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MIT 00:00:29.790 --> 00:00:32.409 align:middle line:90% OpenCourseWare website. 00:00:32.409 --> 00:00:35.780 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: --to Abe, who is going to give us a guest 00:00:35.780 --> 00:00:37.930 align:middle line:90% lecture on art games. 00:00:37.930 --> 00:00:41.760 align:middle line:84% And today's reading, the proctor reading is kind of 00:00:41.760 --> 00:00:44.620 align:middle line:84% like part two of a lot of the things that Jason maybe talked 00:00:44.620 --> 00:00:49.170 align:middle line:90% about when we did simulations. 00:00:49.170 --> 00:00:52.450 align:middle line:84% If you guys remember, is a quality reading that a 00:00:52.450 --> 00:00:54.074 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] question, where that came from. 00:00:54.074 --> 00:00:57.800 align:middle line:84% One thing that I think was of interest was that there are a 00:00:57.800 --> 00:01:01.430 align:middle line:84% couple of responses to that article. 00:01:01.430 --> 00:01:03.510 align:middle line:84% If you scroll all the way down to the bottom of the article 00:01:03.510 --> 00:01:04.879 align:middle line:84% that these responses vary [INAUDIBLE] 00:01:04.879 --> 00:01:07.400 align:middle line:90% 00:01:07.400 --> 00:01:08.010 align:middle line:90% back to them. 00:01:08.010 --> 00:01:11.320 align:middle line:84% And those are kind of interesting, because it just 00:01:11.320 --> 00:01:12.410 align:middle line:90% carries on a conversation. 00:01:12.410 --> 00:01:16.665 align:middle line:84% People actually just turning his article into basically a 00:01:16.665 --> 00:01:18.600 align:middle line:84% blog post and then write on it. 00:01:18.600 --> 00:01:19.640 align:middle line:90% And they were pretty good. 00:01:19.640 --> 00:01:23.340 align:middle line:84% But a lot of that was kind of the state of art game 00:01:23.340 --> 00:01:27.635 align:middle line:84% discussion back in 1999, I think, I think a pretty old 00:01:27.635 --> 00:01:32.660 align:middle line:84% article, where they were very much thinking about games have 00:01:32.660 --> 00:01:33.540 align:middle line:90% to be simulations. 00:01:33.540 --> 00:01:36.920 align:middle line:90% Games and narratives, blaaach. 00:01:36.920 --> 00:01:41.330 align:middle line:84% Storytelling is like some other mediums' domain. 00:01:41.330 --> 00:01:42.580 align:middle line:90% It's all about the simulation. 00:01:42.580 --> 00:01:45.690 align:middle line:90% 00:01:45.690 --> 00:01:49.890 align:middle line:84% Arguably at that time there wasn't a big discussion of an 00:01:49.890 --> 00:01:50.490 align:middle line:90% art games movement. 00:01:50.490 --> 00:01:54.040 align:middle line:84% There were other games movements, like new games 00:01:54.040 --> 00:01:58.160 align:middle line:84% which were really more about people interacting with you, 00:01:58.160 --> 00:02:00.940 align:middle line:84% trying to get games to where people were more cooperative, 00:02:00.940 --> 00:02:04.300 align:middle line:84% less competitive, and less cutthroat. 00:02:04.300 --> 00:02:09.840 align:middle line:84% There were other movements about people-- 00:02:09.840 --> 00:02:12.200 align:middle line:84% they were probably advertising game movements. 00:02:12.200 --> 00:02:17.270 align:middle line:84% And there was a lot of work in people making months of 00:02:17.270 --> 00:02:19.940 align:middle line:84% computer games that effectively made it 00:02:19.940 --> 00:02:23.210 align:middle line:84% unplayable, but made really pretty images in the process. 00:02:23.210 --> 00:02:25.590 align:middle line:84% So that [UNINTELLIGIBLE], for instance, where everything 00:02:25.590 --> 00:02:27.620 align:middle line:84% becomes black and white and is striped, 00:02:27.620 --> 00:02:28.460 align:middle line:90% including the monsters. 00:02:28.460 --> 00:02:30.770 align:middle line:84% There's no way you can see what the hell's going on, but 00:02:30.770 --> 00:02:33.494 align:middle line:90% they look pretty cool. 00:02:33.494 --> 00:02:34.530 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Have you seen-- 00:02:34.530 --> 00:02:37.904 align:middle line:90% I think it's 96 kilobytes-- 00:02:37.904 --> 00:02:41.290 align:middle line:84% there was a competition in full game [INAUDIBLE]-- no 00:02:41.290 --> 00:02:42.150 align:middle line:90% it's 4 kilobytes, I think. 00:02:42.150 --> 00:02:45.328 align:middle line:84% It's a 4-kilobyte game in full 3-D, with multiple levels, 00:02:45.328 --> 00:02:47.830 align:middle line:84% extremely clever, including the music and everything. 00:02:47.830 --> 00:02:50.210 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Yeah, yeah. 00:02:50.210 --> 00:02:51.500 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Have you ever heard of this or seen this? 00:02:51.500 --> 00:02:53.070 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: There are a couple of those. 00:02:53.070 --> 00:02:55.010 align:middle line:84% A lot of those come up with the demoscene. 00:02:55.010 --> 00:02:58.770 align:middle line:84% Demoscene, which I will put off to some other time-- 00:02:58.770 --> 00:02:59.310 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: It's very impressive, too. 00:02:59.310 --> 00:03:00.120 align:middle line:90% It's like very-- 00:03:00.120 --> 00:03:01.940 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, yeah. 00:03:01.940 --> 00:03:05.100 align:middle line:84% It's kind of this weird thing of computer hacking, really, 00:03:05.100 --> 00:03:08.740 align:middle line:84% really fast and really, really compact coding, and visualized 00:03:08.740 --> 00:03:11.990 align:middle line:84% statics and music, which goes more like a 00:03:11.990 --> 00:03:13.890 align:middle line:90% digital music video. 00:03:13.890 --> 00:03:17.360 align:middle line:84% Only there were some people who added mouse control, and 00:03:17.360 --> 00:03:20.210 align:middle line:84% game play into it and made these kind of games. 00:03:20.210 --> 00:03:24.790 align:middle line:84% But that's very different from the art game scene that we 00:03:24.790 --> 00:03:26.980 align:middle line:84% have today, or at least what's commonly 00:03:26.980 --> 00:03:27.810 align:middle line:90% described as art games. 00:03:27.810 --> 00:03:34.140 align:middle line:84% So I'd like Abe to talk about what happened since then, 00:03:34.140 --> 00:03:34.940 align:middle line:90% since 1999. 00:03:34.940 --> 00:03:36.461 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, yeah. 00:03:36.461 --> 00:03:37.383 align:middle line:90% Hi, guys. 00:03:37.383 --> 00:03:38.305 align:middle line:90% I'm Abe. 00:03:38.305 --> 00:03:39.770 align:middle line:90% I work here at the lab. 00:03:39.770 --> 00:03:40.800 align:middle line:90% I play a bunch of your games. 00:03:40.800 --> 00:03:43.210 align:middle line:90% I've met a bunch of you. 00:03:43.210 --> 00:03:44.020 align:middle line:90% It's nice to be here. 00:03:44.020 --> 00:03:46.550 align:middle line:84% Phillip asked me to come in to talk about, 00:03:46.550 --> 00:03:48.150 align:middle line:90% quote/unquote, art games. 00:03:48.150 --> 00:03:54.720 align:middle line:84% I think largely because it's a kind of, I'll say, sector of 00:03:54.720 --> 00:03:59.210 align:middle line:84% game development that my work at Gambit tends to intersect 00:03:59.210 --> 00:04:02.100 align:middle line:90% with, especially recently. 00:04:02.100 --> 00:04:05.563 align:middle line:90% And I think, too, that it's-- 00:04:05.563 --> 00:04:06.024 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Sorry. 00:04:06.024 --> 00:04:09.440 align:middle line:90% I was choking from-- 00:04:09.440 --> 00:04:13.410 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: I think, too, that it's a sector that's a 00:04:13.410 --> 00:04:15.860 align:middle line:90% little bit confusing-- 00:04:15.860 --> 00:04:17.220 align:middle line:90% and possibly confusing, too. 00:04:17.220 --> 00:04:20.680 align:middle line:84% And so, just to give you guys a sense-- 00:04:20.680 --> 00:04:23.745 align:middle line:84% when you asked me about this it actually made me think, 00:04:23.745 --> 00:04:25.705 align:middle line:84% like, oh, yeah, cool, I'll talk about this art games 00:04:25.705 --> 00:04:28.410 align:middle line:84% movement or whatever, but that of course-- 00:04:28.410 --> 00:04:29.270 align:middle line:90% ooh, wait. 00:04:29.270 --> 00:04:33.070 align:middle line:84% I'm locked into some kind of weird mode right now. 00:04:33.070 --> 00:04:34.020 align:middle line:90% Sorry. 00:04:34.020 --> 00:04:35.222 align:middle line:90% OK. 00:04:35.222 --> 00:04:38.040 align:middle line:84% That brings up this question, which is, are games art? 00:04:38.040 --> 00:04:44.200 align:middle line:84% And just to give you a sense for how this little talk 00:04:44.200 --> 00:04:46.660 align:middle line:84% thing, whatever, is going to go, I'm going to talk a little 00:04:46.660 --> 00:04:50.020 align:middle line:84% bit about this question, give you examples of what people 00:04:50.020 --> 00:04:53.661 align:middle line:84% have said about this, and opinions that I think are 00:04:53.661 --> 00:04:54.420 align:middle line:84% particularly important, particularly 00:04:54.420 --> 00:04:56.880 align:middle line:90% valid on this subject. 00:04:56.880 --> 00:05:01.040 align:middle line:84% I also after that want to show you some examples, some 00:05:01.040 --> 00:05:03.200 align:middle line:84% historical and then kind of moving forward examples. 00:05:03.200 --> 00:05:05.910 align:middle line:84% I'm actually going to get some of you guys to just come up 00:05:05.910 --> 00:05:08.020 align:middle line:84% here and maybe even play some of these examples that I think 00:05:08.020 --> 00:05:09.020 align:middle line:90% are particularly important. 00:05:09.020 --> 00:05:13.322 align:middle line:84% And I'd really like it if we can keep this less of a me 00:05:13.322 --> 00:05:17.150 align:middle line:84% talking at you and you engaging me as you have 00:05:17.150 --> 00:05:17.840 align:middle line:90% questions on this. 00:05:17.840 --> 00:05:23.420 align:middle line:84% Because me blabbing at you as you fall asleep is maybe good 00:05:23.420 --> 00:05:28.050 align:middle line:84% for a nap, but less useful for getting anything out of this. 00:05:28.050 --> 00:05:30.750 align:middle line:84% So we'll try to structure this as a conversation, and then 00:05:30.750 --> 00:05:34.500 align:middle line:84% I'll try to pull back, hearken back, to any of my teacher 00:05:34.500 --> 00:05:36.640 align:middle line:84% instincts and see if I can get you engaged. 00:05:36.640 --> 00:05:37.670 align:middle line:90% But we'll see. 00:05:37.670 --> 00:05:39.060 align:middle line:90% So are games art? 00:05:39.060 --> 00:05:41.878 align:middle line:90% I hate this question. 00:05:41.878 --> 00:05:45.240 align:middle line:84% Let's start off by saying that I fundamentally find it 00:05:45.240 --> 00:05:48.490 align:middle line:84% abhorrent, and I hear it all the time. 00:05:48.490 --> 00:05:51.560 align:middle line:84% And it's aggravating to me because I think it's 00:05:51.560 --> 00:05:53.330 align:middle line:90% incontrovertibly yes. 00:05:53.330 --> 00:05:56.730 align:middle line:84% I think that you can't possibly come up with any 00:05:56.730 --> 00:05:59.800 align:middle line:84% other answer other than yes, games are art, games have art, 00:05:59.800 --> 00:06:01.090 align:middle line:90% yes, yes, yes, right? 00:06:01.090 --> 00:06:03.410 align:middle line:90% But it keeps coming up. 00:06:03.410 --> 00:06:06.380 align:middle line:84% And it keeps becoming a question-- and I should say, 00:06:06.380 --> 00:06:11.910 align:middle line:84% too, that this is a wholly biased and slanted talk. 00:06:11.910 --> 00:06:16.110 align:middle line:84% This is my perspective on this, and hopefully by the 00:06:16.110 --> 00:06:17.640 align:middle line:84% time-- you'll be like, wow, he's absolutely right. 00:06:17.640 --> 00:06:20.870 align:middle line:84% There's no way that games could be anything but art. 00:06:20.870 --> 00:06:23.790 align:middle line:84% Or at least they are art, and then some. 00:06:23.790 --> 00:06:27.580 align:middle line:84% So this guy, who's a little hard to see right now, but 00:06:27.580 --> 00:06:30.300 align:middle line:84% he's handily brought up, recently brought into the 00:06:30.300 --> 00:06:35.920 align:middle line:84% fore, and that's Roger Ebert of Siskel and Ebert fame. 00:06:35.920 --> 00:06:38.205 align:middle line:84% Or since you guys are, some of you, younger than me, probably 00:06:38.205 --> 00:06:40.850 align:middle line:90% Ebert and Roeper. 00:06:40.850 --> 00:06:42.430 align:middle line:90% He had some interesting, 00:06:42.430 --> 00:06:44.960 align:middle line:90% controversial comments recently. 00:06:44.960 --> 00:06:47.200 align:middle line:84% And I pulled this quote, "Nevertheless, I'm being 00:06:47.200 --> 00:06:49.040 align:middle line:84% convinced that in principle--" I love that 00:06:49.040 --> 00:06:51.070 align:middle line:90% he put that in italics. 00:06:51.070 --> 00:06:52.770 align:middle line:90% "--video games cannot be art. 00:06:52.770 --> 00:06:55.630 align:middle line:84% Perhaps it is foolish for me to say never, because never as 00:06:55.630 --> 00:06:58.380 align:middle line:84% Rick Wakeman informs us, is a long, long time. 00:06:58.380 --> 00:07:02.020 align:middle line:84% Let me just say that no video gamer now living will survive 00:07:02.020 --> 00:07:05.400 align:middle line:84% long enough to experience the medium as an art form." 00:07:05.400 --> 00:07:08.760 align:middle line:84% So apparently we should all be dead already, according to 00:07:08.760 --> 00:07:10.650 align:middle line:84% Ebert, because we wouldn't have lived long enough to 00:07:10.650 --> 00:07:12.020 align:middle line:84% experience the medium as an art form. 00:07:12.020 --> 00:07:15.610 align:middle line:84% But here's a guy who, even though I don't think he's a 00:07:15.610 --> 00:07:17.580 align:middle line:84% particularly good film critic, is a popular film critic. 00:07:17.580 --> 00:07:19.910 align:middle line:84% And he's weighing in on a medium that he doesn't 00:07:19.910 --> 00:07:20.340 align:middle line:90% particularly understand. 00:07:20.340 --> 00:07:23.240 align:middle line:84% And I think it's important to look at what exactly is he 00:07:23.240 --> 00:07:25.980 align:middle line:84% doing when he makes this statement. 00:07:25.980 --> 00:07:28.510 align:middle line:84% He's in this business of classification, right? 00:07:28.510 --> 00:07:30.130 align:middle line:84% He's in this business of saying, all right, we've got 00:07:30.130 --> 00:07:31.480 align:middle line:90% this subject called art. 00:07:31.480 --> 00:07:35.570 align:middle line:84% What can we say falls under that subset and what does not? 00:07:35.570 --> 00:07:37.450 align:middle line:84% So he says things like painting, sculpture, dance, 00:07:37.450 --> 00:07:42.580 align:middle line:84% opera, literature, film can all be classified as art and 00:07:42.580 --> 00:07:46.110 align:middle line:90% that games are not. 00:07:46.110 --> 00:07:47.430 align:middle line:90% Probably some other things. 00:07:47.430 --> 00:07:48.930 align:middle line:84% I don't know where he stands on comic books. 00:07:48.930 --> 00:07:50.765 align:middle line:84% I don't think he's written about it yet, but I'm sure 00:07:50.765 --> 00:07:51.190 align:middle line:90% he'd probably-- 00:07:51.190 --> 00:07:54.100 align:middle line:84% I don't know what he thinks about pornography. 00:07:54.100 --> 00:07:56.190 align:middle line:84% Although, since it's in film form, maybe he 00:07:56.190 --> 00:07:56.520 align:middle line:90% does think it's art. 00:07:56.520 --> 00:07:57.230 align:middle line:90% It's unclear. 00:07:57.230 --> 00:07:59.650 align:middle line:84% He hasn't weighed in on that yet. 00:07:59.650 --> 00:08:01.120 align:middle line:84% But the interesting thing about this 00:08:01.120 --> 00:08:02.700 align:middle line:90% is, this is not new. 00:08:02.700 --> 00:08:04.850 align:middle line:84% This is like a high-culture, low-culture debate that's been 00:08:04.850 --> 00:08:06.550 align:middle line:84% going on for a really long time. 00:08:06.550 --> 00:08:08.560 align:middle line:84% And I think it's particularly hilarious because 00:08:08.560 --> 00:08:09.840 align:middle line:90% he would use films. 00:08:09.840 --> 00:08:12.560 align:middle line:84% And films had to fight out of the low-culture phenomenon to 00:08:12.560 --> 00:08:15.020 align:middle line:84% gain respect as a high-culture medium. 00:08:15.020 --> 00:08:17.160 align:middle line:90% So he's working-- 00:08:17.160 --> 00:08:19.860 align:middle line:84% reviewing a medium that was once conceived as low culture, 00:08:19.860 --> 00:08:22.580 align:middle line:84% had to work really hard to be considered high culture. 00:08:22.580 --> 00:08:25.620 align:middle line:84% And now he's saying, look, my films are high culture, your 00:08:25.620 --> 00:08:26.770 align:middle line:90% video games are low culture. 00:08:26.770 --> 00:08:30.350 align:middle line:84% Which is totally hilarious because in the past 50 years, 00:08:30.350 --> 00:08:32.780 align:middle line:84% this has been completely collapsed by post-modernism. 00:08:32.780 --> 00:08:36.031 align:middle line:84% That's a whole 'nother talk altogether. 00:08:36.031 --> 00:08:36.640 align:middle line:84% Maybe high culture and low culture 00:08:36.640 --> 00:08:38.360 align:middle line:90% don't even exist anymore. 00:08:38.360 --> 00:08:39.950 align:middle line:90% So Ebert brings us all back. 00:08:39.950 --> 00:08:40.780 align:middle line:90% And you get everybody upset. 00:08:40.780 --> 00:08:42.840 align:middle line:84% And a bunch of trolls are on his website saying really 00:08:42.840 --> 00:08:45.240 align:middle line:84% terrible things about him and about what he said. 00:08:45.240 --> 00:08:48.450 align:middle line:84% But he kind of reinvigorated this talk. 00:08:48.450 --> 00:08:51.180 align:middle line:84% And so new scientists, inspired by this Ebert 00:08:51.180 --> 00:08:54.630 align:middle line:84% controversy and looking for con tips on CultureLab asked 00:08:54.630 --> 00:08:56.570 align:middle line:84% the question, can games be art? 00:08:56.570 --> 00:08:58.880 align:middle line:84% And they sent it out to a bunch of game scholars saying, 00:08:58.880 --> 00:09:01.725 align:middle line:90% what is your opinion on this? 00:09:01.725 --> 00:09:06.340 align:middle line:84% Ian Bogost is a very smart guy and says some really 00:09:06.340 --> 00:09:06.850 align:middle line:90% interesting things. 00:09:06.850 --> 00:09:08.420 align:middle line:84% This is really why I'm not gonna read the whole thing, 00:09:08.420 --> 00:09:13.170 align:middle line:84% but in the first paragraph he brings up things like Fountain 00:09:13.170 --> 00:09:16.550 align:middle line:84% by Marcel Duchamp, which is a urinal in a museum, for those 00:09:16.550 --> 00:09:17.400 align:middle line:84% of you who don't know about it. 00:09:17.400 --> 00:09:20.340 align:middle line:84% And that was a statement, a piece of art that he was 00:09:20.340 --> 00:09:23.020 align:middle line:84% literally trying to confront, what high culture defines as 00:09:23.020 --> 00:09:28.520 align:middle line:84% art by taking, literally, a urinal, putting it upside down 00:09:28.520 --> 00:09:30.270 align:middle line:84% on a pedestal, entitling it Fountain, and putting it in a 00:09:30.270 --> 00:09:32.180 align:middle line:84% museum, which is the pinnacle of high culture. 00:09:32.180 --> 00:09:34.530 align:middle line:84% If you can make it in a museum, you're art. 00:09:34.530 --> 00:09:36.996 align:middle line:84% And so this is something that-- 00:09:36.996 --> 00:09:40.220 align:middle line:84% He mentions Yoko Ono's performance art, where she's 00:09:40.220 --> 00:09:43.247 align:middle line:84% sitting in a chair, and she has scissors next to her and 00:09:43.247 --> 00:09:45.510 align:middle line:84% the audience is invited to come cut her clothes off one 00:09:45.510 --> 00:09:47.500 align:middle line:90% piece at a time. 00:09:47.500 --> 00:09:49.270 align:middle line:90% A lot of this kind of stuff. 00:09:49.270 --> 00:09:52.480 align:middle line:84% Andy Warhol pop culture paintings, 00:09:52.480 --> 00:09:55.950 align:middle line:90% Mondrian's abstract paintings. 00:09:55.950 --> 00:09:58.260 align:middle line:84% And he says a lot in that first paragraph. 00:09:58.260 --> 00:09:59.860 align:middle line:84% But I think this interesting part that I've 00:09:59.860 --> 00:10:01.730 align:middle line:84% pseudo-highlighted down here is interesting. 00:10:01.730 --> 00:10:02.940 align:middle line:90% I'm starting in the middle. 00:10:02.940 --> 00:10:05.670 align:middle line:84% He says if the purpose of art is indeed to force us to see 00:10:05.670 --> 00:10:08.560 align:middle line:84% something we thought we understood in a new light, 00:10:08.560 --> 00:10:10.995 align:middle line:84% perhaps the most fundamental move video games have made in 00:10:10.995 --> 00:10:14.151 align:middle line:84% the artistic tradition is in the very eliciting of the 00:10:14.151 --> 00:10:15.640 align:middle line:84% question, can video games be art? 00:10:15.640 --> 00:10:17.000 align:middle line:84% I think that's really interesting. 00:10:17.000 --> 00:10:19.030 align:middle line:84% So the fact that people are even asking this question 00:10:19.030 --> 00:10:22.380 align:middle line:84% suggests that video games are doing something that we 00:10:22.380 --> 00:10:25.070 align:middle line:84% traditionally conceive of art doing. 00:10:25.070 --> 00:10:27.470 align:middle line:84% That's, I think, a really powerful statement, that we're 00:10:27.470 --> 00:10:31.840 align:middle line:84% even having this discussion renders the question moot in 00:10:31.840 --> 00:10:35.080 align:middle line:84% some senses, which is I would say 00:10:35.080 --> 00:10:39.698 align:middle line:90% classic Bogostian wordplay. 00:10:39.698 --> 00:10:41.626 align:middle line:84% I think I just made something up called Bogostian. 00:10:41.626 --> 00:10:44.730 align:middle line:90% I should tweet all about it. 00:10:44.730 --> 00:10:48.070 align:middle line:84% John Sharp, from the Savannah College of Art and Design, has 00:10:48.070 --> 00:10:50.050 align:middle line:90% had a lot of thoughts on this. 00:10:50.050 --> 00:10:51.950 align:middle line:84% He's actually a great person to talk about this, because he 00:10:51.950 --> 00:10:53.870 align:middle line:84% studies video games, but he does it from an art history 00:10:53.870 --> 00:10:54.940 align:middle line:90% background as well. 00:10:54.940 --> 00:10:56.750 align:middle line:90% That's pretty good and useful. 00:10:56.750 --> 00:11:00.310 align:middle line:84% He talks about some interesting things here. 00:11:00.310 --> 00:11:03.750 align:middle line:84% Similarly to what Ian is doing, he's talking a bit 00:11:03.750 --> 00:11:08.340 align:middle line:84% about how video games and art are doing some similar things 00:11:08.340 --> 00:11:11.510 align:middle line:84% at times, and yet games have certain affordances that other 00:11:11.510 --> 00:11:14.638 align:middle line:90% media do not. 00:11:14.638 --> 00:11:17.440 align:middle line:84% He says at the end here, which I think is interesting, all 00:11:17.440 --> 00:11:19.990 align:middle line:84% this poses the question of why are we concerned with giving 00:11:19.990 --> 00:11:21.220 align:middle line:90% video games the status of art? 00:11:21.220 --> 00:11:23.010 align:middle line:84% This is one of the reasons why I hate this question. 00:11:23.010 --> 00:11:24.940 align:middle line:84% Are we simply trying to legitimize them? 00:11:24.940 --> 00:11:27.000 align:middle line:84% Does being called, quote/unquote art change the 00:11:27.000 --> 00:11:28.730 align:middle line:90% qualities of video games. 00:11:28.730 --> 00:11:31.056 align:middle line:84% Only if we can answer these questions can we move the 00:11:31.056 --> 00:11:31.620 align:middle line:90% conversation forward. 00:11:31.620 --> 00:11:34.500 align:middle line:84% I think he's reacting here to the question itself. 00:11:34.500 --> 00:11:36.730 align:middle line:84% Actually, he and Ian both are reacting to the question, Ian 00:11:36.730 --> 00:11:39.150 align:middle line:84% saying the question invalidates itself and John 00:11:39.150 --> 00:11:42.820 align:middle line:84% Sharp now saying that this question, it's not helping us. 00:11:42.820 --> 00:11:45.850 align:middle line:84% Asking how does calling it art, what does that do for the 00:11:45.850 --> 00:11:48.390 align:middle line:84% medium, that's the important question. 00:11:48.390 --> 00:11:51.470 align:middle line:84% Here's some thoughts about the question and some more 00:11:51.470 --> 00:11:54.340 align:middle line:84% evidence for why I think the question, are video games art 00:11:54.340 --> 00:11:57.898 align:middle line:90% is just quite wrong. 00:11:57.898 --> 00:12:03.880 align:middle line:84% Mary Flanagan takes it as being assumed that video games 00:12:03.880 --> 00:12:05.170 align:middle line:84% are art, which I think is actually great. 00:12:05.170 --> 00:12:08.150 align:middle line:84% In Critical Play she doesn't go to great lengths to define 00:12:08.150 --> 00:12:08.910 align:middle line:90% video games as art. 00:12:08.910 --> 00:12:10.710 align:middle line:84% She just looks at art and she looks at games 00:12:10.710 --> 00:12:11.830 align:middle line:90% and compares them. 00:12:11.830 --> 00:12:14.580 align:middle line:84% She just assumes that this is so. 00:12:14.580 --> 00:12:17.500 align:middle line:84% I think this is a really nice quote from the beginning of 00:12:17.500 --> 00:12:19.520 align:middle line:84% her Critical Play book, which is that, "Critical Play is 00:12:19.520 --> 00:12:22.180 align:middle line:84% built on the premise that, as with other media, games carry 00:12:22.180 --> 00:12:24.620 align:middle line:84% beliefs within their representation systems and 00:12:24.620 --> 00:12:26.440 align:middle line:84% mechanics." This is really important. "Artists using 00:12:26.440 --> 00:12:29.012 align:middle line:84% games as a medium of expression--" Again, good use 00:12:29.012 --> 00:12:30.290 align:middle line:90% of italics. 00:12:30.290 --> 00:12:32.230 align:middle line:84% "--,then, manipulate elements common to games-- 00:12:32.230 --> 00:12:34.836 align:middle line:84% representation systems and styles, rules of progress, 00:12:34.836 --> 00:12:37.640 align:middle line:84% codes of conduct, context of reception, winning and losing 00:12:37.640 --> 00:12:40.442 align:middle line:84% paradigms, ways of interacting in a game-- for they are the 00:12:40.442 --> 00:12:43.220 align:middle line:84% material properties of games, much like marble and chisel or 00:12:43.220 --> 00:12:46.025 align:middle line:84% pen and ink bring with them their own intended 00:12:46.025 --> 00:12:48.350 align:middle line:84% possibilities, limitations, and conventions." 00:12:48.350 --> 00:12:49.280 align:middle line:90% It's a great point. 00:12:49.280 --> 00:12:51.860 align:middle line:84% You would have a really hard time making a painting with a 00:12:51.860 --> 00:12:55.177 align:middle line:84% chisel and no paint, like you were using marble and a 00:12:55.177 --> 00:12:56.410 align:middle line:84% chisel, a you were trying to make a painting. 00:12:56.410 --> 00:12:57.360 align:middle line:90% Two different things. 00:12:57.360 --> 00:12:58.130 align:middle line:90% Both are art. 00:12:58.130 --> 00:12:59.670 align:middle line:84% It's the same thing with games. 00:12:59.670 --> 00:13:03.490 align:middle line:84% Games have rule sets, games have systems, games have 00:13:03.490 --> 00:13:04.730 align:middle line:90% win-and-loss paradigms. 00:13:04.730 --> 00:13:07.955 align:middle line:84% They have all these things that are conventions and 00:13:07.955 --> 00:13:11.180 align:middle line:84% things that we associate with even our definition of what a 00:13:11.180 --> 00:13:14.280 align:middle line:84% game is, which is at times faulty. 00:13:14.280 --> 00:13:15.890 align:middle line:90% But those are our tools. 00:13:15.890 --> 00:13:17.060 align:middle line:84% Those are how we communicate things. 00:13:17.060 --> 00:13:20.150 align:middle line:84% I think her first sentence is really important. 00:13:20.150 --> 00:13:22.210 align:middle line:84% I'm guessing with the stuff that you've been talking 00:13:22.210 --> 00:13:24.372 align:middle line:84% about-- them and Gonzalo Frasca-- 00:13:24.372 --> 00:13:25.670 align:middle line:90% that's coming through. 00:13:25.670 --> 00:13:27.190 align:middle line:84% I actually see that in your games. 00:13:27.190 --> 00:13:29.450 align:middle line:84% You're trying to-- so, for example I play-tested that 00:13:29.450 --> 00:13:32.800 align:middle line:84% FedEx game, and I play-tested the game about marriage. 00:13:32.800 --> 00:13:35.290 align:middle line:84% There's all kinds of meaning in those systems and meanings 00:13:35.290 --> 00:13:39.200 align:middle line:84% in those choices that you get that are being communicated. 00:13:39.200 --> 00:13:42.220 align:middle line:84% And that's very similar to what an artist would do with 00:13:42.220 --> 00:13:43.156 align:middle line:90% any other medium. 00:13:43.156 --> 00:13:45.310 align:middle line:84% You're communicating a message through those. 00:13:45.310 --> 00:13:47.120 align:middle line:84% And sometimes we do it accidentally. 00:13:47.120 --> 00:13:49.200 align:middle line:90% It's not always explicit. 00:13:49.200 --> 00:13:49.940 align:middle line:90% We make something-- 00:13:49.940 --> 00:13:54.020 align:middle line:84% I would say that the graveyard and when you get divorced and 00:13:54.020 --> 00:13:56.610 align:middle line:84% you put your divorced person in the graveyard is an 00:13:56.610 --> 00:13:59.360 align:middle line:84% interesting choice for me, because it was creating an 00:13:59.360 --> 00:14:01.473 align:middle line:84% equivalence between divorce and death, which I think is 00:14:01.473 --> 00:14:02.980 align:middle line:90% kind of interesting. 00:14:02.980 --> 00:14:05.540 align:middle line:84% That's just one interesting example. 00:14:05.540 --> 00:14:08.790 align:middle line:84% So Mary Flanagan in her book talks about this art movement 00:14:08.790 --> 00:14:09.210 align:middle line:90% called Fluxus. 00:14:09.210 --> 00:14:09.980 align:middle line:90% Before I go into-- 00:14:09.980 --> 00:14:13.550 align:middle line:84% any kind of thoughts or questions? 00:14:13.550 --> 00:14:15.680 align:middle line:84% Does anybody else think-- does anybody think video games 00:14:15.680 --> 00:14:16.833 align:middle line:90% aren't art still? 00:14:16.833 --> 00:14:17.520 align:middle line:90% It's okay. 00:14:17.520 --> 00:14:19.544 align:middle line:90% Oh, crap, we're gonna fight. 00:14:19.544 --> 00:14:22.125 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE] when we were designing art, so our art 00:14:22.125 --> 00:14:25.590 align:middle line:84% project now is you have to choose a real-world 00:14:25.590 --> 00:14:27.072 align:middle line:90% system and relate it. 00:14:27.072 --> 00:14:28.740 align:middle line:84% That's what we're all working on. 00:14:28.740 --> 00:14:31.570 align:middle line:84% And one of the big things that really helped us get started 00:14:31.570 --> 00:14:34.303 align:middle line:84% is, what is the message we want to get across to each set 00:14:34.303 --> 00:14:34.580 align:middle line:90% of ablutions? 00:14:34.580 --> 00:14:35.370 align:middle line:90% What is a bad ablution? 00:14:35.370 --> 00:14:36.826 align:middle line:84% Do you want to say that's random, do you want to say 00:14:36.826 --> 00:14:37.690 align:middle line:90% that's this? 00:14:37.690 --> 00:14:40.910 align:middle line:84% And how do we express that, which [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 00:14:40.910 --> 00:14:41.225 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Totally. 00:14:41.225 --> 00:14:43.640 align:middle line:84% And it gets even crazier when you take-- 00:14:43.640 --> 00:14:45.760 align:middle line:84% when you try to look at systems that are not 00:14:45.760 --> 00:14:48.590 align:middle line:90% particularly tangible. 00:14:48.590 --> 00:14:52.500 align:middle line:84% You maybe looked at it, but Elude is a game about 00:14:52.500 --> 00:14:53.780 align:middle line:90% depression. 00:14:53.780 --> 00:14:57.135 align:middle line:84% There aren't exactly tangible kind of road maps the way 00:14:57.135 --> 00:15:00.540 align:middle line:84% there are with FedEx systems, for clinical depression. 00:15:00.540 --> 00:15:02.570 align:middle line:84% And yet you're looking at things like emotions, 00:15:02.570 --> 00:15:06.660 align:middle line:84% feelings, stuff like that, that we might call abstract, 00:15:06.660 --> 00:15:08.410 align:middle line:90% or just not immediate. 00:15:08.410 --> 00:15:12.205 align:middle line:84% How do you communicate those in systems? 00:15:12.205 --> 00:15:13.630 align:middle line:90% It's really tricky. 00:15:13.630 --> 00:15:16.955 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I have friends that talk about all their games 00:15:16.955 --> 00:15:21.626 align:middle line:84% which are like more --genic or more abstract. 00:15:21.626 --> 00:15:23.900 align:middle line:84% Does Ebert [UNINTELLIGIBLE] art? 00:15:23.900 --> 00:15:27.075 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: I mean, it's a really good question. 00:15:27.075 --> 00:15:28.860 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: What would he say about that? 00:15:28.860 --> 00:15:31.400 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: I think that falls along the same lines as, 00:15:31.400 --> 00:15:34.460 align:middle line:84% like I said, does Ebert consider pornography art? 00:15:34.460 --> 00:15:35.790 align:middle line:84% It's a really difficult question. 00:15:35.790 --> 00:15:41.460 align:middle line:84% That's a much larger art history debate, about has high 00:15:41.460 --> 00:15:43.200 align:middle line:84% culture and low culture completely collapsed? 00:15:43.200 --> 00:15:47.870 align:middle line:84% Has mass-media proliferation deteriorated conceptions of 00:15:47.870 --> 00:15:51.110 align:middle line:84% what really high culture art are, versus low culture. 00:15:51.110 --> 00:15:54.600 align:middle line:90% 00:15:54.600 --> 00:15:56.700 align:middle line:84% I don't have particularly good answers for that. 00:15:56.700 --> 00:16:00.000 align:middle line:84% I think just as all of the other media that we looked at, 00:16:00.000 --> 00:16:02.200 align:middle line:84% does a Jerry Bruckheimer film count as art? 00:16:02.200 --> 00:16:05.100 align:middle line:84% Just like we would look at that and ask that question, we 00:16:05.100 --> 00:16:08.720 align:middle line:84% don't then deny the entire medium of film from the 00:16:08.720 --> 00:16:10.600 align:middle line:90% possibility of being artistic. 00:16:10.600 --> 00:16:13.310 align:middle line:84% There seems to be this desire, because the majority of games 00:16:13.310 --> 00:16:14.900 align:middle line:90% in our sector-- 00:16:14.900 --> 00:16:16.780 align:middle line:84% which I actually do, too, because if you 00:16:16.780 --> 00:16:18.290 align:middle line:90% go far enough back-- 00:16:18.290 --> 00:16:21.000 align:middle line:90% I should say video games-- 00:16:21.000 --> 00:16:24.847 align:middle line:84% Because most video games are commercially intended and 00:16:24.847 --> 00:16:28.280 align:middle line:84% involve fairly similar things, does that preclude the medium 00:16:28.280 --> 00:16:30.904 align:middle line:84% from the possibility of being artistic? 00:16:30.904 --> 00:16:35.140 align:middle line:84% I go back to that Ebert comment about he says they 00:16:35.140 --> 00:16:38.160 align:middle line:84% can't possibly be, or at least he says never is a long time. 00:16:38.160 --> 00:16:41.556 align:middle line:84% But not in our lifetime, it apparently is impossible. 00:16:41.556 --> 00:16:42.720 align:middle line:90% It's a good point. 00:16:42.720 --> 00:16:46.600 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: There's actually interesting effects with the 00:16:46.600 --> 00:16:49.263 align:middle line:84% game we're designing which is essentially city building and 00:16:49.263 --> 00:16:53.380 align:middle line:84% city creation in the time of the Roman Empire. 00:16:53.380 --> 00:16:57.845 align:middle line:84% And we actually didn't intend to instill any 00:16:57.845 --> 00:16:58.880 align:middle line:90% meaning in the game. 00:16:58.880 --> 00:17:01.090 align:middle line:84% But once we actually designed the mechanics and stuff, we 00:17:01.090 --> 00:17:02.940 align:middle line:84% realized that it was essentially a game about the 00:17:02.940 --> 00:17:05.760 align:middle line:84% rich getting richer and trying to control the board. 00:17:05.760 --> 00:17:08.170 align:middle line:84% So it's like there's almost this inherent meaning that 00:17:08.170 --> 00:17:09.780 align:middle line:84% came out from just designing the game. 00:17:09.780 --> 00:17:10.859 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, yeah. 00:17:10.859 --> 00:17:14.050 align:middle line:84% You almost can't help but have it happen in some instances. 00:17:14.050 --> 00:17:17.449 align:middle line:84% It reminds me of a good thing that Brenda Brathwaite put in 00:17:17.449 --> 00:17:19.589 align:middle line:84% one of her talks once, which was about the game 00:17:19.589 --> 00:17:22.560 align:middle line:84% Civilization, the mod Colonization for sig IV, which 00:17:22.560 --> 00:17:24.970 align:middle line:84% is a great mod in which you play one of the European 00:17:24.970 --> 00:17:26.910 align:middle line:84% colonizers and you come over to the New World. 00:17:26.910 --> 00:17:30.530 align:middle line:84% And there's indigenous peoples there. 00:17:30.530 --> 00:17:32.450 align:middle line:84% You have to negotiate with them at first, but eventually 00:17:32.450 --> 00:17:36.010 align:middle line:84% you just beat them up and take their land, or they just give 00:17:36.010 --> 00:17:37.450 align:middle line:84% it to you because you're more powerful than they are. 00:17:37.450 --> 00:17:40.160 align:middle line:84% And she was making the point, there's this great box art, 00:17:40.160 --> 00:17:42.490 align:middle line:84% the Native Americans in the corner and the Conquistador in 00:17:42.490 --> 00:17:44.290 align:middle line:84% the middle, the Spanish, and the Dutch. 00:17:44.290 --> 00:17:46.380 align:middle line:84% And it's like, if you were a Native American how would you 00:17:46.380 --> 00:17:47.610 align:middle line:90% respond to this game? 00:17:47.610 --> 00:17:50.850 align:middle line:84% And I'm like, yeah, I'm totally making America again. 00:17:50.850 --> 00:17:53.160 align:middle line:84% And other people would be like, oh my god, you basically 00:17:53.160 --> 00:17:56.080 align:middle line:84% just wiped out my ancestors, thanks. 00:17:56.080 --> 00:17:59.610 align:middle line:84% So it's true, sometimes you falling into meaning. 00:17:59.610 --> 00:18:00.918 align:middle line:90% It's something. 00:18:00.918 --> 00:18:03.720 align:middle line:84% And I think, again, a lot of art does that, right? 00:18:03.720 --> 00:18:06.620 align:middle line:84% And some art did it quite purposely, where they weren't 00:18:06.620 --> 00:18:10.860 align:middle line:84% divulging the meaning, they were inviting readings on it. 00:18:10.860 --> 00:18:11.310 align:middle line:90% So, Fluxus. 00:18:11.310 --> 00:18:14.770 align:middle line:84% Fluxus is this really interesting 00:18:14.770 --> 00:18:16.690 align:middle line:90% mid-20th-century art-- 00:18:16.690 --> 00:18:19.160 align:middle line:84% they rejected the term "movement," they called it an 00:18:19.160 --> 00:18:20.264 align:middle line:90% "attitude"-- 00:18:20.264 --> 00:18:23.200 align:middle line:84% that Mary Flanagan talks about a bit in her 00:18:23.200 --> 00:18:24.280 align:middle line:90% Critical Play book. 00:18:24.280 --> 00:18:25.820 align:middle line:84% It's actually quite interesting. 00:18:25.820 --> 00:18:28.410 align:middle line:84% It really starts out early with John Cage. 00:18:28.410 --> 00:18:30.940 align:middle line:84% Have you guys heard of him, the composer? 00:18:30.940 --> 00:18:34.400 align:middle line:84% He's most famous for this piece of music that he wrote 00:18:34.400 --> 00:18:37.240 align:middle line:90% where, I forget the duration, 00:18:37.240 --> 00:18:38.130 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: 4'33". 00:18:38.130 --> 00:18:39.020 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: 4'33", yeah. 00:18:39.020 --> 00:18:44.070 align:middle line:84% it's 4 minutes and 33 seconds of not, well, not playing. 00:18:44.070 --> 00:18:44.740 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: He rests. 00:18:44.740 --> 00:18:45.030 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: He rests. 00:18:45.030 --> 00:18:45.930 align:middle line:90% Exactly. 00:18:45.930 --> 00:18:48.560 align:middle line:84% So you'd sit down at the piano. 00:18:48.560 --> 00:18:50.050 align:middle line:84% You'd pull out the music and everyone would hush. 00:18:50.050 --> 00:18:52.340 align:middle line:84% And then for 4 minutes and 33 seconds you'd sit there, 00:18:52.340 --> 00:18:54.310 align:middle line:84% possibly with your hands on the keys. 00:18:54.310 --> 00:18:56.566 align:middle line:84% And then after the time, you would stand up, and you'd take 00:18:56.566 --> 00:18:58.670 align:middle line:84% your bow, and the audience would erupt 00:18:58.670 --> 00:19:02.370 align:middle line:90% into incredible applause. 00:19:02.370 --> 00:19:06.110 align:middle line:84% He was really testing the idea of what they eventually called 00:19:06.110 --> 00:19:07.680 align:middle line:90% scores, or event scores. 00:19:07.680 --> 00:19:13.090 align:middle line:84% This idea that music is an art form where you can write it 00:19:13.090 --> 00:19:15.060 align:middle line:84% down, and then it becomes performable. 00:19:15.060 --> 00:19:19.130 align:middle line:84% It becomes this thing that someone can engage with. 00:19:19.130 --> 00:19:21.280 align:middle line:84% We don't think of paintings that way. 00:19:21.280 --> 00:19:23.750 align:middle line:84% We don't think of paintings as having a score, having some 00:19:23.750 --> 00:19:26.060 align:middle line:84% kind of, how do I engage with this? 00:19:26.060 --> 00:19:29.790 align:middle line:84% It sounds kind of like games, in figuring out how does 00:19:29.790 --> 00:19:33.790 align:middle line:84% interactivity work in artistic mediums. 00:19:33.790 --> 00:19:37.080 align:middle line:84% Really interested in indeterminacy, too. 00:19:37.080 --> 00:19:40.230 align:middle line:84% I think you'll see in some of these examples, they're really 00:19:40.230 --> 00:19:44.480 align:middle line:84% kind of pushing on the boundaries of what art has 00:19:44.480 --> 00:19:46.010 align:middle line:90% been doing to this point. 00:19:46.010 --> 00:19:50.910 align:middle line:84% They call it intermedia, meaning that the more multiple 00:19:50.910 --> 00:19:55.060 align:middle line:84% modes that you can use for communicating it was really 00:19:55.060 --> 00:19:57.520 align:middle line:90% important to the attitude. 00:19:57.520 --> 00:20:01.390 align:middle line:84% Simplicity was really big, having basic 00:20:01.390 --> 00:20:03.450 align:middle line:90% systems and basic scores. 00:20:03.450 --> 00:20:07.590 align:middle line:84% And then this idea of play was really important. 00:20:07.590 --> 00:20:11.020 align:middle line:84% Yoko Ono, it's funny we sort of just attach her to John 00:20:11.020 --> 00:20:15.405 align:middle line:84% Lennon, but she was an artist before she was in a 00:20:15.405 --> 00:20:16.270 align:middle line:90% relationship with him. 00:20:16.270 --> 00:20:18.920 align:middle line:84% She's actually well known as one of these kind of Fluxus 00:20:18.920 --> 00:20:20.650 align:middle line:90% practitioners. 00:20:20.650 --> 00:20:21.440 align:middle line:90% This is interesting. 00:20:21.440 --> 00:20:24.460 align:middle line:90% This is the Fluxus manifesto. 00:20:24.460 --> 00:20:27.090 align:middle line:84% I wanted to put this up because I think you can get a 00:20:27.090 --> 00:20:30.940 align:middle line:84% little bit of a sense for what they were trying to go for. 00:20:30.940 --> 00:20:34.810 align:middle line:84% They were taking the word "flux" and putting 00:20:34.810 --> 00:20:37.370 align:middle line:84% definition-- but then they were mending it here, so, 00:20:37.370 --> 00:20:41.310 align:middle line:84% purge the world of Bourgeois sickness, intellectual, 00:20:41.310 --> 00:20:43.220 align:middle line:84% professional, and commercialized culture. 00:20:43.220 --> 00:20:46.320 align:middle line:84% Purge the world of dead art, imitation, artificial art, 00:20:46.320 --> 00:20:48.150 align:middle line:84% abstract art, illusionistic art, mathematical art. 00:20:48.150 --> 00:20:51.762 align:middle line:84% I like this, purge the world of Europeanism. 00:20:51.762 --> 00:20:53.578 align:middle line:90% I don't think that's a word. 00:20:53.578 --> 00:20:55.370 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 00:20:55.370 --> 00:20:56.120 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Promote a revolutionary 00:20:56.120 --> 00:20:58.000 align:middle line:90% flood and tide in art. 00:20:58.000 --> 00:21:01.280 align:middle line:84% Promote living art, anti-art, non-art reality. 00:21:01.280 --> 00:21:03.860 align:middle line:84% These things sound totally crazy. 00:21:03.860 --> 00:21:06.720 align:middle line:84% I love the, "to be fully grasped," but then it crosses 00:21:06.720 --> 00:21:10.380 align:middle line:84% out "fully." I don't doubt that was completely 00:21:10.380 --> 00:21:12.440 align:middle line:84% intentional, or if they wrote fully grasped and were like, 00:21:12.440 --> 00:21:13.345 align:middle line:90% oh, this is gonna be great. 00:21:13.345 --> 00:21:14.709 align:middle line:84% I'm crossing it out so you can see that I 00:21:14.709 --> 00:21:15.180 align:middle line:90% crossed out fully grasped. 00:21:15.180 --> 00:21:17.790 align:middle line:84% We want it to be not fully grasped. 00:21:17.790 --> 00:21:20.860 align:middle line:84% We want it to be partially grasped by all people. 00:21:20.860 --> 00:21:24.690 align:middle line:84% Not only critics feel this class is professional. 00:21:24.690 --> 00:21:27.370 align:middle line:84% It's just a really interesting thing, and it sort of screams 00:21:27.370 --> 00:21:28.520 align:middle line:90% the avant-garde. 00:21:28.520 --> 00:21:30.080 align:middle line:84% They were trying to push against boundaries. 00:21:30.080 --> 00:21:32.420 align:middle line:84% They're trying to figure out what is the edge of the medium 00:21:32.420 --> 00:21:35.770 align:middle line:84% and then how can we jump way off it? 00:21:35.770 --> 00:21:38.450 align:middle line:90% 00:21:38.450 --> 00:21:41.190 align:middle line:84% Some of the classic Fluxus works were these things called 00:21:41.190 --> 00:21:43.630 align:middle line:90% Flux boxes or Flux kits. 00:21:43.630 --> 00:21:45.270 align:middle line:84% Flux kits tended to have event scores. 00:21:45.270 --> 00:21:46.580 align:middle line:84% This is one of the most famous called Water 00:21:46.580 --> 00:21:48.870 align:middle line:90% Yam by George Brecht. 00:21:48.870 --> 00:21:53.930 align:middle line:84% And basically this is a box with 70 event scores. 00:21:53.930 --> 00:21:56.460 align:middle line:84% These are an example of these event scores. 00:21:56.460 --> 00:21:56.940 align:middle line:90% It's interesting. 00:21:56.940 --> 00:21:59.160 align:middle line:84% The event scores really seem like rule systems. 00:21:59.160 --> 00:22:02.070 align:middle line:84% They're like the instructions to your board game, except 00:22:02.070 --> 00:22:03.803 align:middle line:90% they're kind of whacky. 00:22:03.803 --> 00:22:06.960 align:middle line:84% If you look at air conditioning, the rule is move 00:22:06.960 --> 00:22:08.150 align:middle line:90% through the place. 00:22:08.150 --> 00:22:09.880 align:middle line:90% Which is really interesting. 00:22:09.880 --> 00:22:12.522 align:middle line:84% If you encounter this game and you're like, all right, I'm 00:22:12.522 --> 00:22:13.612 align:middle line:90% gonna play Water Yam. 00:22:13.612 --> 00:22:15.540 align:middle line:84% And you're like, move through the place. 00:22:15.540 --> 00:22:18.840 align:middle line:84% I think that's pretty characteristic of movement, 00:22:18.840 --> 00:22:22.540 align:middle line:84% right, present you with some sort of objective or some sort 00:22:22.540 --> 00:22:27.601 align:middle line:84% of requirement, but one that is abstract or nebulous, or 00:22:27.601 --> 00:22:28.870 align:middle line:90% just kind of strange. 00:22:28.870 --> 00:22:30.400 align:middle line:90% This one's even better. 00:22:30.400 --> 00:22:34.490 align:middle line:84% On a white chair, a great tape measure, alphabet, flag, 00:22:34.490 --> 00:22:36.920 align:middle line:90% black, and spectral color. 00:22:36.920 --> 00:22:38.680 align:middle line:84% In this instance, it's not even clear what you're 00:22:38.680 --> 00:22:39.920 align:middle line:90% necessarily supposed to do. 00:22:39.920 --> 00:22:43.390 align:middle line:84% Are you supposed to compile these things on a white chair? 00:22:43.390 --> 00:22:45.370 align:middle line:84% Are you supposed to sit on a white chair and hold all of 00:22:45.370 --> 00:22:46.521 align:middle line:90% these things? 00:22:46.521 --> 00:22:48.485 align:middle line:90% It's not particularly clear. 00:22:48.485 --> 00:22:51.280 align:middle line:90% 00:22:51.280 --> 00:22:52.810 align:middle line:84% This is the playfulness of this movement. 00:22:52.810 --> 00:22:59.870 align:middle line:84% This is the energy of this of avant-garde movement. 00:22:59.870 --> 00:23:02.350 align:middle line:84% You can see the relationship, I hope, between 00:23:02.350 --> 00:23:03.800 align:middle line:90% rule systems and these. 00:23:03.800 --> 00:23:06.386 align:middle line:84% The next example is, I think, an even better one. 00:23:06.386 --> 00:23:07.910 align:middle line:84% But you can see how they're playing 00:23:07.910 --> 00:23:08.560 align:middle line:90% around with these ideas. 00:23:08.560 --> 00:23:10.625 align:middle line:84% At least they're incorporating interactivity 00:23:10.625 --> 00:23:12.070 align:middle line:90% into these art movements. 00:23:12.070 --> 00:23:14.987 align:middle line:84% And keep in mind, these are being shown in galleries These 00:23:14.987 --> 00:23:17.740 align:middle line:84% are being shown in high-art places. 00:23:17.740 --> 00:23:23.285 align:middle line:84% These are being sent out to their friends as works of art. 00:23:23.285 --> 00:23:24.640 align:middle line:90% This one's great. 00:23:24.640 --> 00:23:28.560 align:middle line:84% This is White Chess by Yoko Ono. 00:23:28.560 --> 00:23:31.490 align:middle line:84% It's often depicted on its own and you have to imagine what 00:23:31.490 --> 00:23:31.990 align:middle line:90% the rules are. 00:23:31.990 --> 00:23:34.510 align:middle line:84% But I actually think her rules as they are written are 00:23:34.510 --> 00:23:36.010 align:middle line:84% actually pretty important to it. 00:23:36.010 --> 00:23:38.780 align:middle line:84% She says, play it for as long as you remember who is your 00:23:38.780 --> 00:23:41.640 align:middle line:84% opponent and who is your own self. 00:23:41.640 --> 00:23:44.750 align:middle line:90% Very interesting wordage. 00:23:44.750 --> 00:23:46.665 align:middle line:84% What are the complications with white chess. 00:23:46.665 --> 00:23:47.160 align:middle line:90% Anyone. 00:23:47.160 --> 00:23:47.440 align:middle line:90% Any thoughts? 00:23:47.440 --> 00:23:50.750 align:middle line:84% Based on your perceptions of non-white chess or 00:23:50.750 --> 00:23:52.070 align:middle line:90% white-and-black chess? 00:23:52.070 --> 00:23:55.070 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You'd get into arguing about is that my pawn 00:23:55.070 --> 00:23:56.210 align:middle line:90% or your pawn? 00:23:56.210 --> 00:23:57.760 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yes, you definitely-- it will be hard 00:23:57.760 --> 00:23:59.560 align:middle line:84% to keep track of, I would think. 00:23:59.560 --> 00:24:01.670 align:middle line:84% That's why she said, "as long as you can remember." Any 00:24:01.670 --> 00:24:04.920 align:middle line:90% other weirdness from this? 00:24:04.920 --> 00:24:06.150 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Who is friend and who is enemy? 00:24:06.150 --> 00:24:07.620 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, certainly. 00:24:07.620 --> 00:24:09.400 align:middle line:84% This sort of like, wait, was that my piece? 00:24:09.400 --> 00:24:10.100 align:middle line:90% Was that your piece? 00:24:10.100 --> 00:24:13.200 align:middle line:84% Not only does that complicate your relationship to the other 00:24:13.200 --> 00:24:15.670 align:middle line:84% player, but now it's like, to the game itself, it's like, 00:24:15.670 --> 00:24:17.864 align:middle line:84% wait, what was the strategy I was doing? 00:24:17.864 --> 00:24:18.640 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Friendly or unfriendly fire? 00:24:18.640 --> 00:24:20.472 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: I mean, it's really hard to keep track of 00:24:20.472 --> 00:24:21.150 align:middle line:90% stuff in chess. 00:24:21.150 --> 00:24:22.480 align:middle line:90% What about the board? 00:24:22.480 --> 00:24:24.170 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: He writes off the king and the queen by mistake 00:24:24.170 --> 00:24:25.730 align:middle line:90% because you don't have to-- 00:24:25.730 --> 00:24:28.880 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: There's not really any actual boxes on the board. 00:24:28.880 --> 00:24:30.780 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: There are boxes-- 00:24:30.780 --> 00:24:33.740 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, they're all white. 00:24:33.740 --> 00:24:36.915 align:middle line:84% That complicates things a little bit, too, because you 00:24:36.915 --> 00:24:38.870 align:middle line:84% need to remember how you were moving. 00:24:38.870 --> 00:24:39.220 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: How large is-- 00:24:39.220 --> 00:24:39.712 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: This one's really big. 00:24:39.712 --> 00:24:42.410 align:middle line:84% This is like a garden installment of White Chess. 00:24:42.410 --> 00:24:45.600 align:middle line:84% And I think the cool thing, too, this is another example 00:24:45.600 --> 00:24:47.020 align:middle line:90% of the movement. 00:24:47.020 --> 00:24:48.690 align:middle line:84% As long as you have the components you 00:24:48.690 --> 00:24:49.710 align:middle line:90% could play this game. 00:24:49.710 --> 00:24:51.090 align:middle line:84% You could create this art piece. 00:24:51.090 --> 00:24:54.190 align:middle line:84% I think the intent is not go play my 00:24:54.190 --> 00:24:55.560 align:middle line:90% installation of White Chess. 00:24:55.560 --> 00:24:58.410 align:middle line:84% It's that this is the rules, these are the 00:24:58.410 --> 00:25:00.400 align:middle line:90% pieces, it can be played. 00:25:00.400 --> 00:25:01.850 align:middle line:84% That screams game, that screams that 00:25:01.850 --> 00:25:04.540 align:middle line:90% portability of a game. 00:25:04.540 --> 00:25:08.380 align:middle line:84% Again, this wasn't considered anything but art, except 00:25:08.380 --> 00:25:10.750 align:middle line:84% probably by people who turned their nose at 00:25:10.750 --> 00:25:14.260 align:middle line:90% this sort of thing. 00:25:14.260 --> 00:25:20.100 align:middle line:84% they've Any thoughts on what White Chess could 00:25:20.100 --> 00:25:23.740 align:middle line:90% be about, in a-- 00:25:23.740 --> 00:25:26.150 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Two different sides merging to one. 00:25:26.150 --> 00:25:31.500 align:middle line:84% And so you eventually get, why am I fighting? 00:25:31.500 --> 00:25:33.170 align:middle line:84% Who is my enemy in this situation? 00:25:33.170 --> 00:25:33.620 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Sure, sure. 00:25:33.620 --> 00:25:35.440 align:middle line:90% Any other thoughts? 00:25:35.440 --> 00:25:36.560 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Racial relations. 00:25:36.560 --> 00:25:38.830 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Sure, racial relations. 00:25:38.830 --> 00:25:41.730 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: It's probably a whole antiwar thing of, like, 00:25:41.730 --> 00:25:43.560 align:middle line:84% are we actually destroying ourselves? 00:25:43.560 --> 00:25:45.920 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, and that's an interesting thing. 00:25:45.920 --> 00:25:50.290 align:middle line:84% Yoko Ono was a decidedly antiwar activist at the time 00:25:50.290 --> 00:25:52.790 align:middle line:84% she was making this in the early '60s. 00:25:52.790 --> 00:25:54.975 align:middle line:84% One thing-- you can't take anything for granted, but the 00:25:54.975 --> 00:25:57.060 align:middle line:84% pieces aren't all black, they're all white. 00:25:57.060 --> 00:26:00.179 align:middle line:84% So I think the race thing does play a factor. 00:26:00.179 --> 00:26:02.892 align:middle line:84% The inability to remember who you're attacking and 00:26:02.892 --> 00:26:04.220 align:middle line:90% who you are, even. 00:26:04.220 --> 00:26:06.320 align:middle line:84% I think that's actually why I really like her words. 00:26:06.320 --> 00:26:08.801 align:middle line:84% Because, "for as long as you can remember who's your 00:26:08.801 --> 00:26:10.170 align:middle line:84% opponent and who is your own self," there's something about 00:26:10.170 --> 00:26:13.650 align:middle line:84% incorporating your own self in there, not just saying what 00:26:13.650 --> 00:26:14.710 align:middle line:90% your pieces are. 00:26:14.710 --> 00:26:16.740 align:middle line:84% She's not saying can you remember what your pieces are. 00:26:16.740 --> 00:26:19.100 align:middle line:84% She's saying remember who you're playing against versus 00:26:19.100 --> 00:26:20.996 align:middle line:90% who you are. 00:26:20.996 --> 00:26:25.370 align:middle line:84% That's very different verbiage. 00:26:25.370 --> 00:26:28.680 align:middle line:84% I think it's very much a game about who are 00:26:28.680 --> 00:26:30.250 align:middle line:90% you fighting, anyway? 00:26:30.250 --> 00:26:34.428 align:middle line:84% What is the point of war, what is the purpose of war? 00:26:34.428 --> 00:26:37.230 align:middle line:84% And how does war particularly function? 00:26:37.230 --> 00:26:39.116 align:middle line:84% And in the rhetoric of the time it makes a 00:26:39.116 --> 00:26:41.670 align:middle line:90% lot of sense, right? 00:26:41.670 --> 00:26:44.140 align:middle line:84% So that's Yoko Ono's White Chess, which is part of the 00:26:44.140 --> 00:26:45.260 align:middle line:90% Fluxus [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 00:26:45.260 --> 00:26:46.620 align:middle line:90% Yes, it's pretty cool. 00:26:46.620 --> 00:26:49.566 align:middle line:84% Actually, Fluxus and artists in this period have a really 00:26:49.566 --> 00:26:51.180 align:middle line:84% interesting relationship with chess. 00:26:51.180 --> 00:26:52.526 align:middle line:84% There's like some quote, and I'm gonna 00:26:52.526 --> 00:26:53.640 align:middle line:90% butcher it, but it's-- 00:26:53.640 --> 00:26:57.690 align:middle line:84% I think it was Marcel Duchamp saying that not all chess 00:26:57.690 --> 00:27:00.350 align:middle line:84% players are artists, but all artists are chess players, or 00:27:00.350 --> 00:27:00.980 align:middle line:90% something like that. 00:27:00.980 --> 00:27:04.050 align:middle line:84% He is particularly fascinated with chess, and you can see 00:27:04.050 --> 00:27:08.020 align:middle line:84% elements of chess in his work, ought to 00:27:08.020 --> 00:27:10.860 align:middle line:90% be painted or whatever. 00:27:10.860 --> 00:27:12.110 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: He was completely obsessed with chess. 00:27:12.110 --> 00:27:12.830 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah. 00:27:12.830 --> 00:27:14.805 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: He played it really hard. 00:27:14.805 --> 00:27:17.140 align:middle line:84% He wasn't necessarily a very good player, 00:27:17.140 --> 00:27:18.120 align:middle line:90% but he played a lot. 00:27:18.120 --> 00:27:20.080 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Very into it. 00:27:20.080 --> 00:27:22.830 align:middle line:84% So now I'm gonna move out of this Fluxus movement. 00:27:22.830 --> 00:27:24.075 align:middle line:84% I just wanted to show you a couple examples. 00:27:24.075 --> 00:27:27.091 align:middle line:84% But I think this next one is actually an interesting-- this 00:27:27.091 --> 00:27:29.300 align:middle line:84% is a current theme that I'm really excited about, which is 00:27:29.300 --> 00:27:32.436 align:middle line:90% called Sixteen Tons. 00:27:32.436 --> 00:27:34.700 align:middle line:84% This is a game I unfortunately have not been able to play 00:27:34.700 --> 00:27:37.070 align:middle line:84% yet, but I've witnessed play because it's a 00:27:37.070 --> 00:27:37.900 align:middle line:90% game for four players. 00:27:37.900 --> 00:27:42.640 align:middle line:84% This was created by Eric Zimmerman and Nathalie Pozzi. 00:27:42.640 --> 00:27:43.560 align:middle line:84% It's a really interesting game. 00:27:43.560 --> 00:27:45.230 align:middle line:84% It's a little hard to see from these pictures. 00:27:45.230 --> 00:27:47.490 align:middle line:84% But it's this giant circle, I would say almost the size of 00:27:47.490 --> 00:27:50.775 align:middle line:84% this room, of corrugated cardboard, maybe even bigger, 00:27:50.775 --> 00:27:52.350 align:middle line:84% a little bit bigger than this room. 00:27:52.350 --> 00:27:57.840 align:middle line:84% Inside you've got this array of colored and circles in 00:27:57.840 --> 00:28:04.010 align:middle line:84% these pretty hefty steel tubes that have color. 00:28:04.010 --> 00:28:04.920 align:middle line:90% Let's go through the rules. 00:28:04.920 --> 00:28:07.330 align:middle line:84% The first thing you notice is that they contextualize the 00:28:07.330 --> 00:28:11.790 align:middle line:84% title, Sixteen Tons, with a quote from the song, "You load 00:28:11.790 --> 00:28:13.412 align:middle line:90% 16 tons, and what do you get? 00:28:13.412 --> 00:28:15.070 align:middle line:84% Another day older and deeper in debt." 00:28:15.070 --> 00:28:18.766 align:middle line:84% This is doing an interesting thing that John Sharp, who you 00:28:18.766 --> 00:28:20.510 align:middle line:84% can see in the middle, thinks is actually particularly 00:28:20.510 --> 00:28:23.710 align:middle line:84% important for games and games that are working this art 00:28:23.710 --> 00:28:26.370 align:middle line:84% movement is that they declare their intentionality. 00:28:26.370 --> 00:28:29.570 align:middle line:84% Whether they declare what they're meaning is or not is 00:28:29.570 --> 00:28:30.640 align:middle line:90% less important. 00:28:30.640 --> 00:28:33.650 align:middle line:84% To be taken seriously, you take yourself seriously, I 00:28:33.650 --> 00:28:35.030 align:middle line:84% think was one of things he said. 00:28:35.030 --> 00:28:38.450 align:middle line:84% And I think this is another good example when you talk 00:28:38.450 --> 00:28:40.600 align:middle line:84% about how games maybe in the digital space do this. 00:28:40.600 --> 00:28:44.480 align:middle line:84% But right now they're already priming you for reading the 00:28:44.480 --> 00:28:47.245 align:middle line:84% rules in a way that is different than just, ooh, 00:28:47.245 --> 00:28:48.750 align:middle line:90% let's play. 00:28:48.750 --> 00:28:52.260 align:middle line:84% Could you imagine if Monopoly had some sort of Marxist quote 00:28:52.260 --> 00:28:53.940 align:middle line:84% in the front of it, or something like that, your 00:28:53.940 --> 00:28:57.360 align:middle line:84% experience of it would be completely different. 00:28:57.360 --> 00:29:00.460 align:middle line:84% You set up, you put the pieces in this array, you stand on a 00:29:00.460 --> 00:29:02.750 align:middle line:84% number and that indicates what color you are. 00:29:02.750 --> 00:29:04.480 align:middle line:84% And this is great, you take out $3.00. 00:29:04.480 --> 00:29:08.180 align:middle line:84% Although you can see in this second picture they're playing 00:29:08.180 --> 00:29:12.485 align:middle line:84% what Eric the designer has deemed high stakes. 00:29:12.485 --> 00:29:16.625 align:middle line:84% Sixteen Tons where you pull out three five-dollar bills. 00:29:16.625 --> 00:29:17.930 align:middle line:90% It says, how to win. 00:29:17.930 --> 00:29:19.740 align:middle line:84% You win when the two pieces of your color are directly 00:29:19.740 --> 00:29:21.460 align:middle line:90% adjacent to each other. 00:29:21.460 --> 00:29:24.142 align:middle line:84% So diagonally adjacent does not count for a win. 00:29:24.142 --> 00:29:25.660 align:middle line:84% The way you play is, players take turns, starting with 00:29:25.660 --> 00:29:26.285 align:middle line:90% player one. 00:29:26.285 --> 00:29:28.320 align:middle line:84% When it's your turn, you say, put me to work. 00:29:28.320 --> 00:29:30.530 align:middle line:84% Players may then offer to pay you one or more 00:29:30.530 --> 00:29:31.880 align:middle line:90% dollars in any order. 00:29:31.880 --> 00:29:34.060 align:middle line:84% So anyone can just say, I'll give you this. 00:29:34.060 --> 00:29:36.130 align:middle line:84% You have to accept the highest payment, except 00:29:36.130 --> 00:29:37.730 align:middle line:90% if there's a tie. 00:29:37.730 --> 00:29:40.420 align:middle line:84% Because with specific denominations there is very 00:29:40.420 --> 00:29:41.140 align:middle line:90% likely to be a tie. 00:29:41.140 --> 00:29:43.570 align:middle line:84% Then you get to choose which of the highest 00:29:43.570 --> 00:29:46.110 align:middle line:90% bidders you can take. 00:29:46.110 --> 00:29:50.700 align:middle line:84% The person who pays then tells you what move to make. 00:29:50.700 --> 00:29:52.480 align:middle line:84% And if no one offers to pay you, you get to 00:29:52.480 --> 00:29:53.991 align:middle line:90% decide what to do. 00:29:53.991 --> 00:29:56.877 align:middle line:84% And then it's the next player's turn, and you would 00:29:56.877 --> 00:29:59.980 align:middle line:84% continue until one player wins. 00:29:59.980 --> 00:30:02.000 align:middle line:84% Just off the top of your heads, having not even played 00:30:02.000 --> 00:30:04.370 align:middle line:84% it-- it's tough to critique games when you haven't played. 00:30:04.370 --> 00:30:06.302 align:middle line:84% But just looking at the rules and hearing 00:30:06.302 --> 00:30:06.850 align:middle line:90% about it and even-- 00:30:06.850 --> 00:30:09.970 align:middle line:84% I love that picture on the left, because it embodies some 00:30:09.970 --> 00:30:12.550 align:middle line:84% of the spirit of the play, too. 00:30:12.550 --> 00:30:14.755 align:middle line:84% What are some interesting things about this rule set of 00:30:14.755 --> 00:30:17.330 align:middle line:90% that you notice? 00:30:17.330 --> 00:30:19.630 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You play with money, but you won't win money? 00:30:19.630 --> 00:30:21.650 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Well, that's an interesting question. 00:30:21.650 --> 00:30:25.434 align:middle line:84% What happens to the money at the end of the game? 00:30:25.434 --> 00:30:25.915 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Who knows? 00:30:25.915 --> 00:30:26.396 align:middle line:90% Do you keep it? 00:30:26.396 --> 00:30:27.839 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: It's unclear. 00:30:27.839 --> 00:30:29.550 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Very unclear. 00:30:29.550 --> 00:30:31.620 align:middle line:84% That's one of the things that's really great about this 00:30:31.620 --> 00:30:35.470 align:middle line:84% game, is that it puts you to into these social situations 00:30:35.470 --> 00:30:37.190 align:middle line:84% where now you're playing with real currency 00:30:37.190 --> 00:30:38.210 align:middle line:90% that was your own. 00:30:38.210 --> 00:30:42.160 align:middle line:84% And now it's like, what happens to this? 00:30:42.160 --> 00:30:44.600 align:middle line:84% It says you win if your piece-- but maybe you feel 00:30:44.600 --> 00:30:46.790 align:middle line:84% like you win if you moved those pieces and you have the 00:30:46.790 --> 00:30:48.500 align:middle line:84% most money at the end of the game. 00:30:48.500 --> 00:30:51.620 align:middle line:84% You've got this kind of weird economy in here. 00:30:51.620 --> 00:30:54.697 align:middle line:84% I think the fact that it's not explicit in 00:30:54.697 --> 00:30:56.230 align:middle line:90% this rule set is great. 00:30:56.230 --> 00:30:59.590 align:middle line:84% That's what creates this potential for an interesting 00:30:59.590 --> 00:31:00.380 align:middle line:90% social dynamic. 00:31:00.380 --> 00:31:02.870 align:middle line:84% Other things that are interesting about this game? 00:31:02.870 --> 00:31:05.060 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: If you're the only person who has money, then you 00:31:05.060 --> 00:31:05.360 align:middle line:90% can basically win. 00:31:05.360 --> 00:31:07.230 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: You can basically win if you're the 00:31:07.230 --> 00:31:08.090 align:middle line:84% only person who has money, yeah. 00:31:08.090 --> 00:31:11.590 align:middle line:84% So it does require a little bit of strategy, too. 00:31:11.590 --> 00:31:14.090 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Technically, from that set of-- 00:31:14.090 --> 00:31:16.725 align:middle line:84% could you win on the first turn, because it seems you 00:31:16.725 --> 00:31:20.640 align:middle line:84% only have two pieces of a certain color. 00:31:20.640 --> 00:31:22.630 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Yeah, but the right is still 00:31:22.630 --> 00:31:23.410 align:middle line:90% the starting position. 00:31:23.410 --> 00:31:24.250 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah, Iknow. 00:31:24.250 --> 00:31:29.140 align:middle line:84% And so on your turn, you could take one-- your piece and have 00:31:29.140 --> 00:31:31.640 align:middle line:84% it be moved to the square right next to yours. 00:31:31.640 --> 00:31:32.200 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: No. 00:31:32.200 --> 00:31:33.520 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Move to any adjacent-- 00:31:33.520 --> 00:31:35.290 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Oh, you have to move it-- 00:31:35.290 --> 00:31:37.305 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Read the rule in the red there. 00:31:37.305 --> 00:31:39.125 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Oh, any adjacent number,okay. 00:31:39.125 --> 00:31:40.490 align:middle line:84% I didn't read the adjacent part. 00:31:40.490 --> 00:31:42.203 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, it's any adjacent or empty square. 00:31:42.203 --> 00:31:43.600 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: It's actually really interesting. 00:31:43.600 --> 00:31:45.690 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, it's a really weird-- 00:31:45.690 --> 00:31:51.250 align:middle line:84% I also think you're not-- the agency you have in the game to 00:31:51.250 --> 00:31:54.460 align:middle line:84% win is not by moving your own pieces, it's by paying someone 00:31:54.460 --> 00:31:56.030 align:middle line:90% to do the work for you. 00:31:56.030 --> 00:31:58.448 align:middle line:84% So then we get back to this quote at the beginning, "You 00:31:58.448 --> 00:31:59.344 align:middle line:84% load 16 tons and what do you get? 00:31:59.344 --> 00:32:00.240 align:middle line:84% Another day older and deeper in debt." 00:32:00.240 --> 00:32:02.720 align:middle line:84% It's like, what is this game about. 00:32:02.720 --> 00:32:03.710 align:middle line:84% It could be about a lot of things. 00:32:03.710 --> 00:32:06.670 align:middle line:84% And we honestly probably shouldn't dissect it until 00:32:06.670 --> 00:32:08.610 align:middle line:90% we've played it. 00:32:08.610 --> 00:32:12.940 align:middle line:84% I think, too, the corrugated cardboard, it gets hot inside 00:32:12.940 --> 00:32:14.330 align:middle line:84% of there, if you're not outside. 00:32:14.330 --> 00:32:15.910 align:middle line:84% And that's a really interesting thing, too. 00:32:15.910 --> 00:32:19.570 align:middle line:84% You're in there, it's hot, it's sweaty, you've got dirty 00:32:19.570 --> 00:32:23.010 align:middle line:84% money in your hands, you're moving around these sizable-- 00:32:23.010 --> 00:32:24.249 align:middle line:90% they have weight to them. 00:32:24.249 --> 00:32:25.686 align:middle line:84% That was really important, too. 00:32:25.686 --> 00:32:28.081 align:middle line:84% This could have been played around a table with go-pieces 00:32:28.081 --> 00:32:29.518 align:middle line:84% or something, painted go-pieces. 00:32:29.518 --> 00:32:34.077 align:middle line:84% But these are substantial steel pieces that you've got 00:32:34.077 --> 00:32:36.040 align:middle line:90% to pick up and move. 00:32:36.040 --> 00:32:40.730 align:middle line:84% Obviously the song was about manual labor. 00:32:40.730 --> 00:32:42.530 align:middle line:84% So this is a really interesting game. 00:32:42.530 --> 00:32:44.270 align:middle line:84% This was released at the Art History of Games 00:32:44.270 --> 00:32:45.420 align:middle line:90% conference last year. 00:32:45.420 --> 00:32:46.760 align:middle line:84% And it did well at IndieCade this year. 00:32:46.760 --> 00:32:48.840 align:middle line:84% It won the Developers Choice Award. 00:32:48.840 --> 00:32:50.890 align:middle line:90% And it's really cool. 00:32:50.890 --> 00:32:52.640 align:middle line:84% I want to try to get it up to MIT so that we 00:32:52.640 --> 00:32:53.950 align:middle line:90% can all play it. 00:32:53.950 --> 00:32:57.030 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: It occurs to me that if you went by rules where you 00:32:57.030 --> 00:32:59.400 align:middle line:84% keep the money you get to the end of the game, you basically 00:32:59.400 --> 00:33:01.580 align:middle line:84% could throw the game to get all the money. 00:33:01.580 --> 00:33:03.200 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, you could try. 00:33:03.200 --> 00:33:05.760 align:middle line:84% But people are gonna know what you're doing. 00:33:05.760 --> 00:33:06.870 align:middle line:84% Because they're going to see you're shiny. 00:33:06.870 --> 00:33:07.520 align:middle line:90% So it's-- 00:33:07.520 --> 00:33:08.660 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I'm not gonna pay you back. 00:33:08.660 --> 00:33:10.020 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, the multiplayer gets-- 00:33:10.020 --> 00:33:14.690 align:middle line:84% the multiplayer, the game gets in it. 00:33:14.690 --> 00:33:16.696 align:middle line:84% Just cycling back to what we're talking 00:33:16.696 --> 00:33:19.800 align:middle line:90% about, is this art? 00:33:19.800 --> 00:33:24.260 align:middle line:84% It would be hard for me to call it much of anything else. 00:33:24.260 --> 00:33:28.000 align:middle line:84% So this is one of my favorite games. 00:33:28.000 --> 00:33:30.300 align:middle line:84% It's certainly my favorite that Jason's ever made. 00:33:30.300 --> 00:33:31.940 align:middle line:90% Who's played Gravitation here? 00:33:31.940 --> 00:33:32.400 align:middle line:90% A couple of games? 00:33:32.400 --> 00:33:33.070 align:middle line:90% Alright, cool. 00:33:33.070 --> 00:33:34.070 align:middle line:90% And a bunch of you haven't. 00:33:34.070 --> 00:33:34.785 align:middle line:90% That's awesome. 00:33:34.785 --> 00:33:36.250 align:middle line:84% So I'll get one of you to play it. 00:33:36.250 --> 00:33:38.790 align:middle line:84% One thing I want to point out with this-- we can talk after 00:33:38.790 --> 00:33:43.150 align:middle line:84% someone's played Gravitation, a little bit about what we 00:33:43.150 --> 00:33:44.260 align:middle line:90% think about the game itself. 00:33:44.260 --> 00:33:45.660 align:middle line:84% But I think this quote is interesting. 00:33:45.660 --> 00:33:47.980 align:middle line:84% He has artist statements with all of his games. 00:33:47.980 --> 00:33:50.510 align:middle line:84% Some of them say more, some of them say less. 00:33:50.510 --> 00:33:53.270 align:middle line:84% This one responded briefly 'cause this was after Passage 00:33:53.270 --> 00:33:53.590 align:middle line:90% was released. 00:33:53.590 --> 00:33:55.910 align:middle line:84% And I think you guys have all seen Passage, right? 00:33:55.910 --> 00:33:58.740 align:middle line:84% You can immediately identify the aesthetic similarities 00:33:58.740 --> 00:34:01.562 align:middle line:84% because the character is exactly the same. 00:34:01.562 --> 00:34:04.900 align:middle line:84% He was responding to criticism from people about his pixel 00:34:04.900 --> 00:34:07.435 align:middle line:84% art, and why did he go for Pixel art. 00:34:07.435 --> 00:34:10.639 align:middle line:84% He says, "I now see ultra-low res pixel art as a kind of 00:34:10.639 --> 00:34:12.159 align:middle line:90% digital cartooning. 00:34:12.159 --> 00:34:14.150 align:middle line:84% It stands right on the line between the symbolic and the 00:34:14.150 --> 00:34:16.100 align:middle line:84% representational, leaving plenty of room for viewer 00:34:16.100 --> 00:34:17.360 align:middle line:90% interpretation. 00:34:17.360 --> 00:34:20.565 align:middle line:84% Why draw sideburns when the viewers can imagine sideburns 00:34:20.565 --> 00:34:21.539 align:middle line:90% on their own. 00:34:21.539 --> 00:34:22.876 align:middle line:84% You just need to give them something to pin their 00:34:22.876 --> 00:34:24.948 align:middle line:84% imagination on, something to guide them a bit. 00:34:24.948 --> 00:34:25.922 align:middle line:90% Cartoons are perfect for that. 00:34:25.922 --> 00:34:27.889 align:middle line:84% I think it's a really interesting point. 00:34:27.889 --> 00:34:31.690 align:middle line:84% And I think what he's also suggesting here, which is 00:34:31.690 --> 00:34:34.260 align:middle line:84% maybe not clear, is that this is doing a similar thing to 00:34:34.260 --> 00:34:36.621 align:middle line:84% what that quote from the music does. 00:34:36.621 --> 00:34:39.384 align:middle line:84% It's priming your experience of the play. 00:34:39.384 --> 00:34:41.909 align:middle line:84% You load up this game, you see that it's got this low-res 00:34:41.909 --> 00:34:44.320 align:middle line:84% pixel art that we now associate with this kind of 00:34:44.320 --> 00:34:46.305 align:middle line:84% art game movement, and you're ready to read 00:34:46.305 --> 00:34:47.889 align:middle line:90% this in another way. 00:34:47.889 --> 00:34:51.060 align:middle line:84% If I gave you a first-person shooter and told you nothing 00:34:51.060 --> 00:34:52.900 align:middle line:84% about it except that it was gonna be the fastest, 00:34:52.900 --> 00:34:54.469 align:middle line:84% awesomest, multiplayer first-person shooter 00:34:54.469 --> 00:34:59.800 align:middle line:84% experience, but it looked like this, would you be inclined to 00:34:59.800 --> 00:35:01.750 align:middle line:90% read it like an art game? 00:35:01.750 --> 00:35:02.900 align:middle line:90% I don't know. 00:35:02.900 --> 00:35:05.150 align:middle line:84% But certainly in this instance with these kind of little 00:35:05.150 --> 00:35:08.500 align:middle line:84% games, this pixel-art aesthetic that you see being 00:35:08.500 --> 00:35:14.110 align:middle line:84% duplicated in a lot of places, is sort of priming the pump. 00:35:14.110 --> 00:35:17.340 align:middle line:84% It's establishing some sort of context in which you 00:35:17.340 --> 00:35:18.580 align:middle line:90% can read this game. 00:35:18.580 --> 00:35:22.285 align:middle line:84% So who wants to play Gravitation? 00:35:22.285 --> 00:35:25.231 align:middle line:84% Oops, no, that's not what's supposed to happen. 00:35:25.231 --> 00:35:26.704 align:middle line:90% Why did it click on link. 00:35:26.704 --> 00:35:29.650 align:middle line:84% Oh, 'cause I clicked on my screen, not on this screen. 00:35:29.650 --> 00:35:30.091 align:middle line:84% All that does is take me out of here. 00:35:30.091 --> 00:35:31.341 align:middle line:90% Yay. 00:35:31.341 --> 00:35:33.090 align:middle line:90% 00:35:33.090 --> 00:35:34.150 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Me not being here, it might be a problem. 00:35:34.150 --> 00:35:36.954 align:middle line:90% Let's see. 00:35:36.954 --> 00:35:40.950 align:middle line:84% Let's see what screen it's logged up on. 00:35:40.950 --> 00:35:42.950 align:middle line:90% One. 00:35:42.950 --> 00:35:44.060 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Hold on one sec. 00:35:44.060 --> 00:35:45.310 align:middle line:84% I've got a mirror on my screen. 00:35:45.310 --> 00:35:49.930 align:middle line:90% 00:35:49.930 --> 00:35:53.840 align:middle line:84% I should not be choosing who plays. 00:35:53.840 --> 00:35:54.920 align:middle line:90% Who wants to-- 00:35:54.920 --> 00:35:55.433 align:middle line:90% I can't make the choice. 00:35:55.433 --> 00:35:56.720 align:middle line:90% Who wants to do it? 00:35:56.720 --> 00:35:58.740 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Interesting that it's a version zero. 00:35:58.740 --> 00:36:00.940 align:middle line:84% You have to explicitly make that the case. 00:36:00.940 --> 00:36:03.450 align:middle line:90% 00:36:03.450 --> 00:36:04.870 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Anybody. 00:36:04.870 --> 00:36:07.683 align:middle line:84% It's free to download, so if you don't play it now, you can 00:36:07.683 --> 00:36:08.510 align:middle line:90% play it on your own. 00:36:08.510 --> 00:36:11.530 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: We have a few games, right? 00:36:11.530 --> 00:36:12.910 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, we have a few. 00:36:12.910 --> 00:36:16.720 align:middle line:84% We have a few opportunities, so anybody jump over and play. 00:36:16.720 --> 00:36:19.165 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Just talk with Jason, and then we'll do join 00:36:19.165 --> 00:36:20.310 align:middle line:90% me in Dubai-- 00:36:20.310 --> 00:36:22.360 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: And actually, if you wouldn't mind talking 00:36:22.360 --> 00:36:25.730 align:middle line:84% about your experience to play Gravitation as you play it. 00:36:25.730 --> 00:36:28.830 align:middle line:90% Let's play, but live, say. 00:36:28.830 --> 00:36:29.140 align:middle line:90% [GAME MUSIC] 00:36:29.140 --> 00:36:34.206 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I seem to have a restricted 00:36:34.206 --> 00:36:38.560 align:middle line:90% view, and it's falling. 00:36:38.560 --> 00:36:39.810 align:middle line:90% I caught it. 00:36:39.810 --> 00:36:44.800 align:middle line:90% 00:36:44.800 --> 00:36:46.050 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: She stole your ball. 00:36:46.050 --> 00:36:52.080 align:middle line:90% 00:36:52.080 --> 00:36:53.906 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: She seemed to like you, but she stole it for 00:36:53.906 --> 00:36:54.080 align:middle line:90% the moment. 00:36:54.080 --> 00:36:56.120 align:middle line:84% Now she seems to be playing, which is better. 00:36:56.120 --> 00:36:58.680 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: We seem to-- he bats it back and forth and my 00:36:58.680 --> 00:37:01.600 align:middle line:84% screen gets bigger whenever I especially do so. 00:37:01.600 --> 00:37:02.850 align:middle line:90% And it's getting brighter. 00:37:02.850 --> 00:37:05.996 align:middle line:90% 00:37:05.996 --> 00:37:09.804 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: It gets bigger when she loves you. 00:37:09.804 --> 00:37:12.066 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: It changes this fiery thing and it seems to be 00:37:12.066 --> 00:37:13.316 align:middle line:90% batting the ball more. 00:37:13.316 --> 00:37:17.890 align:middle line:90% 00:37:17.890 --> 00:37:20.060 align:middle line:90% [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 00:37:20.060 --> 00:37:20.660 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: You're on fire. 00:37:20.660 --> 00:37:21.910 align:middle line:90% [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 00:37:21.910 --> 00:37:25.050 align:middle line:90% 00:37:25.050 --> 00:37:26.330 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: I'm on fire. 00:37:26.330 --> 00:37:29.108 align:middle line:90% This seems bad. 00:37:29.108 --> 00:37:29.571 align:middle line:90% Now I'm really confused. 00:37:29.571 --> 00:37:31.250 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You should go to the furnace. 00:37:31.250 --> 00:37:34.024 align:middle line:90% 00:37:34.024 --> 00:37:35.100 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Oh, now you're not on fire. 00:37:35.100 --> 00:37:36.350 align:middle line:90% That makes sense. 00:37:36.350 --> 00:37:38.870 align:middle line:90% 00:37:38.870 --> 00:37:40.120 align:middle line:90% Whoa! 00:37:40.120 --> 00:37:42.650 align:middle line:90% 00:37:42.650 --> 00:37:44.840 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Wait, can you bounce the ball up there? 00:37:44.840 --> 00:37:46.471 align:middle line:84% I didn't see anything that showing me 00:37:46.471 --> 00:37:47.770 align:middle line:90% how to get up there. 00:37:47.770 --> 00:37:48.770 align:middle line:90% Oh, here we go. 00:37:48.770 --> 00:37:50.020 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Isn't that always the case? 00:37:50.020 --> 00:37:52.410 align:middle line:90% 00:37:52.410 --> 00:37:53.660 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: What's that star? 00:37:53.660 --> 00:37:57.050 align:middle line:90% 00:37:57.050 --> 00:37:58.530 align:middle line:90% Uh-oh. 00:37:58.530 --> 00:38:00.150 align:middle line:84% Well, now you can bounce the ball up here. 00:38:00.150 --> 00:38:03.660 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Oh, you can jump higher when she loves you. 00:38:03.660 --> 00:38:04.927 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: --the size of the screen. 00:38:04.927 --> 00:38:06.940 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Yeah, that's how high you can jump . 00:38:06.940 --> 00:38:08.770 align:middle line:90% OK, so-- 00:38:08.770 --> 00:38:10.450 align:middle line:84% I guess maybe bounce it more to get higher? 00:38:10.450 --> 00:38:16.240 align:middle line:90% 00:38:16.240 --> 00:38:17.490 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: You're losing her. 00:38:17.490 --> 00:38:19.174 align:middle line:90% 00:38:19.174 --> 00:38:21.460 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: I'm on fire again. 00:38:21.460 --> 00:38:22.910 align:middle line:84% Oh, but you're gonna be on fire in a while. 00:38:22.910 --> 00:38:25.790 align:middle line:84% She's not gonna love you very soon. 00:38:25.790 --> 00:38:27.760 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Yeah, apparently getting the 00:38:27.760 --> 00:38:29.340 align:middle line:90% stars is also good. 00:38:29.340 --> 00:38:34.860 align:middle line:90% 00:38:34.860 --> 00:38:36.862 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: It seems it goes faster and faster the higher 00:38:36.862 --> 00:38:38.330 align:middle line:90% up you get, I think. 00:38:38.330 --> 00:38:41.140 align:middle line:84% Or maybe the more stars you eat. 00:38:41.140 --> 00:38:42.390 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: And that's all ice. 00:38:42.390 --> 00:38:44.760 align:middle line:90% 00:38:44.760 --> 00:38:45.130 align:middle line:90% Oh, yes. 00:38:45.130 --> 00:38:46.640 align:middle line:84% She seems happier when I bounce the ball. 00:38:46.640 --> 00:38:48.400 align:middle line:90% I guess-- 00:38:48.400 --> 00:38:53.720 align:middle line:84% so I don't have a which is I think the start of it because 00:38:53.720 --> 00:38:57.640 align:middle line:84% the stars into the fire so that they melt or something. 00:38:57.640 --> 00:38:58.890 align:middle line:90% [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 00:38:58.890 --> 00:39:01.470 align:middle line:90% 00:39:01.470 --> 00:39:04.284 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Oh, now it's a star. 00:39:04.284 --> 00:39:05.700 align:middle line:90% Interesting. 00:39:05.700 --> 00:39:07.600 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Well, there's been [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 00:39:07.600 --> 00:39:10.090 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: What? 00:39:10.090 --> 00:39:10.240 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: All right. 00:39:10.240 --> 00:39:12.890 align:middle line:84% Look what's [UNINTELLIGIBLE] into the fire. 00:39:12.890 --> 00:39:13.810 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Otherwise, he's gonna have a hammer. 00:39:13.810 --> 00:39:16.475 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah, you're dead. 00:39:16.475 --> 00:39:20.570 align:middle line:90% 00:39:20.570 --> 00:39:25.080 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: The numbers of the stars are all going down. 00:39:25.080 --> 00:39:25.937 align:middle line:90% The ball can't get to you. 00:39:25.937 --> 00:39:28.739 align:middle line:90% It's [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 00:39:28.739 --> 00:39:29.989 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: OK, now I can-- 00:39:29.989 --> 00:39:32.182 align:middle line:90% 00:39:32.182 --> 00:39:34.724 align:middle line:90% --push the ice into the fire? 00:39:34.724 --> 00:39:37.535 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: And the number on the top goes up every time 00:39:37.535 --> 00:39:40.655 align:middle line:84% you-- yeah, the numbers on the star corresponds 00:39:40.655 --> 00:39:41.905 align:middle line:90% to how many, like-- 00:39:41.905 --> 00:39:45.297 align:middle line:90% 00:39:45.297 --> 00:39:46.764 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You know, fire seems like it would be bad. 00:39:46.764 --> 00:39:54.500 align:middle line:90% 00:39:54.500 --> 00:39:55.750 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah. 00:39:55.750 --> 00:40:00.130 align:middle line:90% 00:40:00.130 --> 00:40:03.130 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Try to get rid of the ice-- 00:40:03.130 --> 00:40:05.400 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: But she doesn't want to play. 00:40:05.400 --> 00:40:06.870 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: That's because I got rid of the ice. 00:40:06.870 --> 00:40:08.220 align:middle line:90% He was happy I think. 00:40:08.220 --> 00:40:11.108 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Oh, it's getting icy, though. 00:40:11.108 --> 00:40:14.360 align:middle line:90% It's getting colder. 00:40:14.360 --> 00:40:16.420 align:middle line:84% There's no way to recharge my thing, though. 00:40:16.420 --> 00:40:17.280 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: I think you just have to go higher. 00:40:17.280 --> 00:40:18.883 align:middle line:84% This is where you were last time, I think. 00:40:18.883 --> 00:40:20.133 align:middle line:90% Yeah, there. 00:40:20.133 --> 00:40:27.410 align:middle line:90% 00:40:27.410 --> 00:40:28.660 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: That was really like-- 00:40:28.660 --> 00:40:32.540 align:middle line:90% 00:40:32.540 --> 00:40:34.340 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Do you think [UNINTELLIGIBLE] too fast, and 00:40:34.340 --> 00:40:36.365 align:middle line:84% your hair's burning, that means you just gave him too 00:40:36.365 --> 00:40:38.030 align:middle line:84% much love, and he starts falling really fast. 00:40:38.030 --> 00:40:40.710 align:middle line:90% 00:40:40.710 --> 00:40:41.960 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Oh, no. 00:40:41.960 --> 00:40:44.600 align:middle line:90% 00:40:44.600 --> 00:40:47.445 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: But there's a a counter on the ice blocks of 00:40:47.445 --> 00:40:50.850 align:middle line:84% the stars, and you get more points if you get them into 00:40:50.850 --> 00:40:53.570 align:middle line:90% the furnace faster. 00:40:53.570 --> 00:40:55.286 align:middle line:84% I think they went down and he started 00:40:55.286 --> 00:40:55.754 align:middle line:90% warming up in the furnace. 00:40:55.754 --> 00:40:58.450 align:middle line:84% The warmer the world, the less points you get for de-icing? 00:40:58.450 --> 00:40:59.950 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Is this about global warming? 00:40:59.950 --> 00:41:03.450 align:middle line:90% 00:41:03.450 --> 00:41:04.200 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think he's on drugs. 00:41:04.200 --> 00:41:08.290 align:middle line:84% He gets love from this girl, and then the ice and the stars 00:41:08.290 --> 00:41:10.140 align:middle line:84% make you happy, but only for a little bit. 00:41:10.140 --> 00:41:17.472 align:middle line:90% 00:41:17.472 --> 00:41:19.862 align:middle line:90% Yeah. 00:41:19.862 --> 00:41:21.112 align:middle line:90% Yeah. 00:41:21.112 --> 00:41:27.480 align:middle line:90% 00:41:27.480 --> 00:41:29.480 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So if I'm on fire it seems to reduce at a much 00:41:29.480 --> 00:41:30.730 align:middle line:90% faster rate. 00:41:30.730 --> 00:41:43.210 align:middle line:90% 00:41:43.210 --> 00:41:45.290 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] 00:41:45.290 --> 00:41:48.330 align:middle line:90% said 00:41:48.330 --> 00:41:50.370 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think it's about drugs. 00:41:50.370 --> 00:41:51.810 align:middle line:84% I think everything's about drugs. 00:41:51.810 --> 00:41:53.230 align:middle line:90% I mean, yeah, obviously. 00:41:53.230 --> 00:41:57.577 align:middle line:90% 00:41:57.577 --> 00:41:59.509 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You can actually catch the purple 00:41:59.509 --> 00:42:00.759 align:middle line:90% guy into that cave. 00:42:00.759 --> 00:42:04.836 align:middle line:90% 00:42:04.836 --> 00:42:05.655 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Oh, no. 00:42:05.655 --> 00:42:08.875 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: It's a really stupid design, going all the way back 00:42:08.875 --> 00:42:09.600 align:middle line:90% down there. 00:42:09.600 --> 00:42:10.830 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: There's a [INAUDIBLE] on the right, you 00:42:10.830 --> 00:42:12.578 align:middle line:90% can fall faster. 00:42:12.578 --> 00:42:16.232 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: The higher you climb, the further you fall. 00:42:16.232 --> 00:42:17.630 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Ooh, poetic. 00:42:17.630 --> 00:42:20.622 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Now I probably have a [UNINTELLIGIBLE] stars, so I 00:42:20.622 --> 00:42:22.066 align:middle line:90% think they need to play-- 00:42:22.066 --> 00:42:22.500 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: She's gone. 00:42:22.500 --> 00:42:24.404 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: She's dead. 00:42:24.404 --> 00:42:25.880 align:middle line:90% You killed her. 00:42:25.880 --> 00:42:26.372 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: So sad. 00:42:26.372 --> 00:42:29.940 align:middle line:90% And it's not the fire left. 00:42:29.940 --> 00:42:31.090 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Oh, no. 00:42:31.090 --> 00:42:33.740 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE:And the fire isn't bringing things back. 00:42:33.740 --> 00:42:34.630 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Oh, my god. 00:42:34.630 --> 00:42:37.445 align:middle line:84% You didn't get any stars for her, so she died. 00:42:37.445 --> 00:42:39.230 align:middle line:90% She eats stars. 00:42:39.230 --> 00:42:40.510 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Oh, there you go. 00:42:40.510 --> 00:42:41.265 align:middle line:90% Is she there now? 00:42:41.265 --> 00:42:42.960 align:middle line:84% The fire started warming you again. 00:42:42.960 --> 00:42:45.780 align:middle line:90% 00:42:45.780 --> 00:42:46.250 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Nope. 00:42:46.250 --> 00:42:47.530 align:middle line:90% She's gone forever. 00:42:47.530 --> 00:42:48.800 align:middle line:90% You can't play ball alone. 00:42:48.800 --> 00:42:49.880 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: When she's gone. 00:42:49.880 --> 00:42:51.265 align:middle line:84% Maybe she only comes in the spring. 00:42:51.265 --> 00:42:52.490 align:middle line:90% Maybe winter's too cold. 00:42:52.490 --> 00:42:54.720 align:middle line:84% So maybe if I wait by the fire. 00:42:54.720 --> 00:42:55.970 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Does is go faster right there? 00:42:55.970 --> 00:43:01.150 align:middle line:90% 00:43:01.150 --> 00:43:03.790 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Yeah, why is it getting bigger? 00:43:03.790 --> 00:43:05.160 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: 'Cause he's by the fire. 00:43:05.160 --> 00:43:06.298 align:middle line:90% It's getting warmer. 00:43:06.298 --> 00:43:07.732 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: That wasn't working earlier. 00:43:07.732 --> 00:43:08.982 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Now it is. 00:43:08.982 --> 00:43:11.360 align:middle line:90% 00:43:11.360 --> 00:43:12.425 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: He's at rock bottom. 00:43:12.425 --> 00:43:13.810 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Looks like it's spring. 00:43:13.810 --> 00:43:16.600 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: But when she-- 00:43:16.600 --> 00:43:17.570 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: How high can you jump right now? 00:43:17.570 --> 00:43:20.130 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Can you hit the ball? 00:43:20.130 --> 00:43:20.780 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Pretty high. 00:43:20.780 --> 00:43:23.342 align:middle line:90% That's a lot of jumbos. 00:43:23.342 --> 00:43:25.306 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: No, I can't hit the ball. 00:43:25.306 --> 00:43:26.430 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Only she can hit the ball. 00:43:26.430 --> 00:43:27.682 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: While you're increasing, you should 00:43:27.682 --> 00:43:29.460 align:middle line:90% probably go up and get-- 00:43:29.460 --> 00:43:30.500 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Go up. 00:43:30.500 --> 00:43:30.950 align:middle line:90% Go up. 00:43:30.950 --> 00:43:32.301 align:middle line:90% Go up. 00:43:32.301 --> 00:43:34.656 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Ah, there you go. 00:43:34.656 --> 00:43:35.930 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE] stop [INAUDIBLE]. 00:43:35.930 --> 00:43:39.570 align:middle line:90% It stopped contracting, too. 00:43:39.570 --> 00:43:40.777 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: You're on fire now. 00:43:40.777 --> 00:43:43.212 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: He's on fire. 00:43:43.212 --> 00:43:44.673 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Can you go [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 00:43:44.673 --> 00:43:45.923 align:middle line:90% high if he's on fire? 00:43:45.923 --> 00:43:49.543 align:middle line:90% 00:43:49.543 --> 00:43:51.004 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Uh-oh. 00:43:51.004 --> 00:43:52.952 align:middle line:90% Whoa. 00:43:52.952 --> 00:43:55.410 align:middle line:90% Four stars. 00:43:55.410 --> 00:43:57.030 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Are you getting all of them? 00:43:57.030 --> 00:44:01.750 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: That might have been a bit of overdose. 00:44:01.750 --> 00:44:05.170 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You totally OD'd on stars just there. 00:44:05.170 --> 00:44:08.250 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Or, or, you can only hold four, and then it 00:44:08.250 --> 00:44:11.480 align:middle line:84% retracts and you get four that turn to ice blocks. 00:44:11.480 --> 00:44:12.690 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: What? 00:44:12.690 --> 00:44:13.800 align:middle line:90% That was intense. 00:44:13.800 --> 00:44:15.950 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: That's a lot of falling. 00:44:15.950 --> 00:44:19.690 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: There was so much energy. 00:44:19.690 --> 00:44:20.940 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Wait. 00:44:20.940 --> 00:44:23.100 align:middle line:90% 00:44:23.100 --> 00:44:24.100 align:middle line:90% No. 00:44:24.100 --> 00:44:25.350 align:middle line:90% No. 00:44:25.350 --> 00:44:30.100 align:middle line:90% 00:44:30.100 --> 00:44:30.940 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: You won. 00:44:30.940 --> 00:44:32.190 align:middle line:90% Yay! 00:44:32.190 --> 00:44:33.820 align:middle line:90% 00:44:33.820 --> 00:44:36.390 align:middle line:84% Now what you won is a good question. 00:44:36.390 --> 00:44:37.500 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: That's Gravitation. 00:44:37.500 --> 00:44:38.810 align:middle line:84% Actually, I'm not even kidding. 00:44:38.810 --> 00:44:42.460 align:middle line:84% That's certainly my favorite Jason Rohrer game. 00:44:42.460 --> 00:44:43.998 align:middle line:90% It's one of my favorite games. 00:44:43.998 --> 00:44:46.722 align:middle line:84% And I think even just the example of you guys playing is 00:44:46.722 --> 00:44:49.740 align:middle line:84% great, because you're just shouting out all these 00:44:49.740 --> 00:44:51.400 align:middle line:84% different ideas for what it could be about. 00:44:51.400 --> 00:44:54.840 align:middle line:90% 00:44:54.840 --> 00:45:00.362 align:middle line:84% There's some clear intentionality in his design 00:45:00.362 --> 00:45:03.196 align:middle line:84% with this game, in terms of the system's trying to 00:45:03.196 --> 00:45:05.320 align:middle line:84% communicate something that's other than just 00:45:05.320 --> 00:45:09.470 align:middle line:90% engagement or fun. 00:45:09.470 --> 00:45:10.758 align:middle line:90% Was it fun? 00:45:10.758 --> 00:45:11.166 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah. 00:45:11.166 --> 00:45:11.982 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Oh, all right. 00:45:11.982 --> 00:45:13.330 align:middle line:90% Cool. 00:45:13.330 --> 00:45:14.890 align:middle line:90% Yeah, it's pretty good. 00:45:14.890 --> 00:45:16.090 align:middle line:90% Thoughts on what it's about? 00:45:16.090 --> 00:45:17.428 align:middle line:84% I heard a couple people be like, drugs. 00:45:17.428 --> 00:45:19.212 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: It's definitely drugs. 00:45:19.212 --> 00:45:21.806 align:middle line:90% I saw tons of analogies. 00:45:21.806 --> 00:45:24.250 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, it's kind of like drugs. 00:45:24.250 --> 00:45:24.670 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Or love. 00:45:24.670 --> 00:45:25.680 align:middle line:90% Or both. 00:45:25.680 --> 00:45:27.370 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Love is a drug. 00:45:27.370 --> 00:45:29.410 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Your relationship versus whatever you're trying 00:45:29.410 --> 00:45:30.790 align:middle line:90% to do for your career. 00:45:30.790 --> 00:45:32.040 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah. 00:45:32.040 --> 00:45:33.655 align:middle line:90% 00:45:33.655 --> 00:45:36.570 align:middle line:84% I think it's like the ultimate MIT game. 00:45:36.570 --> 00:45:41.530 align:middle line:84% If I told you that this was his daughter, would it change 00:45:41.530 --> 00:45:44.050 align:middle line:84% your interpretations of the game? 00:45:44.050 --> 00:45:45.390 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yes. 00:45:45.390 --> 00:45:47.940 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: So now, if you know that that's his daughter, 00:45:47.940 --> 00:45:50.020 align:middle line:90% what do you think it's about? 00:45:50.020 --> 00:45:51.680 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Neglect. 00:45:51.680 --> 00:45:55.550 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Job versus family. 00:45:55.550 --> 00:45:57.860 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: He says explicitly, before you play, 00:45:57.860 --> 00:45:59.350 align:middle line:84% that this is a game of motivation. 00:45:59.350 --> 00:46:03.090 align:middle line:84% He doesn't go too far into telling you what the game is 00:46:03.090 --> 00:46:04.000 align:middle line:90% specifically about. 00:46:04.000 --> 00:46:05.260 align:middle line:84% I think playing through it a couple times-- 00:46:05.260 --> 00:46:09.350 align:middle line:84% I will tell you the first time I played and I came back down 00:46:09.350 --> 00:46:12.070 align:middle line:84% and she was gone, it was very upsetting for me. 00:46:12.070 --> 00:46:17.540 align:middle line:84% I was like, and I don't know if it's just I was ready to 00:46:17.540 --> 00:46:20.510 align:middle line:84% play it that way, or my life stage or something like that. 00:46:20.510 --> 00:46:23.647 align:middle line:84% But the idea of he's playing with his daughter, that 00:46:23.647 --> 00:46:26.700 align:middle line:84% inspires him, he travels, and then one of these days if 00:46:26.700 --> 00:46:29.530 align:middle line:84% you're gone too long, she grows up. 00:46:29.530 --> 00:46:31.330 align:middle line:84% I don't know if she dies, but-- 00:46:31.330 --> 00:46:34.650 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: He didn't bring her any money. 00:46:34.650 --> 00:46:38.640 align:middle line:84% Because she had no money, she dies [INAUDIBLE]. 00:46:38.640 --> 00:46:42.120 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: So I think this is a really-- 00:46:42.120 --> 00:46:43.360 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: What did they say, it's a game about motivation? 00:46:43.360 --> 00:46:45.660 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: It is, yeah. 00:46:45.660 --> 00:46:47.770 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Or she OD'd on drugs. 00:46:47.770 --> 00:46:48.350 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: It's free. 00:46:48.350 --> 00:46:50.320 align:middle line:84% If you just Google-search Gravitation Jason Rohrer, 00:46:50.320 --> 00:46:51.600 align:middle line:90% you'll find the links to it. 00:46:51.600 --> 00:46:53.510 align:middle line:84% You'll find his artist statement, which I think is 00:46:53.510 --> 00:46:55.070 align:middle line:90% really good to read. 00:46:55.070 --> 00:46:57.850 align:middle line:84% Again, with John Sharp's point about declare your 00:46:57.850 --> 00:46:58.400 align:middle line:90% intentionality. 00:46:58.400 --> 00:47:02.370 align:middle line:84% Whatever you say what game's about is important. 00:47:02.370 --> 00:47:05.800 align:middle line:84% I think this qualifies, at least for me, as art. 00:47:05.800 --> 00:47:11.230 align:middle line:84% It's doing things that I see other piece of art doing. 00:47:11.230 --> 00:47:12.710 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: OK, so Paolo Pedercini-- 00:47:12.710 --> 00:47:13.540 align:middle line:90% how many over time? 00:47:13.540 --> 00:47:14.610 align:middle line:90% Oh, good. 00:47:14.610 --> 00:47:17.240 align:middle line:84% Paolo Pedercini is one of my favorite game 00:47:17.240 --> 00:47:18.220 align:middle line:90% designers right now. 00:47:18.220 --> 00:47:21.916 align:middle line:84% This game actually is one of his newest ones, and I think 00:47:21.916 --> 00:47:24.060 align:middle line:90% it's hilarious and great. 00:47:24.060 --> 00:47:26.120 align:middle line:84% It's called Memory Reloaded The Downfall. 00:47:26.120 --> 00:47:28.480 align:middle line:84% Test your concentration with Memory Reloaded matching game 00:47:28.480 --> 00:47:29.995 align:middle line:90% for these unstable times. 00:47:29.995 --> 00:47:32.830 align:middle line:84% History may be different from that which you remember. 00:47:32.830 --> 00:47:34.330 align:middle line:84% Who would like to play Memory Reloaded? 00:47:34.330 --> 00:47:35.950 align:middle line:84% I'm laughing already, because it's funny. 00:47:35.950 --> 00:47:36.750 align:middle line:90% Has anybody played it? 00:47:36.750 --> 00:47:38.090 align:middle line:84% I need somebody who's not played it. 00:47:38.090 --> 00:47:38.690 align:middle line:90% OK, good. 00:47:38.690 --> 00:47:39.450 align:middle line:90% Do you [UNINTELLIGIBLE]? 00:47:39.450 --> 00:47:39.870 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Sure. 00:47:39.870 --> 00:47:41.120 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Awesome. 00:47:41.120 --> 00:47:46.316 align:middle line:90% 00:47:46.316 --> 00:47:46.788 align:middle line:90% OK. 00:47:46.788 --> 00:47:50.080 align:middle line:90% You're up. 00:47:50.080 --> 00:47:52.140 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: I will click. 00:47:52.140 --> 00:47:53.583 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Don't do it. 00:47:53.583 --> 00:47:55.270 align:middle line:90% Oh, you're on. 00:47:55.270 --> 00:47:55.626 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: You're done. 00:47:55.626 --> 00:47:58.120 align:middle line:90% You lost already. 00:47:58.120 --> 00:47:59.302 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: --go away. 00:47:59.302 --> 00:48:01.325 align:middle line:90% It's kind of scary. 00:48:01.325 --> 00:48:02.560 align:middle line:84% I could already see what they can do. 00:48:02.560 --> 00:48:05.820 align:middle line:84% You're gonna play a game switch on me. 00:48:05.820 --> 00:48:06.580 align:middle line:90% Afghan Freedom Fighters. 00:48:06.580 --> 00:48:08.460 align:middle line:84% He's gonna be a terrorist later. 00:48:08.460 --> 00:48:09.710 align:middle line:90% Migrant Workforce. 00:48:09.710 --> 00:48:12.870 align:middle line:90% 00:48:12.870 --> 00:48:14.120 align:middle line:90% Migrant workforce. 00:48:14.120 --> 00:48:17.780 align:middle line:90% 00:48:17.780 --> 00:48:19.538 align:middle line:90% Iraqi Oil. 00:48:19.538 --> 00:48:20.810 align:middle line:90% Afghan Freedom Fighter. 00:48:20.810 --> 00:48:23.945 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I bet if you grab Iraqi Oil before Afghan 00:48:23.945 --> 00:48:25.525 align:middle line:84% Freedom Fighter, it becomes terrorist. 00:48:25.525 --> 00:48:28.630 align:middle line:90% 00:48:28.630 --> 00:48:29.620 align:middle line:90% Global Inequality. 00:48:29.620 --> 00:48:30.470 align:middle line:90% Peace in Palestine. 00:48:30.470 --> 00:48:32.220 align:middle line:90% Global Inequality. 00:48:32.220 --> 00:48:34.311 align:middle line:90% Global Inequality. 00:48:34.311 --> 00:48:35.340 align:middle line:90% Yes. 00:48:35.340 --> 00:48:37.948 align:middle line:90% Global Inequality. 00:48:37.948 --> 00:48:39.352 align:middle line:90% Yes. 00:48:39.352 --> 00:48:40.290 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: All right. 00:48:40.290 --> 00:48:41.230 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: I'm doing well. 00:48:41.230 --> 00:48:42.950 align:middle line:90% Ruthless Banker. 00:48:42.950 --> 00:48:43.460 align:middle line:90% Loan shark. 00:48:43.460 --> 00:48:46.250 align:middle line:90% Was Iraqi Oil here? 00:48:46.250 --> 00:48:47.500 align:middle line:90% No. 00:48:47.500 --> 00:48:52.680 align:middle line:90% 00:48:52.680 --> 00:48:54.590 align:middle line:90% Universal Health Care. 00:48:54.590 --> 00:48:56.160 align:middle line:90% Man-made Global Warming. 00:48:56.160 --> 00:48:57.442 align:middle line:90% Natural Global Warming. 00:48:57.442 --> 00:48:59.366 align:middle line:90% Ha! 00:48:59.366 --> 00:49:01.780 align:middle line:90% Hey, not cool. 00:49:01.780 --> 00:49:03.290 align:middle line:90% Universal Health Care. 00:49:03.290 --> 00:49:04.150 align:middle line:90% Universal Health Care. 00:49:04.150 --> 00:49:05.491 align:middle line:90% Sweet. 00:49:05.491 --> 00:49:06.385 align:middle line:90% Oh. 00:49:06.385 --> 00:49:07.280 align:middle line:90% One over. 00:49:07.280 --> 00:49:08.530 align:middle line:90% There. 00:49:08.530 --> 00:49:12.180 align:middle line:90% 00:49:12.180 --> 00:49:13.430 align:middle line:90% Peace in Palestine. 00:49:13.430 --> 00:49:17.341 align:middle line:90% 00:49:17.341 --> 00:49:18.460 align:middle line:90% There we go. 00:49:18.460 --> 00:49:20.570 align:middle line:90% Wait. 00:49:20.570 --> 00:49:21.650 align:middle line:90% Needy Banker. 00:49:21.650 --> 00:49:24.000 align:middle line:90% Ruthless Banker. 00:49:24.000 --> 00:49:25.860 align:middle line:84% Does it matter, the order you click them in? 00:49:25.860 --> 00:49:26.720 align:middle line:90% Ruthless Banker. 00:49:26.720 --> 00:49:28.200 align:middle line:90% What? 00:49:28.200 --> 00:49:30.590 align:middle line:84% What did the other one [UNINTELLIGIBLE]? 00:49:30.590 --> 00:49:32.382 align:middle line:90% There we go. 00:49:32.382 --> 00:49:33.278 align:middle line:90% Nice. 00:49:33.278 --> 00:49:34.570 align:middle line:90% So that means now-- 00:49:34.570 --> 00:49:38.394 align:middle line:90% 00:49:38.394 --> 00:49:41.740 align:middle line:90% He's never a satisfied banker. 00:49:41.740 --> 00:49:44.230 align:middle line:90% What the hell? 00:49:44.230 --> 00:49:44.850 align:middle line:90% Oh, dear. 00:49:44.850 --> 00:49:45.520 align:middle line:90% Did we? 00:49:45.520 --> 00:49:47.420 align:middle line:90% Shoot. 00:49:47.420 --> 00:49:50.730 align:middle line:90% Better move. 00:49:50.730 --> 00:49:51.160 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: This-- 00:49:51.160 --> 00:49:52.156 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] 00:49:52.156 --> 00:49:53.650 align:middle line:90% Natural Climate [INAUDIBLE]. 00:49:53.650 --> 00:50:02.116 align:middle line:90% 00:50:02.116 --> 00:50:03.366 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Oh, I get it. 00:50:03.366 --> 00:50:19.580 align:middle line:90% 00:50:19.580 --> 00:50:20.550 align:middle line:90% That's fun. 00:50:20.550 --> 00:50:21.940 align:middle line:90% Is that the entire game? 00:50:21.940 --> 00:50:23.805 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yes, that is the whole game. 00:50:23.805 --> 00:50:26.180 align:middle line:84% Of course, you get different outcomes. 00:50:26.180 --> 00:50:28.420 align:middle line:90% Yeah, that's the idea. 00:50:28.420 --> 00:50:30.870 align:middle line:84% I think you guys have seen some of the Molleindustria's 00:50:30.870 --> 00:50:32.138 align:middle line:90% [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 00:50:32.138 --> 00:50:33.954 align:middle line:84% You guys saw Every Day the Same Dream? 00:50:33.954 --> 00:50:34.792 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: I like that one. 00:50:34.792 --> 00:50:36.470 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Which is interesting. 00:50:36.470 --> 00:50:39.940 align:middle line:84% Yeah, that one's also one of my favorite games. 00:50:39.940 --> 00:50:47.350 align:middle line:84% This is looking at another kind of sector of art, the 00:50:47.350 --> 00:50:49.135 align:middle line:84% activist political statement sector of art is doing that 00:50:49.135 --> 00:50:52.040 align:middle line:84% through games, and it's something-- this music too 00:50:52.040 --> 00:50:53.280 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE]-- 00:50:53.280 --> 00:50:56.240 align:middle line:84% something that he does particularly 00:50:56.240 --> 00:50:56.990 align:middle line:90% well with his games. 00:50:56.990 --> 00:51:01.163 align:middle line:84% And I think this one's particularly interesting and 00:51:01.163 --> 00:51:01.840 align:middle line:90% kind of funny. 00:51:01.840 --> 00:51:10.050 align:middle line:84% I love the reworking of a really classic game mechanic. 00:51:10.050 --> 00:51:12.460 align:middle line:84% The entire point of memory is your expectation that they 00:51:12.460 --> 00:51:15.590 align:middle line:84% would be the same the second time you turn it over. 00:51:15.590 --> 00:51:19.420 align:middle line:84% And when it changes on you, it really worsens that kind of 00:51:19.420 --> 00:51:24.660 align:middle line:84% perspective, I suppose imbalance, that can exist when 00:51:24.660 --> 00:51:28.190 align:middle line:84% you're not just turning over Toadstools and Bowsers, but 00:51:28.190 --> 00:51:30.700 align:middle line:90% actual, interesting things. 00:51:30.700 --> 00:51:36.180 align:middle line:84% I love the crying, sweating polar bear with a beach chair. 00:51:36.180 --> 00:51:38.720 align:middle line:90% It actually cracks me up. 00:51:38.720 --> 00:51:39.750 align:middle line:84% Humor is actually something that 00:51:39.750 --> 00:51:40.510 align:middle line:90% shouldn't be ignored here. 00:51:40.510 --> 00:51:43.260 align:middle line:84% If we remember, that was one of the central Fluxus things, 00:51:43.260 --> 00:51:44.750 align:middle line:90% this idea of satire. 00:51:44.750 --> 00:51:47.230 align:middle line:90% Humor is important. 00:51:47.230 --> 00:51:51.972 align:middle line:84% So I think Paolo Pedercini's work is really awesome. 00:51:51.972 --> 00:51:56.350 align:middle line:84% Again, for me, it's certainly arcing up. 00:51:56.350 --> 00:51:57.820 align:middle line:90% This game's really cool. 00:51:57.820 --> 00:51:59.020 align:middle line:90% Who's played Love? 00:51:59.020 --> 00:52:00.345 align:middle line:84% A few people who's played Love? 00:52:00.345 --> 00:52:01.015 align:middle line:90% All right, cool. 00:52:01.015 --> 00:52:04.168 align:middle line:84% I'd love someone who has not played Love to play for a 00:52:04.168 --> 00:52:04.794 align:middle line:90% little bit. 00:52:04.794 --> 00:52:07.950 align:middle line:84% I don't know if we can play the whole game. 00:52:07.950 --> 00:52:12.780 align:middle line:84% This is actually a game that I really don't like, but I like 00:52:12.780 --> 00:52:15.170 align:middle line:84% the things that it does, if that makes any sense. 00:52:15.170 --> 00:52:17.395 align:middle line:90% It bothers me for some reason. 00:52:17.395 --> 00:52:19.200 align:middle line:90% And yet-- 00:52:19.200 --> 00:52:20.350 align:middle line:84% it's such an articulate statement, this 00:52:20.350 --> 00:52:23.860 align:middle line:90% game bothers me-- 00:52:23.860 --> 00:52:28.674 align:middle line:84% but I think it's worth looking at, because he's doing a 00:52:28.674 --> 00:52:31.530 align:middle line:84% particularly interesting thing, Alexander Ocias. 00:52:31.530 --> 00:52:34.865 align:middle line:84% I suppose it's a soft C, Ocias. 00:52:34.865 --> 00:52:43.773 align:middle line:90% 00:52:43.773 --> 00:52:46.268 align:middle line:90% I have the sound turned off. 00:52:46.268 --> 00:52:47.765 align:middle line:90% I'm sorry, top right. 00:52:47.765 --> 00:53:06.575 align:middle line:90% [GAME MUSIC] 00:53:06.575 --> 00:53:09.212 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: If you say, yes, will he like not 00:53:09.212 --> 00:53:10.462 align:middle line:90% teach you how to play? 00:53:10.462 --> 00:53:30.948 align:middle line:90% 00:53:30.948 --> 00:53:32.198 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Don't touch the buttons. 00:53:32.198 --> 00:53:39.346 align:middle line:90% 00:53:39.346 --> 00:53:40.828 align:middle line:90% It's like [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 00:53:40.828 --> 00:53:51.770 align:middle line:90% 00:53:51.770 --> 00:53:53.020 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: There's two paths. 00:53:53.020 --> 00:54:01.353 align:middle line:90% 00:54:01.353 --> 00:54:02.850 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Can you find them? 00:54:02.850 --> 00:54:03.848 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 00:54:03.848 --> 00:54:04.846 align:middle line:90% I'm not gonna listen-- 00:54:04.846 --> 00:54:06.842 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: It says travel the lower paths. 00:54:06.842 --> 00:54:08.339 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Who's gonna be able to listen to all this? 00:54:08.339 --> 00:54:12.331 align:middle line:90% 00:54:12.331 --> 00:54:13.828 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: What's appearing? 00:54:13.828 --> 00:54:23.309 align:middle line:90% 00:54:23.309 --> 00:54:27.301 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Weird slowdown. 00:54:27.301 --> 00:54:30.295 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You [UNINTELLIGIBLE] disobey him. 00:54:30.295 --> 00:54:31.293 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: What? 00:54:31.293 --> 00:54:32.543 align:middle line:84% I can't hit the red blocks now? 00:54:32.543 --> 00:54:38.778 align:middle line:90% 00:54:38.778 --> 00:54:40.028 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Disgusting. 00:54:40.028 --> 00:54:45.227 align:middle line:90% 00:54:45.227 --> 00:54:46.477 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] 00:54:46.477 --> 00:54:49.210 align:middle line:90% 00:54:49.210 --> 00:54:50.410 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Just give us not only art, it's all so 00:54:50.410 --> 00:54:51.660 align:middle line:90% [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 00:54:51.660 --> 00:54:55.270 align:middle line:90% 00:54:55.270 --> 00:54:56.520 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Patience. 00:54:56.520 --> 00:54:59.644 align:middle line:90% 00:54:59.644 --> 00:55:01.600 align:middle line:90% Yay. 00:55:01.600 --> 00:55:03.652 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Those are red. 00:55:03.652 --> 00:55:04.381 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: I know. 00:55:04.381 --> 00:55:07.540 align:middle line:84% That means they can't touch him. 00:55:07.540 --> 00:55:08.440 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Don't do it. 00:55:08.440 --> 00:55:09.210 align:middle line:90% Don't do it, dude. 00:55:09.210 --> 00:55:10.022 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Do it. 00:55:10.022 --> 00:55:11.274 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Do it. 00:55:11.274 --> 00:55:12.540 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Do it. 00:55:12.540 --> 00:55:14.351 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You're just gonna have to go back to the part 00:55:14.351 --> 00:55:15.601 align:middle line:90% that was just hard. 00:55:15.601 --> 00:55:21.560 align:middle line:90% 00:55:21.560 --> 00:55:23.160 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You get red blocks when you disobey. 00:55:23.160 --> 00:55:26.240 align:middle line:90% 00:55:26.240 --> 00:55:27.490 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You still can't touch them. 00:55:27.490 --> 00:55:31.179 align:middle line:90% 00:55:31.179 --> 00:55:33.167 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So if you disobey, it hides from you what things 00:55:33.167 --> 00:55:34.417 align:middle line:90% actually are. 00:55:34.417 --> 00:55:37.640 align:middle line:90% 00:55:37.640 --> 00:55:41.616 align:middle line:84% Or if you obey, they're getting the victory. 00:55:41.616 --> 00:55:49.568 align:middle line:90% 00:55:49.568 --> 00:55:50.562 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: It's so funny. 00:55:50.562 --> 00:55:52.550 align:middle line:90% Just that little-- 00:55:52.550 --> 00:55:53.800 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: What are the controls for this? 00:55:53.800 --> 00:56:06.963 align:middle line:90% 00:56:06.963 --> 00:56:07.957 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: You should disobey. 00:56:07.957 --> 00:56:09.245 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: What? 00:56:09.245 --> 00:56:11.504 align:middle line:90% Can you no longer jump? 00:56:11.504 --> 00:56:12.496 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I'm just screwing around. 00:56:12.496 --> 00:56:13.746 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: He's [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 00:56:13.746 --> 00:56:25.888 align:middle line:90% 00:56:25.888 --> 00:56:27.872 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Oh, I thought that was bad. 00:56:27.872 --> 00:56:39.320 align:middle line:90% 00:56:39.320 --> 00:56:40.920 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: This game is well aggravatingly tuned, 00:56:40.920 --> 00:56:43.872 align:middle line:90% because it's difficult enough. 00:56:43.872 --> 00:56:54.696 align:middle line:90% 00:56:54.696 --> 00:56:57.156 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Are you doing that intentionally? 00:56:57.156 --> 00:56:58.406 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: I just like to. 00:56:58.406 --> 00:57:03.590 align:middle line:90% 00:57:03.590 --> 00:57:05.470 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: It's actually a pretty long game. 00:57:05.470 --> 00:57:07.920 align:middle line:90% I encourage you guys to-- 00:57:07.920 --> 00:57:09.720 align:middle line:84% it's pretty- it's all flash-based. 00:57:09.720 --> 00:57:11.549 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: What's the message? 00:57:11.549 --> 00:57:13.545 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: It's a really good question. 00:57:13.545 --> 00:57:15.042 align:middle line:84% Let me just jump in and go back to that place where-- 00:57:15.042 --> 00:57:17.038 align:middle line:90% thank you for playing. 00:57:17.038 --> 00:57:19.540 align:middle line:90% Thank you for playing. 00:57:19.540 --> 00:57:20.350 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Disgusting. 00:57:20.350 --> 00:57:23.920 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You are a changed person because of it. 00:57:23.920 --> 00:57:26.150 align:middle line:84% So the question then becomes what's the point, which 00:57:26.150 --> 00:57:28.060 align:middle line:84% already we're in a position now where we're asking 00:57:28.060 --> 00:57:28.910 align:middle line:90% questions like that. 00:57:28.910 --> 00:57:31.330 align:middle line:84% Which is, if you were playing Modern Warfare II, you might 00:57:31.330 --> 00:57:33.350 align:middle line:84% say what's the point, and be like, to blow a lot 00:57:33.350 --> 00:57:35.210 align:middle line:90% of stuff up, right? 00:57:35.210 --> 00:57:38.850 align:middle line:84% This is the response he had in one of his interviews he gave 00:57:38.850 --> 00:57:40.690 align:middle line:84% after his release and said, I wanted to get people to wake 00:57:40.690 --> 00:57:42.830 align:middle line:84% up and think about the games they are playing. 00:57:42.830 --> 00:57:44.680 align:middle line:84% Much of the industry appears to be pushing in the opposite 00:57:44.680 --> 00:57:46.790 align:middle line:84% direction, as we'll have tutorials, holding your hand 00:57:46.790 --> 00:57:49.650 align:middle line:84% from beginning to end in subtext, screens for pointless 00:57:49.650 --> 00:57:50.540 align:middle line:90% exposition. 00:57:50.540 --> 00:57:52.320 align:middle line:84% It is treating players like idiots. 00:57:52.320 --> 00:57:53.480 align:middle line:90% It is absolutely infuriating. 00:57:53.480 --> 00:57:55.960 align:middle line:84% When you think about it in terms of the tutorial, if this 00:57:55.960 --> 00:57:57.066 align:middle line:90% is the tutorial for playing the 00:57:57.066 --> 00:57:59.370 align:middle line:90% game, it's pretty obnoxious. 00:57:59.370 --> 00:58:01.240 align:middle line:84% But it's not that much different than the kind of 00:58:01.240 --> 00:58:03.600 align:middle line:84% tutorials we encounter in a lot of games that just 00:58:03.600 --> 00:58:06.440 align:middle line:84% basically hold your hand and tell you how to do everything. 00:58:06.440 --> 00:58:10.290 align:middle line:84% I think he's really confronting that. 00:58:10.290 --> 00:58:12.140 align:middle line:84% I guess if I were to say the reasons that I don't like this 00:58:12.140 --> 00:58:14.790 align:middle line:84% game, I think the control scheme is 00:58:14.790 --> 00:58:17.040 align:middle line:90% actually, it's a weakness. 00:58:17.040 --> 00:58:21.242 align:middle line:84% The game is so hard that, I mean, you saw you couldn't 00:58:21.242 --> 00:58:22.475 align:middle line:84% even get to the things that he was trying to communicate. 00:58:22.475 --> 00:58:24.610 align:middle line:84% It gets weirder, the further along you get, 00:58:24.610 --> 00:58:25.530 align:middle line:90% I can promise you. 00:58:25.530 --> 00:58:29.610 align:middle line:84% It's just you have to get really skilled at doing it. 00:58:29.610 --> 00:58:34.480 align:middle line:84% There's kind of like a play barrier for entry on it. 00:58:34.480 --> 00:58:40.856 align:middle line:84% It's also, for me, I think dare I say, it almost gets too 00:58:40.856 --> 00:58:43.818 align:middle line:84% abstract for me at certain points. 00:58:43.818 --> 00:58:46.220 align:middle line:84% Clearly he's trying to say something, but there's nothing 00:58:46.220 --> 00:58:48.140 align:middle line:84% I can latch onto to understand what it is. 00:58:48.140 --> 00:58:50.420 align:middle line:84% That's entirely his prerogative, but for me, I'm 00:58:50.420 --> 00:58:52.290 align:middle line:90% just like, what? 00:58:52.290 --> 00:58:55.760 align:middle line:84% I have no clue what this is about at all. 00:58:55.760 --> 00:58:59.045 align:middle line:84% So that's a little tricky, not fully grasping. 00:58:59.045 --> 00:59:00.905 align:middle line:90% Clearly I'm not-- 00:59:00.905 --> 00:59:02.950 align:middle line:84% I'm partially, so it's like the perfect 00:59:02.950 --> 00:59:05.820 align:middle line:90% Fluxus piece of art. 00:59:05.820 --> 00:59:07.980 align:middle line:84% OK, so I've only got a couple more to talk about. 00:59:07.980 --> 00:59:09.357 align:middle line:90% I've got about 15 minutes. 00:59:09.357 --> 00:59:11.422 align:middle line:84% This, I think, is actually one of the most important games we 00:59:11.422 --> 00:59:13.490 align:middle line:84% can talk about today, which is Cow Clicker. 00:59:13.490 --> 00:59:14.320 align:middle line:90% Who's played Cow Clicker? 00:59:14.320 --> 00:59:16.310 align:middle line:90% Yay. 00:59:16.310 --> 00:59:20.260 align:middle line:84% This is by Ian Bogost-- that's the guy we saw earlier. 00:59:20.260 --> 00:59:22.240 align:middle line:84% And he said, Cow Clicker is a Facebook game 00:59:22.240 --> 00:59:23.900 align:middle line:90% about Facebook games. 00:59:23.900 --> 00:59:26.470 align:middle line:84% It's partly a satire and partly a playable theory of 00:59:26.470 --> 00:59:29.000 align:middle line:84% today's social games, and partly an earnest example of 00:59:29.000 --> 00:59:30.350 align:middle line:90% that genre. 00:59:30.350 --> 00:59:32.370 align:middle line:84% So this is kind of like a classic sort of 00:59:32.370 --> 00:59:33.520 align:middle line:90% art thing to do. 00:59:33.520 --> 00:59:36.310 align:middle line:84% You take something that you're going to satire, and you make 00:59:36.310 --> 00:59:40.770 align:middle line:84% a version of that, that maybe does something differently, 00:59:40.770 --> 00:59:43.190 align:middle line:84% but it's fundamentally what you are satiring. 00:59:43.190 --> 00:59:46.620 align:middle line:84% It's like the Andy Kaufman comedic kind of style. 00:59:46.620 --> 00:59:50.460 align:middle line:84% You just assume that kind of character or role. 00:59:50.460 --> 00:59:57.150 align:middle line:84% It's something that I think is like joyfully subversive in 00:59:57.150 --> 00:59:58.120 align:middle line:90% doing satire. 00:59:58.120 --> 01:00:00.110 align:middle line:84% So hopefully I'm logged into Facebook so you can see. 01:00:00.110 --> 01:00:01.587 align:middle line:84% I haven't clicked recently, so you guys can 01:00:01.587 --> 01:00:03.610 align:middle line:90% witness one of my clicks. 01:00:03.610 --> 01:00:04.860 align:middle line:90% [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 01:00:04.860 --> 01:00:07.047 align:middle line:90% 01:00:07.047 --> 01:00:09.011 align:middle line:90% Facebook is down. 01:00:09.011 --> 01:00:10.975 align:middle line:90% Facebook is canceled forever. 01:00:10.975 --> 01:00:12.225 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yes. 01:00:12.225 --> 01:00:14.920 align:middle line:90% 01:00:14.920 --> 01:00:18.770 align:middle line:90% [LAUGHTER] 01:00:18.770 --> 01:00:20.400 align:middle line:90% It actually has no friends. 01:00:20.400 --> 01:00:22.720 align:middle line:84% It's also possible that the wireless-- 01:00:22.720 --> 01:00:25.560 align:middle line:84% the wireless in that corner is kind of bad. 01:00:25.560 --> 01:00:26.810 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Should I switch to Google Guest? 01:00:26.810 --> 01:00:34.000 align:middle line:90% 01:00:34.000 --> 01:00:36.610 align:middle line:84% I can actually, before we can see it, I can talk a little 01:00:36.610 --> 01:00:38.740 align:middle line:84% bit about the sort of interesting controversy that 01:00:38.740 --> 01:00:41.410 align:middle line:90% Cow Clicker is creating. 01:00:41.410 --> 01:00:43.040 align:middle line:90% It's making money. 01:00:43.040 --> 01:00:48.050 align:middle line:90% 01:00:48.050 --> 01:00:51.585 align:middle line:90% Let me try Google Guest. 01:00:51.585 --> 01:00:53.070 align:middle line:90% I'm not connected. 01:00:53.070 --> 01:00:55.050 align:middle line:90% How about now? 01:00:55.050 --> 01:00:58.590 align:middle line:90% It seems to be working better. 01:00:58.590 --> 01:00:59.840 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: You're still not-- 01:00:59.840 --> 01:01:03.030 align:middle line:90% 01:01:03.030 --> 01:01:05.130 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: The last part of his statement is about an 01:01:05.130 --> 01:01:06.580 align:middle line:90% earnest effort at a game. 01:01:06.580 --> 01:01:08.340 align:middle line:84% It is fundamentally a Facebook game. 01:01:08.340 --> 01:01:14.170 align:middle line:84% You can see I've got 5 mooney and my next click is in a 01:01:14.170 --> 01:01:15.920 align:middle line:84% minute and 40-- ah, man, I missed one of my clicks. 01:01:15.920 --> 01:01:18.240 align:middle line:84% But maybe if we wait while I talk about it you can witness 01:01:18.240 --> 01:01:20.170 align:middle line:90% one of my clicks. 01:01:20.170 --> 01:01:22.490 align:middle line:84% Oh, wait, I actually have some clicks left. 01:01:22.490 --> 01:01:24.120 align:middle line:90% I've got one this week. 01:01:24.120 --> 01:01:27.010 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: That's in two hours? 01:01:27.010 --> 01:01:28.030 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, it looks like that's when 01:01:28.030 --> 01:01:29.630 align:middle line:90% I get my next one. 01:01:29.630 --> 01:01:31.475 align:middle line:84% So basically you can click your cow. 01:01:31.475 --> 01:01:35.570 align:middle line:90% 01:01:35.570 --> 01:01:40.220 align:middle line:84% Why can I not click my cow here. 01:01:40.220 --> 01:01:42.260 align:middle line:84% But you can click your cow, and then you can-- oh, it's 01:01:42.260 --> 01:01:43.510 align:middle line:90% because I'm on scroll? 01:01:43.510 --> 01:01:46.400 align:middle line:90% 01:01:46.400 --> 01:01:48.380 align:middle line:84% Anyway, you can click your cow, and then you can use your 01:01:48.380 --> 01:01:52.510 align:middle line:84% mooney to buy new cows that are fundamentally the same 01:01:52.510 --> 01:01:56.945 align:middle line:84% thing as other cows, just with aesthetic differences. 01:01:56.945 --> 01:01:59.960 align:middle line:90% So plain cow. 01:01:59.960 --> 01:02:00.930 align:middle line:90% These are the cows I have. 01:02:00.930 --> 01:02:02.350 align:middle line:84% I have a plain cow and a steel cow. 01:02:02.350 --> 01:02:04.640 align:middle line:84% I haven't been playing a lot of Cow Clicker. 01:02:04.640 --> 01:02:06.630 align:middle line:84% If I go to buy a cow, I can buy a new cow. 01:02:06.630 --> 01:02:09.270 align:middle line:90% 01:02:09.270 --> 01:02:11.490 align:middle line:84% So you can see lots of different cows. 01:02:11.490 --> 01:02:15.110 align:middle line:84% They cost you in game currency. 01:02:15.110 --> 01:02:16.090 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Paisley cow. 01:02:16.090 --> 01:02:19.190 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Holy cow. 01:02:19.190 --> 01:02:19.880 align:middle line:90% Oil cow [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 01:02:19.880 --> 01:02:22.180 align:middle line:90% It's got a BP logo. 01:02:22.180 --> 01:02:23.626 align:middle line:90% Cute. 01:02:23.626 --> 01:02:25.554 align:middle line:84% Like the [UNINTELLIGIBLE] cows. 01:02:25.554 --> 01:02:27.000 align:middle line:90% That's pretty good. 01:02:27.000 --> 01:02:28.350 align:middle line:84% So there's lots of different cows. 01:02:28.350 --> 01:02:30.820 align:middle line:84% You can buy cows, you can give cows, you can invite a cow, 01:02:30.820 --> 01:02:32.680 align:middle line:90% there's cow rankings. 01:02:32.680 --> 01:02:34.450 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: You can buy a cow. 01:02:34.450 --> 01:02:37.780 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: So you can see, mooney's actually pretty 01:02:37.780 --> 01:02:38.910 align:middle line:90% inflated at this point. 01:02:38.910 --> 01:02:40.680 align:middle line:84% You can get 10 mooney for 50 cents, which is pretty good, 01:02:40.680 --> 01:02:44.060 align:middle line:84% 1,000 for $10, which is awesome. 01:02:44.060 --> 01:02:45.840 align:middle line:90% And collect a lot of cows. 01:02:45.840 --> 01:02:46.970 align:middle line:90% You can trade cows. 01:02:46.970 --> 01:02:49.460 align:middle line:84% And you can go to your friends barns and see how 01:02:49.460 --> 01:02:51.200 align:middle line:90% many cows they have. 01:02:51.200 --> 01:02:55.070 align:middle line:84% And you can click on your cows when you make your appointment 01:02:55.070 --> 01:02:56.850 align:middle line:90% to actually visit a cow. 01:02:56.850 --> 01:03:01.360 align:middle line:84% So I think you can see how he's poking fun at things like 01:03:01.360 --> 01:03:03.735 align:middle line:84% FarmVille things like Ravenwood Fair, which I'm 01:03:03.735 --> 01:03:07.750 align:middle line:84% obsessed with now, actually, these kind of games where all 01:03:07.750 --> 01:03:10.565 align:middle line:84% you're fundamentally doing is clicking and acquiring an 01:03:10.565 --> 01:03:12.020 align:middle line:84% in-game currency that's you can then 01:03:12.020 --> 01:03:13.510 align:middle line:90% use for in-game goods. 01:03:13.510 --> 01:03:15.700 align:middle line:84% But then, of course, you reach this barrier where you don't 01:03:15.700 --> 01:03:17.940 align:middle line:84% have enough in-game currency and you use moo currency. 01:03:17.940 --> 01:03:20.820 align:middle line:84% Of course the interesting thing is there are 500,000 01:03:20.820 --> 01:03:21.920 align:middle line:90% people playing this. 01:03:21.920 --> 01:03:22.430 align:middle line:84% I don't know if it's that many. 01:03:22.430 --> 01:03:23.822 align:middle line:90% It's a lot. 01:03:23.822 --> 01:03:26.650 align:middle line:84% If you go to the Cow Clicker front page it'll tell us. 01:03:26.650 --> 01:03:27.900 align:middle line:90% It just [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 01:03:27.900 --> 01:03:30.361 align:middle line:90% 01:03:30.361 --> 01:03:31.822 align:middle line:84% Where does it say how many players there are? 01:03:31.822 --> 01:03:33.283 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Ranking, probably in ranking. 01:03:33.283 --> 01:03:37.666 align:middle line:90% 01:03:37.666 --> 01:03:41.080 align:middle line:90% He's milking the cow clicker. 01:03:41.080 --> 01:03:42.950 align:middle line:90% You can see this person's-- 01:03:42.950 --> 01:03:44.830 align:middle line:90% Monica's-- 01:03:44.830 --> 01:03:46.112 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Is the cow-- 01:03:46.112 --> 01:03:48.620 align:middle line:90% 01:03:48.620 --> 01:03:49.334 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Is that their all-time clicks 01:03:49.334 --> 01:03:50.910 align:middle line:90% or this week's clicks? 01:03:50.910 --> 01:03:52.770 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Is there a-- 01:03:52.770 --> 01:03:56.630 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Here we go, yeah, yeah. 01:03:56.630 --> 01:03:57.840 align:middle line:90% 12,000 monthly active users. 01:03:57.840 --> 01:04:00.410 align:middle line:84% That's 500,000 in a business [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 01:04:00.410 --> 01:04:01.490 align:middle line:90% But that's a lot of people. 01:04:01.490 --> 01:04:02.930 align:middle line:84% And he's making some interesting money on it. 01:04:02.930 --> 01:04:04.680 align:middle line:84% And I think one of the things that was important that he did 01:04:04.680 --> 01:04:06.290 align:middle line:84% is there's an active forum where people 01:04:06.290 --> 01:04:07.495 align:middle line:90% can talk about it. 01:04:07.495 --> 01:04:10.500 align:middle line:84% So it is a little bit weirdly controversial, 'cause he made 01:04:10.500 --> 01:04:13.320 align:middle line:84% this game that is poking fun at Facebook games. 01:04:13.320 --> 01:04:16.935 align:middle line:84% And yet it is a Facebook game and presumably making some 01:04:16.935 --> 01:04:18.960 align:middle line:90% money, too. 01:04:18.960 --> 01:04:21.115 align:middle line:90% But I think it's really good. 01:04:21.115 --> 01:04:23.640 align:middle line:84% This is the kind of art that's also important, where it's 01:04:23.640 --> 01:04:27.930 align:middle line:84% taking what we do and purposely looking at how is it 01:04:27.930 --> 01:04:32.080 align:middle line:84% constructed and how it's set up and forcing us to kind of 01:04:32.080 --> 01:04:34.619 align:middle line:84% be introspective about the things that we do and the way 01:04:34.619 --> 01:04:35.910 align:middle line:90% that we engage. 01:04:35.910 --> 01:04:38.340 align:middle line:84% So this is a kind of subversive game design that I 01:04:38.340 --> 01:04:42.430 align:middle line:84% think along the lines of Paolo Pedercini's work and even 01:04:42.430 --> 01:04:45.820 align:middle line:84% Gonzalo Frasca if forcing us to look at how we interact. 01:04:45.820 --> 01:04:47.070 align:middle line:90% And Cow Clicker-- 01:04:47.070 --> 01:04:49.950 align:middle line:90% 01:04:49.950 --> 01:04:50.620 align:middle line:90% So that's that one. 01:04:50.620 --> 01:04:51.880 align:middle line:90% And I've got like 15 minutes. 01:04:51.880 --> 01:04:55.340 align:middle line:84% Phillip asked me to talk a little bit about some work 01:04:55.340 --> 01:04:58.450 align:middle line:90% that I'm doing in this space. 01:04:58.450 --> 01:05:01.210 align:middle line:84% So I'm gonna talk to you about a game, it's 01:05:01.210 --> 01:05:02.670 align:middle line:90% still a work in progress. 01:05:02.670 --> 01:05:04.010 align:middle line:84% It's tentatively entitled Before and 01:05:04.010 --> 01:05:07.950 align:middle line:90% Now, and it's by me. 01:05:07.950 --> 01:05:14.521 align:middle line:84% And the idea from it is it's inspired by Fluxus boxes and 01:05:14.521 --> 01:05:16.710 align:middle line:90% those Flux kits. 01:05:16.710 --> 01:05:19.470 align:middle line:84% I'm really interested in physically tangible games. 01:05:19.470 --> 01:05:22.370 align:middle line:84% I don't know why I'm all of a sudden obsessed 01:05:22.370 --> 01:05:23.370 align:middle line:90% with holding something. 01:05:23.370 --> 01:05:26.790 align:middle line:84% But I was at IndieCade and I heard again-- and this is the 01:05:26.790 --> 01:05:31.385 align:middle line:84% question that drives me more nuts than the are video games 01:05:31.385 --> 01:05:33.940 align:middle line:84% art question, although they're interestingly related. 01:05:33.940 --> 01:05:37.160 align:middle line:84% But it's when will we have the Citizen Kane in video games? 01:05:37.160 --> 01:05:38.390 align:middle line:90% It drives me absolutely nuts. 01:05:38.390 --> 01:05:41.000 align:middle line:84% I think 80% of the time people who say that have never seen 01:05:41.000 --> 01:05:42.830 align:middle line:90% Citizen Kane. 01:05:42.830 --> 01:05:44.720 align:middle line:90% I don't really know that. 01:05:44.720 --> 01:05:47.220 align:middle line:84% But I heard it for the umpteenth time at IndieCade. 01:05:47.220 --> 01:05:50.015 align:middle line:84% I wanted to throw the television out of my hotel 01:05:50.015 --> 01:05:51.120 align:middle line:90% room window. 01:05:51.120 --> 01:05:52.350 align:middle line:90% And I was going nuts. 01:05:52.350 --> 01:05:55.630 align:middle line:84% And I was like, all right, what is Citizen Kane about? 01:05:55.630 --> 01:05:56.780 align:middle line:90% I don't want to spoil it. 01:05:56.780 --> 01:05:59.160 align:middle line:84% Who's seen Citizen Kane in this room actually? 01:05:59.160 --> 01:06:01.680 align:middle line:90% All right, good. 01:06:01.680 --> 01:06:08.060 align:middle line:84% So I see Citizen Kane and it's about this very interesting 01:06:08.060 --> 01:06:14.595 align:middle line:84% idea about presents and mementos and happiness in a 01:06:14.595 --> 01:06:15.590 align:middle line:90% very kind of real way. 01:06:15.590 --> 01:06:17.710 align:middle line:84% And the temporality of happiness, like 01:06:17.710 --> 01:06:18.690 align:middle line:90% are you happy now? 01:06:18.690 --> 01:06:19.630 align:middle line:90% Were you happy then? 01:06:19.630 --> 01:06:20.640 align:middle line:90% Do you remember being happy? 01:06:20.640 --> 01:06:22.820 align:middle line:90% When is happiness? 01:06:22.820 --> 01:06:25.150 align:middle line:84% And so I was like, well, I'm going to make a Citizen Kane 01:06:25.150 --> 01:06:28.810 align:middle line:84% in video games, but it's not gonna be known for being 01:06:28.810 --> 01:06:32.690 align:middle line:84% epically innovative with camera movement. 01:06:32.690 --> 01:06:34.240 align:middle line:84% It's going to be about the things I think 01:06:34.240 --> 01:06:36.760 align:middle line:90% Citizen Kane are about. 01:06:36.760 --> 01:06:42.590 align:middle line:84% So it's basically in this form, although I'm rethinking 01:06:42.590 --> 01:06:44.290 align:middle line:84% what kind of box it's gonna be in. 01:06:44.290 --> 01:06:45.760 align:middle line:90% But in this form it's a box. 01:06:45.760 --> 01:06:49.760 align:middle line:84% And inside of it are various objects that start out as-- 01:06:49.760 --> 01:06:51.900 align:middle line:84% the starting objects of the box are the things that have 01:06:51.900 --> 01:06:53.900 align:middle line:90% personal significance to me. 01:06:53.900 --> 01:06:55.980 align:middle line:84% One of the rules of the game, in fact, I think the most 01:06:55.980 --> 01:06:58.305 align:middle line:84% important rule of the game is this one. 01:06:58.305 --> 01:07:00.710 align:middle line:84% Rule number one, you may permanently exchange an object 01:07:00.710 --> 01:07:03.580 align:middle line:84% of personal significance for any object of equal value. 01:07:03.580 --> 01:07:05.240 align:middle line:84% So when you're playing this game, you can take something 01:07:05.240 --> 01:07:07.770 align:middle line:84% that belongs to you, and you can exchange it for anything 01:07:07.770 --> 01:07:09.370 align:middle line:90% in the box. 01:07:09.370 --> 01:07:13.560 align:middle line:84% And of course, the interesting thing is these objects in the 01:07:13.560 --> 01:07:17.350 align:middle line:84% box are of varying degrees of interactivity. 01:07:17.350 --> 01:07:18.590 align:middle line:90% You can [INAUDIBLE] 01:07:18.590 --> 01:07:23.050 align:middle line:84% so you can draw something on the Etch A Sketch. 01:07:23.050 --> 01:07:25.050 align:middle line:84% The rules are kind of veiled at this moment now, where's 01:07:25.050 --> 01:07:26.890 align:middle line:84% there's like a couple other rules that 01:07:26.890 --> 01:07:27.900 align:middle line:90% are causing to reflect. 01:07:27.900 --> 01:07:31.050 align:middle line:84% This is actually an extension of Yup on Word which is a 01:07:31.050 --> 01:07:33.430 align:middle line:84% project we worked on in the summer, which was a game that 01:07:33.430 --> 01:07:35.680 align:middle line:84% as you're playing it's a platform where you're typing, 01:07:35.680 --> 01:07:38.440 align:middle line:84% and the game stops and asks you personal questions. 01:07:38.440 --> 01:07:40.480 align:middle line:84% What I really liked about that is it was doing something that 01:07:40.480 --> 01:07:45.982 align:middle line:84% I was referring to as a mechanic of reflection, where 01:07:45.982 --> 01:07:50.440 align:middle line:84% the activity of playing is reflecting, is thinking, is 01:07:50.440 --> 01:07:51.800 align:middle line:90% contemplating. 01:07:51.800 --> 01:07:56.120 align:middle line:84% It's not interactive in a very active way as we think of it, 01:07:56.120 --> 01:07:57.470 align:middle line:90% it's more reflective. 01:07:57.470 --> 01:07:59.950 align:middle line:84% I liken it to the moments in chess where you're 01:07:59.950 --> 01:08:00.640 align:middle line:90% planning your move. 01:08:00.640 --> 01:08:02.530 align:middle line:84% There's not a lot of action in chess. 01:08:02.530 --> 01:08:04.740 align:middle line:84% But it's a lot of contemplation in chess. 01:08:04.740 --> 01:08:06.290 align:middle line:90% So if it's personal-- 01:08:06.290 --> 01:08:07.820 align:middle line:90% what if that were personal. 01:08:07.820 --> 01:08:11.590 align:middle line:84% And so what I didn't particularly care about with 01:08:11.590 --> 01:08:16.420 align:middle line:84% Yup on Word it inspires you to reflect, but it doesn't do it 01:08:16.420 --> 01:08:18.380 align:middle line:90% with tremendous grace. 01:08:18.380 --> 01:08:19.540 align:middle line:90% It just asks you a question. 01:08:19.540 --> 01:08:23.210 align:middle line:84% It just comes up out of the blue and and says, hey, when 01:08:23.210 --> 01:08:24.830 align:middle line:90% was the last time you lied? 01:08:24.830 --> 01:08:27.250 align:middle line:84% Sometimes you're surprised by that, and that's a good 01:08:27.250 --> 01:08:30.319 align:middle line:84% effect, but it's also not subtle. 01:08:30.319 --> 01:08:33.279 align:middle line:84% So I'm trying to explore how can we be subtle in causing 01:08:33.279 --> 01:08:34.109 align:middle line:90% reflection. 01:08:34.109 --> 01:08:35.180 align:middle line:84% So there are a few things here. 01:08:35.180 --> 01:08:36.750 align:middle line:84% The value question is interesting. 01:08:36.750 --> 01:08:39.890 align:middle line:84% How do you know what the value of the object is in the box? 01:08:39.890 --> 01:08:42.210 align:middle line:84% Do you think of it as monetary value? 01:08:42.210 --> 01:08:44.300 align:middle line:84% Do you think of it as value in terms of significance to the 01:08:44.300 --> 01:08:45.950 align:middle line:90% person who put that in there? 01:08:45.950 --> 01:08:48.649 align:middle line:84% Why is it significant to the person who put that in there? 01:08:48.649 --> 01:08:49.790 align:middle line:90% What is this thing? 01:08:49.790 --> 01:08:50.729 align:middle line:84% You can look at it and reflect. 01:08:50.729 --> 01:08:54.090 align:middle line:84% And then when you leave a trace of yourself in this box, 01:08:54.090 --> 01:08:57.100 align:middle line:84% the next person who comes and plays is going to see that. 01:08:57.100 --> 01:08:58.979 align:middle line:84% And they're going to wonder what was that. 01:08:58.979 --> 01:09:06.810 align:middle line:84% So I'm also kind of interested the organicness, the kind of 01:09:06.810 --> 01:09:10.180 align:middle line:84% never-ending, interminable nature of a game that carries 01:09:10.180 --> 01:09:14.240 align:middle line:84% the effect of the person who's played it on and on and on. 01:09:14.240 --> 01:09:16.519 align:middle line:84% The next iteration of this that I want to do-- actually 01:09:16.519 --> 01:09:18.819 align:middle line:84% this was an idea that Jason Bean gave me was to use an 01:09:18.819 --> 01:09:20.200 align:middle line:90% apothecary chest. 01:09:20.200 --> 01:09:22.279 align:middle line:84% Because one of the things that we play-tested it here with-- 01:09:22.279 --> 01:09:24.523 align:middle line:84% I left it out for two weeks and people-- you 01:09:24.523 --> 01:09:25.430 align:middle line:90% probably saw it. 01:09:25.430 --> 01:09:25.939 align:middle line:90% It's right there. 01:09:25.939 --> 01:09:27.074 align:middle line:90% People were engaging in-- 01:09:27.074 --> 01:09:31.020 align:middle line:84% this is a photo with objects that people had left in. 01:09:31.020 --> 01:09:33.326 align:middle line:84% So it was really fun for me after two weeks to go into 01:09:33.326 --> 01:09:36.300 align:middle line:84% this box and be like, what is all this stuff. 01:09:36.300 --> 01:09:37.210 align:middle line:90% What got left? 01:09:37.210 --> 01:09:39.109 align:middle line:84% I was actually surprised the Etch A Sketch was left. 01:09:39.109 --> 01:09:40.920 align:middle line:84% And then I was like, what is this stuff? 01:09:40.920 --> 01:09:43.963 align:middle line:84% And to give you one really good example, one person at 01:09:43.963 --> 01:09:49.970 align:middle line:84% the lab put in a Nintendo DS flash card, which was really a 01:09:49.970 --> 01:09:51.660 align:middle line:90% wrapped DS flash card. 01:09:51.660 --> 01:09:54.130 align:middle line:84% So now there's this kind of next level. 01:09:54.130 --> 01:09:55.810 align:middle line:84% The game has changed with another level of 01:09:55.810 --> 01:09:59.340 align:middle line:84% interactivity, where it's like, if I want to get at what 01:09:59.340 --> 01:10:03.630 align:middle line:84% was the significance of this object to this person, I need 01:10:03.630 --> 01:10:06.110 align:middle line:90% to get a DS and play this. 01:10:06.110 --> 01:10:10.920 align:middle line:84% So I open up the-- it's got folders, and it's got a copy 01:10:10.920 --> 01:10:12.130 align:middle line:90% of the game Lemming. 01:10:12.130 --> 01:10:13.870 align:middle line:90% It's got some music in it. 01:10:13.870 --> 01:10:15.610 align:middle line:90% So now it's kind of like you've 01:10:15.610 --> 01:10:16.940 align:middle line:90% uncovered this next layer. 01:10:16.940 --> 01:10:19.980 align:middle line:84% And it's like the interesting traces of the people who 01:10:19.980 --> 01:10:24.990 align:middle line:84% played this game are now marked onto this box forever. 01:10:24.990 --> 01:10:26.140 align:middle line:90% Marley even said to me-- 01:10:26.140 --> 01:10:29.020 align:middle line:84% I was talking to her about her play after she had done it, 01:10:29.020 --> 01:10:30.940 align:middle line:90% and I was like-- 01:10:30.940 --> 01:10:33.660 align:middle line:84% She told me she wanted to take the instructions. 01:10:33.660 --> 01:10:34.680 align:middle line:90% She wanted to take the rules. 01:10:34.680 --> 01:10:36.800 align:middle line:84% That's one of the objects that she could take out of that. 01:10:36.800 --> 01:10:38.610 align:middle line:84% And I told her I had thought about that actually when I was 01:10:38.610 --> 01:10:40.474 align:middle line:84% designing it, that someone might be like, ha, I'm going 01:10:40.474 --> 01:10:41.160 align:middle line:90% to take the rules. 01:10:41.160 --> 01:10:43.660 align:middle line:84% And I was going to put in a rule that said you can 01:10:43.660 --> 01:10:46.120 align:middle line:84% permanently exchange for an object that's not the rules, 01:10:46.120 --> 01:10:47.640 align:middle line:84% so that the game could persist. 01:10:47.640 --> 01:10:51.010 align:middle line:84% But I didn't want to artificially impose that. 01:10:51.010 --> 01:10:53.050 align:middle line:84% If someone takes the rules because that's what they want, 01:10:53.050 --> 01:10:54.780 align:middle line:90% and now the game has changed. 01:10:54.780 --> 01:10:58.060 align:middle line:84% And maybe someone comes along later and modifies it. 01:10:58.060 --> 01:11:00.000 align:middle line:84% And maybe they put something in that makes it a whole new, 01:11:00.000 --> 01:11:00.650 align:middle line:90% different game. 01:11:00.650 --> 01:11:03.410 align:middle line:84% And I really liked the idea that you could encounter this 01:11:03.410 --> 01:11:07.110 align:middle line:84% game and that it's gonna be in this state of flux, I guess 01:11:07.110 --> 01:11:09.430 align:middle line:90% you could say. 01:11:09.430 --> 01:11:10.810 align:middle line:84% That's what I'm working on now. 01:11:10.810 --> 01:11:13.095 align:middle line:84% And like I said, I think one of the things I didn't like is 01:11:13.095 --> 01:11:15.600 align:middle line:84% that all of the objects are accessible all at once. 01:11:15.600 --> 01:11:18.150 align:middle line:84% So if it's an apothecary chest with lots of drawers, this was 01:11:18.150 --> 01:11:20.590 align:middle line:84% Jason Bean's idea, then you have to do a little exploring. 01:11:20.590 --> 01:11:22.860 align:middle line:84% And maybe the rules are in one of those drawers. 01:11:22.860 --> 01:11:24.280 align:middle line:84% And maybe you see the rules first. 01:11:24.280 --> 01:11:25.730 align:middle line:84% Maybe you see the rules way after you've 01:11:25.730 --> 01:11:26.350 align:middle line:90% looked at a lot of stuff. 01:11:26.350 --> 01:11:28.280 align:middle line:84% And now you've seen all this stuff and played with it all 01:11:28.280 --> 01:11:29.435 align:middle line:90% and you really like something. 01:11:29.435 --> 01:11:32.520 align:middle line:84% And now it's like, ooh, what do I trade? 01:11:32.520 --> 01:11:38.560 align:middle line:84% And yeah, I also am trying to find a way to give the box a 01:11:38.560 --> 01:11:39.960 align:middle line:90% history as well. 01:11:39.960 --> 01:11:43.670 align:middle line:84% I've contemplated some ideas of putting in some kind of 01:11:43.670 --> 01:11:47.230 align:middle line:84% clues that you could then, if you felt, if you thought about 01:11:47.230 --> 01:11:49.040 align:middle line:84% it or looked it up, you might be able to find a 01:11:49.040 --> 01:11:50.745 align:middle line:90% story to this box. 01:11:50.745 --> 01:11:52.710 align:middle line:84% Like if you did an Internet search you might come up on a 01:11:52.710 --> 01:11:55.000 align:middle line:84% fake website-- well, it wouldn't be fake, it'd just be 01:11:55.000 --> 01:11:58.800 align:middle line:84% a website-- but a website with a fake story that tells you a 01:11:58.800 --> 01:12:00.893 align:middle line:84% little bit about this box, and then it gives you a few more 01:12:00.893 --> 01:12:03.200 align:middle line:84% hooks into what the meaning of this game or the inspiration 01:12:03.200 --> 01:12:05.740 align:middle line:90% for this game was. 01:12:05.740 --> 01:12:07.850 align:middle line:84% And so this is one of my projects that I'm working on 01:12:07.850 --> 01:12:10.430 align:middle line:84% right now, like I said, I'm interested in essentially. 01:12:10.430 --> 01:12:13.460 align:middle line:84% But you can see where a lot of the other things that I was 01:12:13.460 --> 01:12:17.700 align:middle line:84% talking about are inspiring this work. 01:12:17.700 --> 01:12:22.415 align:middle line:84% And so we come back to that question of, are games art? 01:12:22.415 --> 01:12:23.410 align:middle line:84% Of course we only have five minutes. 01:12:23.410 --> 01:12:24.380 align:middle line:84% I don't know if you guys have administrative stuff 01:12:24.380 --> 01:12:24.840 align:middle line:90% afterwards. 01:12:24.840 --> 01:12:31.120 align:middle line:84% But this is, like I said, this is my viewpoint. 01:12:31.120 --> 01:12:34.690 align:middle line:84% It's certainly shared with a lot of people. 01:12:34.690 --> 01:12:39.093 align:middle line:90% But it's not guaranteed truth. 01:12:39.093 --> 01:12:44.470 align:middle line:84% This is an opinion that I have just shared. 01:12:44.470 --> 01:12:48.500 align:middle line:84% Any thoughts you guys have about this subject or these 01:12:48.500 --> 01:12:51.222 align:middle line:90% ideas or these games? 01:12:51.222 --> 01:12:54.680 align:middle line:90% Anything at all? 01:12:54.680 --> 01:12:57.200 align:middle line:90% Yesterday's football game? 01:12:57.200 --> 01:12:58.450 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 01:12:58.450 --> 01:13:01.460 align:middle line:90% 01:13:01.460 --> 01:13:02.110 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Well, cool. 01:13:02.110 --> 01:13:03.230 align:middle line:90% I hope this was useful. 01:13:03.230 --> 01:13:05.000 align:middle line:90% I hope it was helpful. 01:13:05.000 --> 01:13:08.280 align:middle line:84% I think if, at the very least, it causes you to continue to 01:13:08.280 --> 01:13:10.920 align:middle line:84% think about your own games that you're developing and how 01:13:10.920 --> 01:13:14.660 align:middle line:84% meaning can be embedded in the play that you might not even 01:13:14.660 --> 01:13:16.080 align:middle line:90% realize is there. 01:13:16.080 --> 01:13:17.830 align:middle line:84% And also just to count the possibility space. 01:13:17.830 --> 01:13:19.510 align:middle line:90% I really am excited by-- 01:13:19.510 --> 01:13:23.710 align:middle line:84% I'm discouraged by the safe choices that a lot of 01:13:23.710 --> 01:13:25.675 align:middle line:84% independent game developers make and excited when some 01:13:25.675 --> 01:13:29.160 align:middle line:84% game developers really push on the edge. 01:13:29.160 --> 01:13:30.960 align:middle line:84% I don't think we have a clear understanding of what the 01:13:30.960 --> 01:13:34.190 align:middle line:84% rules are or what even constitutes a game. 01:13:34.190 --> 01:13:37.010 align:middle line:84% Or what degree of interactivity is appropriate 01:13:37.010 --> 01:13:38.800 align:middle line:90% for a quote/unquote game. 01:13:38.800 --> 01:13:42.260 align:middle line:84% And I think some of these designers are really testing 01:13:42.260 --> 01:13:45.072 align:middle line:84% the waters of the medium, you know, what can we 01:13:45.072 --> 01:13:45.990 align:middle line:90% really do with this? 01:13:45.990 --> 01:13:47.760 align:middle line:90% Where can we go? 01:13:47.760 --> 01:13:49.975 align:middle line:84% How edgy and satirical and avant-garde can we be? 01:13:49.975 --> 01:13:53.090 align:middle line:90% 01:13:53.090 --> 01:13:55.571 align:middle line:90% I think that's always good. 01:13:55.571 --> 01:13:59.954 align:middle line:84% 'Cause I'm a revolutionary, crazy person. 01:13:59.954 --> 01:14:01.204 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Crazy person. 01:14:01.204 --> 01:14:07.760 align:middle line:90% 01:14:07.760 --> 01:14:11.280 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Hope 7 played yet one more this year, which were 01:14:11.280 --> 01:14:14.568 align:middle line:84% some of the games that Abe worked with the team on over 01:14:14.568 --> 01:14:15.570 align:middle line:90% the summer. 01:14:15.570 --> 01:14:19.492 align:middle line:84% Those are all on our GAMBIT website, just until 2010 and 01:14:19.492 --> 01:14:21.690 align:middle line:84% as yet [UNINTELLIGIBLE] which we're 01:14:21.690 --> 01:14:23.220 align:middle line:90% booked about this summer. 01:14:23.220 --> 01:14:26.480 align:middle line:84% This sounds like tri-season will be digital work. 01:14:26.480 --> 01:14:27.790 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, and please play them and give us 01:14:27.790 --> 01:14:28.620 align:middle line:90% feedback, too, right? 01:14:28.620 --> 01:14:29.784 align:middle line:84% Because that's the other thing. 01:14:29.784 --> 01:14:32.860 align:middle line:84% These are not perfect articulations of game as the 01:14:32.860 --> 01:14:34.654 align:middle line:90% pure art form. 01:14:34.654 --> 01:14:37.039 align:middle line:84% We're constantly evolving and trying to improve, so any 01:14:37.039 --> 01:14:39.435 align:middle line:84% feedback you can give us on this stuff is greatly 01:14:39.435 --> 01:14:40.685 align:middle line:90% appreciated. 01:14:40.685 --> 01:14:42.420 align:middle line:90% 01:14:42.420 --> 01:14:44.520 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Do you still have that box, like somewhere? 01:14:44.520 --> 01:14:45.100 align:middle line:90% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, yeah. 01:14:45.100 --> 01:14:45.805 align:middle line:90% It's in my office. 01:14:45.805 --> 01:14:46.250 align:middle line:90% Yeah, totally. 01:14:46.250 --> 01:14:50.970 align:middle line:84% I have the box and the other part of it is when I do the 01:14:50.970 --> 01:14:54.760 align:middle line:84% second version of it in the apothecary kind of chest-- 01:14:54.760 --> 01:14:57.620 align:middle line:84% The one thing that's important to me is that each of the-- 01:14:57.620 --> 01:15:00.470 align:middle line:84% For the prototype I just sort of threw some reasonably 01:15:00.470 --> 01:15:02.210 align:middle line:90% meaningful objects in there. 01:15:02.210 --> 01:15:05.020 align:middle line:84% But I want it to be populated with objects that are 01:15:05.020 --> 01:15:08.350 align:middle line:84% personally significant to myself or symbolic to myself. 01:15:08.350 --> 01:15:13.270 align:middle line:84% And populating that box at the outset with meaningful objects 01:15:13.270 --> 01:15:19.050 align:middle line:84% I think is important, because once it's released into the 01:15:19.050 --> 01:15:22.100 align:middle line:84% world for play that it's constantly changing. 01:15:22.100 --> 01:15:27.460 align:middle line:84% So that first instantiation of the game is the one that's 01:15:27.460 --> 01:15:30.210 align:middle line:84% about me in some sense, and about my experiences and then 01:15:30.210 --> 01:15:32.520 align:middle line:84% it becomes the world's to just play. 01:15:32.520 --> 01:15:36.210 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So the way that your game kind of reminds me of is 01:15:36.210 --> 01:15:38.740 align:middle line:84% I'm pretty sure I heard somewhere that some 01:15:38.740 --> 01:15:41.950 align:middle line:90% person had a pen. 01:15:41.950 --> 01:15:44.824 align:middle line:84% He started with a pen and kept trading-- 01:15:44.824 --> 01:15:46.290 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: The red paper-- 01:15:46.290 --> 01:15:46.980 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: No. 01:15:46.980 --> 01:15:48.210 align:middle line:90% This is a different one. 01:15:48.210 --> 01:15:49.500 align:middle line:84% Not the red paper clip for a car. 01:15:49.500 --> 01:15:52.120 align:middle line:84% I think someone started with a pen or something and kept 01:15:52.120 --> 01:15:52.450 align:middle line:90% trading it. 01:15:52.450 --> 01:15:57.140 align:middle line:84% And over the course of a year or two, he'd got-- 01:15:57.140 --> 01:16:00.314 align:middle line:84% From that initial pen, he was able to trade 01:16:00.314 --> 01:16:01.640 align:middle line:90% for a house or something. 01:16:01.640 --> 01:16:03.940 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: It was [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 01:16:03.940 --> 01:16:06.980 align:middle line:84% And that was sort of an interesting-- 01:16:06.980 --> 01:16:09.860 align:middle line:84% I think it was on eBay, too, or something like that. 01:16:09.860 --> 01:16:12.460 align:middle line:84% And that's even using a pretty well-designed game system-- 01:16:12.460 --> 01:16:14.560 align:middle line:84% 'cause eBay is totally a game-- 01:16:14.560 --> 01:16:17.850 align:middle line:84% and using a game system and subverting the system itself 01:16:17.850 --> 01:16:19.970 align:middle line:84% to do something really interesting. 01:16:19.970 --> 01:16:21.170 align:middle line:90% Yeah, that's a really great-- 01:16:21.170 --> 01:16:23.190 align:middle line:90% it's a game inside of a game. 01:16:23.190 --> 01:16:23.820 align:middle line:90% I love that. 01:16:23.820 --> 01:16:26.320 align:middle line:84% It's kind of like the Cow Clicker, like making a game 01:16:26.320 --> 01:16:29.612 align:middle line:84% inside of the game that subverts-- 01:16:29.612 --> 01:16:31.430 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Are you familiar with the concept of 01:16:31.430 --> 01:16:33.500 align:middle line:90% geo-caching? 01:16:33.500 --> 01:16:35.596 align:middle line:90% When I first saw-- 01:16:35.596 --> 01:16:37.488 align:middle line:84% the game you were talking about using [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 01:16:37.488 --> 01:16:38.907 align:middle line:90% reminded me of it. 01:16:38.907 --> 01:16:40.700 align:middle line:84% So initially what it was, was when GPS's first came out, 01:16:40.700 --> 01:16:42.310 align:middle line:84% people were like, oh, hey, this is really cool 01:16:42.310 --> 01:16:42.460 align:middle line:90% technology. 01:16:42.460 --> 01:16:44.190 align:middle line:84% We should think of something fun to do with it. 01:16:44.190 --> 01:16:49.255 align:middle line:84% So what they did was, these people started hiding empty 01:16:49.255 --> 01:16:53.770 align:middle line:84% tins of little trinkets and stuff on various hiking trails 01:16:53.770 --> 01:16:55.080 align:middle line:90% or other locations. 01:16:55.080 --> 01:16:56.840 align:middle line:84% And you would look up the coordinates on your GPS 01:16:56.840 --> 01:16:59.622 align:middle line:84% finder, and you would find this box. 01:16:59.622 --> 01:17:02.646 align:middle line:84% And then you'd trade trinkets, and you get them. 01:17:02.646 --> 01:17:05.020 align:middle line:84% And you keep traveling to these other-- 01:17:05.020 --> 01:17:06.330 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, and in that sense this whole 01:17:06.330 --> 01:17:09.930 align:middle line:90% worldwide game becomes-- 01:17:09.930 --> 01:17:12.690 align:middle line:84% There's some shared ideas with some location-based games that 01:17:12.690 --> 01:17:17.110 align:middle line:84% do some really interesting things with that, whether it's 01:17:17.110 --> 01:17:19.885 align:middle line:84% alternate reality, but not even with the narrative. 01:17:19.885 --> 01:17:23.867 align:middle line:84% There was one I was reading about that was, come out and 01:17:23.867 --> 01:17:26.850 align:middle line:84% play, I think, in New York City at one point. 01:17:26.850 --> 01:17:29.280 align:middle line:84% It was Cruel to be Kind, it was called. 01:17:29.280 --> 01:17:33.526 align:middle line:84% It was a game where you don't know who's playing, you don't 01:17:33.526 --> 01:17:36.900 align:middle line:84% know who's on what team, but you get missions and you get a 01:17:36.900 --> 01:17:40.630 align:middle line:84% weapon that's a complement, like to kill someone who's on 01:17:40.630 --> 01:17:42.660 align:middle line:84% the other team, mistake them for a celebrity, or 01:17:42.660 --> 01:17:44.110 align:middle line:90% something like that. 01:17:44.110 --> 01:17:46.740 align:middle line:84% So you're using these random acts of kindness-- you know, 01:17:46.740 --> 01:17:48.140 align:middle line:84% helping somebody across the street-- 01:17:48.140 --> 01:17:51.672 align:middle line:84% and you don't know, it's in New York City, so you don't 01:17:51.672 --> 01:17:52.580 align:middle line:84% know if someone's playing the game. 01:17:52.580 --> 01:17:54.890 align:middle line:84% So now all of a sudden you're wandering around doing really 01:17:54.890 --> 01:17:58.140 align:middle line:84% nice things for people on the chance, on a hunch that you 01:17:58.140 --> 01:18:00.310 align:middle line:84% have that maybe they're playing the game. 01:18:00.310 --> 01:18:01.830 align:middle line:84% And maybe they're not, so you've just helped somebody 01:18:01.830 --> 01:18:03.777 align:middle line:84% across the street, which is totally nice. 01:18:03.777 --> 01:18:07.156 align:middle line:84% And it comes to this massive conclusion where you just have 01:18:07.156 --> 01:18:10.300 align:middle line:84% these two giant teams who meet up in a location to "nice" 01:18:10.300 --> 01:18:13.520 align:middle line:84% each other to death, basically. 01:18:13.520 --> 01:18:16.920 align:middle line:84% There's a lot of really, really interesting stuff, 01:18:16.920 --> 01:18:20.370 align:middle line:84% especially in the location-based, around. 01:18:20.370 --> 01:18:21.780 align:middle line:90% Big games are really cool. 01:18:21.780 --> 01:18:23.230 align:middle line:84% There's a lot of people doing really neat 01:18:23.230 --> 01:18:25.550 align:middle line:90% stuff with big games. 01:18:25.550 --> 01:18:28.000 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think in particular with the box and 01:18:28.000 --> 01:18:31.877 align:middle line:84% the geo-caching idea, and talking about the 01:18:31.877 --> 01:18:35.740 align:middle line:84% paperclip-for-a-house thing, it's really interesting how 01:18:35.740 --> 01:18:37.710 align:middle line:90% people value things. 01:18:37.710 --> 01:18:40.380 align:middle line:84% In particular, you have this very vague rule, and it just 01:18:40.380 --> 01:18:42.690 align:middle line:90% says something of equal value. 01:18:42.690 --> 01:18:43.940 align:middle line:84% And what does it actually mean? 01:18:43.940 --> 01:18:46.910 align:middle line:90% 01:18:46.910 --> 01:18:50.230 align:middle line:84% Like what someone is willing to trade for something else. 01:18:50.230 --> 01:18:51.720 align:middle line:84% GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, those are the kind of implicit rules 01:18:51.720 --> 01:18:53.715 align:middle line:84% like you see in Sixteen Tons, where it's like, what happens 01:18:53.715 --> 01:18:56.210 align:middle line:90% with the money? 01:18:56.210 --> 01:18:57.800 align:middle line:84% Jason Bean really pointed it out, 'cause he was thinking 01:18:57.800 --> 01:18:59.400 align:middle line:84% about value when he was doing the trading. 01:18:59.400 --> 01:19:01.530 align:middle line:84% And it's such a good word, because value is such a 01:19:01.530 --> 01:19:03.110 align:middle line:84% different thing to different people. 01:19:03.110 --> 01:19:08.190 align:middle line:84% Someone might see the flash card for the DS, which has a 01:19:08.190 --> 01:19:12.330 align:middle line:84% very clear, higher monetary value than an Etch A Sketch. 01:19:12.330 --> 01:19:14.500 align:middle line:84% And yet, maybe you played with an Etch A Sketch when you were 01:19:14.500 --> 01:19:17.080 align:middle line:84% a kid, and all of a sudden it floods back these memories 01:19:17.080 --> 01:19:19.110 align:middle line:90% that you have. 01:19:19.110 --> 01:19:21.670 align:middle line:84% There's also a component to it that I didn't really talk 01:19:21.670 --> 01:19:23.815 align:middle line:84% about, which is the sacrificing of an object. 01:19:23.815 --> 01:19:30.080 align:middle line:84% And I think, too, that we tend to be beholden to our material 01:19:30.080 --> 01:19:32.400 align:middle line:90% objects too much. 01:19:32.400 --> 01:19:36.225 align:middle line:84% In giving it up, in sacrificing it to this game so 01:19:36.225 --> 01:19:37.580 align:middle line:84% that you don't have it anymore, if it's something of 01:19:37.580 --> 01:19:40.650 align:middle line:84% personal significance, you're letting go and being able to 01:19:40.650 --> 01:19:42.040 align:middle line:84% say, OK, the memory is one thing. 01:19:42.040 --> 01:19:43.170 align:middle line:90% I don't need to-- 01:19:43.170 --> 01:19:46.355 align:middle line:84% And that's how it relates a bit back to Citizen Kane, 01:19:46.355 --> 01:19:49.265 align:middle line:84% which is a movie you should see, because it is good. 01:19:49.265 --> 01:19:54.115 align:middle line:84% It's everything they said it is, depending on who they are. 01:19:54.115 --> 01:19:58.490 align:middle line:90% 01:19:58.490 --> 01:19:58.960 align:middle line:90% Cool. 01:19:58.960 --> 01:20:00.210 align:middle line:90% Thanks, guys. 01:20:00.210 --> 01:20:01.110 align:middle line:90%