WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:00.090 align:middle line:90% 00:00:00.090 --> 00:00:02.490 align:middle line:84% The following content is provided under a Creative 00:00:02.490 --> 00:00:04.030 align:middle line:90% Commons license. 00:00:04.030 --> 00:00:06.330 align:middle line:84% Your support will help MIT OpenCourseWare 00:00:06.330 --> 00:00:10.720 align:middle line:84% continue to offer high quality educational resources for free. 00:00:10.720 --> 00:00:13.320 align:middle line:84% To make a donation or view additional materials 00:00:13.320 --> 00:00:17.280 align:middle line:84% from hundreds of MIT courses, visit MIT OpenCourseWare 00:00:17.280 --> 00:00:20.820 align:middle line:90% at ocw.mit.edu. 00:00:20.820 --> 00:00:22.500 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: We go into a reading today. 00:00:22.500 --> 00:00:29.130 align:middle line:84% So this is an interesting book that 00:00:29.130 --> 00:00:31.890 align:middle line:84% came out from something called the New Games Movement, which 00:00:31.890 --> 00:00:36.110 align:middle line:84% I have mentioned a few times in class but just as a reminder. 00:00:36.110 --> 00:00:38.720 align:middle line:84% I think it was mostly in the 60's. 00:00:38.720 --> 00:00:40.440 align:middle line:84% How many of you kind of got that vibe 00:00:40.440 --> 00:00:41.606 align:middle line:90% while you were reading this? 00:00:41.606 --> 00:00:44.300 align:middle line:90% 00:00:44.300 --> 00:00:50.490 align:middle line:84% But it's interesting because it's written in this almost 00:00:50.490 --> 00:00:53.890 align:middle line:84% Hemminway-ish kind of short little sentences-- 00:00:53.890 --> 00:00:56.580 align:middle line:84% short little declarative sentences 00:00:56.580 --> 00:00:59.670 align:middle line:84% about wellness, and happiness, and getting along 00:00:59.670 --> 00:01:01.540 align:middle line:84% with the community and stuff like that. 00:01:01.540 --> 00:01:04.800 align:middle line:84% But all of the principles, at least 00:01:04.800 --> 00:01:06.660 align:middle line:84% in the chapter in today's reading, 00:01:06.660 --> 00:01:08.640 align:middle line:84% aren't actually all that different from what 00:01:08.640 --> 00:01:11.340 align:middle line:84% I've been teaching all semester long 00:01:11.340 --> 00:01:18.300 align:middle line:84% regarding game design and play testing, if it's your job 00:01:18.300 --> 00:01:20.270 align:middle line:90% to actually make a game. 00:01:20.270 --> 00:01:23.390 align:middle line:84% What Bernie DeKoven and some of his other colleagues-- 00:01:23.390 --> 00:01:27.230 align:middle line:84% has anyone heard of the Whole Earth Catalog? 00:01:27.230 --> 00:01:27.844 align:middle line:90% Brant, was it? 00:01:27.844 --> 00:01:28.760 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Brant, yeah. 00:01:28.760 --> 00:01:29.682 align:middle line:90% What was it? 00:01:29.682 --> 00:01:31.140 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: The Whole Earth Catalog. 00:01:31.140 --> 00:01:33.167 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: That was the thing with the parachute? 00:01:33.167 --> 00:01:35.000 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: Well, actually, that's a New Game 00:01:35.000 --> 00:01:35.970 align:middle line:90% Movement in particular. 00:01:35.970 --> 00:01:37.000 align:middle line:90% Yeah. 00:01:37.000 --> 00:01:39.330 align:middle line:84% It's kind of the same community of people who are just 00:01:39.330 --> 00:01:41.040 align:middle line:90% trying to find ways to-- 00:01:41.040 --> 00:01:44.850 align:middle line:84% not only to find ways for people to get along with each other, 00:01:44.850 --> 00:01:47.010 align:middle line:84% but also things like [INAUDIBLE] where you're 00:01:47.010 --> 00:01:49.320 align:middle line:84% taking military equipment and turning them 00:01:49.320 --> 00:01:53.790 align:middle line:84% into things that you play with and stuff like that. 00:01:53.790 --> 00:01:58.260 align:middle line:84% So today's chapter has a lot of stuff 00:01:58.260 --> 00:02:02.910 align:middle line:84% about how people who don't necessarily see themselves 00:02:02.910 --> 00:02:05.100 align:middle line:84% as game makers can use some of the practices 00:02:05.100 --> 00:02:08.820 align:middle line:84% that we've been talking about in this class to basically change 00:02:08.820 --> 00:02:13.260 align:middle line:84% the way they play games that they already play. 00:02:13.260 --> 00:02:18.000 align:middle line:84% And in the process of that create new games. 00:02:18.000 --> 00:02:19.800 align:middle line:84% The New Games Movement-- there's actually 00:02:19.800 --> 00:02:23.670 align:middle line:84% a New Games Book that is more about the kinds of games 00:02:23.670 --> 00:02:24.420 align:middle line:90% that you can play. 00:02:24.420 --> 00:02:26.370 align:middle line:84% It includes things like parachute. 00:02:26.370 --> 00:02:30.650 align:middle line:84% If you've ever done that game where there's 00:02:30.650 --> 00:02:33.280 align:middle line:84% two people back to back-- you're sitting back to back 00:02:33.280 --> 00:02:36.680 align:middle line:84% and then your job is to stand up, 00:02:36.680 --> 00:02:38.795 align:middle line:84% I think without using your hands. 00:02:38.795 --> 00:02:40.170 align:middle line:90% Is that right? 00:02:40.170 --> 00:02:43.530 align:middle line:90% Oh, you lock your arms. 00:02:43.530 --> 00:02:45.170 align:middle line:90% Yeah. 00:02:45.170 --> 00:02:52.380 align:middle line:84% Also that game where everyone gets into a tight circle, 00:02:52.380 --> 00:02:55.530 align:middle line:84% reaches in, grabs somebody else's hand and the whole job 00:02:55.530 --> 00:02:56.930 align:middle line:90% is to untangle it. 00:02:56.930 --> 00:03:00.400 align:middle line:84% You see that in schools a lot nowadays, as well as 00:03:00.400 --> 00:03:01.770 align:middle line:90% games like parachute. 00:03:01.770 --> 00:03:05.850 align:middle line:84% And all that came from this New Games Movement. 00:03:05.850 --> 00:03:13.260 align:middle line:84% Again, it's a reaction to wars in Vietnam and, I guess, Korea. 00:03:13.260 --> 00:03:14.907 align:middle line:84% Am I getting my chronology right? 00:03:14.907 --> 00:03:16.240 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah, Korea then 'Nam. 00:03:16.240 --> 00:03:20.500 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: Yeah, and just trying to say, how do we 00:03:20.500 --> 00:03:21.990 align:middle line:84% learn how to play with other people 00:03:21.990 --> 00:03:24.790 align:middle line:84% instead of fighting other people? 00:03:24.790 --> 00:03:27.960 align:middle line:84% But there are a couple of interesting ideas 00:03:27.960 --> 00:03:32.522 align:middle line:84% in here that I felt were kind of unique to today's reading 00:03:32.522 --> 00:03:34.480 align:middle line:84% that we haven't necessarily addressed in class. 00:03:34.480 --> 00:03:39.925 align:middle line:84% Did anything leap out in Changing the Game? 00:03:39.925 --> 00:03:40.460 align:middle line:90% Yeah? 00:03:40.460 --> 00:03:42.722 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: He talked a lot about borrowing rules. 00:03:42.722 --> 00:03:45.082 align:middle line:84% So taking something from another game and kind 00:03:45.082 --> 00:03:47.442 align:middle line:90% of putting in your own. 00:03:47.442 --> 00:03:50.869 align:middle line:84% And making it your own and getting you 00:03:50.869 --> 00:03:53.782 align:middle line:84% over the hump of having to make up something completely new. 00:03:53.782 --> 00:03:56.240 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: Yeah, and it's kind of funny because the example 00:03:56.240 --> 00:03:59.610 align:middle line:84% that you talked about-- it's kind of like borrowing 00:03:59.610 --> 00:04:03.150 align:middle line:84% the rule on the fly, like from a different variant 00:04:03.150 --> 00:04:03.900 align:middle line:90% of the same game. 00:04:03.900 --> 00:04:05.691 align:middle line:84% But I think the same principle can actually 00:04:05.691 --> 00:04:10.460 align:middle line:84% be applied to a much wider range of things like safety rules. 00:04:10.460 --> 00:04:13.350 align:middle line:84% Like say you're playing a game like tag or something 00:04:13.350 --> 00:04:17.640 align:middle line:84% like that, and you haven't necessarily 00:04:17.640 --> 00:04:21.329 align:middle line:84% mapped out the boundaries of your game, 00:04:21.329 --> 00:04:24.930 align:middle line:84% but the game that you've played with your friends 00:04:24.930 --> 00:04:28.215 align:middle line:84% before decided that one of the boundaries 00:04:28.215 --> 00:04:30.090 align:middle line:84% was going to be the edge of that road, right? 00:04:30.090 --> 00:04:31.530 align:middle line:90% Nobody can run past that road. 00:04:31.530 --> 00:04:34.950 align:middle line:84% That's a fairly sensible safety rule. 00:04:34.950 --> 00:04:37.141 align:middle line:84% It'd be easy enough to just borrow a rule from that 00:04:37.141 --> 00:04:39.390 align:middle line:84% and just say, just like that last game that we played, 00:04:39.390 --> 00:04:42.406 align:middle line:84% no one crosses that road for safety reasons. 00:04:42.406 --> 00:04:42.906 align:middle line:90% Yeah? 00:04:42.906 --> 00:04:44.840 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Another one on this combat 00:04:44.840 --> 00:04:47.980 align:middle line:84% that's really, really confused as far as where it comes from, 00:04:47.980 --> 00:04:50.332 align:middle line:84% especially when your game isn't necessarily 00:04:50.332 --> 00:04:51.290 align:middle line:90% about the whole combat. 00:04:51.290 --> 00:04:54.141 align:middle line:84% Like nothing like just not having to worry about how 00:04:54.141 --> 00:04:55.224 align:middle line:90% the combat actually works. 00:04:55.224 --> 00:04:56.833 align:middle line:84% We borrowed a few different ones. 00:04:56.833 --> 00:04:58.170 align:middle line:84% Like we tried Risk, we tried [INAUDIBLE]. 00:04:58.170 --> 00:04:59.544 align:middle line:84% It's like, we don't actually want 00:04:59.544 --> 00:05:02.400 align:middle line:84% to spend time on developing a fair combat system, 00:05:02.400 --> 00:05:03.774 align:middle line:90% just trying stuff out. 00:05:03.774 --> 00:05:04.440 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Sure. 00:05:04.440 --> 00:05:06.420 align:middle line:84% I mean, as game designers you can certainly 00:05:06.420 --> 00:05:09.490 align:middle line:84% sort of be inspired by what other people have done. 00:05:09.490 --> 00:05:14.010 align:middle line:84% And of course, again, you're designing 00:05:14.010 --> 00:05:16.050 align:middle line:84% a game meant for somebody else to play, 00:05:16.050 --> 00:05:18.590 align:middle line:84% where it's what Bernie DeKoven is writing about. 00:05:18.590 --> 00:05:22.556 align:middle line:84% It's about changing a rule that you're about to play or maybe 00:05:22.556 --> 00:05:23.430 align:middle line:90% even a possible play. 00:05:23.430 --> 00:05:24.150 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] 00:05:24.150 --> 00:05:25.672 align:middle line:90% 00:05:25.672 --> 00:05:27.213 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I just found it interesting 00:05:27.213 --> 00:05:32.195 align:middle line:84% how [INAUDIBLE] rules that sort of help players 00:05:32.195 --> 00:05:34.051 align:middle line:84% play the game as it is right now. 00:05:34.051 --> 00:05:36.039 align:middle line:84% And rules that actually change the strategy 00:05:36.039 --> 00:05:37.986 align:middle line:90% that you have to [INAUDIBLE]. 00:05:37.986 --> 00:05:38.710 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Right. 00:05:38.710 --> 00:05:42.910 align:middle line:84% So there are rules that clarify what it is that you can or you 00:05:42.910 --> 00:05:45.176 align:middle line:90% cannot do, right? 00:05:45.176 --> 00:05:50.320 align:middle line:84% And then there are rules which he explicitly 00:05:50.320 --> 00:05:54.690 align:middle line:84% states as the definition of a change game. 00:05:54.690 --> 00:05:58.330 align:middle line:84% It's one that requires you to come up with a new strategy. 00:05:58.330 --> 00:06:02.530 align:middle line:84% So things like that safety rule that I described earlier 00:06:02.530 --> 00:06:04.466 align:middle line:90% doesn't necessarily fit that. 00:06:04.466 --> 00:06:09.120 align:middle line:84% But it fulfills other purposes like being able to play well, 00:06:09.120 --> 00:06:11.170 align:middle line:84% giving you the feeling of wellness. 00:06:11.170 --> 00:06:15.790 align:middle line:84% I can't believe that line, but it's great. 00:06:15.790 --> 00:06:17.830 align:middle line:84% But then there's also rules like, we're 00:06:17.830 --> 00:06:22.281 align:middle line:84% going to change the game because it's not challenging given 00:06:22.281 --> 00:06:23.530 align:middle line:90% the way it's currently played. 00:06:23.530 --> 00:06:28.510 align:middle line:84% Maybe the current set of rules has a simple exploit 00:06:28.510 --> 00:06:30.730 align:middle line:84% that just leads to one person winning all the time. 00:06:30.730 --> 00:06:32.854 align:middle line:84% Maybe someone is just way more skilled at this game 00:06:32.854 --> 00:06:35.290 align:middle line:84% than somebody else or you're playing with a five-year-old, 00:06:35.290 --> 00:06:36.123 align:middle line:90% something that like. 00:06:36.123 --> 00:06:39.277 align:middle line:84% And you want to have some challenge, 00:06:39.277 --> 00:06:41.110 align:middle line:84% you want to keep some challenge for the kid. 00:06:41.110 --> 00:06:43.200 align:middle line:84% But if you just stick with the rules right now, 00:06:43.200 --> 00:06:45.070 align:middle line:84% the kid will be endlessly challenged 00:06:45.070 --> 00:06:47.060 align:middle line:84% and will not ever be able to win, 00:06:47.060 --> 00:06:49.190 align:middle line:84% and you're not being challenged at all. 00:06:49.190 --> 00:06:51.300 align:middle line:90% That's where you give yourself-- 00:06:51.300 --> 00:06:56.020 align:middle line:84% and he brings this up, what's that the thing 00:06:56.020 --> 00:07:00.500 align:middle line:84% you introduce into the game to be able to rebalance that? 00:07:00.500 --> 00:07:04.090 align:middle line:84% You should know it even if you didn't read it. 00:07:04.090 --> 00:07:05.710 align:middle line:84% If you're playing with somebody who 00:07:05.710 --> 00:07:08.740 align:middle line:84% is way less skilled than you, you give yourself a handicap. 00:07:08.740 --> 00:07:10.380 align:middle line:90% Yeah. 00:07:10.380 --> 00:07:16.270 align:middle line:84% Yeah, so handicapping is a really interesting concept 00:07:16.270 --> 00:07:18.067 align:middle line:90% regarding game balance. 00:07:18.067 --> 00:07:20.150 align:middle line:84% Because normally when we think about game balance, 00:07:20.150 --> 00:07:25.120 align:middle line:84% it's all about how do we think of the rules 00:07:25.120 --> 00:07:27.880 align:middle line:84% so that everybody is kind of equally skilled, 00:07:27.880 --> 00:07:29.590 align:middle line:84% everyone kind of has a fair chance 00:07:29.590 --> 00:07:33.460 align:middle line:84% of winning, a decent chance-- maybe not exactly 00:07:33.460 --> 00:07:35.680 align:middle line:84% an even chance of winning, but at least a fair chance 00:07:35.680 --> 00:07:37.210 align:middle line:90% of winning. 00:07:37.210 --> 00:07:42.520 align:middle line:84% But he's introducing the concept of handicapping as a way 00:07:42.520 --> 00:07:46.380 align:middle line:84% to be able to reintroduce challenge in the situation 00:07:46.380 --> 00:07:50.370 align:middle line:84% where players are not equally skilled because 00:07:50.370 --> 00:07:53.359 align:middle line:84% of physical reasons, because of expertise 00:07:53.359 --> 00:07:55.400 align:middle line:84% or familiarity with the game, that sort of thing. 00:07:55.400 --> 00:07:58.270 align:middle line:90% 00:07:58.270 --> 00:08:02.284 align:middle line:90% So let me see, is that it? 00:08:02.284 --> 00:08:04.450 align:middle line:84% Anything else that people remember from the reading? 00:08:04.450 --> 00:08:10.180 align:middle line:90% 00:08:10.180 --> 00:08:12.080 align:middle line:90% Again a lot of the stuff-- 00:08:12.080 --> 00:08:13.540 align:middle line:84% there is an interesting little bit 00:08:13.540 --> 00:08:16.330 align:middle line:84% that he talks about cheating as a thing 00:08:16.330 --> 00:08:21.250 align:middle line:84% that players should be trying to do if you are already 00:08:21.250 --> 00:08:25.690 align:middle line:84% in the mood to be able to then suggest 00:08:25.690 --> 00:08:27.750 align:middle line:84% rule changes to the rest of the community. 00:08:27.750 --> 00:08:29.890 align:middle line:84% And you should be finding the loopholes, right. 00:08:29.890 --> 00:08:32.830 align:middle line:84% You should be trying to figure out, 00:08:32.830 --> 00:08:36.230 align:middle line:84% given the current set of rules that you're playing right now, 00:08:36.230 --> 00:08:38.870 align:middle line:84% what are the problems with that set of rules 00:08:38.870 --> 00:08:40.659 align:middle line:90% and how do you improve on them? 00:08:40.659 --> 00:08:44.049 align:middle line:84% And the way how you figure out whether these rules are 00:08:44.049 --> 00:08:47.240 align:middle line:84% important, or well written, or problematic, 00:08:47.240 --> 00:08:49.090 align:middle line:90% is you try to break them. 00:08:49.090 --> 00:08:52.330 align:middle line:84% And then, if you break them, then you realize that, oh OK, 00:08:52.330 --> 00:08:55.510 align:middle line:84% that rule was really necessary in order for the game to play, 00:08:55.510 --> 00:08:57.580 align:middle line:84% but your attitude is, I want to continue 00:08:57.580 --> 00:08:58.960 align:middle line:90% playing with all of you. 00:08:58.960 --> 00:09:04.870 align:middle line:84% Then you say, all right, we're not going to do that anymore. 00:09:04.870 --> 00:09:07.630 align:middle line:84% I think it takes a tremendous amount of trust among players 00:09:07.630 --> 00:09:09.400 align:middle line:90% to be able to accommodate that. 00:09:09.400 --> 00:09:12.760 align:middle line:84% I don't know how many people actually play regularly 00:09:12.760 --> 00:09:14.060 align:middle line:90% in environments like that. 00:09:14.060 --> 00:09:17.042 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Are you saying that you 00:09:17.042 --> 00:09:20.091 align:middle line:84% should be trying to cheat to show the rules [INAUDIBLE]? 00:09:20.091 --> 00:09:23.470 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: That you should be trying to find the exploits. 00:09:23.470 --> 00:09:27.670 align:middle line:84% You should be trying to figure out exactly how ironclad 00:09:27.670 --> 00:09:29.080 align:middle line:90% this rule actually is, right. 00:09:29.080 --> 00:09:32.416 align:middle line:84% Or whether this rule is a good idea in the first place. 00:09:32.416 --> 00:09:34.664 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: By breaking the rules? 00:09:34.664 --> 00:09:35.830 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: By breaking them. 00:09:35.830 --> 00:09:36.850 align:middle line:90% It's very, very strange. 00:09:36.850 --> 00:09:40.930 align:middle line:84% It's a very, very interesting suggestion. 00:09:40.930 --> 00:09:42.610 align:middle line:84% I can't recall of a situation when 00:09:42.610 --> 00:09:45.750 align:middle line:84% I've been in a play community, as he describes it, 00:09:45.750 --> 00:09:48.730 align:middle line:84% where there's enough trust to be able to let people get away 00:09:48.730 --> 00:09:49.280 align:middle line:90% with that. 00:09:49.280 --> 00:09:51.571 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Honestly, I think it's just less interesting. 00:09:51.571 --> 00:09:53.968 align:middle line:90% I think it's more interesting-- 00:09:53.968 --> 00:09:56.134 align:middle line:84% I forget who said this-- this is like a quote that's 00:09:56.134 --> 00:09:59.310 align:middle line:84% like, creatively actually comes from constraints. 00:09:59.310 --> 00:10:01.460 align:middle line:84% I think it's a lot more interesting to actually try 00:10:01.460 --> 00:10:06.990 align:middle line:84% to find the broken strategy in a game as it is. 00:10:06.990 --> 00:10:12.190 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: OK, to find the degenerate strategies 00:10:12.190 --> 00:10:14.140 align:middle line:84% within the rules as supposed to figure out 00:10:14.140 --> 00:10:15.434 align:middle line:90% where the rules are broken. 00:10:15.434 --> 00:10:18.338 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So some of them play the-- 00:10:18.338 --> 00:10:20.758 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] change the rules [INAUDIBLE]. 00:10:20.758 --> 00:10:24.146 align:middle line:84% Sometimes when playing games you're like, how do we-- 00:10:24.146 --> 00:10:26.919 align:middle line:84% but I feel like every time I've done those with other people, 00:10:26.919 --> 00:10:28.502 align:middle line:84% it's always been important to everyone 00:10:28.502 --> 00:10:31.266 align:middle line:84% that everyone knows what the rules are [INAUDIBLE]. 00:10:31.266 --> 00:10:32.890 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: And that's one thing that he 00:10:32.890 --> 00:10:34.830 align:middle line:90% very, very clearly states. 00:10:34.830 --> 00:10:38.200 align:middle line:84% It's like, you are cheating publicly. 00:10:38.200 --> 00:10:41.334 align:middle line:84% You are broadcasting the fact that you are cheating, which 00:10:41.334 --> 00:10:43.750 align:middle line:84% brings up the question, are you really cheating or are you 00:10:43.750 --> 00:10:47.300 align:middle line:84% just proposing a rule change, right? 00:10:47.300 --> 00:10:49.180 align:middle line:84% But the idea of treating the rules 00:10:49.180 --> 00:10:51.280 align:middle line:84% as something that could be maleable, I think, 00:10:51.280 --> 00:10:52.840 align:middle line:90% is what he's really getting at. 00:10:52.840 --> 00:10:54.490 align:middle line:84% He doesn't fight to use the word cheating, which 00:10:54.490 --> 00:10:56.615 align:middle line:84% I'm not entirely sure whether that's the right word 00:10:56.615 --> 00:10:57.454 align:middle line:90% to describe it. 00:10:57.454 --> 00:11:00.130 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: To me it seems sort of similar to the phase 00:11:00.130 --> 00:11:05.310 align:middle line:84% idea of [INAUDIBLE] what's underneath the game. 00:11:05.310 --> 00:11:09.760 align:middle line:84% So if you start breaking a rule and you're doing it publicly 00:11:09.760 --> 00:11:11.710 align:middle line:84% with the knowledge of other people, 00:11:11.710 --> 00:11:13.460 align:middle line:84% just to see what happens if we start to break this rule, 00:11:13.460 --> 00:11:15.501 align:middle line:84% I think you can get into some interesting issues. 00:11:15.501 --> 00:11:19.407 align:middle line:84% Like well, what makes the game tick? 00:11:19.407 --> 00:11:21.990 align:middle line:84% I don't know, I feel like a lot of games I used play as a kid, 00:11:21.990 --> 00:11:23.807 align:middle line:90% we would explicitly break rules. 00:11:23.807 --> 00:11:25.390 align:middle line:84% We would know of the rule of the game, 00:11:25.390 --> 00:11:27.413 align:middle line:84% but we would choose to either not play with it 00:11:27.413 --> 00:11:29.459 align:middle line:90% or to just limit it. 00:11:29.459 --> 00:11:30.500 align:middle line:90% This resource is limited. 00:11:30.500 --> 00:11:32.667 align:middle line:84% Like well, you know, this time when we play it it's 00:11:32.667 --> 00:11:33.400 align:middle line:90% not going to be. 00:11:33.400 --> 00:11:34.566 align:middle line:90% Let's just see what happens. 00:11:34.566 --> 00:11:35.560 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Right. 00:11:35.560 --> 00:11:39.059 align:middle line:84% Yeah, and that's the attitude that he is trying to encourage. 00:11:39.059 --> 00:11:41.674 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I feel like if you're like, for whatever purpose 00:11:41.674 --> 00:11:43.490 align:middle line:84% you're playing a game-- like if you're playing to win 00:11:43.490 --> 00:11:45.486 align:middle line:84% or if you're playing just for fun or something, 00:11:45.486 --> 00:11:48.692 align:middle line:84% players are too keen to change the rules when they don't do 00:11:48.692 --> 00:11:50.052 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE]. 00:11:50.052 --> 00:11:51.760 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: Players aren't or players are? 00:11:51.760 --> 00:11:53.253 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Players are. 00:11:53.253 --> 00:11:55.618 align:middle line:84% Like if you're just not very good at a game 00:11:55.618 --> 00:11:58.929 align:middle line:84% or you run into some sort of obstacle or strategy 00:11:58.929 --> 00:12:00.200 align:middle line:90% that [INAUDIBLE] done that. 00:12:00.200 --> 00:12:03.470 align:middle line:84% I think players, in general, jump to changing the rules too 00:12:03.470 --> 00:12:03.970 align:middle line:90% frequently. 00:12:03.970 --> 00:12:04.530 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Too frequently? 00:12:04.530 --> 00:12:05.155 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah. 00:12:05.155 --> 00:12:09.650 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: OK, let's dig into that. 00:12:09.650 --> 00:12:12.160 align:middle line:90% Why too frequently? 00:12:12.160 --> 00:12:14.170 align:middle line:84% Why do you feel that happens too often? 00:12:14.170 --> 00:12:15.902 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I'm thinking along the lines of competitive games 00:12:15.902 --> 00:12:16.150 align:middle line:90% here. 00:12:16.150 --> 00:12:18.496 align:middle line:84% You just get tired of how they have blame other people 00:12:18.496 --> 00:12:20.497 align:middle line:90% besides themselves. 00:12:20.497 --> 00:12:21.080 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: OK. 00:12:21.080 --> 00:12:23.040 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Just in general. 00:12:23.040 --> 00:12:25.240 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: But what if you were trying to change 00:12:25.240 --> 00:12:27.960 align:middle line:90% the rules for other people? 00:12:27.960 --> 00:12:30.385 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Yeah, no, I think that sort thing requires 00:12:30.385 --> 00:12:32.325 align:middle line:84% a really in depth understanding of all 00:12:32.325 --> 00:12:34.730 align:middle line:90% the strategy [INAUDIBLE]. 00:12:34.730 --> 00:12:40.690 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: Well, say I'm in a fighting game tournament 00:12:40.690 --> 00:12:44.910 align:middle line:84% or something like that where usually the rules are 00:12:44.910 --> 00:12:47.255 align:middle line:90% pretty rigidly enforced, right? 00:12:47.255 --> 00:12:47.880 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah. 00:12:47.880 --> 00:12:51.430 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: But I'm not like a top-level player. 00:12:51.430 --> 00:12:57.700 align:middle line:84% I just happen to be on a real winning streak among people 00:12:57.700 --> 00:13:05.450 align:middle line:84% that I know and I don't seem to be able to lose right now. 00:13:05.450 --> 00:13:10.120 align:middle line:84% So I think what Bernie is talking about 00:13:10.120 --> 00:13:13.390 align:middle line:84% is describing a situation where, especially if you 00:13:13.390 --> 00:13:15.880 align:middle line:84% are that person who seems to be on a winning streak, 00:13:15.880 --> 00:13:18.100 align:middle line:84% you might want to suggest a rule change to be 00:13:18.100 --> 00:13:21.910 align:middle line:84% able to bring the challenge back to you, right. 00:13:21.910 --> 00:13:25.355 align:middle line:84% I've seen players do this specifically in our kids 00:13:25.355 --> 00:13:27.730 align:middle line:84% where it's like, I'm going to pick the character that I'm 00:13:27.730 --> 00:13:29.620 align:middle line:84% crappiest at because I can't seem 00:13:29.620 --> 00:13:31.630 align:middle line:84% to be able to lose by playing the characters 00:13:31.630 --> 00:13:34.590 align:middle line:90% that I'm actually good at. 00:13:34.590 --> 00:13:38.190 align:middle line:84% That's [INAUDIBLE] very interesting for me. 00:13:38.190 --> 00:13:47.035 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I mean, [INAUDIBLE] rule changes to [INAUDIBLE] 00:13:47.035 --> 00:13:48.191 align:middle line:90% I'm calling it cheating. 00:13:48.191 --> 00:13:48.857 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Yeah. 00:13:48.857 --> 00:13:51.273 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Because to me cheating implies that you are not. 00:13:51.273 --> 00:13:53.885 align:middle line:84% Me changing the rules and everyone agrees on the rules 00:13:53.885 --> 00:13:55.705 align:middle line:84% and how the rules change, and it's not. 00:13:55.705 --> 00:13:57.060 align:middle line:90% Then you have changed the rules. 00:13:57.060 --> 00:13:58.857 align:middle line:84% You are now playing by a different set of rules. 00:13:58.857 --> 00:14:01.481 align:middle line:84% If you play by those, you're not cheating because you're not 00:14:01.481 --> 00:14:02.174 align:middle line:90% playing by the original. 00:14:02.174 --> 00:14:03.791 align:middle line:84% I feel like cheating is anything where 00:14:03.791 --> 00:14:06.940 align:middle line:84% you are breaking the set of rules that was agreed upon. 00:14:06.940 --> 00:14:10.270 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: Well, cheating also, I think, 00:14:10.270 --> 00:14:13.167 align:middle line:84% has a certain assumption that everybody else is not 00:14:13.167 --> 00:14:14.250 align:middle line:90% breaking the rules, right. 00:14:14.250 --> 00:14:16.583 align:middle line:84% No one is playing with a different set of rules but you. 00:14:16.583 --> 00:14:18.760 align:middle line:90% All but the cheat. 00:14:18.760 --> 00:14:20.440 align:middle line:84% In fact, a lot of cheats only work 00:14:20.440 --> 00:14:22.800 align:middle line:84% if everyone else sticks to the rules as written 00:14:22.800 --> 00:14:24.560 align:middle line:84% and then you're the only one cheating. 00:14:24.560 --> 00:14:27.570 align:middle line:84% So again, I think he's trying to get across the attitude 00:14:27.570 --> 00:14:30.029 align:middle line:84% but used the wrong word for it by describing it as cheating 00:14:30.029 --> 00:14:31.528 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You brought up the example 00:14:31.528 --> 00:14:34.570 align:middle line:84% of fighting games and picking a character that you're not 00:14:34.570 --> 00:14:36.518 align:middle line:90% very good at. 00:14:36.518 --> 00:14:38.860 align:middle line:84% That's not even a rule change, in my opinion. 00:14:38.860 --> 00:14:40.620 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: That's true. 00:14:40.620 --> 00:14:42.430 align:middle line:90% Well, yeah, I guess. 00:14:42.430 --> 00:14:45.370 align:middle line:84% I'm trying to think of the implicit-- maybe not 00:14:45.370 --> 00:14:47.740 align:middle line:84% a rule change, but it's more like a values change 00:14:47.740 --> 00:14:49.633 align:middle line:84% that you should be playing to win, right. 00:14:49.633 --> 00:14:51.560 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You can make a rule that, OK, normally everyone 00:14:51.560 --> 00:14:53.460 align:middle line:84% can choose whatever character they want, 00:14:53.460 --> 00:14:54.922 align:middle line:84% but yours is always better than us 00:14:54.922 --> 00:14:56.765 align:middle line:84% so that when you play in our play group, 00:14:56.765 --> 00:14:57.807 align:middle line:90% I choose your character. 00:14:57.807 --> 00:14:58.640 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Oh, yeah. 00:14:58.640 --> 00:15:01.284 align:middle line:84% You get to choose my character or something like that. 00:15:01.284 --> 00:15:02.950 align:middle line:84% You tell me who you want to play against 00:15:02.950 --> 00:15:05.640 align:middle line:84% and I'll try my best to play that game. 00:15:05.640 --> 00:15:08.129 align:middle line:84% Let's start in with Miguel and then over to Laura. 00:15:08.129 --> 00:15:08.628 align:middle line:90% Yeah? 00:15:08.628 --> 00:15:10.770 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So, one thing I wanted to bring up 00:15:10.770 --> 00:15:14.764 align:middle line:84% was so you think if one person isn't 00:15:14.764 --> 00:15:18.424 align:middle line:84% being challenged enough then they can start experimenting. 00:15:18.424 --> 00:15:22.328 align:middle line:84% But in my experience it more often happens 00:15:22.328 --> 00:15:25.744 align:middle line:84% when the entire group is not being challenged anymore. 00:15:25.744 --> 00:15:29.160 align:middle line:84% In the sense of, you two just played Catan three times 00:15:29.160 --> 00:15:31.112 align:middle line:90% over the last few days. 00:15:31.112 --> 00:15:34.040 align:middle line:84% And she was kind of tired of Catan. 00:15:34.040 --> 00:15:36.414 align:middle line:84% You're kind of ready to do something else, 00:15:36.414 --> 00:15:38.710 align:middle line:84% but you don't have a different board game [INAUDIBLE] 00:15:38.710 --> 00:15:40.164 align:middle line:90% or something. 00:15:40.164 --> 00:15:41.830 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: So then make a variant, sure. 00:15:41.830 --> 00:15:43.330 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: --different variants up. 00:15:43.330 --> 00:15:46.330 align:middle line:84% And it's like everyone is trying to increase the challenge, 00:15:46.330 --> 00:15:49.396 align:middle line:84% not because it's not challenging. 00:15:49.396 --> 00:15:52.628 align:middle line:84% There's still [INAUDIBLE] who is going win 00:15:52.628 --> 00:15:54.268 align:middle line:84% and you all sit down and start playing. 00:15:54.268 --> 00:15:57.220 align:middle line:84% But it's not challenging in the sense that it's not engaging 00:15:57.220 --> 00:15:58.100 align:middle line:90% and not interesting. 00:15:58.100 --> 00:16:00.350 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: I think the reason why it's easier to do it 00:16:00.350 --> 00:16:04.310 align:middle line:84% when there's a lot of people finding a game uninteresting 00:16:04.310 --> 00:16:06.170 align:middle line:84% is because it's easier to get a consensus 00:16:06.170 --> 00:16:09.770 align:middle line:84% to be able to enforce a change of the rules, right. 00:16:09.770 --> 00:16:13.536 align:middle line:90% It's a lot harder to say-- 00:16:13.536 --> 00:16:15.410 align:middle line:84% say I'm 12 and I'm playing with a whole bunch 00:16:15.410 --> 00:16:17.076 align:middle line:84% of other 12-year-olds, and there happens 00:16:17.076 --> 00:16:19.700 align:middle line:84% to be a 9-year-old in the group and we're playing 00:16:19.700 --> 00:16:21.440 align:middle line:90% soccer or something like that. 00:16:21.440 --> 00:16:24.200 align:middle line:84% It's harder for anyone to convince 00:16:24.200 --> 00:16:27.780 align:middle line:84% the rest of the 12-year-olds to take it easy on a 9-year-old. 00:16:27.780 --> 00:16:31.950 align:middle line:84% Like, all right, what if we give an extra player 00:16:31.950 --> 00:16:33.994 align:middle line:84% on the 9-year-old team or something like that. 00:16:33.994 --> 00:16:36.730 align:middle line:90% 00:16:36.730 --> 00:16:39.500 align:middle line:84% Not to say it can't be done and I 00:16:39.500 --> 00:16:41.540 align:middle line:84% think that's what Bernie DeKoven is saying, 00:16:41.540 --> 00:16:45.070 align:middle line:84% no you should be able to do that sort of thing. 00:16:45.070 --> 00:16:48.000 align:middle line:84% And it kind of makes the game more interesting for everybody, 00:16:48.000 --> 00:16:50.105 align:middle line:84% not just for the person who is having a hard time. 00:16:50.105 --> 00:16:51.730 align:middle line:84% It makes the game more interesting even 00:16:51.730 --> 00:16:54.740 align:middle line:84% for the people who have an advantage because now it 00:16:54.740 --> 00:16:56.780 align:middle line:90% makes it a big-- 00:16:56.780 --> 00:17:00.140 align:middle line:84% more of a fight, I guess, for them to be able to win. 00:17:00.140 --> 00:17:00.640 align:middle line:90% Laura? 00:17:00.640 --> 00:17:02.785 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Well, I think the other issue 00:17:02.785 --> 00:17:07.570 align:middle line:84% I have with the word cheating in describing changing the rules-- 00:17:07.570 --> 00:17:10.540 align:middle line:84% and less so against for individual players-- 00:17:10.540 --> 00:17:12.272 align:middle line:84% I know, for example, there are games 00:17:12.272 --> 00:17:14.692 align:middle line:84% that I've played since I was really little where it wasn't 00:17:14.692 --> 00:17:16.150 align:middle line:84% really intentional that we were not 00:17:16.150 --> 00:17:17.965 align:middle line:90% playing by the original rules. 00:17:17.965 --> 00:17:20.440 align:middle line:84% It's just that when I was seven and I 00:17:20.440 --> 00:17:24.400 align:middle line:84% learned how to play Monopoly or Clue or some really 00:17:24.400 --> 00:17:26.329 align:middle line:84% generic board game that I learned 00:17:26.329 --> 00:17:27.370 align:middle line:90% when I was really little. 00:17:27.370 --> 00:17:29.845 align:middle line:84% I did not sit through all the rules 00:17:29.845 --> 00:17:34.295 align:middle line:84% or I thought I knew the rules and didn't really remember 00:17:34.295 --> 00:17:34.795 align:middle line:90% them. 00:17:34.795 --> 00:17:37.270 align:middle line:84% And so you had a change in the rules unintentionally. 00:17:37.270 --> 00:17:39.447 align:middle line:84% And I think that's a very different category. 00:17:39.447 --> 00:17:40.655 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Yeah, house rules. 00:17:40.655 --> 00:17:43.470 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Your house rules become so much different. 00:17:43.470 --> 00:17:45.470 align:middle line:84% Even if you play with other people 00:17:45.470 --> 00:17:48.470 align:middle line:84% and you're kind of all playing by your own house rules, 00:17:48.470 --> 00:17:49.929 align:middle line:90% it doesn't really feel like-- 00:17:49.929 --> 00:17:51.470 align:middle line:84% I wouldn't always call that cheating. 00:17:51.470 --> 00:17:52.970 align:middle line:84% It's not because you're not trying 00:17:52.970 --> 00:17:54.534 align:middle line:84% to play by the correct-- what you 00:17:54.534 --> 00:17:55.700 align:middle line:90% think are the correct rules. 00:17:55.700 --> 00:17:57.300 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: And more importantly, everybody in the room's 00:17:57.300 --> 00:17:58.702 align:middle line:90% agreed to that set of-- 00:17:58.702 --> 00:17:59.910 align:middle line:90% this new set of rules, right. 00:17:59.910 --> 00:18:02.670 align:middle line:84% So cheating is again not a great word 00:18:02.670 --> 00:18:04.390 align:middle line:90% to be able to describe that. 00:18:04.390 --> 00:18:07.890 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I feel like when you're modifying rules 00:18:07.890 --> 00:18:10.265 align:middle line:84% there's a few different ways to do it. 00:18:10.265 --> 00:18:12.740 align:middle line:84% Sometimes you just add a little to a game. 00:18:12.740 --> 00:18:17.820 align:middle line:84% You're just like, it's not interesting enough, 00:18:17.820 --> 00:18:21.312 align:middle line:84% make up some initial variants to make it sort more [INAUDIBLE]. 00:18:21.312 --> 00:18:31.728 align:middle line:84% And other times if you're doing it it's [INAUDIBLE] Catan with 00:18:31.728 --> 00:18:39.664 align:middle line:84% friends there, we [INAUDIBLE] because it's really overpowered 00:18:39.664 --> 00:18:41.152 align:middle line:90% if you just-- 00:18:41.152 --> 00:18:44.128 align:middle line:84% it's really overpowered strategy [INAUDIBLE]. 00:18:44.128 --> 00:18:47.600 align:middle line:90% 00:18:47.600 --> 00:18:56.528 align:middle line:84% Some groups a lot more [INAUDIBLE] 00:18:56.528 --> 00:19:03.472 align:middle line:84% overpowered strategy [INAUDIBLE] after playing twice we've 00:19:03.472 --> 00:19:07.700 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] one beater in there [INAUDIBLE] because he's 00:19:07.700 --> 00:19:09.176 align:middle line:90% ridiculously over powered. 00:19:09.176 --> 00:19:17.786 align:middle line:84% And so [INAUDIBLE] different levels of [INAUDIBLE] They 00:19:17.786 --> 00:19:20.978 align:middle line:84% see things and there's experimenting [INAUDIBLE] 00:19:20.978 --> 00:19:22.936 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: I think in the end, Bernie DeKoven's 00:19:22.936 --> 00:19:27.390 align:middle line:84% kind of coming from, you should be free to challenge authority. 00:19:27.390 --> 00:19:29.010 align:middle line:84% That's kind of like the implicit thing 00:19:29.010 --> 00:19:31.198 align:middle line:84% that you get from the whole catalog as well. 00:19:31.198 --> 00:19:32.906 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Going back to what Nathan said, 00:19:32.906 --> 00:19:36.025 align:middle line:90% people are sometimes too keen. 00:19:36.025 --> 00:19:38.316 align:middle line:84% For example, something might seem initially overpowered 00:19:38.316 --> 00:19:40.440 align:middle line:84% but then you play it, you might be 00:19:40.440 --> 00:19:42.320 align:middle line:84% after the first game, everybody's just 00:19:42.320 --> 00:19:44.340 align:middle line:84% like, oh yeah, it's broken, might as well just change it, 00:19:44.340 --> 00:19:44.460 align:middle line:90% right. 00:19:44.460 --> 00:19:47.085 align:middle line:84% Whereas, if you'd played another game, you might have realized, 00:19:47.085 --> 00:19:49.530 align:middle line:84% oh wait, you can actually counter this by just doing X. 00:19:49.530 --> 00:19:51.904 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: So actually a really interesting counterpoint, 00:19:51.904 --> 00:19:54.730 align:middle line:84% which is not part of our reading is Dave Sirlin who 00:19:54.730 --> 00:19:57.500 align:middle line:84% is a MIT alum, actually, who wrote 00:19:57.500 --> 00:19:59.100 align:middle line:90% a book called Playing to Win. 00:19:59.100 --> 00:20:01.710 align:middle line:84% This is not part of our class reading 00:20:01.710 --> 00:20:04.720 align:middle line:84% but he will definitely back that up, right. 00:20:04.720 --> 00:20:07.170 align:middle line:84% His is like, no it's everyone's responsibility 00:20:07.170 --> 00:20:11.005 align:middle line:84% to play as hard as they can because you have an-- 00:20:11.005 --> 00:20:12.630 align:middle line:84% especially for certain kinds of games-- 00:20:12.630 --> 00:20:14.004 align:middle line:84% you haven't discovered everything 00:20:14.004 --> 00:20:16.980 align:middle line:84% that your game systems capable of. 00:20:16.980 --> 00:20:19.200 align:middle line:84% And if somebody can beat you playing that same game 00:20:19.200 --> 00:20:21.150 align:middle line:84% with the same set of rules, then clearly it's 00:20:21.150 --> 00:20:26.160 align:middle line:84% possible to beat that player or at least get up to the point 00:20:26.160 --> 00:20:29.190 align:middle line:90% where they are equally skilled. 00:20:29.190 --> 00:20:31.940 align:middle line:84% So now there's a whole bunch of game design philosophy 00:20:31.940 --> 00:20:34.400 align:middle line:90% to come out of that as well. 00:20:34.400 --> 00:20:35.610 align:middle line:90% And I believe we played-- 00:20:35.610 --> 00:20:37.710 align:middle line:84% did we play Yomi in this class before? 00:20:37.710 --> 00:20:38.610 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: We used to. 00:20:38.610 --> 00:20:39.526 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: We used to? 00:20:39.526 --> 00:20:40.110 align:middle line:90% Yeah, OK. 00:20:40.110 --> 00:20:43.999 align:middle line:84% There's actually an iPad version of it now. 00:20:43.999 --> 00:20:45.540 align:middle line:84% It's definitely not an iPhone version 00:20:45.540 --> 00:20:50.476 align:middle line:84% because it's way too much text to fit on an iPhone screen. 00:20:50.476 --> 00:20:53.160 align:middle line:90% But Yomi is a game that-- 00:20:53.160 --> 00:20:56.340 align:middle line:84% it's a card game version of basically a Street Fighter 00:20:56.340 --> 00:20:58.050 align:middle line:90% type fighting game. 00:20:58.050 --> 00:21:02.054 align:middle line:84% And it's all about anticipating what the other player is going 00:21:02.054 --> 00:21:03.720 align:middle line:84% to do and if you manage to get it right, 00:21:03.720 --> 00:21:05.553 align:middle line:84% you can build up your combos and everything. 00:21:05.553 --> 00:21:10.680 align:middle line:84% But the whole idea of everything that Davie Sirlin's worked on, 00:21:10.680 --> 00:21:15.530 align:middle line:84% I believe he did a remix version of a Street Fighter, which was 00:21:15.530 --> 00:21:16.640 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE]. 00:21:16.640 --> 00:21:20.310 align:middle line:90% Yeah, the HD remix versions. 00:21:20.310 --> 00:21:23.520 align:middle line:84% The whole idea of everything that he 00:21:23.520 --> 00:21:25.620 align:middle line:84% wrote about it and everything that he makes 00:21:25.620 --> 00:21:28.500 align:middle line:84% is that these kinds of competitive games 00:21:28.500 --> 00:21:30.690 align:middle line:84% really should be more about, how do you challenge 00:21:30.690 --> 00:21:32.380 align:middle line:90% yourself to improve better? 00:21:32.380 --> 00:21:35.850 align:middle line:84% And it's a lot less about the community around you. 00:21:35.850 --> 00:21:39.960 align:middle line:84% It's a lot more about you and the game system. 00:21:39.960 --> 00:21:42.180 align:middle line:84% So you are submitting yourself willingly 00:21:42.180 --> 00:21:46.590 align:middle line:84% to the authority of the game system, which of course, game 00:21:46.590 --> 00:21:48.630 align:middle line:90% designers create. 00:21:48.630 --> 00:21:53.340 align:middle line:84% And then if there's anything that you should be challenging, 00:21:53.340 --> 00:21:54.990 align:middle line:84% you should be challenging your ability 00:21:54.990 --> 00:21:56.941 align:middle line:84% to be able to rise to the occasion, right. 00:21:56.941 --> 00:21:59.190 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Everyone should be doing [INAUDIBLE], right. 00:21:59.190 --> 00:22:01.468 align:middle line:84% If that person's arguing that, they're not 00:22:01.468 --> 00:22:02.676 align:middle line:90% giving you a good experience. 00:22:02.676 --> 00:22:03.513 align:middle line:90% They're letting you down. 00:22:03.513 --> 00:22:04.221 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Right. 00:22:04.221 --> 00:22:06.630 align:middle line:84% They're not fighting as hard as they can. 00:22:06.630 --> 00:22:08.790 align:middle line:84% And even Bernie describes this, right. 00:22:08.790 --> 00:22:15.060 align:middle line:84% The whole idea is what happens if you give somebody 00:22:15.060 --> 00:22:16.410 align:middle line:90% a chance to-- 00:22:16.410 --> 00:22:18.900 align:middle line:84% it's like, I could have played this game optimally 00:22:18.900 --> 00:22:22.310 align:middle line:84% because I know this game so well and have beaten you 00:22:22.310 --> 00:22:23.340 align:middle line:90% into the ground. 00:22:23.340 --> 00:22:25.530 align:middle line:90% But I'm just going to-- 00:22:25.530 --> 00:22:27.690 align:middle line:84% instead of handicapping myself, which 00:22:27.690 --> 00:22:30.000 align:middle line:84% is a sort of public declaration that this 00:22:30.000 --> 00:22:31.740 align:middle line:84% is how I'm going to be doing it, I'm just 00:22:31.740 --> 00:22:33.590 align:middle line:90% not going to play optimally. 00:22:33.590 --> 00:22:37.300 align:middle line:84% Then I think both Dave Sirlin and Bernie DeKoven are actually 00:22:37.300 --> 00:22:37.890 align:middle line:90% in agreement. 00:22:37.890 --> 00:22:39.280 align:middle line:90% This is not a good way to play. 00:22:39.280 --> 00:22:42.090 align:middle line:90% 00:22:42.090 --> 00:22:45.210 align:middle line:84% Because the person who is getting the benefit of that 00:22:45.210 --> 00:22:49.380 align:middle line:84% feels cheated of experience as well. 00:22:49.380 --> 00:22:52.412 align:middle line:90% Did I see? 00:22:52.412 --> 00:22:54.703 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think I need to clarify that oftentimes you 00:22:54.703 --> 00:22:58.434 align:middle line:90% can use [INAUDIBLE]. 00:22:58.434 --> 00:23:01.416 align:middle line:84% So in a game with really defined strategies, 00:23:01.416 --> 00:23:05.964 align:middle line:84% you could sort of be going for some strategy 00:23:05.964 --> 00:23:08.910 align:middle line:84% that you believe to be sort of optimal because you wanted 00:23:08.910 --> 00:23:11.350 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] other players that you were like-- 00:23:11.350 --> 00:23:14.580 align:middle line:84% and it could be, be and you sort of 00:23:14.580 --> 00:23:16.963 align:middle line:84% are [INAUDIBLE] along the lines of, oh you 00:23:16.963 --> 00:23:19.380 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] possibilities of the game in there. 00:23:19.380 --> 00:23:22.580 align:middle line:84% So you can just try hard and you can do that. 00:23:22.580 --> 00:23:25.320 align:middle line:84% I think you're actually working toward that purpose 00:23:25.320 --> 00:23:26.570 align:middle line:90% if you do something like-- 00:23:26.570 --> 00:23:28.820 align:middle line:84% you're not going to try a strategy that's totally bad, 00:23:28.820 --> 00:23:30.650 align:middle line:90% but who knows. 00:23:30.650 --> 00:23:33.840 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: You know, I do that a lot and I always 00:23:33.840 --> 00:23:36.090 align:middle line:84% feel compelled to publicly declare 00:23:36.090 --> 00:23:38.160 align:middle line:90% that this is what I'm doing. 00:23:38.160 --> 00:23:40.230 align:middle line:84% I think because I don't want anyone 00:23:40.230 --> 00:23:42.480 align:middle line:90% to think that I'm stupid. 00:23:42.480 --> 00:23:46.652 align:middle line:84% I really do something bad [INAUDIBLE] 00:23:46.652 --> 00:23:49.820 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: A lot of times when I play a board game, 00:23:49.820 --> 00:23:52.590 align:middle line:84% I play with people were really, really good at understanding 00:23:52.590 --> 00:23:55.560 align:middle line:90% and making board games, too. 00:23:55.560 --> 00:23:58.980 align:middle line:84% If I think that something might be an interesting way 00:23:58.980 --> 00:24:00.730 align:middle line:84% to play that game, I'll say it out 00:24:00.730 --> 00:24:03.600 align:middle line:84% and then it become more of a cooperative, 00:24:03.600 --> 00:24:04.767 align:middle line:90% how could this strategy be-- 00:24:04.767 --> 00:24:06.058 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Let's play this out. 00:24:06.058 --> 00:24:07.660 align:middle line:90% Let's see what happens, right. 00:24:07.660 --> 00:24:09.120 align:middle line:84% A learning experience for everyone. 00:24:09.120 --> 00:24:11.075 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Well, what would you have done from my shoes? 00:24:11.075 --> 00:24:12.264 align:middle line:84% It's like at this point we're not even playing to win, 00:24:12.264 --> 00:24:13.763 align:middle line:84% we're playing to develop a strategy. 00:24:13.763 --> 00:24:14.780 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Yeah. 00:24:14.780 --> 00:24:18.330 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Yeah, I was thinking [INAUDIBLE] 00:24:18.330 --> 00:24:21.042 align:middle line:84% you're not necessarily playing to maximize your fun right now. 00:24:21.042 --> 00:24:24.970 align:middle line:84% You're playing to explore [INAUDIBLE] the game has. 00:24:24.970 --> 00:24:29.326 align:middle line:84% And maybe find a bigger strategical future later on, 00:24:29.326 --> 00:24:31.900 align:middle line:90% I guess. 00:24:31.900 --> 00:24:34.930 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: And I think that's in keeping with what Bernie 00:24:34.930 --> 00:24:38.520 align:middle line:90% has tried to write about. 00:24:38.520 --> 00:24:41.040 align:middle line:84% He ends up the chapter by talking about how 00:24:41.040 --> 00:24:42.030 align:middle line:90% you are scoring, right. 00:24:42.030 --> 00:24:46.660 align:middle line:84% How you're deciding what a win is. 00:24:46.660 --> 00:24:48.810 align:middle line:84% And in this particular case, it's a situation 00:24:48.810 --> 00:24:51.130 align:middle line:84% that we're describing, a win is learning 00:24:51.130 --> 00:24:54.790 align:middle line:84% how a new, untested strategy is going to play out. 00:24:54.790 --> 00:24:59.610 align:middle line:84% It becomes less about who is the individual who's actually 00:24:59.610 --> 00:25:02.670 align:middle line:84% winning and more about, are we getting something new 00:25:02.670 --> 00:25:04.650 align:middle line:84% from our understanding of this game? 00:25:04.650 --> 00:25:09.960 align:middle line:84% Which can be really entertaining. 00:25:09.960 --> 00:25:13.410 align:middle line:84% Whereas I think Dave Sirlin, not quite so willing to let that 00:25:13.410 --> 00:25:15.157 align:middle line:90% go. 00:25:15.157 --> 00:25:17.240 align:middle line:84% He's a little bit more adamant that, no you should 00:25:17.240 --> 00:25:20.280 align:middle line:84% be winning based on the definition of the rule set, 00:25:20.280 --> 00:25:23.220 align:middle line:84% not based on something like extra community 00:25:23.220 --> 00:25:24.169 align:middle line:90% arrived position. 00:25:24.169 --> 00:25:25.710 align:middle line:84% And Bernie DeKoven is trying to fight 00:25:25.710 --> 00:25:29.100 align:middle line:84% for, no community determines when the conditions are fine. 00:25:29.100 --> 00:25:32.612 align:middle line:84% In fact, there are many good reasons for you to go for that. 00:25:32.612 --> 00:25:34.929 align:middle line:90% 00:25:34.929 --> 00:25:35.970 align:middle line:90% Different points of view. 00:25:35.970 --> 00:25:39.233 align:middle line:84% I'm not saying that anyone is [INAUDIBLE] about that. 00:25:39.233 --> 00:25:40.774 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I mean, I think if you want 00:25:40.774 --> 00:25:44.034 align:middle line:84% to maximize-- like in the long term-- your chances of winning 00:25:44.034 --> 00:25:45.230 align:middle line:90% has to be [INAUDIBLE]. 00:25:45.230 --> 00:25:46.480 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Oh yes, absolutely. 00:25:46.480 --> 00:25:48.500 align:middle line:90% Yeah, I will agree. 00:25:48.500 --> 00:25:51.590 align:middle line:84% If you're a professional player who is in a team, 00:25:51.590 --> 00:25:53.340 align:middle line:84% you are probably going to be working 00:25:53.340 --> 00:25:54.940 align:middle line:84% with your teammates a lot of times-- 00:25:54.940 --> 00:25:57.230 align:middle line:84% not to determine who is better at the game, 00:25:57.230 --> 00:25:59.889 align:middle line:84% but to try to make everybody else play better, right? 00:25:59.889 --> 00:26:01.680 align:middle line:84% And there's just two different perspectives 00:26:01.680 --> 00:26:03.320 align:middle line:90% on how you arrive at that. 00:26:03.320 --> 00:26:06.780 align:middle line:84% One is to always play as hard as you 00:26:06.780 --> 00:26:10.590 align:middle line:84% can so that everyone has to sort of rise to the occasion. 00:26:10.590 --> 00:26:12.070 align:middle line:90% And the other way is just-- 00:26:12.070 --> 00:26:13.920 align:middle line:84% no, it's OK to do things like experiment. 00:26:13.920 --> 00:26:16.200 align:middle line:84% It's OK to do things like handicaps. 00:26:16.200 --> 00:26:17.610 align:middle line:90% It's OK to do things like-- 00:26:17.610 --> 00:26:19.100 align:middle line:90% I'm just going to play-- 00:26:19.100 --> 00:26:21.890 align:middle line:84% I was just playing a game recently 00:26:21.890 --> 00:26:24.090 align:middle line:84% where like I'm going to do a sub-optimal strategy 00:26:24.090 --> 00:26:26.160 align:middle line:84% on purpose, just to see whether my opponent's 00:26:26.160 --> 00:26:27.930 align:middle line:90% capable of fighting it off. 00:26:27.930 --> 00:26:29.830 align:middle line:90% Because it's just ridiculous. 00:26:29.830 --> 00:26:32.877 align:middle line:84% So yeah-- I had fun even though I didn't win. 00:26:32.877 --> 00:26:35.580 align:middle line:90% 00:26:35.580 --> 00:26:39.760 align:middle line:84% So today I was thinking of going through three games. 00:26:39.760 --> 00:26:40.857 align:middle line:90% But what time is it now? 00:26:40.857 --> 00:26:41.440 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: 3:00 00:26:41.440 --> 00:26:42.050 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: It's almost 3:00? 00:26:42.050 --> 00:26:43.841 align:middle line:84% OK, so I think we're going to do two games. 00:26:43.841 --> 00:26:47.215 align:middle line:84% I'm going to very quickly have a discussion about what 00:26:47.215 --> 00:26:48.840 align:middle line:84% are all the different versions of Mafia 00:26:48.840 --> 00:26:49.990 align:middle line:90% that people have played. 00:26:49.990 --> 00:26:52.406 align:middle line:84% How many of you have played a version of Mafia or Werewolf 00:26:52.406 --> 00:26:53.780 align:middle line:90% or something like that? 00:26:53.780 --> 00:26:54.280 align:middle line:90% No? 00:26:54.280 --> 00:26:54.910 align:middle line:90% Everybody? 00:26:54.910 --> 00:26:55.430 align:middle line:90% OK. 00:26:55.430 --> 00:27:00.360 align:middle line:84% All right, let me quickly give a description. 00:27:00.360 --> 00:27:04.080 align:middle line:84% The general framework of these games everybody gets a card, 00:27:04.080 --> 00:27:06.000 align:middle line:90% and the card gives you a role. 00:27:06.000 --> 00:27:08.970 align:middle line:84% These are usually just regular playing cards where-- 00:27:08.970 --> 00:27:12.180 align:middle line:84% one version that I have played is 00:27:12.180 --> 00:27:16.110 align:middle line:84% that if you have a king or queen or a jack of clubs, 00:27:16.110 --> 00:27:17.300 align:middle line:90% you are mafia. 00:27:17.300 --> 00:27:18.870 align:middle line:84% And it's your job to kill everybody 00:27:18.870 --> 00:27:21.940 align:middle line:84% else who didn't receive a king, queen, or jack of clubs. 00:27:21.940 --> 00:27:24.610 align:middle line:90% 00:27:24.610 --> 00:27:27.450 align:middle line:84% And then everybody else is a villager 00:27:27.450 --> 00:27:31.350 align:middle line:84% whose job is to figure out who are the mafia players. 00:27:31.350 --> 00:27:37.410 align:middle line:84% So everyone closes their eyes and open their eyes 00:27:37.410 --> 00:27:40.260 align:middle line:84% based on the cues of a person who is like a moderator. 00:27:40.260 --> 00:27:44.400 align:middle line:84% If I ran the game here in class, I would be the moderator. 00:27:44.400 --> 00:27:48.490 align:middle line:84% And I'd say like, nighttime, everyone closes their eyes. 00:27:48.490 --> 00:27:50.100 align:middle line:90% Mafia awakes. 00:27:50.100 --> 00:27:53.509 align:middle line:84% And then the mafia do not say anything, 00:27:53.509 --> 00:27:56.050 align:middle line:84% but they can communicate with things like gestures and moving 00:27:56.050 --> 00:27:56.940 align:middle line:90% their head. 00:27:56.940 --> 00:28:00.600 align:middle line:84% And they're basically sort of using body language to vote 00:28:00.600 --> 00:28:03.310 align:middle line:90% on who dies that night-- 00:28:03.310 --> 00:28:05.720 align:middle line:84% usually by nodding, or by pointing, 00:28:05.720 --> 00:28:07.270 align:middle line:90% or something like that. 00:28:07.270 --> 00:28:09.160 align:middle line:84% And then everyone closes their eyes. 00:28:09.160 --> 00:28:11.690 align:middle line:90% The moderator declares who dies. 00:28:11.690 --> 00:28:15.090 align:middle line:84% Everyone opens their eyes again, and that person 00:28:15.090 --> 00:28:17.270 align:middle line:90% reveals their card. 00:28:17.270 --> 00:28:21.990 align:middle line:84% And that shows whether they were mafia or not. 00:28:21.990 --> 00:28:25.590 align:middle line:84% And the whole idea is that in between rounds 00:28:25.590 --> 00:28:27.390 align:middle line:90% everyone speaks freely. 00:28:27.390 --> 00:28:29.710 align:middle line:84% And so there are accusations that are flying around, 00:28:29.710 --> 00:28:34.080 align:middle line:84% and suspicions, and exchanging of very, very 00:28:34.080 --> 00:28:36.090 align:middle line:84% tangential evidence-- like, I thought 00:28:36.090 --> 00:28:38.130 align:middle line:90% I heard rustling over there. 00:28:38.130 --> 00:28:40.254 align:middle line:90% You know, and it's like-- 00:28:40.254 --> 00:28:42.420 align:middle line:84% you know, that could be the mafia person just trying 00:28:42.420 --> 00:28:43.544 align:middle line:90% to throw you off the track. 00:28:43.544 --> 00:28:46.030 align:middle line:84% That could be somebody who is actually the villager. 00:28:46.030 --> 00:28:49.740 align:middle line:84% Only the mafia know for sure who is who. 00:28:49.740 --> 00:28:51.670 align:middle line:84% And then there are other hidden roles. 00:28:51.670 --> 00:28:54.300 align:middle line:84% So what are some other variants that you've played? 00:28:54.300 --> 00:28:55.262 align:middle line:90% Yeah? 00:28:55.262 --> 00:28:56.705 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] 00:28:56.705 --> 00:28:59.102 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So I've played where the card doesn't 00:28:59.102 --> 00:29:00.585 align:middle line:90% get revealed when you die. 00:29:00.585 --> 00:29:01.746 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Oh, yeah? 00:29:01.746 --> 00:29:03.937 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: And one particular other thing 00:29:03.937 --> 00:29:07.700 align:middle line:84% that-- like all sorts of different roles, as well. 00:29:07.700 --> 00:29:12.960 align:middle line:84% And the voting mechanic for who gets killed-- 00:29:12.960 --> 00:29:18.514 align:middle line:84% so I've seen it played where people decide 00:29:18.514 --> 00:29:20.630 align:middle line:90% when the discussion is over. 00:29:20.630 --> 00:29:21.810 align:middle line:90% And then they little vote. 00:29:21.810 --> 00:29:24.018 align:middle line:84% And then the person who has the majority gets killed. 00:29:24.018 --> 00:29:25.425 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: They vote by printing? 00:29:25.425 --> 00:29:26.050 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah. 00:29:26.050 --> 00:29:26.954 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Yeah. 00:29:26.954 --> 00:29:28.620 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: But the way that I always play 00:29:28.620 --> 00:29:32.150 align:middle line:84% is that all it takes for someone on the block 00:29:32.150 --> 00:29:33.625 align:middle line:84% is to have someone say, I'm putting 00:29:33.625 --> 00:29:35.500 align:middle line:84% that person on the block, and another persons 00:29:35.500 --> 00:29:37.420 align:middle line:90% says "seconded". 00:29:37.420 --> 00:29:40.025 align:middle line:84% And at that point, until a vote happens, 00:29:40.025 --> 00:29:41.650 align:middle line:84% you can't put anyone else on the block. 00:29:41.650 --> 00:29:42.774 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Oh, interesting. 00:29:42.774 --> 00:29:45.654 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So either everyone will vote and will say, OK, 00:29:45.654 --> 00:29:47.320 align:middle line:84% this person-- and a majority will result 00:29:47.320 --> 00:29:52.510 align:middle line:84% in a kill, at which point it's night instantly-- 00:29:52.510 --> 00:29:54.810 align:middle line:90% and that's that day. 00:29:54.810 --> 00:29:58.654 align:middle line:84% Or they fail to kill that person, 00:29:58.654 --> 00:30:01.150 align:middle line:84% and then people can feel free to like put up more people-- 00:30:01.150 --> 00:30:04.040 align:middle line:84% like to just point out another person which they like-- 00:30:04.040 --> 00:30:05.237 align:middle line:90% no, I'm like [INAUDIBLE]. 00:30:05.237 --> 00:30:06.570 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: You had your hand up. 00:30:06.570 --> 00:30:08.140 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: The two most basic roles, 00:30:08.140 --> 00:30:11.554 align:middle line:84% in addition to like mafia and villager-- that I've 00:30:11.554 --> 00:30:14.220 align:middle line:84% seen in pretty much every game-- is the medic and the detective. 00:30:14.220 --> 00:30:16.880 align:middle line:84% The medic, every night, gets to point at someone, 00:30:16.880 --> 00:30:19.450 align:middle line:84% and if the mafia were trying to hit that person, 00:30:19.450 --> 00:30:22.695 align:middle line:90% that person stays alive. 00:30:22.695 --> 00:30:26.020 align:middle line:84% The detective, every night, gets to basically point at someone 00:30:26.020 --> 00:30:27.354 align:middle line:90% while everyone else is sleeping. 00:30:27.354 --> 00:30:29.853 align:middle line:84% And the moderator will either nod his head saying, yes, he's 00:30:29.853 --> 00:30:30.910 align:middle line:90% mafia or no he's not. 00:30:30.910 --> 00:30:34.896 align:middle line:90% 00:30:34.896 --> 00:30:37.342 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So I have sort of a variant of Mafia 00:30:37.342 --> 00:30:46.514 align:middle line:84% that's at MIT, mostly [INAUDIBLE] called Live Action 00:30:46.514 --> 00:30:47.810 align:middle line:90% Mafia. 00:30:47.810 --> 00:30:50.510 align:middle line:84% And the way this works is one day 00:30:50.510 --> 00:30:52.200 align:middle line:84% is one day-- so like often there's 00:30:52.200 --> 00:30:54.790 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] where like mafia lasts one [INAUDIBLE]. 00:30:54.790 --> 00:30:58.850 align:middle line:84% But in this version, the mafia can kill someone once per day 00:30:58.850 --> 00:31:01.690 align:middle line:84% by tapping them on the shoulder and saying bang. 00:31:01.690 --> 00:31:03.970 align:middle line:84% And essentially, because you obviously-- 00:31:03.970 --> 00:31:05.680 align:middle line:84% like in this game, you couldn't do this. 00:31:05.680 --> 00:31:07.130 align:middle line:84% If you're mafia, you couldn't kill someone 00:31:07.130 --> 00:31:08.524 align:middle line:90% in front of other Mafia players. 00:31:08.524 --> 00:31:10.076 align:middle line:84% Because then they will see you kill that person, 00:31:10.076 --> 00:31:12.201 align:middle line:84% and will tell everyone that you killed that person. 00:31:12.201 --> 00:31:14.500 align:middle line:84% And then you'll be lynched for it. 00:31:14.500 --> 00:31:17.700 align:middle line:90% It's an [INAUDIBLE] game of-- 00:31:17.700 --> 00:31:21.160 align:middle line:84% often times you try to figure it as like-- 00:31:21.160 --> 00:31:23.474 align:middle line:84% people like [INAUDIBLE] so they get 00:31:23.474 --> 00:31:25.140 align:middle line:84% friends to lie for them about where they 00:31:25.140 --> 00:31:27.160 align:middle line:90% were in that location there. 00:31:27.160 --> 00:31:30.100 align:middle line:84% In one of the games recently there, 00:31:30.100 --> 00:31:32.780 align:middle line:84% someone said, oh, I was working on my lab 00:31:32.780 --> 00:31:35.010 align:middle line:90% until like 4:30 or something. 00:31:35.010 --> 00:31:36.926 align:middle line:84% And then someone found out who the partner was 00:31:36.926 --> 00:31:38.301 align:middle line:84% in that lab, emailed the partner, 00:31:38.301 --> 00:31:41.190 align:middle line:84% and the partner said they got out at 4:00. 00:31:41.190 --> 00:31:42.970 align:middle line:90% And this kill was at 4:15. 00:31:42.970 --> 00:31:45.810 align:middle line:90% That person was lynched. 00:31:45.810 --> 00:31:51.070 align:middle line:84% And so there are a number of special rules and powers, 00:31:51.070 --> 00:31:52.970 align:middle line:84% but like [INAUDIBLE] the game, where 00:31:52.970 --> 00:31:55.410 align:middle line:84% the focus is on actually like figuring where 00:31:55.410 --> 00:31:57.198 align:middle line:90% people were like [INAUDIBLE]. 00:31:57.198 --> 00:32:01.082 align:middle line:90% 00:32:01.082 --> 00:32:02.540 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: One thing that I think-- 00:32:02.540 --> 00:32:05.800 align:middle line:84% one reason why that works well on the MIT campus 00:32:05.800 --> 00:32:08.960 align:middle line:84% is because it's a fairly small campus compared 00:32:08.960 --> 00:32:11.780 align:middle line:84% to other university campuses, even in Massachusetts. 00:32:11.780 --> 00:32:13.887 align:middle line:84% And even when you're off campus, you 00:32:13.887 --> 00:32:18.230 align:middle line:84% are often in close proximity to a lot of other MIT people. 00:32:18.230 --> 00:32:21.100 align:middle line:84% Do people know who else is playing in this game-- 00:32:21.100 --> 00:32:24.610 align:middle line:90% in a round of Live Action Mafia? 00:32:24.610 --> 00:32:26.426 align:middle line:90% Do you know who [INAUDIBLE]? 00:32:26.426 --> 00:32:28.050 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Occasionally there are some-- 00:32:28.050 --> 00:32:31.770 align:middle line:90% there are like [INAUDIBLE]. 00:32:31.770 --> 00:32:32.824 align:middle line:90% Like most of it's random. 00:32:32.824 --> 00:32:34.210 align:middle line:90% There's people in campus. 00:32:34.210 --> 00:32:36.922 align:middle line:84% There's always people playing at-- there's 00:32:36.922 --> 00:32:38.997 align:middle line:84% a fraternity across the river in Brookline. 00:32:38.997 --> 00:32:40.190 align:middle line:90% They're [INAUDIBLE]. 00:32:40.190 --> 00:32:42.687 align:middle line:84% And so it's when a kill happens there, 00:32:42.687 --> 00:32:44.770 align:middle line:84% and so immediately everyone's trying to figure out 00:32:44.770 --> 00:32:47.700 align:middle line:90% who was on the MIT campus. 00:32:47.700 --> 00:32:49.670 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] people are trying figure out 00:32:49.670 --> 00:32:52.484 align:middle line:84% who couldn't have gotten back there in time. 00:32:52.484 --> 00:32:53.192 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Right. 00:32:53.192 --> 00:32:56.640 align:middle line:84% That's nice because it helps you do the detective work. 00:32:56.640 --> 00:32:58.350 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I used to play, but I'm not 00:32:58.350 --> 00:33:00.620 align:middle line:84% friends with like a lot of people who are in the game. 00:33:00.620 --> 00:33:02.120 align:middle line:84% I just had a couple of friends going 00:33:02.120 --> 00:33:03.400 align:middle line:90% who always invited me to play. 00:33:03.400 --> 00:33:05.401 align:middle line:84% And so I usually get lynched pretty quickly, 00:33:05.401 --> 00:33:07.900 align:middle line:84% because because they'd just be like, we don't know this kid. 00:33:07.900 --> 00:33:10.592 align:middle line:90% So long. 00:33:10.592 --> 00:33:13.030 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: My biggest problem with Mafia is like even just 00:33:13.030 --> 00:33:17.740 align:middle line:84% the like the table [INAUDIBLE] like there's like no-- 00:33:17.740 --> 00:33:19.740 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE] Mafia, if you don't know-- 00:33:19.740 --> 00:33:20.540 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah. 00:33:20.540 --> 00:33:22.339 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: And so like what will end up 00:33:22.339 --> 00:33:24.380 align:middle line:84% happening based on the first round it like, John, 00:33:24.380 --> 00:33:25.450 align:middle line:90% you look suspicious. 00:33:25.450 --> 00:33:26.820 align:middle line:90% I think John's mafia. 00:33:26.820 --> 00:33:27.970 align:middle line:90% Everyone vote yes. 00:33:27.970 --> 00:33:30.104 align:middle line:84% And then everyone votes yes, and he dies. 00:33:30.104 --> 00:33:32.970 align:middle line:84% And he's sitting there like, I'm sorry, what? 00:33:32.970 --> 00:33:33.691 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Yeah. 00:33:33.691 --> 00:33:34.190 align:middle line:90% That's-- 00:33:34.190 --> 00:33:38.410 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: That's kind of how the game [INAUDIBLE] 00:33:38.410 --> 00:33:39.565 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Sorry? 00:33:39.565 --> 00:33:40.440 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: I had more. 00:33:40.440 --> 00:33:42.800 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Oh, sorry. 00:33:42.800 --> 00:33:44.884 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I was going to say that a couple 00:33:44.884 --> 00:33:46.550 align:middle line:84% of interesting variants I've played with 00:33:46.550 --> 00:33:50.410 align:middle line:84% are like where you have things like the fool, where his job is 00:33:50.410 --> 00:33:55.720 align:middle line:84% to try and get killed as Mafia, or an innocent, where 00:33:55.720 --> 00:33:57.970 align:middle line:84% if the town accidentally kills them, 00:33:57.970 --> 00:33:59.770 align:middle line:84% then they just like automatically lose, 00:33:59.770 --> 00:34:01.572 align:middle line:90% and things like that. 00:34:01.572 --> 00:34:03.530 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think the most confusing variant is 00:34:03.530 --> 00:34:08.510 align:middle line:84% the [INAUDIBLE] where they have the mafia, the medic, 00:34:08.510 --> 00:34:10.867 align:middle line:84% the detective-- then they also have, I think, 00:34:10.867 --> 00:34:13.200 align:middle line:84% the serial killer, who is supposed to be the last person 00:34:13.200 --> 00:34:17.104 align:middle line:84% standing, and then the arsonist-- 00:34:17.104 --> 00:34:19.670 align:middle line:90% I can't remember his goal. 00:34:19.670 --> 00:34:24.528 align:middle line:84% Then there was a transporter who could switch targets. 00:34:24.528 --> 00:34:26.494 align:middle line:84% You know, like if the mafia picks one person, 00:34:26.494 --> 00:34:28.927 align:middle line:84% and the transporter hasn't been picked, 00:34:28.927 --> 00:34:31.800 align:middle line:84% that other person can switch the mafia's turn. 00:34:31.800 --> 00:34:38.230 align:middle line:84% And then there was a seer who can talk to dead people. 00:34:38.230 --> 00:34:41.730 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: Who specifies the roles? 00:34:41.730 --> 00:34:44.520 align:middle line:84% Is it just like a stable set of rules on an online server? 00:34:44.520 --> 00:34:48.073 align:middle line:84% Or is it like every round has this set of check boxes? 00:34:48.073 --> 00:34:50.659 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think that how it works 00:34:50.659 --> 00:34:53.240 align:middle line:84% is that you choose what type of game that you want. 00:34:53.240 --> 00:34:54.212 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Oh, I see. 00:34:54.212 --> 00:34:56.271 align:middle line:84% So you're setting up a little lobby for this-- 00:34:56.271 --> 00:34:56.770 align:middle line:90% OK. 00:34:56.770 --> 00:34:57.270 align:middle line:90% I see. 00:34:57.270 --> 00:34:57.950 align:middle line:90% OK. 00:34:57.950 --> 00:35:00.450 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: One of the funny ones that I played-- like there's 00:35:00.450 --> 00:35:03.170 align:middle line:90% one that was called Epic Mafia. 00:35:03.170 --> 00:35:07.151 align:middle line:84% It's actually like imbalance, but it's still fun. 00:35:07.151 --> 00:35:10.310 align:middle line:90% It's a crazy cop, who always-- 00:35:10.310 --> 00:35:12.980 align:middle line:84% so there's basically three cops and a mafia. 00:35:12.980 --> 00:35:14.790 align:middle line:84% And the cops don't know which cop they are. 00:35:14.790 --> 00:35:17.123 align:middle line:84% There's a crazy cop who always gets everything inverted. 00:35:17.123 --> 00:35:18.270 align:middle line:90% There's a regular cop. 00:35:18.270 --> 00:35:22.230 align:middle line:84% And then there's a cop who like always sees everything 00:35:22.230 --> 00:35:25.604 align:middle line:84% as truthful, or always sees everything innocent 00:35:25.604 --> 00:35:26.520 align:middle line:90% or everything as not-- 00:35:26.520 --> 00:35:28.810 align:middle line:90% I don't remember which. 00:35:28.810 --> 00:35:31.420 align:middle line:84% It's actually really unfair for the mafia [INAUDIBLE] 00:35:31.420 --> 00:35:32.710 align:middle line:84% where you just like say, this is what I got. 00:35:32.710 --> 00:35:35.190 align:middle line:84% And then someone dies, and then you say this is what I got. 00:35:35.190 --> 00:35:36.565 align:middle line:84% And then, basically, you can just 00:35:36.565 --> 00:35:38.240 align:middle line:90% piece together who is lying. 00:35:38.240 --> 00:35:40.839 align:middle line:90% But it's interesting. 00:35:40.839 --> 00:35:42.610 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: [INAUDIBLE] 00:35:42.610 --> 00:35:44.450 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Yeah, I was going to say. 00:35:44.450 --> 00:35:46.830 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] the game before that. 00:35:46.830 --> 00:35:48.720 align:middle line:84% There's a game where someone will swap God 00:35:48.720 --> 00:35:50.866 align:middle line:90% with one of the players. 00:35:50.866 --> 00:35:54.313 align:middle line:84% And decided to allow this to proceed. 00:35:54.313 --> 00:35:55.312 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Wait, hold on. 00:35:55.312 --> 00:35:57.096 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Did God [INAUDIBLE]? 00:35:57.096 --> 00:35:59.089 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE] 00:35:59.089 --> 00:35:59.630 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: OK 00:35:59.630 --> 00:36:01.190 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So this person role-swaps God with one 00:36:01.190 --> 00:36:02.230 align:middle line:90% of the players. 00:36:02.230 --> 00:36:03.960 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Oh, OK. 00:36:03.960 --> 00:36:06.232 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: And so the God's role became a villager. 00:36:06.232 --> 00:36:08.690 align:middle line:84% The moderator became-- it was like the moderator's role was 00:36:08.690 --> 00:36:10.940 align:middle line:84% now a villager, and like one of the random villagers-- 00:36:10.940 --> 00:36:12.110 align:middle line:90% they were all just now God. 00:36:12.110 --> 00:36:13.580 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: OK. 00:36:13.580 --> 00:36:16.846 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE] 00:36:16.846 --> 00:36:18.070 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: They're like-- 00:36:18.070 --> 00:36:18.750 align:middle line:90% Yes. 00:36:18.750 --> 00:36:21.020 align:middle line:84% And they're like this person who has now 00:36:21.020 --> 00:36:22.790 align:middle line:84% the new God made a bet with the player who 00:36:22.790 --> 00:36:24.498 align:middle line:84% was the head of the mafia that they could 00:36:24.498 --> 00:36:25.884 align:middle line:90% live until the end of game. 00:36:25.884 --> 00:36:27.800 align:middle line:84% And after it's money, like 10 different people 00:36:27.800 --> 00:36:28.425 align:middle line:90% won this thing. 00:36:28.425 --> 00:36:32.420 align:middle line:90% 00:36:32.420 --> 00:36:39.520 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So the different aggregates of roles 00:36:39.520 --> 00:36:41.740 align:middle line:90% happen more or less-- 00:36:41.740 --> 00:36:45.390 align:middle line:84% not by accident, but it's not like someone-- 00:36:45.390 --> 00:36:47.740 align:middle line:84% it's not like there are standards. 00:36:47.740 --> 00:36:50.820 align:middle line:84% It's like you get together with the group that's playing, 00:36:50.820 --> 00:36:51.810 align:middle line:84% and then you decide what goals there are. 00:36:51.810 --> 00:36:54.143 align:middle line:84% Or someone is like, oh, I thought about this beforehand, 00:36:54.143 --> 00:36:57.500 align:middle line:84% and I have some set up I think would be really cool. 00:36:57.500 --> 00:36:59.780 align:middle line:84% So my brother once put together a set up like that, 00:36:59.780 --> 00:37:05.950 align:middle line:90% which had I believe 17 people-- 00:37:05.950 --> 00:37:09.426 align:middle line:84% three of which vanilla villagers with-- 00:37:09.426 --> 00:37:13.930 align:middle line:84% I'm not sure whether it was four or five different sides. 00:37:13.930 --> 00:37:15.130 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Factions. 00:37:15.130 --> 00:37:17.100 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So there's like four or five different factions. 00:37:17.100 --> 00:37:18.940 align:middle line:84% So they were just playing like-- there's like mafia, 00:37:18.940 --> 00:37:20.280 align:middle line:84% and then there's like werewolves, 00:37:20.280 --> 00:37:21.655 align:middle line:84% which are identical to the mafia, 00:37:21.655 --> 00:37:23.660 align:middle line:90% and also get a kill at night. 00:37:23.660 --> 00:37:26.100 align:middle line:84% And then there's the serial killer, who's bulletproof, 00:37:26.100 --> 00:37:29.130 align:middle line:90% so he can't get killed at night. 00:37:29.130 --> 00:37:31.570 align:middle line:84% And he was also a separate faction 00:37:31.570 --> 00:37:33.169 align:middle line:90% trying to kill everyone else. 00:37:33.169 --> 00:37:34.710 align:middle line:84% And then there's the vigilante, who's 00:37:34.710 --> 00:37:39.430 align:middle line:84% like a good guy who also gets a kill at night. 00:37:39.430 --> 00:37:41.950 align:middle line:84% And so this game, it was actually, 00:37:41.950 --> 00:37:43.680 align:middle line:90% surprisingly, very good. 00:37:43.680 --> 00:37:47.565 align:middle line:84% Because everyone basically had a role, 00:37:47.565 --> 00:37:49.640 align:middle line:84% so no one was unhappy about that. 00:37:49.640 --> 00:37:52.090 align:middle line:84% And everyone more or less tried-- 00:37:52.090 --> 00:37:54.766 align:middle line:84% and the game is quick, because even though it's 17 people, 00:37:54.766 --> 00:37:56.224 align:middle line:84% you've got like four or five people 00:37:56.224 --> 00:37:58.420 align:middle line:84% dying every round for the first couple of rounds. 00:37:58.420 --> 00:38:01.350 align:middle line:90% 00:38:01.350 --> 00:38:04.670 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: I'm trying to figure out why there are so 00:38:04.670 --> 00:38:07.260 align:middle line:90% many variants on Mafia. 00:38:07.260 --> 00:38:13.890 align:middle line:84% There's something about Mafia or Werewolf-- or any of the names 00:38:13.890 --> 00:38:16.170 align:middle line:84% that people use-- that seems to lend itself 00:38:16.170 --> 00:38:20.110 align:middle line:84% to people coming up with new variants and then adopting it. 00:38:20.110 --> 00:38:21.840 align:middle line:84% I mean, clearly it makes sense for-- 00:38:21.840 --> 00:38:24.300 align:middle line:84% you need to be able to have a large group of people 00:38:24.300 --> 00:38:26.106 align:middle line:84% agree on the roles before it starts. 00:38:26.106 --> 00:38:28.320 align:middle line:84% So I'm not so confused about that. 00:38:28.320 --> 00:38:29.644 align:middle line:90% I'm wondering why Mafia-- 00:38:29.644 --> 00:38:32.145 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think, one, it's really fast to play through, 00:38:32.145 --> 00:38:34.490 align:middle line:84% which makes it very easy to playtest. 00:38:34.490 --> 00:38:38.730 align:middle line:84% And then, two, it's also just really, really easy to extend. 00:38:38.730 --> 00:38:40.230 align:middle line:84% You could always make your own role, 00:38:40.230 --> 00:38:41.860 align:middle line:90% but you honestly don't need to. 00:38:41.860 --> 00:38:43.890 align:middle line:84% There's at least a hundred different roles. 00:38:43.890 --> 00:38:46.070 align:middle line:84% You could just like eenie-meenie-miney-mo and like 00:38:46.070 --> 00:38:47.233 align:middle line:90% aggregate into a game. 00:38:47.233 --> 00:38:49.601 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: All right. 00:38:49.601 --> 00:38:51.389 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I was going to say that it's 00:38:51.389 --> 00:38:56.112 align:middle line:84% sort of boring for the villagers that they're just 00:38:56.112 --> 00:38:57.560 align:middle line:90% getting kicked out one by one. 00:38:57.560 --> 00:38:59.260 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: So there's a flaw in the game 00:38:59.260 --> 00:39:02.045 align:middle line:84% that every one of these variants is trying to address, which 00:39:02.045 --> 00:39:03.961 align:middle line:84% is making things a little bit more interesting 00:39:03.961 --> 00:39:05.690 align:middle line:90% for the poor villagers. 00:39:05.690 --> 00:39:09.770 align:middle line:90% And that's, I think-- 00:39:09.770 --> 00:39:12.890 align:middle line:84% the fact that it's very clear that all the rules are just 00:39:12.890 --> 00:39:16.060 align:middle line:84% imposed by the people in the room-- 00:39:16.060 --> 00:39:19.220 align:middle line:84% definitely that's a Mafia tournament as far as I know. 00:39:19.220 --> 00:39:21.270 align:middle line:84% I guess we could have Mafia tournaments spring up 00:39:21.270 --> 00:39:23.810 align:middle line:84% in the middle of conventions and stuff like that. 00:39:23.810 --> 00:39:26.510 align:middle line:84% But they don't seem to last very long. 00:39:26.510 --> 00:39:30.020 align:middle line:84% It's hard to imagine a version of Mafia 00:39:30.020 --> 00:39:33.230 align:middle line:84% where you are in direct contact with the person who 00:39:33.230 --> 00:39:35.100 align:middle line:84% established the rules for the round 00:39:35.100 --> 00:39:36.350 align:middle line:90% that you're playing right now. 00:39:36.350 --> 00:39:39.480 align:middle line:84% So it's very easy to just think that there's 00:39:39.480 --> 00:39:42.010 align:middle line:90% no canonical set of rules. 00:39:42.010 --> 00:39:45.010 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I was just reminded of some things. 00:39:45.010 --> 00:39:47.900 align:middle line:84% There was one time where there was 00:39:47.900 --> 00:39:55.770 align:middle line:84% a game of Mafia where God failed to give out any Mafia cards. 00:39:55.770 --> 00:39:56.532 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Oh. 00:39:56.532 --> 00:39:59.065 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Like, he cheated, as far as that goes. 00:39:59.065 --> 00:40:00.940 align:middle line:84% And so god chose someone to kill every night, 00:40:00.940 --> 00:40:04.080 align:middle line:84% and pretended that there was a mafia doing. 00:40:04.080 --> 00:40:08.717 align:middle line:84% And so the group started as probably around 12 people. 00:40:08.717 --> 00:40:10.842 align:middle line:84% And at around five people, they were like, OK, this 00:40:10.842 --> 00:40:14.704 align:middle line:84% is impossible-- as in, the previous [INAUDIBLE] 00:40:14.704 --> 00:40:16.620 align:middle line:84% they were like, OK, if this happens then blah. 00:40:16.620 --> 00:40:18.338 align:middle line:90% And if this happens, then blah. 00:40:18.338 --> 00:40:20.796 align:middle line:84% And then they killed someone, and that person was innocent, 00:40:20.796 --> 00:40:23.550 align:middle line:84% even though they had to be guilty in order 00:40:23.550 --> 00:40:25.830 align:middle line:90% for it to make sense. 00:40:25.830 --> 00:40:27.380 align:middle line:84% But they were like, what's going on? 00:40:27.380 --> 00:40:27.719 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: I don't know. 00:40:27.719 --> 00:40:29.844 align:middle line:84% I think that's the sort of cheating that we'll need 00:40:29.844 --> 00:40:31.380 align:middle line:90% to go to actually describing. 00:40:31.380 --> 00:40:33.370 align:middle line:84% Maybe we should try that once in a while. 00:40:33.370 --> 00:40:36.217 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You know, they were like pretty mad at the person. 00:40:36.217 --> 00:40:37.258 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: I can imagine. 00:40:37.258 --> 00:40:38.005 align:middle line:90% I can imagine. 00:40:38.005 --> 00:40:38.899 align:middle line:90% Yeah, yeah. 00:40:38.899 --> 00:40:41.133 align:middle line:84% Maybe that's the counter argument. 00:40:41.133 --> 00:40:42.550 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You are never god again. 00:40:42.550 --> 00:40:45.008 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So I don't actually know what the game is called, 00:40:45.008 --> 00:40:46.050 align:middle line:90% but we call it spies. 00:40:46.050 --> 00:40:48.710 align:middle line:84% It's basically there's a certain number of spies, 00:40:48.710 --> 00:40:50.652 align:middle line:84% and a certain number of resistance players. 00:40:50.652 --> 00:40:51.576 align:middle line:90% It's very similar to Mafia. 00:40:51.576 --> 00:40:52.038 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Resistance. 00:40:52.038 --> 00:40:52.500 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Oh, Resistance? 00:40:52.500 --> 00:40:53.424 align:middle line:90% OK. 00:40:53.424 --> 00:40:55.740 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: So this is a Mafia type game, yeah. 00:40:55.740 --> 00:40:56.906 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: It's called Spies. 00:40:56.906 --> 00:40:58.880 align:middle line:90% It's like the opposite. 00:40:58.880 --> 00:41:02.475 align:middle line:84% It's very similar to Mafia, except that you 00:41:02.475 --> 00:41:04.260 align:middle line:84% have to have a certain number of missions 00:41:04.260 --> 00:41:05.220 align:middle line:90% by putting people on missions. 00:41:05.220 --> 00:41:07.380 align:middle line:84% And the spies try to fail them, and the resistance 00:41:07.380 --> 00:41:08.370 align:middle line:90% is trying to pass them. 00:41:08.370 --> 00:41:11.295 align:middle line:90% 00:41:11.295 --> 00:41:13.670 align:middle line:84% And we did something very similar to that, where we had-- 00:41:13.670 --> 00:41:15.685 align:middle line:84% one of our friends left the room for a minute. 00:41:15.685 --> 00:41:18.187 align:middle line:84% And we go, OK guys, next round we're all spies. 00:41:18.187 --> 00:41:19.770 align:middle line:84% And we came up with like pecking order 00:41:19.770 --> 00:41:21.757 align:middle line:90% for who does what at what time. 00:41:21.757 --> 00:41:24.090 align:middle line:84% And we all tried to like blame one kid for being the spy 00:41:24.090 --> 00:41:25.300 align:middle line:90% the entire time. 00:41:25.300 --> 00:41:29.320 align:middle line:84% Then, at the end, we finally managed to get to the point 00:41:29.320 --> 00:41:31.790 align:middle line:84% where everyone had voted for the only person that 00:41:31.790 --> 00:41:34.102 align:middle line:90% was not the spy to be the spy. 00:41:34.102 --> 00:41:35.839 align:middle line:84% We basically just messed the game up 00:41:35.839 --> 00:41:37.880 align:middle line:84% to try and like execute him and have fun with it. 00:41:37.880 --> 00:41:38.460 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Right. 00:41:38.460 --> 00:41:40.126 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: But it kind of relates to that 00:41:40.126 --> 00:41:41.890 align:middle line:90% point of taking the rules and-- 00:41:41.890 --> 00:41:43.890 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: And Resistance is a little bit easier 00:41:43.890 --> 00:41:46.290 align:middle line:84% to identify that there is actually a set of rules. 00:41:46.290 --> 00:41:50.280 align:middle line:84% Because Resistance is a boxed product with a rulebook in it-- 00:41:50.280 --> 00:41:53.700 align:middle line:84% unlike a lot of other games of Mafia, where you kind of think 00:41:53.700 --> 00:41:56.280 align:middle line:90% things are pretty malleable. 00:41:56.280 --> 00:41:59.447 align:middle line:84% I do want to move on to something else. 00:41:59.447 --> 00:42:01.530 align:middle line:84% But before I get to Lockup, a couple of questions. 00:42:01.530 --> 00:42:04.680 align:middle line:84% If you have a smartphone, try downloading this. 00:42:04.680 --> 00:42:11.040 align:middle line:84% I think it's free on both the Android and the app store, 00:42:11.040 --> 00:42:13.750 align:middle line:84% because we're going to play a couple of rounds of this-- 00:42:13.750 --> 00:42:16.980 align:middle line:90% if the Wi-Fi works in this room. 00:42:16.980 --> 00:42:19.912 align:middle line:90% Which it may not. 00:42:19.912 --> 00:42:21.370 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I really like Resistance, 00:42:21.370 --> 00:42:24.960 align:middle line:84% because there's actual public information which you need. 00:42:24.960 --> 00:42:26.670 align:middle line:90% It's not just, John's guilty. 00:42:26.670 --> 00:42:27.540 align:middle line:90% He's dead now. 00:42:27.540 --> 00:42:28.200 align:middle line:90% Right? 00:42:28.200 --> 00:42:30.795 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: You don't just start the game by making stuff up. 00:42:30.795 --> 00:42:31.510 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah. 00:42:31.510 --> 00:42:33.760 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: Now, anybody who doesn't have a smartphone, 00:42:33.760 --> 00:42:35.640 align:middle line:90% you're welcome to use mine. 00:42:35.640 --> 00:42:38.640 align:middle line:90% Who would like to? 00:42:38.640 --> 00:42:41.440 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE] 00:42:41.440 --> 00:42:42.715 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Yeah, go ahead. 00:42:42.715 --> 00:42:45.774 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: But yes, I have a chart of Resistance games. 00:42:45.774 --> 00:42:48.690 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Wait, am I the only one who has [INAUDIBLE]? 00:42:48.690 --> 00:42:51.190 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: Yeah. 00:42:51.190 --> 00:42:53.690 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You could play [INAUDIBLE]. 00:42:53.690 --> 00:42:55.121 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: You can [INAUDIBLE] 00:42:55.121 --> 00:42:57.983 align:middle line:84% PROFESSOR: Although, actually, I'm going to get my iPad. 00:42:57.983 --> 00:42:59.414 align:middle line:90% I'll [INAUDIBLE]. 00:42:59.414 --> 00:43:11.245 align:middle line:90% 00:43:11.245 --> 00:43:15.141 align:middle line:90% [SIDE CONVERSATION] 00:43:15.141 --> 00:44:25.020 align:middle line:90% 00:44:25.020 --> 00:44:26.550 align:middle line:90% PROFESSOR: OK. 00:44:26.550 --> 00:44:35.448 align:middle line:84% Yeah, SpaceTeam is a game that I want to give a try. 00:44:35.448 --> 00:44:36.765 align:middle line:90% And we'll see if it works. 00:44:36.765 --> 00:44:38.140 align:middle line:84% If you are surrounded with people 00:44:38.140 --> 00:44:42.024 align:middle line:84% who have like the same kind of phone as yours-- like Android 00:44:42.024 --> 00:44:44.060 align:middle line:84% and iOS are two separate things-- 00:44:44.060 --> 00:44:46.439 align:middle line:84% you can attempt to do it over Google. 00:44:46.439 --> 00:44:48.355 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: There's some way you can play them-- 00:44:48.355 --> 00:44:49.834 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I'm not on the Wi-Fi right now. 00:44:49.834 --> 00:44:51.806 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You can play Android and iPhone together. 00:44:51.806 --> 00:44:52.681 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Over Wi-Fi. 00:44:52.681 --> 00:44:55.135 align:middle line:90% If Wi-Fi works in this room. 00:44:55.135 --> 00:44:56.536 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: I have Wi-Fi. 00:44:56.536 --> 00:45:01.233 align:middle line:90% [SIDE CONVERSATION] 00:45:01.233 --> 00:45:56.889 align:middle line:90%