 --> 01:30:01,150 We have open nights over Wednesdays, so anyone can come. 1737 01:30:01,150 --> 01:30:04,330 And all our design is on GitHub, so if there's 1738 01:30:04,330 --> 01:30:06,207 going to be remote collaborations, 1739 01:30:06,207 --> 01:30:07,540 we would really appreciate that. 1740 01:30:07,540 --> 01:30:09,810 So anyone who is interested in the project, 1741 01:30:09,810 --> 01:30:13,500 you can go on our website, octanis.org/join, 1742 01:30:13,500 --> 01:30:19,927 and we [INAUDIBLE] to collaborate, of course. 1743 01:30:19,927 --> 01:30:21,900 Does that answer your question? 1744 01:30:21,900 --> 01:30:23,690 SAM: Yes, thank you. 1745 01:30:23,690 --> 01:30:25,690 OLIVIER DE WECK: I'd like to ask you a question. 1746 01:30:25,690 --> 01:30:28,450 So you know, I think one of the things that was quite-- 1747 01:30:28,450 --> 01:30:30,850 first of all, the enthusiasm that you guys have 1748 01:30:30,850 --> 01:30:32,686 is infectious. 1749 01:30:32,686 --> 01:30:34,060 It's very clear you guys are very 1750 01:30:34,060 --> 01:30:38,420 passionate about this mission, and it's very exciting. 1751 01:30:38,420 --> 01:30:40,450 The fact that you didn't do these milestones, 1752 01:30:40,450 --> 01:30:42,610 you didn't do a formal PDR or CDR, 1753 01:30:42,610 --> 01:30:45,940 but you're doing essentially, kind of spiral development. 1754 01:30:45,940 --> 01:30:47,980 So two questions, one is how many 1755 01:30:47,980 --> 01:30:50,770 more spirals do you think you'll be able to do before you 1756 01:30:50,770 --> 01:30:53,680 actually deploy the rover? 1757 01:30:53,680 --> 01:30:55,520 Because you said you did two spirals. 1758 01:30:55,520 --> 01:30:57,310 It sounds like so far. 1759 01:30:57,310 --> 01:30:58,690 So how many more spirals? 1760 01:30:58,690 --> 01:31:04,050 And how will you know whether your mission was successful 1761 01:31:04,050 --> 01:31:04,630 or not? 1762 01:31:04,630 --> 01:31:07,890 So what are the success criteria in the end? 1763 01:31:07,890 --> 01:31:12,780 When you look back at the actual operation, 1764 01:31:12,780 --> 01:31:17,260 how will you decide whether you were successful or not? 1765 01:31:17,260 --> 01:31:18,176 RAFAEL: OK, thank you. 1766 01:31:18,176 --> 01:31:22,580 So for the first one, we had our design freeze 1767 01:31:22,580 --> 01:31:25,143 for the last iteration already. 1768 01:31:25,143 --> 01:31:29,480 The truth is we're still adapting some points of it 1769 01:31:29,480 --> 01:31:33,290 because technically, we decided on all the parts, 1770 01:31:33,290 --> 01:31:35,810 and we're just implementing it right now, 1771 01:31:35,810 --> 01:31:38,660 and refinding it, and correcting the bugs. 1772 01:31:38,660 --> 01:31:40,400 So that was actually done. 1773 01:31:40,400 --> 01:31:44,330 And we're now building the last prototype 1774 01:31:44,330 --> 01:31:49,100 or the last, actually, robot that is going to go there. 1775 01:31:49,100 --> 01:31:51,210 And on the thing about achieving our goal, 1776 01:31:51,210 --> 01:31:55,520 so what are the mission criterias, 1777 01:31:55,520 --> 01:31:58,880 that's going to be written down in the project proposal, 1778 01:31:58,880 --> 01:32:02,980 or the paper, that we're going to give to our stakeholders. 1779 01:32:02,980 --> 01:32:06,450 So the Antarctica Institute of Ecuador. 1780 01:32:09,050 --> 01:32:15,110 So one part will be the power autonomy and also 1781 01:32:15,110 --> 01:32:17,350 the communication-- 1782 01:32:17,350 --> 01:32:21,070 like, it has a reliable communication. 1783 01:32:21,070 --> 01:32:24,720 And one part will be also the scientific payload, 1784 01:32:24,720 --> 01:32:27,860 there will be insights of conducting experiments 1785 01:32:27,860 --> 01:32:28,460 on the field. 1786 01:32:31,070 --> 01:32:32,857 You want to add something, Sam? 1787 01:32:32,857 --> 01:32:39,000 SAM: Yes, 100 meters per day [INAUDIBLE] 1788 01:32:39,000 --> 01:32:40,720 Very concrete goals, can we drive 1789 01:32:40,720 --> 01:32:43,350 100 meters per day, yes or no? 1790 01:32:43,350 --> 01:32:47,720 Can we log every minute, every data point 1791 01:32:47,720 --> 01:32:51,190 that we collect temperature pressure, et cetera? 1792 01:32:51,190 --> 01:32:53,700 Can we log that, and can we send that to the base? 1793 01:32:53,700 --> 01:32:57,650 Like, does the 15 kilometer range of the LoRa 1794 01:32:57,650 --> 01:32:59,730 is that [INAUDIBLE] or not? 1795 01:32:59,730 --> 01:33:01,220 Does that work? 1796 01:33:01,220 --> 01:33:04,670 And of course, does the satellite communications work? 1797 01:33:04,670 --> 01:33:08,720 So once they will send back a summary of the data, 1798 01:33:08,720 --> 01:33:11,122 and we want to see if that works, 1799 01:33:11,122 --> 01:33:12,830 if we can calculate all the stuff that we 1800 01:33:12,830 --> 01:33:16,030 want, on the rover, and if we get 1801 01:33:16,030 --> 01:33:18,246 that stuff back [INAUDIBLE]? 1802 01:33:18,246 --> 01:33:20,300 OLIVIER DE WECK: Good, thank you. 1803 01:33:20,300 --> 01:33:21,150 One final question? 1804 01:33:24,760 --> 01:33:25,940 Anybody at EPFL? 1805 01:33:25,940 --> 01:33:26,530 Here at MIT? 1806 01:33:29,560 --> 01:33:31,990 OK, Sam has one more. 1807 01:33:31,990 --> 01:33:34,350 SAM: I just have a question about-- 1808 01:33:34,350 --> 01:33:36,920 because it's going to be, I guess, situated near our base, 1809 01:33:36,920 --> 01:33:39,230 is there any thought about, sort of like, 1810 01:33:39,230 --> 01:33:43,340 how maintenance would work when it's in operation 1811 01:33:43,340 --> 01:33:44,340 or if something happens? 1812 01:33:49,675 --> 01:33:51,762 RAFAEL: Well, the person who is going to be there 1813 01:33:51,762 --> 01:33:54,250 will be in charge of doing maintenance, 1814 01:33:54,250 --> 01:33:57,027 so if something happens, if it gets stuck somewhere, 1815 01:33:57,027 --> 01:33:58,460 he will rescue it. 1816 01:33:58,460 --> 01:34:03,090 And if some parts fall, he'll provide the replacement parts, 1817 01:34:03,090 --> 01:34:06,120 of course, so we will not just send that thing there 1818 01:34:06,120 --> 01:34:10,290 and hope it works. 1819 01:34:10,290 --> 01:34:13,497 Yeah, we have some backup plans as well. 1820 01:34:13,497 --> 01:34:14,330 OLIVIER DE WECK: OK. 1821 01:34:14,330 --> 01:34:14,829 SAM: Great. 1822 01:34:14,829 --> 01:34:17,210 OLIVIER DE WECK: Sounds like Sam is interested. 1823 01:34:17,210 --> 01:34:19,500 RAFAEL: We have another question here at EPFL as well. 1824 01:34:19,500 --> 01:34:20,520 OLIVIER DE WECK: OK, do one more, 1825 01:34:20,520 --> 01:34:22,190 and then we'll close the session. 1826 01:34:22,190 --> 01:34:24,201 Go ahead. 1827 01:34:24,201 --> 01:34:25,700 AUDIENCE: Well, I was just wondering 1828 01:34:25,700 --> 01:34:29,270 if you believe-- if you had followed all what we have seen 1829 01:34:29,270 --> 01:34:32,300 here in this class about the procedures, PDR, CDR, 1830 01:34:32,300 --> 01:34:36,320 and so on, would that have hindered you 1831 01:34:36,320 --> 01:34:38,540 in being so reactive? 1832 01:34:38,540 --> 01:34:41,555 Or do you feel that you can be reactive while still 1833 01:34:41,555 --> 01:34:43,695 following all those procedures? 1834 01:34:46,365 --> 01:34:49,935 RAFAEL: A good question, thank you. 1835 01:34:49,935 --> 01:34:53,635 Certain points of the concepts that we have seen 1836 01:34:53,635 --> 01:34:58,030 would have improved, especially the efficiency 1837 01:34:58,030 --> 01:35:00,550 in the design procedure. 1838 01:35:00,550 --> 01:35:05,350 So going down step by step would help 1839 01:35:05,350 --> 01:35:11,320 us to exactly create what we defined before 1840 01:35:11,320 --> 01:35:14,770 and not go too much into different directions. 1841 01:35:14,770 --> 01:35:19,650 But on the other hand, the fact that we explore our traits, 1842 01:35:19,650 --> 01:35:21,600 those [INAUDIBLE] in the beginning, 1843 01:35:21,600 --> 01:35:26,470 makes that we might have an even better solution because we 1844 01:35:26,470 --> 01:35:28,570 wouldn't have thought about this before when 1845 01:35:28,570 --> 01:35:31,940 we were in the upper part of the [INAUDIBLE].. 1846 01:35:31,940 --> 01:35:34,150 So it's kind of a mix. 1847 01:35:34,150 --> 01:35:38,560 I think a mix of this is really the perfect approach 1848 01:35:38,560 --> 01:35:40,700 for our project.