WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.560 align:middle line:84% The following content is provided under a Creative 00:00:02.560 --> 00:00:03.920 align:middle line:90% Commons license. 00:00:03.920 --> 00:00:06.360 align:middle line:84% Your support will help MIT OpenCourseWare 00:00:06.360 --> 00:00:10.000 align:middle line:84% continue to offer high-quality educational resources for free. 00:00:10.000 --> 00:00:13.280 align:middle line:84% To make a donation or view additional materials 00:00:13.280 --> 00:00:17.240 align:middle line:84% from hundreds of MIT courses, visit MIT OpenCourseWare 00:00:17.240 --> 00:00:20.360 align:middle line:90% at ocw.mit.edu. 00:00:20.360 --> 00:00:25.498 align:middle line:84% Some material has been removed due to copyright restrictions. 00:00:25.498 --> 00:00:27.040 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: We're really 00:00:27.040 --> 00:00:36.600 align:middle line:84% lucky to have Chris Wall as our guest lecturer today. 00:00:36.600 --> 00:00:42.000 align:middle line:84% Chris got a bachelor's at Northwestern University 00:00:42.000 --> 00:00:43.622 align:middle line:90% in political science, correct? 00:00:43.622 --> 00:00:45.080 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Political science, yes. 00:00:45.080 --> 00:00:46.830 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: And then somebody 00:00:46.830 --> 00:00:50.600 align:middle line:90% convinced him to write copy. 00:00:50.600 --> 00:00:53.920 align:middle line:84% And so he joined the advertising world, 00:00:53.920 --> 00:00:58.240 align:middle line:84% and he's had quite a number of positions. 00:00:58.240 --> 00:01:05.960 align:middle line:84% He worked work for Apple, so in between jobs leaving 00:01:05.960 --> 00:01:07.340 align:middle line:90% and jobs coming back. 00:01:07.340 --> 00:01:09.040 align:middle line:90% You were never there with me. 00:01:09.040 --> 00:01:13.400 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: No, I was at other jobs for about 12 years. 00:01:13.400 --> 00:01:17.960 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: In the mid-'90s, he joined Ogilvy 00:01:17.960 --> 00:01:22.920 align:middle line:84% in New York, one of the most prominent advertising companies 00:01:22.920 --> 00:01:24.560 align:middle line:90% in the world. 00:01:24.560 --> 00:01:28.140 align:middle line:84% And in particular, around that time, 00:01:28.140 --> 00:01:32.700 align:middle line:84% IBM consolidated all of its advertising sovereignty. 00:01:32.700 --> 00:01:38.800 align:middle line:84% Prior to that, IBM had a gaggle of advertising companies 00:01:38.800 --> 00:01:42.760 align:middle line:84% with its own advertising, which is not a good idea if you 00:01:42.760 --> 00:01:45.600 align:middle line:90% want to establish a brand. 00:01:45.600 --> 00:01:53.440 align:middle line:84% And I worked really closely with Chris and Steve Hayden 00:01:53.440 --> 00:01:59.440 align:middle line:84% and other colleagues at Ogilvy on what became the key business 00:01:59.440 --> 00:02:01.320 align:middle line:90% strategy. 00:02:01.320 --> 00:02:07.920 align:middle line:84% And if you remember the discussions with IBM, 00:02:07.920 --> 00:02:11.960 align:middle line:90% we had three times-- 00:02:11.960 --> 00:02:17.020 align:middle line:84% they had at least two major challenges. 00:02:17.020 --> 00:02:23.800 align:middle line:84% One is the internet was already hot in '95, '96, 00:02:23.800 --> 00:02:26.320 align:middle line:90% in the consumer space. 00:02:26.320 --> 00:02:30.460 align:middle line:84% But IBM was a business function, an enterprise company. 00:02:30.460 --> 00:02:33.160 align:middle line:84% So somehow, one had to communicate. 00:02:33.160 --> 00:02:37.820 align:middle line:84% Why should a business be excited about the internet challenge? 00:02:37.820 --> 00:02:41.020 align:middle line:84% And [INAUDIBLE] challenge number two, 00:02:41.020 --> 00:02:45.360 align:middle line:84% I don't know which is harder here is that if you remember, 00:02:45.360 --> 00:02:50.400 align:middle line:84% IBM had just come from a near-death experience, 00:02:50.400 --> 00:02:53.900 align:middle line:84% and prior to IBM's near-death experience, 00:02:53.900 --> 00:02:59.810 align:middle line:84% IBM was viewed as a very uncool company-- 00:02:59.810 --> 00:03:04.610 align:middle line:84% striped blue suit and white tie, not what you 00:03:04.610 --> 00:03:07.050 align:middle line:90% associate with the internet. 00:03:07.050 --> 00:03:14.570 align:middle line:84% So not only was IBM uncool, but IBM was viewed as near-death 00:03:14.570 --> 00:03:19.250 align:middle line:90% in the '93-'94 time frame. 00:03:19.250 --> 00:03:26.650 align:middle line:84% So Chris and Tim had to make IBM relevant to the new world 00:03:26.650 --> 00:03:28.690 align:middle line:90% of the internet. 00:03:28.690 --> 00:03:32.530 align:middle line:84% And you're talking about all these cool things they did 00:03:32.530 --> 00:03:35.290 align:middle line:90% and why that is so important. 00:03:35.290 --> 00:03:40.590 align:middle line:84% And Chris was creative director at Ogilvy for a long time, 00:03:40.590 --> 00:03:45.010 align:middle line:84% until just a few weeks ago, after you 00:03:45.010 --> 00:03:48.410 align:middle line:84% had agreed to [INAUDIBLE] this class [INAUDIBLE] 00:03:48.410 --> 00:03:52.090 align:middle line:90% he was named vice chairman. 00:03:52.090 --> 00:03:57.550 align:middle line:84% So that's a very big job, running all over North America. 00:03:57.550 --> 00:04:01.370 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] start over with [INAUDIBLE] 00:04:01.370 --> 00:04:05.050 align:middle line:84% and we hope there is a relation between the [INAUDIBLE]. 00:04:05.050 --> 00:04:12.610 align:middle line:90% 00:04:12.610 --> 00:04:15.015 align:middle line:90% And with that, Chris Wall. 00:04:15.015 --> 00:04:17.930 align:middle line:90% [APPLAUSE] 00:04:17.930 --> 00:04:20.930 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: I worked at the BBDO on the Apple account 00:04:20.930 --> 00:04:23.650 align:middle line:84% for about eight years, launched a number 00:04:23.650 --> 00:04:25.070 align:middle line:90% of pretty significant products. 00:04:25.070 --> 00:04:28.090 align:middle line:84% I mean, we had-- at one time, Apple, 00:04:28.090 --> 00:04:34.730 align:middle line:84% as late as like about 1993, had about a 14% market share of-- 00:04:34.730 --> 00:04:37.563 align:middle line:84% 1992, '93-- of the computer business. 00:04:37.563 --> 00:04:38.730 align:middle line:90% And right now, they've got-- 00:04:38.730 --> 00:04:41.530 align:middle line:84% I think they said they had 8% in North America last month, which 00:04:41.530 --> 00:04:42.530 align:middle line:90% was huge. 00:04:42.530 --> 00:04:45.730 align:middle line:84% But overall, their shares hover around 2% or 3% 00:04:45.730 --> 00:04:48.990 align:middle line:90% for the last six or eight years. 00:04:48.990 --> 00:04:50.610 align:middle line:84% And I left when it was pretty clear 00:04:50.610 --> 00:04:53.930 align:middle line:84% that the management of the company 00:04:53.930 --> 00:04:57.210 align:middle line:90% was not going on an upward path. 00:04:57.210 --> 00:04:59.170 align:middle line:84% And I went in, I did the Windows 95 00:04:59.170 --> 00:05:00.770 align:middle line:84% launch at a little agency in Portland 00:05:00.770 --> 00:05:01.910 align:middle line:90% called Wieden and Kennedy. 00:05:01.910 --> 00:05:09.130 align:middle line:84% And then I came to Ogilvy in the fall of 1996 to work on IBM. 00:05:09.130 --> 00:05:12.210 align:middle line:84% And, I mean, I'm just going to stumble 00:05:12.210 --> 00:05:15.090 align:middle line:84% through my career at Ogilvy here a little bit 00:05:15.090 --> 00:05:19.410 align:middle line:84% and tell you various hopefully interesting stories 00:05:19.410 --> 00:05:23.250 align:middle line:84% about this kind of madness of what I do. 00:05:23.250 --> 00:05:25.350 align:middle line:84% And if you want to interrupt me at any time, 00:05:25.350 --> 00:05:29.670 align:middle line:84% please feel free because it's a quasi-linear. 00:05:29.670 --> 00:05:33.370 align:middle line:84% But, of course, the best way to predict the future 00:05:33.370 --> 00:05:36.390 align:middle line:84% is to invent it was a big mantra at Apple. 00:05:36.390 --> 00:05:39.970 align:middle line:84% Apple really bought into the whole political evangelism 00:05:39.970 --> 00:05:43.050 align:middle line:84% of technology is enabling force and really 00:05:43.050 --> 00:05:48.610 align:middle line:84% kind of defined taking products that were pretty obscure 00:05:48.610 --> 00:05:49.740 align:middle line:90% and putting them in a-- 00:05:49.740 --> 00:05:51.490 align:middle line:84% talking to a much more mainstream audience 00:05:51.490 --> 00:05:53.090 align:middle line:84% about the power of technology in a way 00:05:53.090 --> 00:05:58.150 align:middle line:84% that other companies have tried to follow suit. 00:05:58.150 --> 00:06:01.310 align:middle line:84% But I think Apple was really early on that. 00:06:01.310 --> 00:06:03.050 align:middle line:84% But I also put-- and Dan Quayle, I 00:06:03.050 --> 00:06:06.450 align:middle line:84% thought that was a kind of a great quote that Alan said. 00:06:06.450 --> 00:06:08.250 align:middle line:84% One of my favorite movies is 2001-- 00:06:08.250 --> 00:06:09.370 align:middle line:90% A Space Odyssey. 00:06:09.370 --> 00:06:14.830 align:middle line:84% And I've been reading all these books about Kubrick lately, 00:06:14.830 --> 00:06:17.030 align:middle line:84% and there's a lot of stuff in there about Hal, 00:06:17.030 --> 00:06:23.190 align:middle line:84% because the HAL 9,000 Series was one digit away from IBM. 00:06:23.190 --> 00:06:25.670 align:middle line:84% HAL it's one digit away from IBM, which Kubrick denies, 00:06:25.670 --> 00:06:27.690 align:middle line:90% but it has to be that. 00:06:27.690 --> 00:06:29.130 align:middle line:90% Can't be coincidence. 00:06:29.130 --> 00:06:31.410 align:middle line:84% And I always thought The Monolith 00:06:31.410 --> 00:06:34.350 align:middle line:84% was like a great kind of IBM mainframe. 00:06:34.350 --> 00:06:36.370 align:middle line:84% People said it was god, but I actually 00:06:36.370 --> 00:06:39.450 align:middle line:90% think it was an IBM mainframe. 00:06:39.450 --> 00:06:41.673 align:middle line:84% And there's all this great stuff in there. 00:06:41.673 --> 00:06:43.090 align:middle line:84% If you go back and watch it now, I 00:06:43.090 --> 00:06:45.750 align:middle line:84% mean, it's just a beautiful piece of filmmaking and imagery, 00:06:45.750 --> 00:06:48.970 align:middle line:84% even though it's kind of hard to follow and it kind of runs-- 00:06:48.970 --> 00:06:51.670 align:middle line:84% it gets so metaphorical at the end, I get completely lost. 00:06:51.670 --> 00:06:53.890 align:middle line:84% But the whole kind of relationship between knowledge 00:06:53.890 --> 00:06:57.130 align:middle line:84% and technology and the quest for the unknown 00:06:57.130 --> 00:06:58.650 align:middle line:90% is just it's so cool. 00:06:58.650 --> 00:07:00.090 align:middle line:90% It's so incredibly cool. 00:07:00.090 --> 00:07:03.570 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: I think when the movie first came out 00:07:03.570 --> 00:07:07.467 align:middle line:84% in the '60s, you were not supposed to be sober [INAUDIBLE] 00:07:07.467 --> 00:07:09.550 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: You're supposed to be a little stoned, 00:07:09.550 --> 00:07:10.710 align:middle line:90% yeah, when you saw it. 00:07:10.710 --> 00:07:13.470 align:middle line:84% Yeah, I was about 8 or 10 or something, 00:07:13.470 --> 00:07:17.170 align:middle line:84% and I was sat in the back of the Evanston Theater, giggling, 00:07:17.170 --> 00:07:19.650 align:middle line:84% and all the kind of ponderous college students, 00:07:19.650 --> 00:07:23.050 align:middle line:84% probably from the Northwestern Technology Center, sat there, 00:07:23.050 --> 00:07:26.395 align:middle line:84% and they were all very disgusted with the little kids 00:07:26.395 --> 00:07:27.270 align:middle line:90% in the back giggling. 00:07:27.270 --> 00:07:28.830 align:middle line:90% But that defined my career. 00:07:28.830 --> 00:07:29.230 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: By the way, 00:07:29.230 --> 00:07:31.070 align:middle line:84% I'm not advocating [? drug use-- ?] 00:07:31.070 --> 00:07:32.090 align:middle line:90% [LAUGHTER] 00:07:32.090 --> 00:07:34.050 align:middle line:84% --just in case somebody [INAUDIBLE] 00:07:34.050 --> 00:07:36.915 align:middle line:90% from the MIT administration. 00:07:36.915 --> 00:07:38.290 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: But anyway, I mean, I 00:07:38.290 --> 00:07:41.270 align:middle line:84% think that the movie is just a really great-- 00:07:41.270 --> 00:07:43.250 align:middle line:84% I love technology, and try and make 00:07:43.250 --> 00:07:46.320 align:middle line:84% your list of the top 10 engineering movies of all time, 00:07:46.320 --> 00:07:47.980 align:middle line:84% and there aren't that many of them. 00:07:47.980 --> 00:07:50.180 align:middle line:84% There's The China Syndrome, and there's-- 00:07:50.180 --> 00:07:52.097 align:middle line:84% I can't even think of what the other ones are, 00:07:52.097 --> 00:07:53.380 align:middle line:90% but this is one of them. 00:07:53.380 --> 00:07:56.180 align:middle line:84% So this is IBM way before, and it's 00:07:56.180 --> 00:07:59.660 align:middle line:84% my personal story of my relationship with IBM, which 00:07:59.660 --> 00:08:02.820 align:middle line:84% therefore has to be partially fictitious and made up 00:08:02.820 --> 00:08:04.780 align:middle line:84% in romance in hindsight because that's 00:08:04.780 --> 00:08:09.660 align:middle line:84% the business I'm in, and way before before, before, 00:08:09.660 --> 00:08:11.900 align:middle line:90% and after. 00:08:11.900 --> 00:08:15.380 align:middle line:84% And my first personal encounter with the IBM brand 00:08:15.380 --> 00:08:19.620 align:middle line:84% was at the World's Fair in Flushing in 1964. 00:08:19.620 --> 00:08:22.440 align:middle line:84% And for whatever reason, about a year ago, 00:08:22.440 --> 00:08:25.500 align:middle line:84% I kind of went back and revisited that. 00:08:25.500 --> 00:08:27.848 align:middle line:84% And I went on-- eBay is the greatest thing in the world 00:08:27.848 --> 00:08:30.140 align:middle line:84% because you can go in and buy all the souvenirs and all 00:08:30.140 --> 00:08:32.539 align:middle line:90% this stuff, all the guides. 00:08:32.539 --> 00:08:36.780 align:middle line:84% And what's really interesting to me because in our company, 00:08:36.780 --> 00:08:39.380 align:middle line:90% Ogilvy has benefited enormously. 00:08:39.380 --> 00:08:45.060 align:middle line:84% The IBM account remade Ogilvy because it gave us a story 00:08:45.060 --> 00:08:48.260 align:middle line:84% that we could tell that has been incredibly 00:08:48.260 --> 00:08:50.920 align:middle line:84% powerful in convincing other clients to come with us, 00:08:50.920 --> 00:08:57.560 align:middle line:84% and as a result, we have DuPont, we have SAP, we have Motorola, 00:08:57.560 --> 00:09:00.812 align:middle line:84% we have all these companies that deal in technology and culture 00:09:00.812 --> 00:09:03.020 align:middle line:84% because we have a lot of people who can talk about it 00:09:03.020 --> 00:09:05.780 align:middle line:84% and are really turned on by the whole notion of technology 00:09:05.780 --> 00:09:06.280 align:middle line:90% and culture. 00:09:06.280 --> 00:09:07.860 align:middle line:84% And I think it's people who probably 00:09:07.860 --> 00:09:09.902 align:middle line:84% would have gone into engineering, except for they 00:09:09.902 --> 00:09:11.860 align:middle line:84% had no mathematical skills whatsoever. 00:09:11.860 --> 00:09:16.500 align:middle line:84% And so anyway, in 1964, I remember because my father-- 00:09:16.500 --> 00:09:19.220 align:middle line:84% when we got to the World's Fair, the first thing 00:09:19.220 --> 00:09:21.260 align:middle line:84% that he wanted to do was go see the IBM building 00:09:21.260 --> 00:09:25.420 align:middle line:84% and/or the IBM exhibit, which was designed by-- 00:09:25.420 --> 00:09:28.740 align:middle line:84% Saarinen did the actual pavilion itself. 00:09:28.740 --> 00:09:31.660 align:middle line:84% And then the Eameses, Charles and Ray Eames, 00:09:31.660 --> 00:09:34.700 align:middle line:84% curated the exhibit, which was all 00:09:34.700 --> 00:09:36.240 align:middle line:90% about technology and progress. 00:09:36.240 --> 00:09:38.900 align:middle line:84% And this whole fair was this big thing 00:09:38.900 --> 00:09:44.920 align:middle line:84% about the power of technology and to define a better future. 00:09:44.920 --> 00:09:46.320 align:middle line:90% It was very optimistic. 00:09:46.320 --> 00:09:49.020 align:middle line:84% And you think about, this is right after the Cuban Missile 00:09:49.020 --> 00:09:51.280 align:middle line:84% Crisis, and it was right after Sputnik, 00:09:51.280 --> 00:09:53.240 align:middle line:90% which was a huge threat. 00:09:53.240 --> 00:09:55.780 align:middle line:84% And literally, this opened six months 00:09:55.780 --> 00:09:57.640 align:middle line:90% after Kennedy was assassinated. 00:09:57.640 --> 00:10:00.320 align:middle line:84% And yet the thing was very, very optimistic. 00:10:00.320 --> 00:10:02.580 align:middle line:84% And it was all these great companies 00:10:02.580 --> 00:10:05.420 align:middle line:84% embracing the power of technology 00:10:05.420 --> 00:10:06.837 align:middle line:84% to make the world a better place. 00:10:06.837 --> 00:10:08.920 align:middle line:84% And so I went into this thing and this-- actually, 00:10:08.920 --> 00:10:12.140 align:middle line:84% they put you in this thing, and it rose up into the building. 00:10:12.140 --> 00:10:14.640 align:middle line:84% And I remember coming out and going, I'd never heard of IBM, 00:10:14.640 --> 00:10:15.880 align:middle line:90% I've never heard of it. 00:10:15.880 --> 00:10:17.455 align:middle line:90% I had no idea what it was. 00:10:17.455 --> 00:10:19.580 align:middle line:84% And I came out thinking this is the coolest company 00:10:19.580 --> 00:10:20.980 align:middle line:90% in the world. 00:10:20.980 --> 00:10:26.620 align:middle line:84% But if you go back and look at the companies that I mean, 00:10:26.620 --> 00:10:29.300 align:middle line:84% they got something like 50 million people 00:10:29.300 --> 00:10:33.020 align:middle line:84% to come to this fair that was about science, technology, 00:10:33.020 --> 00:10:34.380 align:middle line:90% and a better future. 00:10:34.380 --> 00:10:37.580 align:middle line:84% And that was about a third of the population 00:10:37.580 --> 00:10:38.640 align:middle line:90% in terms of raw numbers. 00:10:38.640 --> 00:10:39.660 align:middle line:84% I mean, I assume some of these people 00:10:39.660 --> 00:10:42.020 align:middle line:84% went back three or four times, but it was about a third 00:10:42.020 --> 00:10:44.580 align:middle line:84% of the population of the United States came to see this. 00:10:44.580 --> 00:10:46.980 align:middle line:84% And it really was the last-- maybe not 00:10:46.980 --> 00:10:48.160 align:middle line:90% the last great World's Fair. 00:10:48.160 --> 00:10:51.940 align:middle line:84% I think there was Osaka, and there was one in-- but the kind 00:10:51.940 --> 00:10:56.300 align:middle line:84% of after the '60s, Expo '67, the whole thing went away, 00:10:56.300 --> 00:11:00.460 align:middle line:84% and Disney kind of took all that market, I think. 00:11:00.460 --> 00:11:04.640 align:middle line:84% But all that was going on at the time. 00:11:04.640 --> 00:11:07.340 align:middle line:84% There was all this interest in technology and design 00:11:07.340 --> 00:11:09.800 align:middle line:84% and new materials and all this great stuff was going on. 00:11:09.800 --> 00:11:11.420 align:middle line:90% It was a very experimental time. 00:11:11.420 --> 00:11:13.080 align:middle line:90% But everything was space age. 00:11:13.080 --> 00:11:17.420 align:middle line:84% I mean, the Saarinen terminal at the TWA Terminal at JFK 00:11:17.420 --> 00:11:20.060 align:middle line:84% and tulip chairs and all this really cool stuff 00:11:20.060 --> 00:11:24.740 align:middle line:84% that all came out of an affinity for technology and new materials 00:11:24.740 --> 00:11:25.260 align:middle line:90% and stuff. 00:11:25.260 --> 00:11:26.860 align:middle line:90% All that was going on. 00:11:26.860 --> 00:11:30.020 align:middle line:84% And we actually wound up doing a commercial that I'll show you 00:11:30.020 --> 00:11:33.040 align:middle line:84% where we used this, not really by design, 00:11:33.040 --> 00:11:36.580 align:middle line:84% but the Saarinen chair was one of the props in the thing. 00:11:36.580 --> 00:11:42.700 align:middle line:84% And so anyway, so that was my introduction to IBM. 00:11:42.700 --> 00:11:47.220 align:middle line:84% And if you look, you can still buy the Eames films on DVD, 00:11:47.220 --> 00:11:48.840 align:middle line:84% and they're really pretty fascinating. 00:11:48.840 --> 00:11:51.740 align:middle line:84% I mean, the stuff that IBM was doing with technology 00:11:51.740 --> 00:11:54.460 align:middle line:84% and culture and investing in all kinds of things that had-- 00:11:54.460 --> 00:11:57.080 align:middle line:90% they used Paul Rand a lot. 00:11:57.080 --> 00:12:00.060 align:middle line:84% I mean, they used all these really neat people. 00:12:00.060 --> 00:12:03.010 align:middle line:90% And so the company was this-- 00:12:03.010 --> 00:12:06.980 align:middle line:84% this was a time when people believed that corporations were 00:12:06.980 --> 00:12:08.645 align:middle line:90% for the better in the world. 00:12:08.645 --> 00:12:11.020 align:middle line:84% I mean, it was very-- the whole thing was very optimistic 00:12:11.020 --> 00:12:15.300 align:middle line:84% because corporations kind of defined 00:12:15.300 --> 00:12:21.460 align:middle line:84% modern, progressive, enlightened diverse culture in the United 00:12:21.460 --> 00:12:21.960 align:middle line:90% States. 00:12:21.960 --> 00:12:24.160 align:middle line:84% And IBM was the ultimate corporation. 00:12:24.160 --> 00:12:25.940 align:middle line:84% I mean, if you look at the design 00:12:25.940 --> 00:12:28.340 align:middle line:84% standards and graphic standards and stuff 00:12:28.340 --> 00:12:31.220 align:middle line:84% of all the major corporations, they all kind 00:12:31.220 --> 00:12:34.980 align:middle line:84% of knocked off what IBM did in some form or other. 00:12:34.980 --> 00:12:38.590 align:middle line:84% And this was the time of all this cool stuff was going 00:12:38.590 --> 00:12:42.110 align:middle line:84% on-- the Space Needle and the Star Trek 00:12:42.110 --> 00:12:46.290 align:middle line:84% and supersonic planes and all that stuff. 00:12:46.290 --> 00:12:48.030 align:middle line:90% It was all this kind of-- 00:12:48.030 --> 00:12:50.630 align:middle line:84% I mean, I was so sad when they retired the Concorde 00:12:50.630 --> 00:12:56.830 align:middle line:84% because it was the last of that era kind of left. 00:12:56.830 --> 00:13:01.610 align:middle line:84% And so let's see-- all the great companies were there. 00:13:01.610 --> 00:13:03.695 align:middle line:84% I mean, this was the Bell system was there, 00:13:03.695 --> 00:13:05.570 align:middle line:84% and they were all trying to outdo each other. 00:13:05.570 --> 00:13:08.570 align:middle line:84% General Motors had this really elaborate pavilion. 00:13:08.570 --> 00:13:10.010 align:middle line:90% Ford, of course, was there. 00:13:10.010 --> 00:13:13.390 align:middle line:84% And this was a time when these companies 00:13:13.390 --> 00:13:15.450 align:middle line:84% were the defining industrial companies. 00:13:15.450 --> 00:13:20.230 align:middle line:90% 00:13:20.230 --> 00:13:22.872 align:middle line:84% This one I thought-- but what's really kind of tragic 00:13:22.872 --> 00:13:24.830 align:middle line:84% about it is that almost none of these companies 00:13:24.830 --> 00:13:28.410 align:middle line:84% today are known for technology and innovation really anymore. 00:13:28.410 --> 00:13:30.610 align:middle line:84% And some of them seem to be hanging on by a thread. 00:13:30.610 --> 00:13:33.050 align:middle line:84% I mean, Kodak, that's another Ogilvy client. 00:13:33.050 --> 00:13:35.950 align:middle line:84% DuPont-- really companies that have either kind of 00:13:35.950 --> 00:13:41.150 align:middle line:84% vanished into obscurity, but they're certainly not 00:13:41.150 --> 00:13:44.150 align:middle line:84% seen as part of the defining culture of technology 00:13:44.150 --> 00:13:45.130 align:middle line:90% and innovation anymore. 00:13:45.130 --> 00:13:46.570 align:middle line:90% It's just kind of vanished. 00:13:46.570 --> 00:13:49.150 align:middle line:84% And then companies like RCA just went away. 00:13:49.150 --> 00:13:50.378 align:middle line:90% I mean, AMF had this thing-- 00:13:50.378 --> 00:13:51.170 align:middle line:90% It was really cool. 00:13:51.170 --> 00:13:53.712 align:middle line:84% The monorail, everybody thought it was going to be monorails. 00:13:53.712 --> 00:13:55.850 align:middle line:90% That was kind of future. 00:13:55.850 --> 00:13:56.670 align:middle line:90% They were there. 00:13:56.670 --> 00:14:00.010 align:middle line:90% They went out of business. 00:14:00.010 --> 00:14:02.230 align:middle line:84% One of the other thing that's interesting, I mean, 00:14:02.230 --> 00:14:03.990 align:middle line:84% at this time, maybe you've talked 00:14:03.990 --> 00:14:08.610 align:middle line:84% about this, that the whole thing with the glass house, 00:14:08.610 --> 00:14:10.870 align:middle line:84% like when they had computers in glass houses, 00:14:10.870 --> 00:14:14.390 align:middle line:84% and they were like, there was no technical reason why a computer 00:14:14.390 --> 00:14:16.090 align:middle line:90% had to be behind a glass wall. 00:14:16.090 --> 00:14:18.550 align:middle line:84% It was basically so that the president or the chairman 00:14:18.550 --> 00:14:21.070 align:middle line:84% of a corporation could walk somebody 00:14:21.070 --> 00:14:23.972 align:middle line:84% as shareholders or new employees or whatever around. 00:14:23.972 --> 00:14:25.930 align:middle line:84% And it kind of proved that you were enlightened 00:14:25.930 --> 00:14:28.910 align:middle line:84% if you had one of these big IBM machines installed 00:14:28.910 --> 00:14:30.630 align:middle line:90% behind the glass wall. 00:14:30.630 --> 00:14:32.830 align:middle line:84% And so there's always been this element 00:14:32.830 --> 00:14:39.170 align:middle line:84% of forward emotional belief in technology. 00:14:39.170 --> 00:14:41.790 align:middle line:84% And it started back in the days when companies could only 00:14:41.790 --> 00:14:43.998 align:middle line:84% afford-- only a few companies could afford these very 00:14:43.998 --> 00:14:45.630 align:middle line:90% expensive installations. 00:14:45.630 --> 00:14:48.330 align:middle line:84% And then when I was doing Apple, one of the things 00:14:48.330 --> 00:14:49.830 align:middle line:84% that worked for Apple and saved them 00:14:49.830 --> 00:14:52.122 align:middle line:84% every time was that they had this culture of people who 00:14:52.122 --> 00:14:54.510 align:middle line:84% really believed in them and talked them up 00:14:54.510 --> 00:14:58.350 align:middle line:84% and would sell Macs, no matter how stupid, 00:14:58.350 --> 00:15:01.490 align:middle line:84% no matter how foolishly Apple spent its money, 00:15:01.490 --> 00:15:03.470 align:middle line:84% they always had this installed base 00:15:03.470 --> 00:15:06.417 align:middle line:84% of people who would evangelize the products to other people. 00:15:06.417 --> 00:15:08.250 align:middle line:84% And so that was a very, very powerful thing. 00:15:08.250 --> 00:15:10.510 align:middle line:84% And I think it's part of the same thing 00:15:10.510 --> 00:15:14.470 align:middle line:84% that people want to be seen as embracing technology and knowing 00:15:14.470 --> 00:15:16.510 align:middle line:84% about technology because it makes you-- you're 00:15:16.510 --> 00:15:17.850 align:middle line:90% a believer in the future. 00:15:17.850 --> 00:15:20.550 align:middle line:84% You have this faith that the future is 00:15:20.550 --> 00:15:22.410 align:middle line:84% going to be better and more interesting, 00:15:22.410 --> 00:15:26.390 align:middle line:84% and you want to be seen as being part of that. 00:15:26.390 --> 00:15:33.590 align:middle line:84% IBM-- I mean, IBM, at least in my recollection, was seen-- 00:15:33.590 --> 00:15:36.910 align:middle line:84% in the '80s, IBM was really late to the party with the personal 00:15:36.910 --> 00:15:37.690 align:middle line:90% computer. 00:15:37.690 --> 00:15:40.710 align:middle line:84% And you had Apple had staked out a territory, 00:15:40.710 --> 00:15:44.590 align:middle line:84% and Apple was the media darling because Jobs is just gifted 00:15:44.590 --> 00:15:47.350 align:middle line:90% at playing the media. 00:15:47.350 --> 00:15:51.470 align:middle line:84% But you also had companies like Osborne and Atari 00:15:51.470 --> 00:15:56.030 align:middle line:84% and Texas Instruments and RadioShack 00:15:56.030 --> 00:15:59.150 align:middle line:84% and all these others selling a pretty substantial number 00:15:59.150 --> 00:16:02.930 align:middle line:84% of computers based on different operating systems, CPM, 00:16:02.930 --> 00:16:04.070 align:middle line:90% stuff like that. 00:16:04.070 --> 00:16:11.630 align:middle line:84% And when IBM came with the PC, which was in 1981, 00:16:11.630 --> 00:16:15.310 align:middle line:84% it was really seen as IBM at its best 00:16:15.310 --> 00:16:17.970 align:middle line:84% because they had been behind the eight ball. 00:16:17.970 --> 00:16:22.470 align:middle line:84% And they did this skunkworks in Boca, where they put together 00:16:22.470 --> 00:16:26.490 align:middle line:84% out of existing components a new computer, put it out there. 00:16:26.490 --> 00:16:27.990 align:middle line:90% It was an immediate success. 00:16:27.990 --> 00:16:29.270 align:middle line:90% It defined the market. 00:16:29.270 --> 00:16:31.590 align:middle line:84% It knocked anybody-- it knocked CPM out of the market 00:16:31.590 --> 00:16:32.570 align:middle line:90% altogether. 00:16:32.570 --> 00:16:33.850 align:middle line:90% It niched Apple. 00:16:33.850 --> 00:16:36.510 align:middle line:84% And they had this very famous ad campaign 00:16:36.510 --> 00:16:38.090 align:middle line:90% that featured Charlie Chaplin. 00:16:38.090 --> 00:16:41.470 align:middle line:84% I mean, they seemed to be doing everything right. 00:16:41.470 --> 00:16:47.430 align:middle line:84% And from about 1981 to about 1985-'86, IBM was still seemed 00:16:47.430 --> 00:16:49.070 align:middle line:90% to be hitting on all cylinders. 00:16:49.070 --> 00:16:51.950 align:middle line:84% And it was only in when they-- and actually, they 00:16:51.950 --> 00:16:56.710 align:middle line:84% launched the second generation PC, which was the PS/2. 00:16:56.710 --> 00:17:00.590 align:middle line:84% And they seemed like-- when i went to COMDEX that year, 00:17:00.590 --> 00:17:03.330 align:middle line:90% and seemed it was a huge event. 00:17:03.330 --> 00:17:07.550 align:middle line:84% And the anticipation-- the basic assumption was IBM 00:17:07.550 --> 00:17:09.190 align:middle line:90% could not fail. 00:17:09.190 --> 00:17:13.630 align:middle line:84% And so they went out, and they seemed 00:17:13.630 --> 00:17:16.750 align:middle line:84% to be hitting on all cylinders again, 00:17:16.750 --> 00:17:19.670 align:middle line:84% but they were unable to ever convince anyone, 00:17:19.670 --> 00:17:21.410 align:middle line:84% or after about two years into it, 00:17:21.410 --> 00:17:23.630 align:middle line:84% they kind of lost any ability to convince anyone 00:17:23.630 --> 00:17:26.849 align:middle line:84% that there was any real value in PS/2 and OS/2, 00:17:26.849 --> 00:17:30.580 align:middle line:84% and they've been doing a partnership with Microsoft, 00:17:30.580 --> 00:17:32.020 align:middle line:90% and that seemed to go south. 00:17:32.020 --> 00:17:40.480 align:middle line:84% And all of a sudden, these kind of holes in the IBM mantra 00:17:40.480 --> 00:17:45.780 align:middle line:84% or the perfection of IBM started to evolve. 00:17:45.780 --> 00:17:48.540 align:middle line:84% And Apple had always used IBM as a kind of a foil, 00:17:48.540 --> 00:17:50.680 align:middle line:84% like when they did the 1984 commercial, 00:17:50.680 --> 00:17:53.800 align:middle line:84% they had always pitted themselves against IBM, which 00:17:53.800 --> 00:17:54.900 align:middle line:90% was completely ridiculous. 00:17:54.900 --> 00:17:56.840 align:middle line:84% I mean, Apple was making this little toy, 00:17:56.840 --> 00:18:01.220 align:middle line:84% and IBM did all these other things. 00:18:01.220 --> 00:18:04.060 align:middle line:84% And the scale of the two companies was ridiculous. 00:18:04.060 --> 00:18:06.440 align:middle line:84% It was not an Apple versus IBM, but Apple 00:18:06.440 --> 00:18:08.840 align:middle line:84% used that very successfully to make it 00:18:08.840 --> 00:18:10.720 align:middle line:90% seem to be a two horse race. 00:18:10.720 --> 00:18:14.120 align:middle line:84% And at the same time, then when IBM started to fail, 00:18:14.120 --> 00:18:18.800 align:middle line:84% there was some of that benefit accrued to Apple. 00:18:18.800 --> 00:18:23.180 align:middle line:84% But anyway, so by about 1980, 1990, 1991, 00:18:23.180 --> 00:18:25.720 align:middle line:90% OS/2 was really a flop. 00:18:25.720 --> 00:18:30.958 align:middle line:84% And there was talk about breaking up the company. 00:18:30.958 --> 00:18:33.500 align:middle line:84% I mean, just about everything that could go wrong went wrong, 00:18:33.500 --> 00:18:36.000 align:middle line:84% and it seemed to go wrong pretty fast. 00:18:36.000 --> 00:18:40.600 align:middle line:84% And so then there came like a slew of publications 00:18:40.600 --> 00:18:44.240 align:middle line:84% in the early '90s that talked about the demise of IBM. 00:18:44.240 --> 00:18:45.800 align:middle line:90% And these were two-- 00:18:45.800 --> 00:18:49.240 align:middle line:84% I mean, they were bestselling business books at the time, 00:18:49.240 --> 00:18:51.540 align:middle line:84% but it was very-- it became, all of a sudden, 00:18:51.540 --> 00:18:55.480 align:middle line:84% the whole world kind of piled on IBM and said IBM is finished. 00:18:55.480 --> 00:18:59.480 align:middle line:84% And the thing about in technology companies, 00:18:59.480 --> 00:19:01.920 align:middle line:84% the change between the top of the heap 00:19:01.920 --> 00:19:04.420 align:middle line:84% and the bottom of the barrel happens very, very quickly. 00:19:04.420 --> 00:19:07.380 align:middle line:84% If you're not ahead of it, if you're not paying attention, 00:19:07.380 --> 00:19:09.100 align:middle line:90% things can go south in a hurry. 00:19:09.100 --> 00:19:10.460 align:middle line:90% And I mean, Apple. 00:19:10.460 --> 00:19:11.780 align:middle line:90% Apple was always like this. 00:19:11.780 --> 00:19:14.760 align:middle line:84% It was like this product-- the Macintosh portable was just 00:19:14.760 --> 00:19:15.580 align:middle line:90% a disaster. 00:19:15.580 --> 00:19:18.160 align:middle line:84% And then the Powerbook was a home run, and they did Newton, 00:19:18.160 --> 00:19:22.440 align:middle line:84% and they were kind of always-- they lived this cycle of birth 00:19:22.440 --> 00:19:24.120 align:middle line:90% and death and rebirth. 00:19:24.120 --> 00:19:26.640 align:middle line:90% 00:19:26.640 --> 00:19:29.240 align:middle line:84% And I think they were used to it, whereas for IBM, it 00:19:29.240 --> 00:19:32.720 align:middle line:84% was really hard because it was something 00:19:32.720 --> 00:19:34.140 align:middle line:90% that IBM just was not used to. 00:19:34.140 --> 00:19:36.160 align:middle line:84% They were used to a world where nobody ever 00:19:36.160 --> 00:19:37.840 align:middle line:90% got fired for buying IBM. 00:19:37.840 --> 00:19:44.880 align:middle line:84% And so this story was the cover of a Fortune magazine story 00:19:44.880 --> 00:19:48.213 align:middle line:84% that appeared that basically talked about the dinosaurs. 00:19:48.213 --> 00:19:50.880 align:middle line:84% So you have GM, which was at the World's Fair, and Sears Roebuck 00:19:50.880 --> 00:19:53.740 align:middle line:84% and IBM as the dinosaurs of American business. 00:19:53.740 --> 00:19:56.340 align:middle line:84% And it's like an obituary because really, 00:19:56.340 --> 00:19:57.840 align:middle line:84% for a technology company, that's not 00:19:57.840 --> 00:20:00.160 align:middle line:90% something you come back from. 00:20:00.160 --> 00:20:03.000 align:middle line:84% And so right around, then, this account, 00:20:03.000 --> 00:20:06.820 align:middle line:84% the account was consolidated at Ogilvy, and I want to show you, 00:20:06.820 --> 00:20:11.640 align:middle line:84% if I can get my technology right here, 00:20:11.640 --> 00:20:16.380 align:middle line:84% I want to show you a commercial that was done not by Ogilvy. 00:20:16.380 --> 00:20:20.920 align:middle line:90% 00:20:20.920 --> 00:20:30.720 align:middle line:84% It was done by a predecessor agency of Ogilvy, and they had-- 00:20:30.720 --> 00:20:34.040 align:middle line:84% basically every fiefdom within IBM 00:20:34.040 --> 00:20:40.000 align:middle line:84% had its own stable of advertising companies. 00:20:40.000 --> 00:20:42.040 align:middle line:84% And for some reason, although they 00:20:42.040 --> 00:20:45.980 align:middle line:84% had done a really great job launching the IBM PC, 00:20:45.980 --> 00:20:48.772 align:middle line:84% they changed agencies, and they went to an agency 00:20:48.772 --> 00:20:50.980 align:middle line:84% that-- they changed agencies several times, actually, 00:20:50.980 --> 00:20:52.772 align:middle line:84% and they went to an advertising agency that 00:20:52.772 --> 00:20:54.560 align:middle line:84% had done-- that kind of did jingles, 00:20:54.560 --> 00:20:57.520 align:middle line:84% and they were kind of known for doing packaged goods and stuff 00:20:57.520 --> 00:20:59.520 align:middle line:90% like soap and stuff like that. 00:20:59.520 --> 00:21:03.640 align:middle line:84% And so this was the launch of the PS/2, 00:21:03.640 --> 00:21:08.000 align:middle line:84% and it shows what happens when you put kind of jingle guys 00:21:08.000 --> 00:21:10.640 align:middle line:84% on a powerful piece of technology. 00:21:10.640 --> 00:21:13.440 align:middle line:84% And you'll note there's a little dig in here against Apple 00:21:13.440 --> 00:21:14.780 align:middle line:90% just in case you miss it. 00:21:14.780 --> 00:21:18.212 align:middle line:90% 00:21:18.212 --> 00:21:19.020 align:middle line:90% [VIDEO PLAYBACK] 00:21:19.020 --> 00:21:23.480 align:middle line:84% - You got to juggle 10 things all at once 00:21:23.480 --> 00:21:25.400 align:middle line:90% and get them done right. 00:21:25.400 --> 00:21:27.760 align:middle line:90% Get done before lunch. 00:21:27.760 --> 00:21:28.900 align:middle line:90% - How you got to do it? 00:21:28.900 --> 00:21:34.160 align:middle line:84% - Well, [INAUDIBLE] it with the IBM PS/2. 00:21:34.160 --> 00:21:36.200 align:middle line:84% You can do things with Michael Chow 00:21:36.200 --> 00:21:38.580 align:middle line:84% that other computers just can't handle. 00:21:38.580 --> 00:21:40.420 align:middle line:84% You got to [INAUDIBLE] power and speed. 00:21:40.420 --> 00:21:41.700 align:middle line:90% You're a forward thinker. 00:21:41.700 --> 00:21:42.660 align:middle line:90% - Yes, indeed. 00:21:42.660 --> 00:21:44.420 align:middle line:90% - How you going to do it easy? 00:21:44.420 --> 00:21:46.640 align:middle line:90% - Easy, you're going to PS/2 it. 00:21:46.640 --> 00:21:48.840 align:middle line:90% - The solution is IBM. 00:21:48.840 --> 00:21:50.798 align:middle line:90% [END PLAYBACK] 00:21:50.798 --> 00:21:52.840 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: I mean, I remember when that came out 00:21:52.840 --> 00:21:55.340 align:middle line:84% because I was working on Apple-- we just couldn't believe it 00:21:55.340 --> 00:21:57.960 align:middle line:84% because it was so incredibly-- everybody was so frightened 00:21:57.960 --> 00:22:02.160 align:middle line:84% of IBM, and it was just so bad and so stupid. 00:22:02.160 --> 00:22:06.760 align:middle line:84% And it violated every kind of ridiculous thing 00:22:06.760 --> 00:22:08.240 align:middle line:90% that you could ever do. 00:22:08.240 --> 00:22:12.720 align:middle line:90% And it was a complete flop. 00:22:12.720 --> 00:22:17.930 align:middle line:84% And they never really were able to explain why anyone would move 00:22:17.930 --> 00:22:20.530 align:middle line:84% to PS/2, and then the industry perceived it 00:22:20.530 --> 00:22:22.850 align:middle line:84% as a move back to proprietary, that there wasn't really 00:22:22.850 --> 00:22:23.710 align:middle line:90% any benefit to it. 00:22:23.710 --> 00:22:29.270 align:middle line:84% It was just IBM trying to enforce a proprietary system, 00:22:29.270 --> 00:22:31.690 align:middle line:90% a closed system. 00:22:31.690 --> 00:22:36.997 align:middle line:84% So anyway, so in there is this cover-- 00:22:36.997 --> 00:22:39.330 align:middle line:84% this is going to take a couple of seconds to switch back 00:22:39.330 --> 00:22:43.610 align:middle line:84% and forth-- is happening, they came to Ogilvy. 00:22:43.610 --> 00:22:46.948 align:middle line:90% And this was the-- 00:22:46.948 --> 00:22:48.990 align:middle line:84% let me just go through this and see what it says. 00:22:48.990 --> 00:22:50.530 align:middle line:84% Nobody ever got fired for buying IBM, which 00:22:50.530 --> 00:22:52.330 align:middle line:84% was kind of before before, and then before was they 00:22:52.330 --> 00:22:52.872 align:middle line:90% don't get it. 00:22:52.872 --> 00:22:56.010 align:middle line:84% I mean, people thought IBM really did not get it. 00:22:56.010 --> 00:22:59.790 align:middle line:84% And you see the trying very hard to be what they're not. 00:22:59.790 --> 00:23:03.830 align:middle line:84% I mean, it's not that unusual when a brand falls out of favor, 00:23:03.830 --> 00:23:06.510 align:middle line:84% they then try and be all the things they're not, 00:23:06.510 --> 00:23:09.730 align:middle line:84% thereby proving that they really aren't what everybody knew 00:23:09.730 --> 00:23:13.650 align:middle line:84% they weren't, and it goes from bad to-- 00:23:13.650 --> 00:23:18.170 align:middle line:84% from being just purely bad to being desperate and lonely. 00:23:18.170 --> 00:23:21.530 align:middle line:84% And so what I wanted to show you first here 00:23:21.530 --> 00:23:26.450 align:middle line:84% was a couple of things that Ogilvy did early on, 00:23:26.450 --> 00:23:27.710 align:middle line:90% both good and bad. 00:23:27.710 --> 00:23:30.930 align:middle line:90% 00:23:30.930 --> 00:23:32.970 align:middle line:84% I'm going to show you quite a bit of work. 00:23:32.970 --> 00:23:35.500 align:middle line:84% Most of it is either is either TV or film, 00:23:35.500 --> 00:23:37.250 align:middle line:84% just because it's more interesting to look 00:23:37.250 --> 00:23:41.210 align:middle line:84% at in an environment like this, and I don't want to pass out-- 00:23:41.210 --> 00:23:44.250 align:middle line:84% and I'm not even sure I have all the printed pieces anymore. 00:23:44.250 --> 00:23:47.090 align:middle line:84% But I mean, we've done every conceivable thing 00:23:47.090 --> 00:23:48.590 align:middle line:90% that you can do for IBM. 00:23:48.590 --> 00:23:53.330 align:middle line:84% We've done TV spots, outdoor campaigns, trade shows, 00:23:53.330 --> 00:23:57.490 align:middle line:90% podcasts, radio spots. 00:23:57.490 --> 00:24:01.050 align:middle line:84% It is a chalk on sidewalks-- oh, god, that was another one. 00:24:01.050 --> 00:24:02.410 align:middle line:90% We made a lot of mistakes. 00:24:02.410 --> 00:24:06.723 align:middle line:84% And we've done thousands and thousands and thousands 00:24:06.723 --> 00:24:07.390 align:middle line:90% of these things. 00:24:07.390 --> 00:24:10.050 align:middle line:84% So I'm just showing you a smattering of things 00:24:10.050 --> 00:24:12.570 align:middle line:84% that we've done, in part because they 00:24:12.570 --> 00:24:14.850 align:middle line:90% have some stories behind them. 00:24:14.850 --> 00:24:18.850 align:middle line:84% But one of the first things that Ogilvy did, 00:24:18.850 --> 00:24:23.850 align:middle line:84% and the first time Ogilvy right, was a campaign called Subtitles. 00:24:23.850 --> 00:24:27.490 align:middle line:84% And it started off really well, and it 00:24:27.490 --> 00:24:30.770 align:middle line:84% was under the theme line of a solution 00:24:30.770 --> 00:24:32.970 align:middle line:84% for a small planet, which was kind of back 00:24:32.970 --> 00:24:35.950 align:middle line:84% to a more thoughtful way of talking about what IBM did. 00:24:35.950 --> 00:24:37.730 align:middle line:90% And it also got to-- 00:24:37.730 --> 00:24:40.850 align:middle line:84% Lou Gerstner, who had become the CEO, 00:24:40.850 --> 00:24:43.670 align:middle line:84% basically said, IBM is a solutions company. 00:24:43.670 --> 00:24:45.962 align:middle line:84% It's more valuable together rather than breaking it up. 00:24:45.962 --> 00:24:48.337 align:middle line:84% And a lot of people, including a lot of people within IBM 00:24:48.337 --> 00:24:49.910 align:middle line:84% and a lot of the financial analysts, 00:24:49.910 --> 00:24:52.090 align:middle line:84% were all kind of clamoring to break the company up. 00:24:52.090 --> 00:24:54.570 align:middle line:84% And there had been a lot of research done on subbranding 00:24:54.570 --> 00:24:56.370 align:middle line:90% and all this other stuff. 00:24:56.370 --> 00:25:01.570 align:middle line:84% And so that was, in hindsight, a pretty enlightened call. 00:25:01.570 --> 00:25:03.030 align:middle line:90% That really saved the company. 00:25:03.030 --> 00:25:12.810 align:middle line:84% And so I'll play you the very first first Subtitle spot. 00:25:12.810 --> 00:25:13.650 align:middle line:90% [TONE] 00:25:13.650 --> 00:25:18.810 align:middle line:84% Now that series started with just little conversations 00:25:18.810 --> 00:25:23.788 align:middle line:84% like that, very unpretentious, simple, kind of charming, people 00:25:23.788 --> 00:25:24.830 align:middle line:90% talking about technology. 00:25:24.830 --> 00:25:26.690 align:middle line:84% There was another very famous commercial 00:25:26.690 --> 00:25:33.307 align:middle line:84% with a group of nuns walking through a nunnery and talking, 00:25:33.307 --> 00:25:34.890 align:middle line:84% and one of them says, I'd like to surf 00:25:34.890 --> 00:25:36.182 align:middle line:90% the web or something like that. 00:25:36.182 --> 00:25:39.130 align:middle line:84% So it was normal people and their ambitions of technology 00:25:39.130 --> 00:25:41.010 align:middle line:84% and involving IBM in that conversation, which 00:25:41.010 --> 00:25:42.490 align:middle line:90% was really smart. 00:25:42.490 --> 00:25:46.650 align:middle line:84% Now it was very smart and it was very-- 00:25:46.650 --> 00:25:48.230 align:middle line:90% it was a confident thing to do. 00:25:48.230 --> 00:25:50.930 align:middle line:84% And it had an intelligence about it, 00:25:50.930 --> 00:25:52.990 align:middle line:84% and it had a kind of a modernness to it. 00:25:52.990 --> 00:25:54.950 align:middle line:84% So this was a very popular thing, 00:25:54.950 --> 00:25:59.810 align:middle line:84% and it was kind of what we call famous advertising that 00:25:59.810 --> 00:26:03.770 align:middle line:84% gave them the sense that maybe they were righting the ship. 00:26:03.770 --> 00:26:07.850 align:middle line:84% Now, the only thing was, as big companies often do, 00:26:07.850 --> 00:26:09.650 align:middle line:84% once they have a success, they then 00:26:09.650 --> 00:26:13.050 align:middle line:84% try and make a shovel everything they do into it. 00:26:13.050 --> 00:26:17.650 align:middle line:84% And I actually was coming into Ogilvy right around then, 00:26:17.650 --> 00:26:21.153 align:middle line:84% although I don't take any blame for this particular thing. 00:26:21.153 --> 00:26:22.570 align:middle line:84% One of my early meetings was where 00:26:22.570 --> 00:26:26.050 align:middle line:84% they were discussing research about how successful this 00:26:26.050 --> 00:26:28.490 align:middle line:90% was in its testing phases. 00:26:28.490 --> 00:26:33.890 align:middle line:84% And this was a commercial for Christmas 00:26:33.890 --> 00:26:36.380 align:middle line:84% in which they wanted to keep the Subtitle campaign going. 00:26:36.380 --> 00:26:38.130 align:middle line:84% Now, the thing about the subtitle campaign 00:26:38.130 --> 00:26:41.290 align:middle line:84% is it worked really well for saying regular people are 00:26:41.290 --> 00:26:43.210 align:middle line:84% out there talking about technology, 00:26:43.210 --> 00:26:45.810 align:middle line:84% but it couldn't explain anything too complicated 00:26:45.810 --> 00:26:49.950 align:middle line:84% because you can only get so many titles into 30 seconds or 60 00:26:49.950 --> 00:26:50.450 align:middle line:90% seconds. 00:26:50.450 --> 00:26:52.470 align:middle line:84% And if you're talking about-- really, 00:26:52.470 --> 00:26:55.082 align:middle line:84% if you really want to explain complex technology, 00:26:55.082 --> 00:26:56.790 align:middle line:84% you have to explain it or demonstrate it. 00:26:56.790 --> 00:26:59.770 align:middle line:84% You can't just put it in words with all this other crap going 00:26:59.770 --> 00:27:00.410 align:middle line:90% on. 00:27:00.410 --> 00:27:02.770 align:middle line:84% So what they did was they started 00:27:02.770 --> 00:27:05.610 align:middle line:84% with this very simple thing of people walking around talking 00:27:05.610 --> 00:27:07.570 align:middle line:90% about, gee, technology is neat. 00:27:07.570 --> 00:27:11.100 align:middle line:84% And it kind of became progressively shoveling 00:27:11.100 --> 00:27:14.860 align:middle line:84% more and more great IBM products and benefits 00:27:14.860 --> 00:27:17.302 align:middle line:84% into these what had been very simple scenes. 00:27:17.302 --> 00:27:18.760 align:middle line:84% And then they started to get bored, 00:27:18.760 --> 00:27:20.218 align:middle line:84% I think, a little bit with the fact 00:27:20.218 --> 00:27:21.898 align:middle line:84% that just two French guys walking along 00:27:21.898 --> 00:27:23.440 align:middle line:84% was-- that wasn't interesting enough. 00:27:23.440 --> 00:27:26.660 align:middle line:84% So they had to they made them more and more characters, 00:27:26.660 --> 00:27:28.540 align:middle line:90% and they made them more jokey. 00:27:28.540 --> 00:27:30.960 align:middle line:84% And it became less and less about real life, 00:27:30.960 --> 00:27:32.460 align:middle line:84% about IBM being a part of real life, 00:27:32.460 --> 00:27:36.180 align:middle line:84% and more and more about a dramatic conceit that 00:27:36.180 --> 00:27:39.540 align:middle line:84% ended with this rather extravagant 00:27:39.540 --> 00:27:42.982 align:middle line:90% take on Christmas and Santa. 00:27:42.982 --> 00:27:44.440 align:middle line:84% And he couldn't read the subtitles. 00:27:44.440 --> 00:27:45.148 align:middle line:90% It didn't matter. 00:27:45.148 --> 00:27:47.660 align:middle line:90% Nobody else read it either. 00:27:47.660 --> 00:27:49.200 align:middle line:90% How do I-- 00:27:49.200 --> 00:27:49.700 align:middle line:90% [TONE] 00:27:49.700 --> 00:27:55.100 align:middle line:84% I mean, the basic problem there is 00:27:55.100 --> 00:27:57.940 align:middle line:84% that you have gone from two real French guys walking along 00:27:57.940 --> 00:28:00.600 align:middle line:84% the Seine to Santa Claus speaking Norwegian. 00:28:00.600 --> 00:28:02.560 align:middle line:84% Why does Santa Claus speak Norwegian? 00:28:02.560 --> 00:28:05.628 align:middle line:84% Well, nowhere else does he speak anything but either 00:28:05.628 --> 00:28:07.420 align:middle line:84% whatever the native language of the country 00:28:07.420 --> 00:28:09.180 align:middle line:84% is shown in, except for they had to do 00:28:09.180 --> 00:28:10.800 align:middle line:90% it to justify the subtitles. 00:28:10.800 --> 00:28:14.140 align:middle line:84% So you have Santa Claus speaking Norwegian while talking 00:28:14.140 --> 00:28:17.900 align:middle line:90% about real-time replication. 00:28:17.900 --> 00:28:20.100 align:middle line:84% I mean, it was just complete gibberish. 00:28:20.100 --> 00:28:24.140 align:middle line:84% And so this is where it had gotten 00:28:24.140 --> 00:28:26.780 align:middle line:84% to the point where we'd kind of figured out 00:28:26.780 --> 00:28:28.720 align:middle line:90% how to humanize IBM again. 00:28:28.720 --> 00:28:33.140 align:middle line:84% But we had lost our ability to talk about complex things 00:28:33.140 --> 00:28:34.540 align:middle line:90% with any kind of authority. 00:28:34.540 --> 00:28:38.780 align:middle line:84% And to make matters worse, then they did a sequel. 00:28:38.780 --> 00:28:42.580 align:middle line:84% They got so wrapped up in this that they did a sequel, which 00:28:42.580 --> 00:28:44.220 align:middle line:90% I have to show you. 00:28:44.220 --> 00:28:46.280 align:middle line:90% [TONE] 00:28:46.280 --> 00:28:48.760 align:middle line:84% So now you have to understand-- now, 00:28:48.760 --> 00:28:50.900 align:middle line:84% the other thing about-- now, normally, 00:28:50.900 --> 00:28:54.500 align:middle line:84% in most dramatic depictions of the United States 00:28:54.500 --> 00:28:56.560 align:middle line:84% of Santa Claus, you would have Santa Claus, 00:28:56.560 --> 00:28:59.400 align:middle line:84% and you usually have, if you're going to have elves, 00:28:59.400 --> 00:29:01.740 align:middle line:84% the elves are usually played by midgets, 00:29:01.740 --> 00:29:05.060 align:middle line:84% but IBM is politically correct, so you can't do that. 00:29:05.060 --> 00:29:09.520 align:middle line:84% So they then become 15-year-old boys or 18-year-old boys. 00:29:09.520 --> 00:29:13.740 align:middle line:84% So now you've got Santa in the hot tub with the 18-year-old 00:29:13.740 --> 00:29:16.740 align:middle line:90% boys speaking Norwegian. 00:29:16.740 --> 00:29:24.300 align:middle line:84% And so at that point, it had just gotten-- 00:29:24.300 --> 00:29:28.460 align:middle line:84% it had gone back to being kind of not so good again. 00:29:28.460 --> 00:29:33.015 align:middle line:84% And that's the kind of thing you deal with a lot in advertising. 00:29:33.015 --> 00:29:35.140 align:middle line:84% It sounded good at the time, and then you go do it, 00:29:35.140 --> 00:29:36.560 align:middle line:90% and you go, oh my god. 00:29:36.560 --> 00:29:39.500 align:middle line:90% 00:29:39.500 --> 00:29:43.100 align:middle line:84% When I started-- and really, I mean, I started in this business 00:29:43.100 --> 00:29:44.780 align:middle line:84% as a copywriter, and you work your way 00:29:44.780 --> 00:29:47.060 align:middle line:84% up to supervising people and more, 00:29:47.060 --> 00:29:49.360 align:middle line:90% but essentially, you write ads. 00:29:49.360 --> 00:29:50.180 align:middle line:90% You think up ads. 00:29:50.180 --> 00:29:56.780 align:middle line:84% And the group of guys that I got when I came to Ogilvy 00:29:56.780 --> 00:30:01.740 align:middle line:84% were really having struggling with IBM, and in part 00:30:01.740 --> 00:30:03.600 align:middle line:84% because the stuff was so complicated. 00:30:03.600 --> 00:30:06.340 align:middle line:84% You have to be really interested in this, 00:30:06.340 --> 00:30:09.220 align:middle line:84% or it comes through because if you just 00:30:09.220 --> 00:30:12.580 align:middle line:84% start-- because you start doing jokes like Santa Claus, 00:30:12.580 --> 00:30:15.620 align:middle line:84% if you don't love and you're not interested in the details 00:30:15.620 --> 00:30:18.060 align:middle line:90% of the technology. 00:30:18.060 --> 00:30:21.740 align:middle line:84% So the other thing was there's such a volume of work 00:30:21.740 --> 00:30:23.980 align:middle line:84% that just getting it out every day 00:30:23.980 --> 00:30:25.660 align:middle line:84% stops you sometimes from thinking 00:30:25.660 --> 00:30:28.400 align:middle line:90% about what you're trying to do. 00:30:28.400 --> 00:30:32.780 align:middle line:84% And so what I try to do is just focus the group of guys 00:30:32.780 --> 00:30:37.740 align:middle line:84% and focus some of the clients at IBM on we need to do-- 00:30:37.740 --> 00:30:39.440 align:middle line:84% two or three things we needed to do. 00:30:39.440 --> 00:30:42.200 align:middle line:84% And if we did them, we would succeed. 00:30:42.200 --> 00:30:44.320 align:middle line:84% And if we didn't, it didn't matter what we did. 00:30:44.320 --> 00:30:46.620 align:middle line:84% And so it was like our prime directive 00:30:46.620 --> 00:30:49.020 align:middle line:84% was to engage a younger audience, 00:30:49.020 --> 00:30:52.180 align:middle line:84% be a part of the future, instead a part of the past, 00:30:52.180 --> 00:30:54.320 align:middle line:90% and prove that IBM gets it. 00:30:54.320 --> 00:30:57.360 align:middle line:84% And that's kind of an issue of both style and substance. 00:30:57.360 --> 00:31:00.060 align:middle line:84% We had to be able to talk about what we do in a way that 00:31:00.060 --> 00:31:01.740 align:middle line:90% had some authority. 00:31:01.740 --> 00:31:03.180 align:middle line:84% At the same way, you had to prove 00:31:03.180 --> 00:31:05.472 align:middle line:84% that we understood the problems that people were having 00:31:05.472 --> 00:31:07.490 align:middle line:90% with everyday technology. 00:31:07.490 --> 00:31:12.238 align:middle line:84% And one of the things, again, that happens a lot in large 00:31:12.238 --> 00:31:14.780 align:middle line:84% companies-- and I think it's more true of the East Coast than 00:31:14.780 --> 00:31:19.860 align:middle line:84% it is of the West Coast, or at least it was 10, 11 years ago-- 00:31:19.860 --> 00:31:26.540 align:middle line:84% is that what IBM would do is it would spend so much time 00:31:26.540 --> 00:31:29.820 align:middle line:84% discussing issues internally that, by the time 00:31:29.820 --> 00:31:33.057 align:middle line:84% it got around to talking to the outside world about them, 00:31:33.057 --> 00:31:35.140 align:middle line:84% the outside world would have been talking about it 00:31:35.140 --> 00:31:37.740 align:middle line:84% for quite a bit because all these companies in Silicon 00:31:37.740 --> 00:31:41.600 align:middle line:84% Valley would be out doing campaigns at various levels, 00:31:41.600 --> 00:31:44.300 align:middle line:90% talking about what was going on. 00:31:44.300 --> 00:31:47.900 align:middle line:84% And IBM would arrive late and declare that, well, here's 00:31:47.900 --> 00:31:49.160 align:middle line:90% what's going on in the world. 00:31:49.160 --> 00:31:50.860 align:middle line:90% But everybody knew it already. 00:31:50.860 --> 00:31:54.700 align:middle line:84% So once again, it's proving that they weren't getting it. 00:31:54.700 --> 00:32:03.230 align:middle line:84% And so we tried to look for ways to just be credible, be what IBM 00:32:03.230 --> 00:32:06.390 align:middle line:84% always was, but be more timely, do things 00:32:06.390 --> 00:32:07.910 align:middle line:90% in a more timely fashion. 00:32:07.910 --> 00:32:11.440 align:middle line:84% Now, as this was happening, one of the first things-- what 00:32:11.440 --> 00:32:13.190 align:middle line:84% was going on was there was a lot of buzz-- 00:32:13.190 --> 00:32:16.078 align:middle line:84% from basically from about '95 on, 00:32:16.078 --> 00:32:17.870 align:middle line:84% there was a lot of buzz about the internet. 00:32:17.870 --> 00:32:21.510 align:middle line:84% So by the end of '96, the internet 00:32:21.510 --> 00:32:22.990 align:middle line:84% was-- people were talking about it. 00:32:22.990 --> 00:32:24.090 align:middle line:90% It was all over the place. 00:32:24.090 --> 00:32:25.870 align:middle line:84% But there was a lot of stuff that was just 00:32:25.870 --> 00:32:28.090 align:middle line:90% about silly, frivolous stuff. 00:32:28.090 --> 00:32:33.350 align:middle line:90% 00:32:33.350 --> 00:32:35.990 align:middle line:90% So what happened was-- 00:32:35.990 --> 00:32:40.310 align:middle line:84% IBM had bought Lotus Software, which was a very credible player 00:32:40.310 --> 00:32:46.950 align:middle line:84% in the PC space and in business computing at a PC level. 00:32:46.950 --> 00:32:55.870 align:middle line:84% And that account came to Ogilvy, and that was the first project 00:32:55.870 --> 00:32:56.970 align:middle line:90% that I worked on. 00:32:56.970 --> 00:32:59.230 align:middle line:84% And it was a little dicey because the people at Lotus 00:32:59.230 --> 00:33:00.212 align:middle line:90% were very wary about-- 00:33:00.212 --> 00:33:01.670 align:middle line:84% I mean, they had an esprit de corps 00:33:01.670 --> 00:33:05.830 align:middle line:84% that was very different than IBM and very much more West 00:33:05.830 --> 00:33:08.150 align:middle line:90% Coast in its attitude. 00:33:08.150 --> 00:33:11.550 align:middle line:84% And they weren't quite sure that they wanted to be a part of IBM. 00:33:11.550 --> 00:33:14.150 align:middle line:84% But IBM said, well, go out and do some advertising 00:33:14.150 --> 00:33:16.270 align:middle line:90% for Lotus, which we did. 00:33:16.270 --> 00:33:19.070 align:middle line:90% And so we basically wrote-- 00:33:19.070 --> 00:33:22.230 align:middle line:84% we basically decided that what Lotus was going to stand for 00:33:22.230 --> 00:33:25.510 align:middle line:84% was to be against stupid uses of the internet. 00:33:25.510 --> 00:33:27.250 align:middle line:84% And we were going to be for business, 00:33:27.250 --> 00:33:29.750 align:middle line:84% and we were going to be against stupid uses of the internet. 00:33:29.750 --> 00:33:32.550 align:middle line:84% And we basically did this campaign in about five weeks. 00:33:32.550 --> 00:33:35.310 align:middle line:84% And we used Denis Leary, who kind of 00:33:35.310 --> 00:33:39.613 align:middle line:84% is a ranting guy, who's really funny when he's against things. 00:33:39.613 --> 00:33:42.030 align:middle line:84% And I'll show you a couple of those-- the very first spots 00:33:42.030 --> 00:33:43.350 align:middle line:90% that we did. 00:33:43.350 --> 00:33:45.350 align:middle line:84% And we did them so fast, there were 00:33:45.350 --> 00:33:47.710 align:middle line:84% some-- these were quite controversial within IBM 00:33:47.710 --> 00:33:48.450 align:middle line:90% at the time. 00:33:48.450 --> 00:33:51.870 align:middle line:90% 00:33:51.870 --> 00:33:55.833 align:middle line:84% But we did them so fast that IBM couldn't muster itself 00:33:55.833 --> 00:33:58.250 align:middle line:84% to stand in the way of them just because we got them done, 00:33:58.250 --> 00:34:00.734 align:middle line:84% and we did them in about three days. 00:34:00.734 --> 00:34:02.430 align:middle line:90% [BEEP] 00:34:02.430 --> 00:34:05.390 align:middle line:84% And so that was a very different attitude. 00:34:05.390 --> 00:34:08.417 align:middle line:84% And they were pretty controversial within IBM, 00:34:08.417 --> 00:34:10.250 align:middle line:84% I think, but they certainly struck a chord-- 00:34:10.250 --> 00:34:11.375 align:middle line:90% I mean, I think, actually-- 00:34:11.375 --> 00:34:12.150 align:middle line:90% I can't remember. 00:34:12.150 --> 00:34:16.909 align:middle line:84% There was one of these campaigns we did early on where 00:34:16.909 --> 00:34:18.989 align:middle line:90% Gerstner really didn't like it. 00:34:18.989 --> 00:34:22.150 align:middle line:84% But he showed it to his son, and his son said, that's cool. 00:34:22.150 --> 00:34:23.780 align:middle line:84% You should be doing more of that. 00:34:23.780 --> 00:34:25.530 align:middle line:84% That's the coolest thing you've ever done. 00:34:25.530 --> 00:34:27.310 align:middle line:90% And that saved us. 00:34:27.310 --> 00:34:29.448 align:middle line:90% [LAUGHTER] 00:34:29.448 --> 00:34:30.389 align:middle line:90% 00:34:30.389 --> 00:34:33.590 align:middle line:84% And so there was another one we did in that series, which I 00:34:33.590 --> 00:34:34.190 align:middle line:90% just-- 00:34:34.190 --> 00:34:37.449 align:middle line:84% I've always liked this one because it's entertaining. 00:34:37.449 --> 00:34:39.284 align:middle line:90% [BEEP] 00:34:39.284 --> 00:34:41.510 align:middle line:90% 00:34:41.510 --> 00:34:45.550 align:middle line:84% So anyway, so that gave a different jolt 00:34:45.550 --> 00:34:47.489 align:middle line:90% to the whole process. 00:34:47.489 --> 00:34:53.870 align:middle line:84% And while we were doing that, we had a discussion with Lotus, 00:34:53.870 --> 00:34:56.750 align:middle line:84% and they were concerned that Denis Leary wouldn't 00:34:56.750 --> 00:34:58.030 align:middle line:90% work overseas. 00:34:58.030 --> 00:35:01.750 align:middle line:84% And so we went, and we shot another commercial 00:35:01.750 --> 00:35:03.350 align:middle line:84% while we were shooting the other ones. 00:35:03.350 --> 00:35:06.710 align:middle line:84% And it was basically the story of a conference call from hell, 00:35:06.710 --> 00:35:09.950 align:middle line:84% where none of the technology worked. 00:35:09.950 --> 00:35:12.130 align:middle line:90% And it was pretty good. 00:35:12.130 --> 00:35:14.070 align:middle line:84% I mean, we shot it in about 45 minutes. 00:35:14.070 --> 00:35:16.350 align:middle line:84% But when we were done with it, Lotus 00:35:16.350 --> 00:35:19.390 align:middle line:84% was so enamored with Leary, and they liked him, 00:35:19.390 --> 00:35:21.430 align:middle line:84% and he clearly was-- and they liked the fact 00:35:21.430 --> 00:35:24.510 align:middle line:84% that IBM was nervous about it because it made them feel 00:35:24.510 --> 00:35:26.950 align:middle line:90% like they were still Lotus. 00:35:26.950 --> 00:35:30.873 align:middle line:84% And so we just kind of put this spot in a drawer, 00:35:30.873 --> 00:35:32.790 align:middle line:84% and we didn't do anything with it for a while. 00:35:32.790 --> 00:35:36.110 align:middle line:84% And about-- I don't know-- four or five months later, 00:35:36.110 --> 00:35:39.910 align:middle line:84% we were doing some other work and still struggling quite a bit 00:35:39.910 --> 00:35:43.990 align:middle line:84% with IBM and where to go after the Subtitles because the other 00:35:43.990 --> 00:35:48.790 align:middle line:84% thing is, the thing with the Santa Claus and the dwarves-- 00:35:48.790 --> 00:35:52.070 align:middle line:90% or the young boys in hot tubs-- 00:35:52.070 --> 00:35:53.910 align:middle line:90% young Vulcans in hot tubs-- 00:35:53.910 --> 00:36:03.410 align:middle line:84% was that someone had screwed up, and by accident, 00:36:03.410 --> 00:36:06.990 align:middle line:84% they had run that spot 26 times on New Year's Day 00:36:06.990 --> 00:36:09.710 align:middle line:90% in the middle of football. 00:36:09.710 --> 00:36:12.510 align:middle line:84% And so the next day, like Regis and Kathie Lee 00:36:12.510 --> 00:36:15.690 align:middle line:84% are making fun of, IBM can't afford more than one commercial. 00:36:15.690 --> 00:36:26.410 align:middle line:84% And it was just unbelievably stupid and really bad. 00:36:26.410 --> 00:36:28.550 align:middle line:84% So as all this is going on, we're 00:36:28.550 --> 00:36:32.270 align:middle line:84% trying to come up with some new campaign 00:36:32.270 --> 00:36:34.670 align:middle line:84% and really having a lot of trouble with it. 00:36:34.670 --> 00:36:37.870 align:middle line:84% And so one of the exercises we did in desperation 00:36:37.870 --> 00:36:39.830 align:middle line:84% was to take this spot that you're 00:36:39.830 --> 00:36:43.990 align:middle line:84% about to see and just put an IBM logo at the end of it. 00:36:43.990 --> 00:36:45.463 align:middle line:90% [BEEP] 00:36:45.463 --> 00:36:47.430 align:middle line:90% [LAUGHTER] 00:36:47.430 --> 00:36:48.890 align:middle line:90% Now that wasn't the form-- 00:36:48.890 --> 00:36:51.360 align:middle line:84% I mean, the interesting thing about that campaign, which 00:36:51.360 --> 00:36:56.440 align:middle line:84% wound up being a pretty famous campaign-- it has now 00:36:56.440 --> 00:37:00.740 align:middle line:84% run in some form or another for almost 10 years. 00:37:00.740 --> 00:37:05.480 align:middle line:84% And the original spot was shot for a different company. 00:37:05.480 --> 00:37:08.240 align:middle line:84% It was shot in color, and the letter boxing 00:37:08.240 --> 00:37:13.117 align:middle line:84% was something that we added later, along the way. 00:37:13.117 --> 00:37:15.200 align:middle line:84% One of the things I think is cool about technology 00:37:15.200 --> 00:37:17.180 align:middle line:84% is it's inherently improvisational. 00:37:17.180 --> 00:37:20.027 align:middle line:84% That's part of the beauty of it is you take this piece 00:37:20.027 --> 00:37:22.360 align:middle line:84% and this piece together, and you get something you never 00:37:22.360 --> 00:37:23.420 align:middle line:90% thought you were going to get. 00:37:23.420 --> 00:37:25.200 align:middle line:84% Or you hand it to somebody, and you get something you never 00:37:25.200 --> 00:37:26.540 align:middle line:90% thought you were going to get. 00:37:26.540 --> 00:37:33.720 align:middle line:84% So I've always tried to embrace the dynamic nature of change 00:37:33.720 --> 00:37:36.600 align:middle line:84% that's part of the business and take it into the advertising 00:37:36.600 --> 00:37:39.498 align:middle line:84% business because the nature of a lot of marketing 00:37:39.498 --> 00:37:41.040 align:middle line:84% and a lot of marketing communications 00:37:41.040 --> 00:37:43.720 align:middle line:84% is to try and distill things down slowly, over time, 00:37:43.720 --> 00:37:48.000 align:middle line:84% to the perfect answer, whereas, in technology, everything 00:37:48.000 --> 00:37:50.600 align:middle line:84% changes week to week, month to month. 00:37:50.600 --> 00:37:53.680 align:middle line:84% And if you can't do things quickly or take advantage 00:37:53.680 --> 00:37:58.000 align:middle line:84% of change, you can get in fairly desperate trouble 00:37:58.000 --> 00:37:59.560 align:middle line:90% pretty quickly. 00:37:59.560 --> 00:38:02.200 align:middle line:84% So we evolved this improvisational style, 00:38:02.200 --> 00:38:04.940 align:middle line:84% where we would go out to write some commercials, 00:38:04.940 --> 00:38:07.340 align:middle line:84% or we'd start on a piece thinking it's going to go here, 00:38:07.340 --> 00:38:09.590 align:middle line:84% and then it would go someplace a little bit different. 00:38:09.590 --> 00:38:12.280 align:middle line:84% At IBM, one of the big changes for IBM 00:38:12.280 --> 00:38:15.640 align:middle line:84% was they kind of got used to working that way. 00:38:15.640 --> 00:38:21.760 align:middle line:84% And eventually, pretty quickly, we came to this e-business 00:38:21.760 --> 00:38:24.680 align:middle line:84% campaign, which came out, I think, of-- 00:38:24.680 --> 00:38:27.480 align:middle line:84% I think the idea of doing e-business came out 00:38:27.480 --> 00:38:29.680 align:middle line:90% of corporate-- 00:38:29.680 --> 00:38:31.372 align:middle line:90% John Iwata's group or something. 00:38:31.372 --> 00:38:33.080 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: [INAUDIBLE] my-- 00:38:33.080 --> 00:38:34.560 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Or it was you, I mean, because-- 00:38:34.560 --> 00:38:36.060 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: [INAUDIBLE] 00:38:36.060 --> 00:38:37.640 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: But it was-- 00:38:37.640 --> 00:38:39.880 align:middle line:84% I mean, it comes down to the agency, like e-business. 00:38:39.880 --> 00:38:45.640 align:middle line:90% And for us, the problem was-- 00:38:45.640 --> 00:38:47.240 align:middle line:90% if you look at-- 00:38:47.240 --> 00:38:49.600 align:middle line:84% it's very hard to do brand transformations. 00:38:49.600 --> 00:38:51.320 align:middle line:90% They're hard to do. 00:38:51.320 --> 00:38:53.680 align:middle line:84% But usually, when they happen, they're 00:38:53.680 --> 00:38:55.400 align:middle line:84% anchored in some kind of product. 00:38:55.400 --> 00:39:02.440 align:middle line:84% So when Apple transformed itself recently, it was the iPod. 00:39:02.440 --> 00:39:04.840 align:middle line:84% The iPod was a transforming technology. 00:39:04.840 --> 00:39:07.200 align:middle line:84% It mostly came down to, here's your music. 00:39:07.200 --> 00:39:10.920 align:middle line:84% And so everybody who bought one of those things, that was 00:39:10.920 --> 00:39:12.920 align:middle line:90% the proof of transformation. 00:39:12.920 --> 00:39:14.960 align:middle line:84% When Volkswagen-- I mean, Volkswagen 00:39:14.960 --> 00:39:19.200 align:middle line:84% had a terrible slump for 20 years. 00:39:19.200 --> 00:39:21.100 align:middle line:84% But when they came out with a new Beetle, 00:39:21.100 --> 00:39:22.060 align:middle line:90% it changed everything. 00:39:22.060 --> 00:39:23.685 align:middle line:84% And they became a new company, and they 00:39:23.685 --> 00:39:26.280 align:middle line:90% became much more successful. 00:39:26.280 --> 00:39:28.160 align:middle line:90% But IBM really didn't do that. 00:39:28.160 --> 00:39:34.660 align:middle line:84% And IBM still makes basically, evolved, 00:39:34.660 --> 00:39:39.660 align:middle line:84% but the same products that they made 25 years ago, 00:39:39.660 --> 00:39:44.420 align:middle line:84% and certainly in 1996, there wasn't anything new. 00:39:44.420 --> 00:39:46.560 align:middle line:84% I mean, there wasn't very much you could touch. 00:39:46.560 --> 00:39:48.720 align:middle line:84% Now there's nothing you could touch 00:39:48.720 --> 00:39:53.680 align:middle line:84% because they've sold off the Personal Computing Division. 00:39:53.680 --> 00:39:55.480 align:middle line:84% And so it was hard for us because it 00:39:55.480 --> 00:39:58.000 align:middle line:84% was like, you need something to take a picture of that you 00:39:58.000 --> 00:39:58.880 align:middle line:90% can say, see? 00:39:58.880 --> 00:40:00.880 align:middle line:90% We've changed. 00:40:00.880 --> 00:40:03.780 align:middle line:90% So we approached e-business-- 00:40:03.780 --> 00:40:06.840 align:middle line:84% I mean, the reason we did this logo was because we needed 00:40:06.840 --> 00:40:09.160 align:middle line:84% something to show, something to happen 00:40:09.160 --> 00:40:11.400 align:middle line:90% that would, say, become a-- 00:40:11.400 --> 00:40:13.560 align:middle line:84% so we tried to treat this like a product launch 00:40:13.560 --> 00:40:15.280 align:middle line:90% without any products. 00:40:15.280 --> 00:40:17.660 align:middle line:90% And we found that-- 00:40:17.660 --> 00:40:20.840 align:middle line:84% you see the problem of the Santa Claus commercial, 00:40:20.840 --> 00:40:24.560 align:middle line:84% besides being a stupid idea, was that you're 00:40:24.560 --> 00:40:27.160 align:middle line:84% taking something very arcane and complex 00:40:27.160 --> 00:40:28.640 align:middle line:84% and trying to jam it into something 00:40:28.640 --> 00:40:31.015 align:middle line:84% and make it interesting in the middle of a football game. 00:40:31.015 --> 00:40:32.560 align:middle line:90% And it's not. 00:40:32.560 --> 00:40:34.900 align:middle line:84% It's not an executive forum or a demo or something. 00:40:34.900 --> 00:40:36.540 align:middle line:84% It's the middle of a football game. 00:40:36.540 --> 00:40:40.960 align:middle line:84% So it has to be somewhat interesting and motivating 00:40:40.960 --> 00:40:43.240 align:middle line:84% in the midst of an environment where somebody's not 00:40:43.240 --> 00:40:45.040 align:middle line:90% really prepared to look at it. 00:40:45.040 --> 00:40:48.120 align:middle line:84% And what we found is that whenever 00:40:48.120 --> 00:40:50.400 align:middle line:84% you can't explain the solution, people 00:40:50.400 --> 00:40:52.720 align:middle line:90% do understand the problem. 00:40:52.720 --> 00:40:55.900 align:middle line:84% I mean, it's an old advertising convention, but it's true. 00:40:55.900 --> 00:40:58.000 align:middle line:90% People understand problems. 00:40:58.000 --> 00:40:59.840 align:middle line:84% The other thing that was good for IBM 00:40:59.840 --> 00:41:03.960 align:middle line:84% was that we were able to talk about problems in a way that 00:41:03.960 --> 00:41:05.760 align:middle line:84% said, we can help-- not necessarily 00:41:05.760 --> 00:41:08.960 align:middle line:84% that we have all the answers, but that we can help. 00:41:08.960 --> 00:41:12.720 align:middle line:84% And that sort of disarmed people and gave them a chance 00:41:12.720 --> 00:41:16.080 align:middle line:84% to think about IBM as being something 00:41:16.080 --> 00:41:18.860 align:middle line:84% that was different and was among the people, 00:41:18.860 --> 00:41:22.043 align:middle line:84% as opposed to this monolithic dinosaur. 00:41:22.043 --> 00:41:23.960 align:middle line:84% The other thing that was good about e-business 00:41:23.960 --> 00:41:27.300 align:middle line:90% was that it wasn't proprietary. 00:41:27.300 --> 00:41:30.637 align:middle line:84% Even though the lawyers will always try to own it-- 00:41:30.637 --> 00:41:33.220 align:middle line:84% the lawyers don't really like the whole notion of open source. 00:41:33.220 --> 00:41:34.420 align:middle line:90% They don't like it. 00:41:34.420 --> 00:41:36.363 align:middle line:84% And so they'll always try and own it. 00:41:36.363 --> 00:41:38.280 align:middle line:84% And Microsoft, at the time we were doing this, 00:41:38.280 --> 00:41:41.990 align:middle line:84% was really at the peak of their strength. 00:41:41.990 --> 00:41:45.010 align:middle line:84% And they were trying to sell an idea called Digital Nervous 00:41:45.010 --> 00:41:48.730 align:middle line:84% System, which was a proprietary marketing gimmick, whereas we 00:41:48.730 --> 00:41:54.930 align:middle line:84% said, we want everybody to use this terminology that we use, 00:41:54.930 --> 00:41:56.810 align:middle line:84% so that if everybody uses it, then 00:41:56.810 --> 00:41:59.450 align:middle line:84% we become part of something that's seen as successful, 00:41:59.450 --> 00:42:02.770 align:middle line:84% rather than just trying to own this and go and do 00:42:02.770 --> 00:42:03.970 align:middle line:90% the e-business boutique. 00:42:03.970 --> 00:42:06.428 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: But we didn't trademark e-business 00:42:06.428 --> 00:42:07.200 align:middle line:90% on purpose-- 00:42:07.200 --> 00:42:07.950 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Right. 00:42:07.950 --> 00:42:08.150 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: --just the E. 00:42:08.150 --> 00:42:09.108 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Just the E. 00:42:09.108 --> 00:42:11.290 align:middle line:90% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Yeah. 00:42:11.290 --> 00:42:15.130 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: And actually, at the time this campaign broke, 00:42:15.130 --> 00:42:17.650 align:middle line:84% Intel had a group called Pandisc, I think, 00:42:17.650 --> 00:42:18.870 align:middle line:90% that was doing e-business. 00:42:18.870 --> 00:42:20.330 align:middle line:90% They didn't do it very loud. 00:42:20.330 --> 00:42:27.030 align:middle line:84% And HP had an online zine called e-business, too. 00:42:27.030 --> 00:42:29.530 align:middle line:90% I mean, it was around. 00:42:29.530 --> 00:42:33.050 align:middle line:84% So the fact that it wasn't proprietary to IBM 00:42:33.050 --> 00:42:35.170 align:middle line:90% was really helpful. 00:42:35.170 --> 00:42:40.450 align:middle line:84% And so anyway, so I'm going to show you the very first things-- 00:42:40.450 --> 00:42:42.990 align:middle line:84% that conference call spot was the very first spot. 00:42:42.990 --> 00:42:45.210 align:middle line:84% And then the next is sort of a group 00:42:45.210 --> 00:42:49.210 align:middle line:84% of things that happened in the early part of the campaign. 00:42:49.210 --> 00:42:50.850 align:middle line:84% And they, a lot of times, didn't really 00:42:50.850 --> 00:42:53.850 align:middle line:84% spell out exactly what IBM did, but they just 00:42:53.850 --> 00:42:56.090 align:middle line:84% tried to get inside the problems. 00:42:56.090 --> 00:42:57.485 align:middle line:90% [BEEP] 00:42:57.485 --> 00:42:58.610 align:middle line:90% I mean, that kind of gets-- 00:42:58.610 --> 00:43:00.050 align:middle line:90% even the-- yes? 00:43:00.050 --> 00:43:03.610 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So where does this "Solutions for a Small Planet" 00:43:03.610 --> 00:43:04.430 align:middle line:90% come from? 00:43:04.430 --> 00:43:06.530 align:middle line:90% Is that from before you guys? 00:43:06.530 --> 00:43:11.770 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: No, that was an Ogilvy idea. 00:43:11.770 --> 00:43:15.630 align:middle line:84% But it started with the Subtitles campaign, 00:43:15.630 --> 00:43:17.130 align:middle line:84% and then it kind of carried through. 00:43:17.130 --> 00:43:18.930 align:middle line:84% And then eventually, what we found 00:43:18.930 --> 00:43:21.690 align:middle line:84% is people kind of referred to us as the e-business campaign. 00:43:21.690 --> 00:43:25.090 align:middle line:84% And so we just didn't need it, and it just kind of went away. 00:43:25.090 --> 00:43:27.850 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: What was that for? 00:43:27.850 --> 00:43:30.850 align:middle line:90% What message does that send? 00:43:30.850 --> 00:43:33.930 align:middle line:84% [? Solutions ?] of all kinds, that kind of message? 00:43:33.930 --> 00:43:36.410 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Well, some of it was IBM-- 00:43:36.410 --> 00:43:39.410 align:middle line:84% I mean, I think in the context of what it was written as, it 00:43:39.410 --> 00:43:42.690 align:middle line:84% was, IBM was perceived as a hardware company and a mainframe 00:43:42.690 --> 00:43:45.730 align:middle line:84% company, and "Solutions" perceived as something more 00:43:45.730 --> 00:43:47.770 align:middle line:90% current and more modern. 00:43:47.770 --> 00:43:50.530 align:middle line:84% And "Small Planet" was just about the kind of social dynamic 00:43:50.530 --> 00:43:52.870 align:middle line:84% of the internet and everything, the connected world, 00:43:52.870 --> 00:43:54.170 align:middle line:90% bringing everybody together. 00:43:54.170 --> 00:43:54.830 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: But remember, you 00:43:54.830 --> 00:43:56.490 align:middle line:84% also said it the first [? time ?] 00:43:56.490 --> 00:44:00.370 align:middle line:84% that, when it first came out in '93, 00:44:00.370 --> 00:44:05.770 align:middle line:84% IBM was going to tear itself apart. 00:44:05.770 --> 00:44:08.350 align:middle line:84% And so the "Solutions for a Small Planet," 00:44:08.350 --> 00:44:12.650 align:middle line:84% when it first came out in '93, was a signal that IBM was not 00:44:12.650 --> 00:44:14.470 align:middle line:90% going to tear itself apart. 00:44:14.470 --> 00:44:17.130 align:middle line:90% And that was what-- 00:44:17.130 --> 00:44:19.022 align:middle line:90% you said that at the beginning. 00:44:19.022 --> 00:44:21.230 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: I mean, also, I mean, one of the things-- 00:44:21.230 --> 00:44:22.270 align:middle line:84% and I haven't talked about it at all, 00:44:22.270 --> 00:44:25.370 align:middle line:84% but as we get into some of this other stuff, a big part of this 00:44:25.370 --> 00:44:28.330 align:middle line:90% was talking to IBM. 00:44:28.330 --> 00:44:32.370 align:middle line:84% A lot of this work talked to IBM about itself. 00:44:32.370 --> 00:44:36.010 align:middle line:84% And I think one of the things that Gerstner tried to do 00:44:36.010 --> 00:44:38.250 align:middle line:84% was lead the company from the outside 00:44:38.250 --> 00:44:40.435 align:middle line:84% by setting the agenda for the inside from outside. 00:44:40.435 --> 00:44:41.810 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: In fact, 00:44:41.810 --> 00:44:47.250 align:middle line:84% if I can put in context what was going on, remember, 00:44:47.250 --> 00:44:50.130 align:middle line:84% we had done this strategy for the business, 00:44:50.130 --> 00:44:52.770 align:middle line:84% and we were trying to execute it. 00:44:52.770 --> 00:44:55.930 align:middle line:84% The question is, how do you explain it? 00:44:55.930 --> 00:44:58.970 align:middle line:90% I mean, it was everything. 00:44:58.970 --> 00:45:01.490 align:middle line:84% So how the hell do you explain it? 00:45:01.490 --> 00:45:05.530 align:middle line:84% And the hardest people to explain anything to 00:45:05.530 --> 00:45:07.970 align:middle line:90% is our own people. 00:45:07.970 --> 00:45:10.850 align:middle line:84% They wanted to know, well, OK, so what do I sell? 00:45:10.850 --> 00:45:13.130 align:middle line:84% And we say, well, sell everything. 00:45:13.130 --> 00:45:15.490 align:middle line:90% Yes, I know, but-- 00:45:15.490 --> 00:45:16.430 align:middle line:90% this is bullshit. 00:45:16.430 --> 00:45:19.570 align:middle line:84% There were lots of things like that. 00:45:19.570 --> 00:45:23.650 align:middle line:84% And somehow, when the ads started 00:45:23.650 --> 00:45:29.830 align:middle line:84% to appear in the fall of 1997, it changed everything. 00:45:29.830 --> 00:45:32.370 align:middle line:84% Within six months and [INAUDIBLE] probably a few more 00:45:32.370 --> 00:45:39.050 align:middle line:84% ads, people started to get it, which gets back to something you 00:45:39.050 --> 00:45:43.570 align:middle line:84% were mentioning over dinner last night, that a lot of what your-- 00:45:43.570 --> 00:45:46.330 align:middle line:90% 00:45:46.330 --> 00:45:52.130 align:middle line:84% you were explaining the parallel between religion and dystopia. 00:45:52.130 --> 00:45:53.990 align:middle line:90% You need people to believe. 00:45:53.990 --> 00:45:58.270 align:middle line:84% And if they believe, they say, ah, now I understand. 00:45:58.270 --> 00:46:01.690 align:middle line:84% And if they don't want to believe, they say, this is crap. 00:46:01.690 --> 00:46:05.150 align:middle line:84% These advertising people-- it's empty. 00:46:05.150 --> 00:46:07.990 align:middle line:84% But it's a very subtle boundary, isn't it, 00:46:07.990 --> 00:46:11.508 align:middle line:84% between, do you get people to believe, or do people-- 00:46:11.508 --> 00:46:13.050 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Well, I mean, I've always 00:46:13.050 --> 00:46:16.290 align:middle line:84% felt like technology is a faith business because if you believe 00:46:16.290 --> 00:46:18.770 align:middle line:84% that somebody can do what they say, you'll pay them, 00:46:18.770 --> 00:46:20.230 align:middle line:90% and you'll pay a premium for it. 00:46:20.230 --> 00:46:22.830 align:middle line:84% And if you don't, you simply won't hire them. 00:46:22.830 --> 00:46:24.330 align:middle line:84% And since you don't really know-- 00:46:24.330 --> 00:46:27.740 align:middle line:84% I mean, you're not selling just a box. 00:46:27.740 --> 00:46:29.490 align:middle line:84% Or if you are, you're going to configure-- 00:46:29.490 --> 00:46:30.450 align:middle line:90% [DING] 00:46:30.450 --> 00:46:31.400 align:middle line:90% What was that about? 00:46:31.400 --> 00:46:32.120 align:middle line:90% Good Lord. 00:46:32.120 --> 00:46:33.735 align:middle line:90% [LAUGHTER] 00:46:33.735 --> 00:46:34.860 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Sorry about that. 00:46:34.860 --> 00:46:36.068 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: That's all right. 00:46:36.068 --> 00:46:37.406 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE] 00:46:37.406 --> 00:46:39.680 align:middle line:90% 00:46:39.680 --> 00:46:43.760 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: But I mean, it really does come down to faith. 00:46:43.760 --> 00:46:47.420 align:middle line:84% I mean, it's funny because a lot of faith 00:46:47.420 --> 00:46:50.660 align:middle line:84% comes from a perception of momentum. 00:46:50.660 --> 00:46:52.680 align:middle line:84% It comes from a perception of new, 00:46:52.680 --> 00:46:54.120 align:middle line:90% even if not necessarily new. 00:46:54.120 --> 00:46:55.940 align:middle line:90% It comes from good press. 00:46:55.940 --> 00:46:59.217 align:middle line:84% One of the things that Apple did with the iPod that 00:46:59.217 --> 00:47:01.800 align:middle line:84% was so brilliant, and they've done it really well a few times, 00:47:01.800 --> 00:47:06.060 align:middle line:84% is they made it seem very big in a few places. 00:47:06.060 --> 00:47:07.520 align:middle line:84% They didn't make it necessarily-- 00:47:07.520 --> 00:47:09.937 align:middle line:84% they didn't spend all their money everywhere in the world. 00:47:09.937 --> 00:47:12.223 align:middle line:90% But they went into Soho. 00:47:12.223 --> 00:47:14.140 align:middle line:84% I'm sure they were around here at certain key, 00:47:14.140 --> 00:47:17.040 align:middle line:84% influential colleges, stuff like that. 00:47:17.040 --> 00:47:23.180 align:middle line:84% And they seemed to be very big in those places. 00:47:23.180 --> 00:47:24.415 align:middle line:90% And that's-- yes? 00:47:24.415 --> 00:47:25.040 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah. 00:47:25.040 --> 00:47:28.140 align:middle line:84% So the other thing was the artistic choice 00:47:28.140 --> 00:47:29.780 align:middle line:84% of putting blue-- obviously, it's 00:47:29.780 --> 00:47:35.340 align:middle line:84% for emphasizing the brand, the blue associated with IBM. 00:47:35.340 --> 00:47:38.460 align:middle line:84% And the black and white is just so that [INAUDIBLE]. 00:47:38.460 --> 00:47:40.060 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Just to look different. 00:47:40.060 --> 00:47:41.260 align:middle line:90% Here was the challenge. 00:47:41.260 --> 00:47:43.540 align:middle line:84% We wanted to do something that looked different, 00:47:43.540 --> 00:47:46.460 align:middle line:84% but we didn't want to be-- because the problem with the PS2 00:47:46.460 --> 00:47:49.140 align:middle line:84% thing, aside from the fact that it's just stupid, 00:47:49.140 --> 00:47:54.900 align:middle line:84% was that it was trying to be not what IBM is. 00:47:54.900 --> 00:47:56.500 align:middle line:84% And so what we said is, look, there's 00:47:56.500 --> 00:47:58.215 align:middle line:84% a lot of people who are rooting for IBM. 00:47:58.215 --> 00:48:00.340 align:middle line:84% There are a lot of people who have the faith in IBM 00:48:00.340 --> 00:48:03.057 align:middle line:84% and want IBM to be seen as good because they go in 00:48:03.057 --> 00:48:04.640 align:middle line:84% and sell it to their own constituency. 00:48:04.640 --> 00:48:08.780 align:middle line:84% I mean, IBM has a huge-- any of these technology companies have 00:48:08.780 --> 00:48:11.758 align:middle line:84% got a huge constituency of people who are their supporters, 00:48:11.758 --> 00:48:13.300 align:middle line:84% whether they're business partners who 00:48:13.300 --> 00:48:17.020 align:middle line:84% are selling the stuff or people on the inside who 00:48:17.020 --> 00:48:19.340 align:middle line:84% have signed their careers away because they have faith. 00:48:19.340 --> 00:48:20.560 align:middle line:90% And somebody says, fine. 00:48:20.560 --> 00:48:23.700 align:middle line:84% If you think it's good, then we'll write a check. 00:48:23.700 --> 00:48:27.600 align:middle line:84% And so there were a lot of people who were rooting for IBM. 00:48:27.600 --> 00:48:31.180 align:middle line:84% So when we did this campaign, we tried 00:48:31.180 --> 00:48:35.340 align:middle line:84% to be true to what IBM was about without being 00:48:35.340 --> 00:48:37.900 align:middle line:84% the old paternal-- there was a very 00:48:37.900 --> 00:48:42.218 align:middle line:84% paternal voice of big corporations that say-- it's 00:48:42.218 --> 00:48:44.260 align:middle line:84% sort of like the oil companies when they come out 00:48:44.260 --> 00:48:48.340 align:middle line:84% and do campaigns where they say, we're putting fish hatcheries 00:48:48.340 --> 00:48:50.940 align:middle line:84% in, and we're making the world-- these kind 00:48:50.940 --> 00:48:52.200 align:middle line:90% of big, bombastic things. 00:48:52.200 --> 00:48:55.020 align:middle line:84% Nobody believes them, ever, because they're not true. 00:48:55.020 --> 00:48:58.340 align:middle line:84% We actually did a campaign for British Petroleum where we did 00:48:58.340 --> 00:48:59.160 align:middle line:90% "It's a Start." 00:48:59.160 --> 00:49:02.300 align:middle line:84% And it's much more effective because it doesn't say 00:49:02.300 --> 00:49:04.160 align:middle line:90% that BP is fixing everything. 00:49:04.160 --> 00:49:06.980 align:middle line:84% It just says, we're starting, and it's 00:49:06.980 --> 00:49:09.900 align:middle line:90% got a tone that's more grounded. 00:49:09.900 --> 00:49:12.300 align:middle line:84% And so it's much more credible that it's 00:49:12.300 --> 00:49:15.180 align:middle line:84% a start than it is that it's the answer because they're clearly 00:49:15.180 --> 00:49:17.960 align:middle line:84% a gas company, and they sell gasoline. 00:49:17.960 --> 00:49:21.780 align:middle line:90% 00:49:21.780 --> 00:49:25.440 align:middle line:84% I mean, we did things like we used humor, humor and irony, 00:49:25.440 --> 00:49:27.740 align:middle line:90% just as kind of a-- 00:49:27.740 --> 00:49:31.660 align:middle line:84% because it translates as confidence. 00:49:31.660 --> 00:49:34.340 align:middle line:84% If you can make people laugh, they usually like you. 00:49:34.340 --> 00:49:36.400 align:middle line:84% And I mean, it's not more complicated than that. 00:49:36.400 --> 00:49:40.333 align:middle line:84% So I have two more of those that I'll show you. 00:49:40.333 --> 00:49:42.000 align:middle line:90% [BEEP] 00:49:42.000 --> 00:49:42.500 align:middle line:90% 00:49:42.500 --> 00:49:47.100 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: In the early days of the business-- 00:49:47.100 --> 00:49:49.820 align:middle line:90% it may have been '97-- 00:49:49.820 --> 00:49:59.100 align:middle line:84% but we got a call in December that Victoria's Secret 00:49:59.100 --> 00:50:02.520 align:middle line:84% wants to put their fashion show on the web. 00:50:02.520 --> 00:50:06.600 align:middle line:84% Now, I don't know if you know Victoria's Secret Fashion Show, 00:50:06.600 --> 00:50:11.380 align:middle line:84% but you can imagine what it looks like. 00:50:11.380 --> 00:50:13.600 align:middle line:90% And we said, great. 00:50:13.600 --> 00:50:17.260 align:middle line:90% Have you talked to the CIO? 00:50:17.260 --> 00:50:19.180 align:middle line:90% No. 00:50:19.180 --> 00:50:20.700 align:middle line:90% We need help. 00:50:20.700 --> 00:50:23.340 align:middle line:90% This is December. 00:50:23.340 --> 00:50:27.420 align:middle line:84% They were going to do an ad in the Super Bowl 00:50:27.420 --> 00:50:31.420 align:middle line:84% to tell everybody that, in another two weeks, 00:50:31.420 --> 00:50:34.700 align:middle line:84% they were going to do the thing on the web. 00:50:34.700 --> 00:50:39.040 align:middle line:84% And these people were just going bananas. 00:50:39.040 --> 00:50:41.340 align:middle line:84% What the hell are they going to do? 00:50:41.340 --> 00:50:46.920 align:middle line:84% The net of that is that the website, at the end, 00:50:46.920 --> 00:50:48.600 align:middle line:90% we did all kinds of things. 00:50:48.600 --> 00:50:53.700 align:middle line:84% It's [? stable. ?] We were able to keep it together. 00:50:53.700 --> 00:50:58.440 align:middle line:84% We had to sign on to the company Mark Cuban [? sold. ?] 00:50:58.440 --> 00:51:02.340 align:middle line:84% I don't remember what it was called in that topic. 00:51:02.340 --> 00:51:05.180 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] 00:51:05.180 --> 00:51:07.260 align:middle line:84% You could go to the website, and then 00:51:07.260 --> 00:51:10.700 align:middle line:84% when you click to get the streaming video, that 00:51:10.700 --> 00:51:11.680 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE]. 00:51:11.680 --> 00:51:14.660 align:middle line:84% So this thing about forgetting to tell people, 00:51:14.660 --> 00:51:19.400 align:middle line:84% that was happening right and left in the '97, '98 time 00:51:19.400 --> 00:51:23.350 align:middle line:90% frame because it was all so new. 00:51:23.350 --> 00:51:26.190 align:middle line:84% It's also fascinating that the public was totally 00:51:26.190 --> 00:51:28.970 align:middle line:90% forgiving because it was new. 00:51:28.970 --> 00:51:30.030 align:middle line:90% And so-- 00:51:30.030 --> 00:51:31.693 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: I mean, but that's-- 00:51:31.693 --> 00:51:34.110 align:middle line:84% anybody who deals in technology realizes it doesn't always 00:51:34.110 --> 00:51:34.970 align:middle line:90% do what it's supposed to do. 00:51:34.970 --> 00:51:36.610 align:middle line:84% And the more ambitious you try to make it-- 00:51:36.610 --> 00:51:38.152 align:middle line:84% I mean, I'm goofing around with this, 00:51:38.152 --> 00:51:39.430 align:middle line:90% trying to get it to work here. 00:51:39.430 --> 00:51:40.870 align:middle line:90% You accept it. 00:51:40.870 --> 00:51:43.850 align:middle line:84% And that's a little bit different. 00:51:43.850 --> 00:51:44.930 align:middle line:90% Yeah? 00:51:44.930 --> 00:51:46.430 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Was there any group in IBM 00:51:46.430 --> 00:51:50.710 align:middle line:84% that studied the impact of these advertisements and marketing 00:51:50.710 --> 00:51:54.510 align:middle line:84% that you guys were doing for technology and your solutions, 00:51:54.510 --> 00:51:56.150 align:middle line:84% or was it just based on, OK, this 00:51:56.150 --> 00:51:58.510 align:middle line:84% is what we have for marketing, and let's 00:51:58.510 --> 00:51:59.870 align:middle line:90% spend this much of money? 00:51:59.870 --> 00:52:01.930 align:middle line:90% Or did you just-- 00:52:01.930 --> 00:52:03.510 align:middle line:90% you know what I'm getting. 00:52:03.510 --> 00:52:06.022 align:middle line:84% Did you do any kind of feedback analysis that-- 00:52:06.022 --> 00:52:07.480 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Absolutely, absolutely. 00:52:07.480 --> 00:52:09.522 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: --this is working, this is not working? 00:52:09.522 --> 00:52:12.830 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Absolutely, but it's an imperfect thing because-- 00:52:12.830 --> 00:52:14.070 align:middle line:90% I mean, here's part of it. 00:52:14.070 --> 00:52:15.810 align:middle line:84% I mean, remember, I'm a creative person, 00:52:15.810 --> 00:52:18.470 align:middle line:84% so I'm going to give you my point of view on it, which is, 00:52:18.470 --> 00:52:21.190 align:middle line:84% IBM makes all kinds of products, and they range from-- 00:52:21.190 --> 00:52:23.530 align:middle line:84% at least at the time this was being done, 00:52:23.530 --> 00:52:28.230 align:middle line:84% it ranged from a ThinkPad that cost $2,000 to a supply chain 00:52:28.230 --> 00:52:32.510 align:middle line:84% engagement that takes eight months to get a sign-off 00:52:32.510 --> 00:52:35.770 align:middle line:84% on and costs millions of dollars. 00:52:35.770 --> 00:52:40.110 align:middle line:84% And if you sell one or one, the long-term profit impact 00:52:40.110 --> 00:52:42.290 align:middle line:90% is enormous versus the ThinkPad. 00:52:42.290 --> 00:52:46.990 align:middle line:84% But if you go out and test, what kind of people come to testing? 00:52:46.990 --> 00:52:48.830 align:middle line:90% A lot of the direct-- 00:52:48.830 --> 00:52:50.870 align:middle line:90% I mean, this isn't like if you-- 00:52:50.870 --> 00:52:53.190 align:middle line:84% the easiest, most trackable kind of advertising 00:52:53.190 --> 00:52:54.910 align:middle line:84% are things like if you run Wendy's 00:52:54.910 --> 00:52:58.590 align:middle line:84% because, with Wendy's, you run an ad on Sunday night, 00:52:58.590 --> 00:53:01.550 align:middle line:84% and tomorrow morning, you sell however many chicken sandwiches. 00:53:01.550 --> 00:53:04.350 align:middle line:84% And you know how it worked versus the last time you did it. 00:53:04.350 --> 00:53:06.150 align:middle line:90% It's pretty scientific. 00:53:06.150 --> 00:53:11.910 align:middle line:84% With a web-enabled supply chain, there's a long engagement 00:53:11.910 --> 00:53:15.350 align:middle line:90% process, and it just depends. 00:53:15.350 --> 00:53:16.190 align:middle line:90% It depends. 00:53:16.190 --> 00:53:18.790 align:middle line:84% If you think about e-business, e-business 00:53:18.790 --> 00:53:20.670 align:middle line:90% changed everything for IBM. 00:53:20.670 --> 00:53:24.870 align:middle line:84% But it's hard to say which was the most important thing 00:53:24.870 --> 00:53:27.710 align:middle line:84% in those things because it probably depended on who you 00:53:27.710 --> 00:53:31.790 align:middle line:84% were talking to and because you have all these constituencies 00:53:31.790 --> 00:53:34.470 align:middle line:84% that are different in their impact, and a lot of them 00:53:34.470 --> 00:53:37.190 align:middle line:84% will not go to advertising testing. 00:53:37.190 --> 00:53:39.443 align:middle line:84% Or it doesn't boil down to one thing. 00:53:39.443 --> 00:53:41.110 align:middle line:84% I mean, for example, one of the things-- 00:53:41.110 --> 00:53:44.045 align:middle line:84% I brought these along because I just 00:53:44.045 --> 00:53:46.670 align:middle line:84% want to make clear that this was not just a bunch of television 00:53:46.670 --> 00:53:47.870 align:middle line:90% advertising. 00:53:47.870 --> 00:53:50.290 align:middle line:84% It's more interesting to look at here. 00:53:50.290 --> 00:53:53.750 align:middle line:90% 00:53:53.750 --> 00:53:56.190 align:middle line:84% This was a piece we did-- we produced originally 00:53:56.190 --> 00:54:00.970 align:middle line:84% for The Wall Street Journal as a launch piece for e-business. 00:54:00.970 --> 00:54:02.172 align:middle line:90% It was eight pages. 00:54:02.172 --> 00:54:03.630 align:middle line:84% And it was all around the theme of, 00:54:03.630 --> 00:54:05.950 align:middle line:90% are you ready for e-business? 00:54:05.950 --> 00:54:08.650 align:middle line:90% And it was very dense copy. 00:54:08.650 --> 00:54:13.030 align:middle line:84% I mean, we deliberately wrote this as very dense copy 00:54:13.030 --> 00:54:19.110 align:middle line:84% with every single fact that we could find within IBM to support 00:54:19.110 --> 00:54:23.310 align:middle line:90% the e-business manifesto. 00:54:23.310 --> 00:54:26.050 align:middle line:84% And do we think everybody read all this copy? 00:54:26.050 --> 00:54:27.813 align:middle line:90% No, absolutely not. 00:54:27.813 --> 00:54:29.230 align:middle line:84% We kind of said, well, look, there 00:54:29.230 --> 00:54:31.570 align:middle line:84% are going to be three kinds of people that read this. 00:54:31.570 --> 00:54:33.190 align:middle line:84% There's going to be-- most people 00:54:33.190 --> 00:54:34.950 align:middle line:84% are going to look at this, and they're 00:54:34.950 --> 00:54:37.290 align:middle line:84% going to say, wow, this is a big statement. 00:54:37.290 --> 00:54:38.370 align:middle line:90% IBM is up to something. 00:54:38.370 --> 00:54:39.950 align:middle line:84% But they're not going to read the whole thing. 00:54:39.950 --> 00:54:41.710 align:middle line:84% Then there's going to be a second tier, which is still 00:54:41.710 --> 00:54:42.770 align:middle line:90% going to be pretty big. 00:54:42.770 --> 00:54:44.450 align:middle line:84% It's going to read some of the captions. 00:54:44.450 --> 00:54:46.970 align:middle line:84% So we wrote it so that if you just read the captions, 00:54:46.970 --> 00:54:48.950 align:middle line:84% you felt like IBM was up to something, 00:54:48.950 --> 00:54:51.030 align:middle line:84% and there was real substance behind it 00:54:51.030 --> 00:54:53.290 align:middle line:84% and that there was a real sense of movement going on. 00:54:53.290 --> 00:54:55.350 align:middle line:84% I mean, part of the reason-- we tried 00:54:55.350 --> 00:54:58.870 align:middle line:84% to capture a sense of all the participants 00:54:58.870 --> 00:55:03.032 align:middle line:84% in this, that it wasn't just for big business. 00:55:03.032 --> 00:55:05.490 align:middle line:84% And it was all about all the things you should worry about, 00:55:05.490 --> 00:55:07.950 align:middle line:84% about the opportunities and the pitfalls. 00:55:07.950 --> 00:55:09.910 align:middle line:90% It was really carefully written. 00:55:09.910 --> 00:55:14.750 align:middle line:84% And what we were trying to do was 00:55:14.750 --> 00:55:17.350 align:middle line:84% do a product launch of something that didn't have 00:55:17.350 --> 00:55:20.270 align:middle line:84% any products that you could show by capturing this sense of, 00:55:20.270 --> 00:55:20.970 align:middle line:90% it's a movement. 00:55:20.970 --> 00:55:24.470 align:middle line:84% And so it was all in this topicality of all the people 00:55:24.470 --> 00:55:26.250 align:middle line:90% who are ready for e-business. 00:55:26.250 --> 00:55:29.050 align:middle line:84% And the thing was, people took it as true. 00:55:29.050 --> 00:55:30.848 align:middle line:84% I mean, they absolutely took it as true. 00:55:30.848 --> 00:55:32.390 align:middle line:84% And then you finally had-- the people 00:55:32.390 --> 00:55:36.070 align:middle line:84% who actually read it were completely persuaded. 00:55:36.070 --> 00:55:39.990 align:middle line:84% And we kind of have anecdotal testing research 00:55:39.990 --> 00:55:41.107 align:middle line:90% that supported that. 00:55:41.107 --> 00:55:42.190 align:middle line:90% But that's pretty typical. 00:55:42.190 --> 00:55:44.510 align:middle line:84% I mean, it's kind of common sense. 00:55:44.510 --> 00:55:46.250 align:middle line:84% But we used this as a mailing piece. 00:55:46.250 --> 00:55:48.570 align:middle line:90% We used it as an internal piece. 00:55:48.570 --> 00:55:50.530 align:middle line:84% We used it to the IBM board of directors. 00:55:50.530 --> 00:55:53.350 align:middle line:84% I mean, we used it as-- we put this thing as many places 00:55:53.350 --> 00:55:55.350 align:middle line:90% as we could put it. 00:55:55.350 --> 00:55:59.390 align:middle line:84% And some people said, well, it's an indulgence, running all 00:55:59.390 --> 00:56:01.530 align:middle line:90% this advertising at one time. 00:56:01.530 --> 00:56:02.230 align:middle line:90% And it was. 00:56:02.230 --> 00:56:03.262 align:middle line:90% It absolutely was. 00:56:03.262 --> 00:56:04.970 align:middle line:84% But at the same time, it was a statement. 00:56:04.970 --> 00:56:07.310 align:middle line:90% It was a stake in the ground. 00:56:07.310 --> 00:56:09.170 align:middle line:84% And it said there was substance behind this, 00:56:09.170 --> 00:56:11.270 align:middle line:90% and it wasn't just a tagline. 00:56:11.270 --> 00:56:14.840 align:middle line:84% And so I think the combination of broad media that just said 00:56:14.840 --> 00:56:20.920 align:middle line:84% "e-business" and then this kind of depth every so often was 00:56:20.920 --> 00:56:21.700 align:middle line:90% really helpful. 00:56:21.700 --> 00:56:24.660 align:middle line:84% And we did have customers who would come in having read this, 00:56:24.660 --> 00:56:27.840 align:middle line:84% and they would call IBM and ask, tell me more. 00:56:27.840 --> 00:56:32.160 align:middle line:90% 00:56:32.160 --> 00:56:34.380 align:middle line:84% So then, eventually, we also extended-- 00:56:34.380 --> 00:56:35.540 align:middle line:90% so that was the issue. 00:56:35.540 --> 00:56:36.040 align:middle line:90% Yeah? 00:56:36.040 --> 00:56:37.960 align:middle line:90% Yes? 00:56:37.960 --> 00:56:41.400 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Did you have any issue about having 00:56:41.400 --> 00:56:46.240 align:middle line:84% two different messages, for example, one is the internet, 00:56:46.240 --> 00:56:50.840 align:middle line:84% and the other one is transition to service company? 00:56:50.840 --> 00:56:55.360 align:middle line:84% Because those guys that I know of who worked at the Global 00:56:55.360 --> 00:56:58.080 align:middle line:84% Services, they had a hard time selling 00:56:58.080 --> 00:57:04.120 align:middle line:84% the concept of IBM becoming more like a service company 00:57:04.120 --> 00:57:04.900 align:middle line:90% at the time. 00:57:04.900 --> 00:57:07.560 align:middle line:90% 00:57:07.560 --> 00:57:10.560 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Yes, we did have some issue with that, including 00:57:10.560 --> 00:57:12.960 align:middle line:84% the fact that some of IBM was not really prepared 00:57:12.960 --> 00:57:14.960 align:middle line:90% to talk about e-business. 00:57:14.960 --> 00:57:16.860 align:middle line:84% On the other hand, if you ask yourself, 00:57:16.860 --> 00:57:19.760 align:middle line:84% Where would IBM be without e-business? 00:57:19.760 --> 00:57:23.262 align:middle line:84% the answer is, in technology, you have to get the word out. 00:57:23.262 --> 00:57:25.720 align:middle line:84% And part of the way you get the word out to your own people 00:57:25.720 --> 00:57:28.303 align:middle line:84% is by doing it big because they don't pay attention to it when 00:57:28.303 --> 00:57:29.620 align:middle line:90% it just comes in through email. 00:57:29.620 --> 00:57:31.880 align:middle line:84% They do pay attention to it when it-- 00:57:31.880 --> 00:57:35.280 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: I think that one of the reasons-- 00:57:35.280 --> 00:57:38.280 align:middle line:84% actually, Lou Gerstner said, Irving, we 00:57:38.280 --> 00:57:40.960 align:middle line:90% have to go outside in. 00:57:40.960 --> 00:57:46.080 align:middle line:84% Partly it's so nobody inside gets confused that we're 00:57:46.080 --> 00:57:48.240 align:middle line:90% asking them for permission. 00:57:48.240 --> 00:57:50.920 align:middle line:84% So not everybody was with the program. 00:57:50.920 --> 00:57:53.780 align:middle line:84% And the most skeptical people were-- 00:57:53.780 --> 00:57:56.760 align:middle line:84% I mean, people in the labs know this stuff. 00:57:56.760 --> 00:58:00.500 align:middle line:84% The people in the sales, some [INAUDIBLE]. 00:58:00.500 --> 00:58:02.820 align:middle line:84% A lot of them said, I just want to sell my stuff. 00:58:02.820 --> 00:58:03.640 align:middle line:90% This is crap. 00:58:03.640 --> 00:58:06.360 align:middle line:84% Really, we were [? fighting ?] "This is bullshit." 00:58:06.360 --> 00:58:11.160 align:middle line:84% But nobody spends this much money on bullshit. 00:58:11.160 --> 00:58:14.420 align:middle line:84% And everybody knows, to spend this much money, 00:58:14.420 --> 00:58:17.480 align:middle line:84% the chairman is behind it because he's giving interviews 00:58:17.480 --> 00:58:18.760 align:middle line:90% and so on. 00:58:18.760 --> 00:58:21.300 align:middle line:84% And so by going outside in-- and remember, 00:58:21.300 --> 00:58:25.600 align:middle line:84% I'm talking big brand-dividing strategies-- 00:58:25.600 --> 00:58:29.400 align:middle line:84% everybody has to come along or else you better 00:58:29.400 --> 00:58:31.400 align:middle line:90% go get another job. 00:58:31.400 --> 00:58:35.560 align:middle line:84% And I think that was-- you have to be careful how you do that 00:58:35.560 --> 00:58:37.800 align:middle line:84% because there are times you do that-- 00:58:37.800 --> 00:58:42.080 align:middle line:84% we tried that in OS/2, and it was a disaster 00:58:42.080 --> 00:58:44.883 align:middle line:90% because [INAUDIBLE]. 00:58:44.883 --> 00:58:46.800 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: I mean, the thing about e-business 00:58:46.800 --> 00:58:48.520 align:middle line:90% was, it was happening. 00:58:48.520 --> 00:58:50.480 align:middle line:90% People were interested in it. 00:58:50.480 --> 00:58:53.860 align:middle line:84% And so it wasn't a marketing gimmick. 00:58:53.860 --> 00:58:56.340 align:middle line:84% It was really a view about what was occurring. 00:58:56.340 --> 00:58:57.200 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: [INAUDIBLE] 00:58:57.200 --> 00:58:57.880 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Yeah. 00:58:57.880 --> 00:58:59.505 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: So you'll see, 00:58:59.505 --> 00:59:02.620 align:middle line:84% you have to be very careful when you go outside in. 00:59:02.620 --> 00:59:06.880 align:middle line:84% And I have a feeling it's easier to go 00:59:06.880 --> 00:59:10.880 align:middle line:84% outside in if what you are talking about 00:59:10.880 --> 00:59:12.700 align:middle line:90% is already happening out there. 00:59:12.700 --> 00:59:14.280 align:middle line:90% Am I correct? 00:59:14.280 --> 00:59:17.120 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: It's more likely to resonate with people if it's-- 00:59:17.120 --> 00:59:19.280 align:middle line:84% I mean, the thing is, it's hard to just-- 00:59:19.280 --> 00:59:22.680 align:middle line:84% if you're going to introduce a mayonnaise, 00:59:22.680 --> 00:59:26.440 align:middle line:84% or you want to put ketchup in a bottle of shampoo, 00:59:26.440 --> 00:59:29.120 align:middle line:84% I guess you can go out and create the need for that. 00:59:29.120 --> 00:59:30.780 align:middle line:84% You can invent the need for that, 00:59:30.780 --> 00:59:34.520 align:middle line:84% and a certain amount of people will try ketchup shampoo, 00:59:34.520 --> 00:59:36.660 align:middle line:84% and you find out whether it's going to fail or not. 00:59:36.660 --> 00:59:41.400 align:middle line:84% But in something that's as complex and faith-based 00:59:41.400 --> 00:59:49.180 align:middle line:84% as technology, big technology, there has to be truth to it. 00:59:49.180 --> 00:59:51.880 align:middle line:84% I mean, the old, old, old adage in advertising 00:59:51.880 --> 00:59:56.780 align:middle line:84% is, an advertising campaign that's a lie 00:59:56.780 --> 00:59:59.238 align:middle line:84% will make a product fail faster because people will try it, 00:59:59.238 --> 01:00:01.363 align:middle line:84% and they'll say, it's not true, and then that's it. 01:00:01.363 --> 01:00:02.160 align:middle line:90% It's over. 01:00:02.160 --> 01:00:05.878 align:middle line:84% And so there has to be some truth. 01:00:05.878 --> 01:00:07.420 align:middle line:84% Certainly, with e-business, the truth 01:00:07.420 --> 01:00:10.680 align:middle line:84% of the matter was, what IBM was able to do 01:00:10.680 --> 01:00:13.200 align:middle line:84% was take something that was really going on 01:00:13.200 --> 01:00:18.560 align:middle line:84% and articulate it well and make it interesting and make it big. 01:00:18.560 --> 01:00:21.200 align:middle line:84% And it gave people permission to think about IBM 01:00:21.200 --> 01:00:23.800 align:middle line:84% in a different way, which was part of the future instead 01:00:23.800 --> 01:00:24.787 align:middle line:90% of part of the past. 01:00:24.787 --> 01:00:27.120 align:middle line:84% And one of the things that we did early on while we were 01:00:27.120 --> 01:00:31.240 align:middle line:84% doing-- all the TV commercials and that manifesto and stuff 01:00:31.240 --> 01:00:34.960 align:middle line:84% were done for a fairly small group within IBM 01:00:34.960 --> 01:00:36.760 align:middle line:90% corporate headquarters. 01:00:36.760 --> 01:00:38.200 align:middle line:84% And what we tried to do then was-- 01:00:38.200 --> 01:00:40.880 align:middle line:84% IBM was spending all this money in other places. 01:00:40.880 --> 01:00:43.000 align:middle line:84% So Global Services had a campaign, 01:00:43.000 --> 01:00:45.760 align:middle line:84% and the software guys had a campaign, 01:00:45.760 --> 01:00:47.740 align:middle line:84% and Lotus had a campaign, all these other guys. 01:00:47.740 --> 01:00:50.198 align:middle line:84% And they were spending pretty significant amounts of money. 01:00:50.198 --> 01:00:52.860 align:middle line:84% So we went to them and tried to say, well, OK, from now on, 01:00:52.860 --> 01:00:54.600 align:middle line:90% the PC company is going to be-- 01:00:54.600 --> 01:00:57.020 align:middle line:84% it's not going to be notebook computers anymore. 01:00:57.020 --> 01:00:59.080 align:middle line:84% It's going to be e-business tools. 01:00:59.080 --> 01:01:02.903 align:middle line:84% And at first, they were really resistant to that 01:01:02.903 --> 01:01:05.070 align:middle line:84% because they said oh, that's a corporate initiative. 01:01:05.070 --> 01:01:05.750 align:middle line:90% It's not for us. 01:01:05.750 --> 01:01:07.190 align:middle line:90% And we said, no, no, trust us. 01:01:07.190 --> 01:01:07.970 align:middle line:90% This will work. 01:01:07.970 --> 01:01:08.550 align:middle line:90% And I forget. 01:01:08.550 --> 01:01:10.970 align:middle line:84% We had some crisis where we had to do it really quickly. 01:01:10.970 --> 01:01:12.050 align:middle line:90% And so they said, OK. 01:01:12.050 --> 01:01:17.150 align:middle line:84% So we went out and did this campaign for e-business tools. 01:01:17.150 --> 01:01:19.010 align:middle line:84% And as soon as we got enough volume, 01:01:19.010 --> 01:01:21.290 align:middle line:84% the feedback started coming back very positively 01:01:21.290 --> 01:01:22.810 align:middle line:84% about the whole e-business thing. 01:01:22.810 --> 01:01:25.250 align:middle line:84% And the timing of it, everything was-- so a lot of this 01:01:25.250 --> 01:01:26.390 align:middle line:90% is about timing. 01:01:26.390 --> 01:01:28.730 align:middle line:84% So the timing of it was really good. 01:01:28.730 --> 01:01:31.130 align:middle line:90% And we did things like we took-- 01:01:31.130 --> 01:01:33.910 align:middle line:84% again, IBM had very little that you could-- 01:01:33.910 --> 01:01:36.230 align:middle line:84% we didn't make very many objects of desire. 01:01:36.230 --> 01:01:38.910 align:middle line:84% But one of the things that we did make was this flat panel. 01:01:38.910 --> 01:01:40.190 align:middle line:90% This was an early flat panel. 01:01:40.190 --> 01:01:42.250 align:middle line:84% It was designed by Richard Sapper. 01:01:42.250 --> 01:01:49.250 align:middle line:84% And we made these wallscape-size posters of the flat panel 01:01:49.250 --> 01:01:54.130 align:middle line:84% monitors and put them up around Wall Street with just ibm.com 01:01:54.130 --> 01:01:58.150 align:middle line:84% underneath and e-business tools on them. 01:01:58.150 --> 01:02:02.890 align:middle line:84% And we tried to do what the iPod was doing 01:02:02.890 --> 01:02:05.550 align:middle line:84% or what the iPod eventually wound up doing in Soho. 01:02:05.550 --> 01:02:08.530 align:middle line:84% We tried to do it a few blocks further south, 01:02:08.530 --> 01:02:10.650 align:middle line:84% just to try and say that IBM could make products 01:02:10.650 --> 01:02:12.942 align:middle line:84% that people wanted, that you would look at that and go, 01:02:12.942 --> 01:02:15.330 align:middle line:90% I want one of those on my desk. 01:02:15.330 --> 01:02:17.750 align:middle line:84% And then we just called it e-business tools. 01:02:17.750 --> 01:02:22.410 align:middle line:84% So we took the cool monitor and glued it 01:02:22.410 --> 01:02:28.090 align:middle line:84% to the big story, which IBM, I think, 01:02:28.090 --> 01:02:31.210 align:middle line:84% tried to get very analytical and was sort of like, well, these 01:02:31.210 --> 01:02:33.150 align:middle line:84% don't have very much impact on our profits. 01:02:33.150 --> 01:02:34.628 align:middle line:90% We only make $100 a monitor. 01:02:34.628 --> 01:02:35.670 align:middle line:90% And why would we do that. 01:02:35.670 --> 01:02:38.510 align:middle line:84% And the answer was because that's proof of faith. 01:02:38.510 --> 01:02:40.770 align:middle line:84% It's proof that IBM could do something really neat 01:02:40.770 --> 01:02:42.770 align:middle line:90% that you would want. 01:02:42.770 --> 01:02:47.410 align:middle line:84% And we had a Global Services campaign. 01:02:47.410 --> 01:02:49.810 align:middle line:84% And all we did was portraits of people 01:02:49.810 --> 01:02:52.930 align:middle line:84% you wouldn't expect to work for IBM because IBM's 01:02:52.930 --> 01:02:57.290 align:middle line:84% classic thing was middle-aged, white guys in a blue suit. 01:02:57.290 --> 01:03:01.190 align:middle line:84% And so we tried to pick people who were not typical of IBM, 01:03:01.190 --> 01:03:03.315 align:middle line:84% and they were doing things like-- 01:03:03.315 --> 01:03:04.690 align:middle line:84% each one of these things would be 01:03:04.690 --> 01:03:06.170 align:middle line:84% a job description of some job you 01:03:06.170 --> 01:03:07.783 align:middle line:90% didn't know went in with IBM. 01:03:07.783 --> 01:03:08.450 align:middle line:90% So it would be-- 01:03:08.450 --> 01:03:10.370 align:middle line:84% somebody would be an ethical hacker, 01:03:10.370 --> 01:03:12.770 align:middle line:84% or someone would be an e-business strategist 01:03:12.770 --> 01:03:14.170 align:middle line:90% or something like that. 01:03:14.170 --> 01:03:18.250 align:middle line:84% But it was consciously trying to be a little surprising. 01:03:18.250 --> 01:03:20.395 align:middle line:90% We thought surprise was a big-- 01:03:20.395 --> 01:03:21.770 align:middle line:84% while still being true to what we 01:03:21.770 --> 01:03:23.790 align:middle line:84% are, because this was still very IBM, 01:03:23.790 --> 01:03:25.470 align:middle line:84% but it just had a more modern voice. 01:03:25.470 --> 01:03:28.050 align:middle line:84% We ran this stuff all over the world. 01:03:28.050 --> 01:03:32.210 align:middle line:84% We ran it in Charles de Gaulle and all over the place. 01:03:32.210 --> 01:03:34.990 align:middle line:84% And it was sort of like, no one ad was that important. 01:03:34.990 --> 01:03:38.050 align:middle line:84% It was more like the collective feeling was, 01:03:38.050 --> 01:03:42.730 align:middle line:84% IBM's got cool people, interesting products. 01:03:42.730 --> 01:03:45.570 align:middle line:84% And then we did this campaign about six months after we 01:03:45.570 --> 01:03:48.350 align:middle line:84% started "e-business," and we called this "e-culture." 01:03:48.350 --> 01:03:52.210 align:middle line:84% And all this was about was, we created this thing 01:03:52.210 --> 01:03:54.607 align:middle line:84% of, so-and-so.com is an IBM e-business. 01:03:54.607 --> 01:03:56.690 align:middle line:84% Now, all that really meant was we gave you a cable 01:03:56.690 --> 01:03:58.370 align:middle line:90% and plugged you into a wall. 01:03:58.370 --> 01:03:59.950 align:middle line:90% It was a very low bar. 01:03:59.950 --> 01:04:02.370 align:middle line:84% And frankly, we had a lot of discussion 01:04:02.370 --> 01:04:05.590 align:middle line:84% within IBM because the IBM clients kept saying, 01:04:05.590 --> 01:04:06.357 align:middle line:90% can't we say more? 01:04:06.357 --> 01:04:08.690 align:middle line:84% And we'd go, well, all you really did was kind of just-- 01:04:08.690 --> 01:04:11.730 align:middle line:84% you gave them some software, and they didn't really do very much. 01:04:11.730 --> 01:04:13.710 align:middle line:84% But they became an IBM e-business. 01:04:13.710 --> 01:04:19.210 align:middle line:84% And then so this one, I think, was-- e-chord was Yamaha pianos, 01:04:19.210 --> 01:04:21.650 align:middle line:90% and this was Motorola, e-chat. 01:04:21.650 --> 01:04:25.210 align:middle line:84% And this was [? REA, ?] the outdoor company. 01:04:25.210 --> 01:04:28.370 align:middle line:84% And there was, in Europe-- we ran this all over the place. 01:04:28.370 --> 01:04:29.990 align:middle line:90% We had some French companies. 01:04:29.990 --> 01:04:30.752 align:middle line:90% We did it online. 01:04:30.752 --> 01:04:31.710 align:middle line:90% We did it in brochures. 01:04:31.710 --> 01:04:34.430 align:middle line:84% We did it-- every place you could do it, we tried to do it. 01:04:34.430 --> 01:04:38.170 align:middle line:84% And again, we weren't that concerned with any one story. 01:04:38.170 --> 01:04:41.850 align:middle line:84% What we wanted to do was make it feel like, every time I 01:04:41.850 --> 01:04:45.430 align:middle line:84% turn around, somebody is becoming an IBM e-business, 01:04:45.430 --> 01:04:48.030 align:middle line:84% up to the point where Victoria's Secret called up and said, 01:04:48.030 --> 01:04:49.697 align:middle line:84% we're going to do this deal, but we only 01:04:49.697 --> 01:04:52.890 align:middle line:84% want to do it if we can be part of this campaign. 01:04:52.890 --> 01:04:54.490 align:middle line:90% Then they said, we want to-- 01:04:54.490 --> 01:04:57.070 align:middle line:84% they cut a deal with the salespeople at IBM and said, 01:04:57.070 --> 01:05:00.010 align:middle line:84% we'll use our photography in the-- you 01:05:00.010 --> 01:05:02.530 align:middle line:84% have to use our Victoria's Secret photography, which 01:05:02.530 --> 01:05:04.330 align:middle line:84% they then send us a portrait-- a stack 01:05:04.330 --> 01:05:09.130 align:middle line:84% of these photographs that are basically against every IBM 01:05:09.130 --> 01:05:12.770 align:middle line:90% kind of gender, sex guideline. 01:05:12.770 --> 01:05:15.462 align:middle line:84% And so then we had to deal with that. 01:05:15.462 --> 01:05:17.170 align:middle line:84% But all these companies, all of a sudden, 01:05:17.170 --> 01:05:21.130 align:middle line:84% wanted to be in the campaign, which was great 01:05:21.130 --> 01:05:23.930 align:middle line:84% for IBM, although then they didn't have-- they hadn't set 01:05:23.930 --> 01:05:25.810 align:middle line:84% aside money to do some of these ads, 01:05:25.810 --> 01:05:28.070 align:middle line:90% but contracts were coming in. 01:05:28.070 --> 01:05:32.850 align:middle line:84% So all of this stuff kind of happened at the same time. 01:05:32.850 --> 01:05:37.450 align:middle line:84% And as it happened, IBM got much more courageous about, 01:05:37.450 --> 01:05:39.230 align:middle line:84% everything didn't have to be perfect. 01:05:39.230 --> 01:05:42.050 align:middle line:84% Everything didn't have to be exactly figured out. 01:05:42.050 --> 01:05:49.290 align:middle line:84% And I brought a couple more things to show, which are risk-- 01:05:49.290 --> 01:05:52.690 align:middle line:90% or other things that we did. 01:05:52.690 --> 01:05:56.540 align:middle line:84% And I've got, like, five things put together here. 01:05:56.540 --> 01:05:59.300 align:middle line:84% One was for a-- at the time, we were doing 01:05:59.300 --> 01:06:00.740 align:middle line:90% a lot of sports marketing. 01:06:00.740 --> 01:06:03.780 align:middle line:84% And that sports marketing stuff always kind of went to waste. 01:06:03.780 --> 01:06:06.820 align:middle line:84% So we tried we tried to use the sports marketing stuff to make 01:06:06.820 --> 01:06:10.860 align:middle line:84% it still technology statements, without making them too goofy. 01:06:10.860 --> 01:06:15.660 align:middle line:84% And you'll see a real range of tonality 01:06:15.660 --> 01:06:18.500 align:middle line:90% here, from inspiring-- yes? 01:06:18.500 --> 01:06:19.780 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: No, continue. 01:06:19.780 --> 01:06:20.902 align:middle line:90% I don't want to interrupt. 01:06:20.902 --> 01:06:22.360 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: No, go ahead, go ahead. 01:06:22.360 --> 01:06:24.580 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So the other question I have was, 01:06:24.580 --> 01:06:28.150 align:middle line:84% IBM has always been associated with serving businesses. 01:06:28.150 --> 01:06:28.900 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Right. 01:06:28.900 --> 01:06:30.483 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: So the choice 01:06:30.483 --> 01:06:33.140 align:middle line:84% of medium for these advertising, through broadcast medium 01:06:33.140 --> 01:06:38.760 align:middle line:84% to everybody out there, what was behind that? 01:06:38.760 --> 01:06:42.020 align:middle line:84% Why won't they just advertise it through other channels 01:06:42.020 --> 01:06:45.760 align:middle line:84% that are more specific, that go to businesses only? 01:06:45.760 --> 01:06:46.900 align:middle line:90% And why would you-- 01:06:46.900 --> 01:06:51.840 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Well, actually, if you want to reach senior-- 01:06:51.840 --> 01:06:54.940 align:middle line:84% at least in North America, if you want to reach senior, 01:06:54.940 --> 01:06:56.360 align:middle line:90% either IT or-- 01:06:56.360 --> 01:06:59.620 align:middle line:90% 01:06:59.620 --> 01:07:02.940 align:middle line:84% if you want to reach IT or business-- because there 01:07:02.940 --> 01:07:07.100 align:middle line:84% are two basic kinds of people who approve IBM, 01:07:07.100 --> 01:07:09.900 align:middle line:84% the guys who build the stuff, the implementers, and the guys 01:07:09.900 --> 01:07:11.900 align:middle line:84% who believe the technology can help them 01:07:11.900 --> 01:07:15.615 align:middle line:84% do something to help run the organization better. 01:07:15.615 --> 01:07:17.740 align:middle line:84% Those people are hard to reach, and there are a lot 01:07:17.740 --> 01:07:19.032 align:middle line:90% of people trying to reach them. 01:07:19.032 --> 01:07:22.260 align:middle line:84% So where you find them is Sunday morning television, 01:07:22.260 --> 01:07:25.680 align:middle line:84% issue-oriented television, like Meet the Press. 01:07:25.680 --> 01:07:28.440 align:middle line:84% I mean, you find some of them on the CNBC and stuff like that, 01:07:28.440 --> 01:07:34.660 align:middle line:84% but it's a very small group of people because that's like-- 01:07:34.660 --> 01:07:36.400 align:middle line:84% people watch that 15 minutes at a time. 01:07:36.400 --> 01:07:38.387 align:middle line:84% They just have it running in the background. 01:07:38.387 --> 01:07:39.720 align:middle line:90% Nothing really goes on on there. 01:07:39.720 --> 01:07:44.140 align:middle line:84% So unless you have your own CEO is going to be on or something-- 01:07:44.140 --> 01:07:46.300 align:middle line:90% I mean, so we run on there. 01:07:46.300 --> 01:07:48.640 align:middle line:90% But they watch sports. 01:07:48.640 --> 01:07:53.280 align:middle line:84% You want to reach the cream of the crop of American business, 01:07:53.280 --> 01:07:55.820 align:middle line:90% it's the Masters. 01:07:55.820 --> 01:07:59.260 align:middle line:90% IBM is one of three sponsors. 01:07:59.260 --> 01:08:04.180 align:middle line:84% They're very golf-- but football, basically any sports, 01:08:04.180 --> 01:08:07.940 align:middle line:84% you find a pretty big contingent of business people. 01:08:07.940 --> 01:08:11.112 align:middle line:84% And then if you want to talk to people in small business 01:08:11.112 --> 01:08:13.820 align:middle line:84% or medium-sized business, which, that's where a lot of the growth 01:08:13.820 --> 01:08:16.380 align:middle line:90% is, those people watch that. 01:08:16.380 --> 01:08:18.640 align:middle line:84% They read The Wall Street Journal. 01:08:18.640 --> 01:08:23.660 align:middle line:84% There's a lot of IT books, but everybody reads the-- 01:08:23.660 --> 01:08:25.080 align:middle line:90% or websites. 01:08:25.080 --> 01:08:27.580 align:middle line:84% I mean, there are more general sites 01:08:27.580 --> 01:08:29.760 align:middle line:84% that a lot of people who are involved in that watch. 01:08:29.760 --> 01:08:32.000 align:middle line:84% And it's changed a little bit over time, too, 01:08:32.000 --> 01:08:35.939 align:middle line:84% because the explosive growth of the internet is-- 01:08:35.939 --> 01:08:37.939 align:middle line:84% and that's actually the second part 01:08:37.939 --> 01:08:41.020 align:middle line:84% of what I brought is where everything is going 01:08:41.020 --> 01:08:43.819 align:middle line:90% because nobody really knows. 01:08:43.819 --> 01:08:47.660 align:middle line:84% And a lot of this stuff is seven, eight years old. 01:08:47.660 --> 01:08:49.979 align:middle line:84% And the whole e-business thing really 01:08:49.979 --> 01:08:53.420 align:middle line:84% was about nine years ago, nine or eight years ago. 01:08:53.420 --> 01:08:55.380 align:middle line:84% Anyway, so I'm going to show this group. 01:08:55.380 --> 01:08:59.460 align:middle line:84% The first one is one we did for the US Open, tennis. 01:08:59.460 --> 01:09:02.580 align:middle line:84% The second one is for-- this is one of the spots 01:09:02.580 --> 01:09:07.088 align:middle line:84% that the senior IBM management absolutely hated this campaign, 01:09:07.088 --> 01:09:09.380 align:middle line:84% but we were all very proud of it because it was like it 01:09:09.380 --> 01:09:11.380 align:middle line:90% was golf done kind of hip. 01:09:11.380 --> 01:09:12.560 align:middle line:90% But they just hated it. 01:09:12.560 --> 01:09:14.060 align:middle line:84% This lasted about five minutes, but I brought it 01:09:14.060 --> 01:09:15.100 align:middle line:84% because I hadn't watched it in a while, 01:09:15.100 --> 01:09:16.580 align:middle line:90% and I thought it was funny. 01:09:16.580 --> 01:09:18.200 align:middle line:90% There's a spot in here from-- 01:09:18.200 --> 01:09:20.380 align:middle line:84% we did a campaign for the Olympics. 01:09:20.380 --> 01:09:23.035 align:middle line:90% IBM was an Olympic sponsor. 01:09:23.035 --> 01:09:24.660 align:middle line:84% And that was an interesting thing, too, 01:09:24.660 --> 01:09:26.080 align:middle line:84% in the whole change in technology. 01:09:26.080 --> 01:09:29.000 align:middle line:84% I mean, IBM was an Olympic sponsor for a long, long time, 01:09:29.000 --> 01:09:30.380 align:middle line:90% and they did all the scoring. 01:09:30.380 --> 01:09:33.979 align:middle line:84% When IBM started, the scoring was really simple. 01:09:33.979 --> 01:09:35.939 align:middle line:84% And when they finished, the scoring 01:09:35.939 --> 01:09:41.260 align:middle line:84% had become this incredibly complex, web-enabled, real time, 01:09:41.260 --> 01:09:42.600 align:middle line:90% real results in real time. 01:09:42.600 --> 01:09:45.100 align:middle line:84% The Olympics got a lot bigger thing, and it became-- 01:09:45.100 --> 01:09:48.620 align:middle line:84% it cost costs IBM way more to do it. 01:09:48.620 --> 01:09:50.357 align:middle line:84% It cost them-- the Olympic sponsorship 01:09:50.357 --> 01:09:51.899 align:middle line:84% was something like $40 million, and I 01:09:51.899 --> 01:09:54.320 align:middle line:84% think IBM was spending, like, $150 million to do it. 01:09:54.320 --> 01:09:55.880 align:middle line:84% It was an extraordinary commitment. 01:09:55.880 --> 01:09:57.505 align:middle line:84% And the thing is, if you screwed it up, 01:09:57.505 --> 01:10:03.540 align:middle line:84% which happened in Atlanta, it became a huge embarrassment. 01:10:03.540 --> 01:10:06.400 align:middle line:84% And then the Olympic people are just kind of awful to work with. 01:10:06.400 --> 01:10:09.300 align:middle line:90% So they dropped it. 01:10:09.300 --> 01:10:10.980 align:middle line:84% And then there's a thing in here that we 01:10:10.980 --> 01:10:14.360 align:middle line:90% did for e-business innovations. 01:10:14.360 --> 01:10:16.940 align:middle line:84% This was about three years into the campaign. 01:10:16.940 --> 01:10:19.260 align:middle line:84% And there's another one in there for servers 01:10:19.260 --> 01:10:21.200 align:middle line:90% that we did for IBM servers. 01:10:21.200 --> 01:10:22.660 align:middle line:84% And at the time, people were still 01:10:22.660 --> 01:10:24.740 align:middle line:84% thinking that mainframes were dead, 01:10:24.740 --> 01:10:26.960 align:middle line:84% and they still looked at IBM as a mainframe company. 01:10:26.960 --> 01:10:29.280 align:middle line:84% So all we wanted to do was say, it's not a mainframe. 01:10:29.280 --> 01:10:32.180 align:middle line:84% It's a server, because server-- because there 01:10:32.180 --> 01:10:35.600 align:middle line:84% are a lot of very simple things, like server is modern language. 01:10:35.600 --> 01:10:37.420 align:middle line:90% Mainframe was old-fashioned. 01:10:37.420 --> 01:10:41.220 align:middle line:84% So we just were trying to say that a server was something-- 01:10:41.220 --> 01:10:45.590 align:middle line:84% these big, black boxes were servers, not just-- 01:10:45.590 --> 01:10:48.790 align:middle line:90% so I'll run all of this. 01:10:48.790 --> 01:10:51.150 align:middle line:90% It's about 2 and 1/2 minutes. 01:10:51.150 --> 01:10:53.110 align:middle line:90% [BEEP] 01:10:53.110 --> 01:10:56.470 align:middle line:84% I've got a couple more things on this first part here. 01:10:56.470 --> 01:10:58.270 align:middle line:84% So anyway, so if you go back to this thing, 01:10:58.270 --> 01:11:00.670 align:middle line:84% one of the things in this Fortune article 01:11:00.670 --> 01:11:04.150 align:middle line:84% that was good in the storytelling part of this 01:11:04.150 --> 01:11:07.150 align:middle line:84% is that Interbrand runs a survey-- a company called 01:11:07.150 --> 01:11:09.230 align:middle line:84% Interbrand, runs a survey in which they 01:11:09.230 --> 01:11:13.330 align:middle line:84% purport to be able to put a value on the value of a brand. 01:11:13.330 --> 01:11:17.990 align:middle line:84% And in this issue, they had given IBM something like 01:11:17.990 --> 01:11:23.390 align:middle line:84% the 250-something most valuable brand in the world ranking. 01:11:23.390 --> 01:11:28.990 align:middle line:84% And actually they rated any product with an IBM brand as-- 01:11:28.990 --> 01:11:31.430 align:middle line:84% or they rated the total value of an IBM brand 01:11:31.430 --> 01:11:33.330 align:middle line:90% as minus $50 million. 01:11:33.330 --> 01:11:35.630 align:middle line:84% And that means that a product with an IBM logo on it 01:11:35.630 --> 01:11:38.710 align:middle line:84% was worth less than one with no logo at all. 01:11:38.710 --> 01:11:42.270 align:middle line:84% And by the time the e-business campaign is out there 01:11:42.270 --> 01:11:44.310 align:middle line:84% for about 18 months, two years, they 01:11:44.310 --> 01:11:47.950 align:middle line:84% were running this story in Fortune in which they actually 01:11:47.950 --> 01:11:49.093 align:middle line:90% put-- they made this up. 01:11:49.093 --> 01:11:50.010 align:middle line:90% This wasn't a real ad. 01:11:50.010 --> 01:11:52.710 align:middle line:84% They made this up and put Gerstner in one 01:11:52.710 --> 01:11:56.710 align:middle line:84% of the e-business people ads and talked about "from big, 01:11:56.710 --> 01:11:58.790 align:middle line:84% blue dinosaur to e-business animal." 01:11:58.790 --> 01:12:02.070 align:middle line:84% And the Interbrand survey ranking on IBM 01:12:02.070 --> 01:12:05.430 align:middle line:84% had gone from number 250 something to number 3. 01:12:05.430 --> 01:12:08.590 align:middle line:84% And it had a value of billions of dollars. 01:12:08.590 --> 01:12:11.370 align:middle line:84% So I mean, for us, for the ad guys, 01:12:11.370 --> 01:12:14.730 align:middle line:84% this is always great because, again, without any new products, 01:12:14.730 --> 01:12:16.352 align:middle line:90% it's a perception game. 01:12:16.352 --> 01:12:17.810 align:middle line:84% And it wasn't just the advertising, 01:12:17.810 --> 01:12:20.990 align:middle line:84% but it was clearly the communication 01:12:20.990 --> 01:12:25.790 align:middle line:84% of what the company could do and both succeed as a business 01:12:25.790 --> 01:12:27.990 align:middle line:84% and not be broken up into its component parts 01:12:27.990 --> 01:12:31.670 align:middle line:90% was pretty powerful. 01:12:31.670 --> 01:12:33.470 align:middle line:90% Eventually, we wound up doing-- 01:12:33.470 --> 01:12:36.190 align:middle line:84% I mean, we got very confident with this, 01:12:36.190 --> 01:12:39.410 align:middle line:84% and we formulated it in a bunch of ways. 01:12:39.410 --> 01:12:42.510 align:middle line:84% We kept this campaign going for about four years. 01:12:42.510 --> 01:12:44.190 align:middle line:84% We won a lot of Effie Awards, which 01:12:44.190 --> 01:12:46.398 align:middle line:84% are given for effectiveness by the American Marketing 01:12:46.398 --> 01:12:48.750 align:middle line:84% Association, including the Grand Effie. 01:12:48.750 --> 01:12:52.070 align:middle line:84% And we actually did this commercial in which these two 01:12:52.070 --> 01:12:55.410 align:middle line:84% guys are taking a picture of the Leaning Tower of Pisa, 01:12:55.410 --> 01:12:56.750 align:middle line:90% and it collapses. 01:12:56.750 --> 01:13:01.670 align:middle line:84% And we ran it on September 10, 2001. 01:13:01.670 --> 01:13:03.630 align:middle line:90% And it was like-- 01:13:03.630 --> 01:13:07.390 align:middle line:90% it was really weird. 01:13:07.390 --> 01:13:09.030 align:middle line:90% Anyway, then this is one-- 01:13:09.030 --> 01:13:11.390 align:middle line:84% I brought a couple of other things. 01:13:11.390 --> 01:13:14.990 align:middle line:84% As time went on, we eventually went into doing this campaign 01:13:14.990 --> 01:13:17.710 align:middle line:90% for e-business on demand. 01:13:17.710 --> 01:13:21.190 align:middle line:84% And the idea here was, this started with this idea of-- 01:13:21.190 --> 01:13:24.943 align:middle line:84% we're always dealing with IBM in this zone between what 01:13:24.943 --> 01:13:27.110 align:middle line:84% you see in the commercial about the magic box, which 01:13:27.110 --> 01:13:29.530 align:middle line:84% is the possibility of what technology can do, 01:13:29.530 --> 01:13:31.370 align:middle line:84% but also the reality of how you get there. 01:13:31.370 --> 01:13:33.030 align:middle line:90% So we're kind of balancing-- 01:13:33.030 --> 01:13:36.910 align:middle line:84% we try and play optimist and skeptic at the same time. 01:13:36.910 --> 01:13:38.550 align:middle line:90% And so we did-- 01:13:38.550 --> 01:13:41.990 align:middle line:84% this campaign was-- or this little drawing 01:13:41.990 --> 01:13:43.550 align:middle line:84% was the start of a campaign based 01:13:43.550 --> 01:13:46.350 align:middle line:84% on taking the false promises of technology 01:13:46.350 --> 01:13:49.170 align:middle line:84% and putting them into some kind of a device that we made up. 01:13:49.170 --> 01:13:50.430 align:middle line:90% And it was just a prop. 01:13:50.430 --> 01:13:55.170 align:middle line:84% And I brought a couple of those to show you 01:13:55.170 --> 01:13:57.910 align:middle line:84% because I think they're some of the more popular things we ever 01:13:57.910 --> 01:13:59.910 align:middle line:90% did. 01:13:59.910 --> 01:14:01.350 align:middle line:90% [BEEP] 01:14:01.350 --> 01:14:05.130 align:middle line:90% 01:14:05.130 --> 01:14:07.030 align:middle line:90% That's kind of the optimist. 01:14:07.030 --> 01:14:09.310 align:middle line:90% That's kind of the skeptic side. 01:14:09.310 --> 01:14:12.730 align:middle line:84% And then I'll show you these spots that we did for-- 01:14:12.730 --> 01:14:15.250 align:middle line:84% well, it was actually-- we did a large campaign. 01:14:15.250 --> 01:14:17.270 align:middle line:90% It was for Linux. 01:14:17.270 --> 01:14:22.110 align:middle line:84% And the original idea started-- a couple of young guys had this 01:14:22.110 --> 01:14:24.350 align:middle line:90% idea for-- 01:14:24.350 --> 01:14:29.550 align:middle line:84% IBM had committed to Linux, and Linux was very counter-IBM 01:14:29.550 --> 01:14:30.930 align:middle line:90% because it was grassroots. 01:14:30.930 --> 01:14:32.250 align:middle line:90% It was open source. 01:14:32.250 --> 01:14:33.950 align:middle line:84% The company has had a knock against it 01:14:33.950 --> 01:14:36.440 align:middle line:90% forever for being proprietary. 01:14:36.440 --> 01:14:38.380 align:middle line:90% They put it on mainframes. 01:14:38.380 --> 01:14:39.800 align:middle line:90% They put it on everything. 01:14:39.800 --> 01:14:41.940 align:middle line:84% And yet, it was kind of an obscure thing. 01:14:41.940 --> 01:14:44.220 align:middle line:84% I mean, Linux, by nature, is an obscure thing. 01:14:44.220 --> 01:14:46.320 align:middle line:84% I mean, most people don't know what it is. 01:14:46.320 --> 01:14:49.720 align:middle line:84% I'm not even sure I know exactly what it is. 01:14:49.720 --> 01:14:52.120 align:middle line:84% But there was a lot of press about it. 01:14:52.120 --> 01:14:56.360 align:middle line:84% And again, the myth of technology 01:14:56.360 --> 01:15:01.280 align:middle line:84% is, people love the iconoclastic, eccentric 01:15:01.280 --> 01:15:03.380 align:middle line:84% innovator, and they love telling that story. 01:15:03.380 --> 01:15:07.180 align:middle line:84% So they will write that story over, and over, and over again. 01:15:07.180 --> 01:15:12.760 align:middle line:84% And it started with Jobs and Wozniak up to Linus Torvalds. 01:15:12.760 --> 01:15:14.280 align:middle line:90% And people like that story. 01:15:14.280 --> 01:15:18.500 align:middle line:84% So IBM embracing that story was something kind of obscure. 01:15:18.500 --> 01:15:20.920 align:middle line:84% And one of the Creative guys had an idea 01:15:20.920 --> 01:15:24.720 align:middle line:84% to do a little fable in which we actually embodied Linux 01:15:24.720 --> 01:15:26.960 align:middle line:84% in a little kid because the whole thing was 01:15:26.960 --> 01:15:29.740 align:middle line:84% about how everybody contributed to Linux and stuff like that. 01:15:29.740 --> 01:15:31.490 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Yeah, and I mean, 01:15:31.490 --> 01:15:34.120 align:middle line:84% there's another very interesting angle. 01:15:34.120 --> 01:15:37.960 align:middle line:84% A couple of years after we embraced Linux, 01:15:37.960 --> 01:15:44.560 align:middle line:84% we were sued for billions and billions on SCO, 01:15:44.560 --> 01:15:48.520 align:middle line:84% perhaps with Microsoft help, perhaps not [INAUDIBLE] anything 01:15:48.520 --> 01:15:50.540 align:middle line:90% have been written on that yet. 01:15:50.540 --> 01:15:56.160 align:middle line:84% And David Boies, who's a very famous lawyer, was the lawyer. 01:15:56.160 --> 01:16:00.060 align:middle line:84% And it was a fascinating campaign because, again, 01:16:00.060 --> 01:16:05.760 align:middle line:84% here is IBM, known for the company lawyers and the one that 01:16:05.760 --> 01:16:09.640 align:middle line:84% sues people on this side of [? Slashdot. ?] I don't know 01:16:09.640 --> 01:16:11.100 align:middle line:84% if you know what [? Slashdot ?] is. 01:16:11.100 --> 01:16:14.240 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] community of hackers and [? open ?] people. 01:16:14.240 --> 01:16:17.200 align:middle line:84% And IBM on one side, and then here 01:16:17.200 --> 01:16:21.800 align:middle line:84% is Microsoft and David Boies and these other people. 01:16:21.800 --> 01:16:24.200 align:middle line:84% So that was also going on [INAUDIBLE]. 01:16:24.200 --> 01:16:26.442 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Well, and the thing that was-- 01:16:26.442 --> 01:16:28.400 align:middle line:84% I mean, I think our original thought about this 01:16:28.400 --> 01:16:29.960 align:middle line:84% it was, it was a really good idea for IBM 01:16:29.960 --> 01:16:32.040 align:middle line:84% to produce this commercial because what we thought 01:16:32.040 --> 01:16:34.040 align:middle line:84% we would do is we would run it a couple of times 01:16:34.040 --> 01:16:36.480 align:middle line:84% in a very public place, and then we'd post it somewhere, 01:16:36.480 --> 01:16:38.605 align:middle line:84% and it would be sent around by the Linux community. 01:16:38.605 --> 01:16:41.880 align:middle line:84% And it would be seen as a good thing for IBM 01:16:41.880 --> 01:16:46.640 align:middle line:84% to promote Linux as this optimistic part of the future. 01:16:46.640 --> 01:16:49.160 align:middle line:84% But what happened when we actually ran it is we 01:16:49.160 --> 01:16:53.673 align:middle line:84% got so much good feedback on it just as a piece of film 01:16:53.673 --> 01:16:55.840 align:middle line:84% that we wound up making a much bigger deal out of it 01:16:55.840 --> 01:16:57.367 align:middle line:90% and evangelizing Unix. 01:16:57.367 --> 01:16:59.700 align:middle line:84% And we actually-- I'm going to show you two commercials. 01:16:59.700 --> 01:17:01.440 align:middle line:84% I'll show you the first one that we did, 01:17:01.440 --> 01:17:03.760 align:middle line:84% and then we wound up actually running it on-- we 01:17:03.760 --> 01:17:06.200 align:middle line:84% did another version of it that we ran on the Super Bowl 01:17:06.200 --> 01:17:10.040 align:middle line:84% about 18 months later that got us a lot of very good press. 01:17:10.040 --> 01:17:12.600 align:middle line:84% Getting to the whole issue of how 01:17:12.600 --> 01:17:15.980 align:middle line:84% to quantify the return on investment, it's hard to say. 01:17:15.980 --> 01:17:18.800 align:middle line:84% But Linux was another one of those big gambles 01:17:18.800 --> 01:17:20.800 align:middle line:84% that worked from a business level 01:17:20.800 --> 01:17:23.200 align:middle line:90% and also from a spiritual level. 01:17:23.200 --> 01:17:24.872 align:middle line:90% So let me-- 01:17:24.872 --> 01:17:26.288 align:middle line:90% [BEEP] 01:17:26.288 --> 01:17:27.520 align:middle line:90% 01:17:27.520 --> 01:17:31.843 align:middle line:84% I went back to this, just because I found, actually, 01:17:31.843 --> 01:17:33.760 align:middle line:84% this, just to justify this next picture, which 01:17:33.760 --> 01:17:39.460 align:middle line:84% was finding the remains of the World's Fair on some website, 01:17:39.460 --> 01:17:43.260 align:middle line:84% at some place in, like, Waco, Texas or something. 01:17:43.260 --> 01:17:45.920 align:middle line:84% I thought that was a really cool picture. 01:17:45.920 --> 01:17:50.720 align:middle line:84% But I think the conclusion is that IBM was able to embrace 01:17:50.720 --> 01:17:56.400 align:middle line:84% the future and has become a part of it again in a way that a lot 01:17:56.400 --> 01:17:58.640 align:middle line:90% of these companies didn't. 01:17:58.640 --> 01:18:02.920 align:middle line:84% And so it all comes down to faith. 01:18:02.920 --> 01:18:05.200 align:middle line:90% So that's the first part. 01:18:05.200 --> 01:18:08.520 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Why don't we take a few minutes? 01:18:08.520 --> 01:18:12.520 align:middle line:84% And then, for the next part, I ask Chris to tell us, 01:18:12.520 --> 01:18:16.280 align:middle line:84% where is marketing and advertising going, 01:18:16.280 --> 01:18:19.920 align:middle line:84% given everything going on around Google and so on? 01:18:19.920 --> 01:18:24.280 align:middle line:84% I really wanted you to see this work directly 01:18:24.280 --> 01:18:30.040 align:middle line:84% from the people who did it because operationalizing 01:18:30.040 --> 01:18:34.200 align:middle line:90% a strategy is really difficult. 01:18:34.200 --> 01:18:37.760 align:middle line:84% And remember, if you spend a lot of time building 01:18:37.760 --> 01:18:41.480 align:middle line:84% something in the labs, and if the marketplace doesn't 01:18:41.480 --> 01:18:45.440 align:middle line:84% accept it, you just wasted a lot of money. 01:18:45.440 --> 01:18:49.740 align:middle line:84% And that's why you need to spend a lot of time in the lab. 01:18:49.740 --> 01:18:52.720 align:middle line:84% But boy, if you don't figure out how 01:18:52.720 --> 01:18:57.040 align:middle line:84% to create demand in the marketplace, 01:18:57.040 --> 01:18:58.880 align:middle line:90% we just don't have anything. 01:18:58.880 --> 01:19:01.760 align:middle line:84% And when you have a disruptive innovation 01:19:01.760 --> 01:19:06.680 align:middle line:84% like the internet was or Linux, the marketplace 01:19:06.680 --> 01:19:08.220 align:middle line:90% doesn't know it wants it. 01:19:08.220 --> 01:19:10.800 align:middle line:84% They don't know what the hell you're talking about. 01:19:10.800 --> 01:19:17.340 align:middle line:84% So you somehow have to create this pull from the marketplace, 01:19:17.340 --> 01:19:18.120 align:middle line:90% this faith. 01:19:18.120 --> 01:19:20.980 align:middle line:84% And as I hope you got from Chris, 01:19:20.980 --> 01:19:26.000 align:middle line:84% this is a lot of hard work, and it's really, really creative, 01:19:26.000 --> 01:19:30.050 align:middle line:84% hard work more to extract the essence of what 01:19:30.050 --> 01:19:34.570 align:middle line:84% it is you [INAUDIBLE] those and then communicate it out there. 01:19:34.570 --> 01:19:36.890 align:middle line:84% So why don't we take 5, 10 minutes, and then 01:19:36.890 --> 01:19:38.650 align:middle line:90% we'll continue. 01:19:38.650 --> 01:19:44.810 align:middle line:84% One thing that I also hope you notice throughout Chris's talk 01:19:44.810 --> 01:19:51.070 align:middle line:84% is the whole creative storytelling aspect, 01:19:51.070 --> 01:19:55.110 align:middle line:84% which is such a big part, because people often say, 01:19:55.110 --> 01:19:57.730 align:middle line:84% well, science, technology, engineering, and so on, 01:19:57.730 --> 01:20:00.130 align:middle line:90% are analytical [INAUDIBLE]. 01:20:00.130 --> 01:20:03.490 align:middle line:84% And obviously, that part is very important. 01:20:03.490 --> 01:20:06.330 align:middle line:84% But if you're trying to communicate what [? intel ?] is 01:20:06.330 --> 01:20:11.830 align:middle line:84% for, it's much more holistic, much more of a creative part. 01:20:11.830 --> 01:20:13.690 align:middle line:84% And the reason this is so important 01:20:13.690 --> 01:20:17.690 align:middle line:84% is because I think that part of engineering, which 01:20:17.690 --> 01:20:22.730 align:middle line:84% I associate with architecture and design, I think 01:20:22.730 --> 01:20:24.170 align:middle line:90% has been lost. 01:20:24.170 --> 01:20:26.890 align:middle line:90% And so very complex things-- 01:20:26.890 --> 01:20:29.010 align:middle line:90% somebody has to do it. 01:20:29.010 --> 01:20:35.210 align:middle line:84% And I can also tell you that, when 01:20:35.210 --> 01:20:39.130 align:middle line:84% we were working on these campaigns, on the ads, 01:20:39.130 --> 01:20:43.250 align:middle line:84% the people [INAUDIBLE] spent a lot of time with our experts 01:20:43.250 --> 01:20:48.650 align:middle line:84% in IBM talking to them so they could extract from them, 01:20:48.650 --> 01:20:50.030 align:middle line:90% why are you excited? 01:20:50.030 --> 01:20:50.870 align:middle line:90% Tell me about it. 01:20:50.870 --> 01:20:53.810 align:middle line:84% And then they [INAUDIBLE] happen. 01:20:53.810 --> 01:20:58.370 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So I had a question about this whole brand-building 01:20:58.370 --> 01:20:59.450 align:middle line:90% exercise. 01:20:59.450 --> 01:21:03.770 align:middle line:84% So this technology that you were promoting at that time 01:21:03.770 --> 01:21:06.310 align:middle line:84% was available to all other companies, 01:21:06.310 --> 01:21:09.930 align:middle line:84% and they were probably pushing it as much as you were. 01:21:09.930 --> 01:21:13.170 align:middle line:84% There were a lot of competitors in that domain. 01:21:13.170 --> 01:21:16.330 align:middle line:84% Your [? quote-- ?] or your real strength 01:21:16.330 --> 01:21:20.130 align:middle line:84% was not really technology, but the people, 01:21:20.130 --> 01:21:24.572 align:middle line:84% the people that were giving these solutions [INAUDIBLE]? 01:21:24.572 --> 01:21:26.530 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Let me give my answer, 01:21:26.530 --> 01:21:31.090 align:middle line:90% and then Chris can do that. 01:21:31.090 --> 01:21:38.330 align:middle line:84% The internet-- when we started in '96, everybody 01:21:38.330 --> 01:21:42.530 align:middle line:84% knew already the internet was really exciting. 01:21:42.530 --> 01:21:44.370 align:middle line:84% But it was-- first of all, nobody 01:21:44.370 --> 01:21:47.570 align:middle line:90% knew what was it excited for. 01:21:47.570 --> 01:21:52.250 align:middle line:84% And it was very much a consumer kind of activity. 01:21:52.250 --> 01:21:56.650 align:middle line:84% And remember, IBM's brand is business, 01:21:56.650 --> 01:21:59.670 align:middle line:84% and IBM's clients are people in business. 01:21:59.670 --> 01:22:01.870 align:middle line:84% And by business, you are including health care, 01:22:01.870 --> 01:22:03.530 align:middle line:90% government, universities. 01:22:03.530 --> 01:22:05.290 align:middle line:90% So it's not consumer. 01:22:05.290 --> 01:22:09.050 align:middle line:84% So we needed to take this thing and make 01:22:09.050 --> 01:22:11.250 align:middle line:90% it relevant to business. 01:22:11.250 --> 01:22:14.610 align:middle line:84% That was the unique thing we needed to do. 01:22:14.610 --> 01:22:18.490 align:middle line:84% And that's why, when you see the ads, they all keep, 01:22:18.490 --> 01:22:20.090 align:middle line:84% one way or another, saying, yeah, I 01:22:20.090 --> 01:22:25.050 align:middle line:84% know this is cute and funny logos and all that. 01:22:25.050 --> 01:22:27.865 align:middle line:84% But business-- that's what you need to do. 01:22:27.865 --> 01:22:28.990 align:middle line:90% So that's what [INAUDIBLE]. 01:22:28.990 --> 01:22:30.657 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So what you are really selling 01:22:30.657 --> 01:22:34.150 align:middle line:84% were the professional services [INAUDIBLE]? 01:22:34.150 --> 01:22:35.650 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Everything. 01:22:35.650 --> 01:22:37.890 align:middle line:84% We were also hardware and software 01:22:37.890 --> 01:22:39.770 align:middle line:84% because the hardware and software-- 01:22:39.770 --> 01:22:44.690 align:middle line:84% we wanted our clients to buy hardware and software to run 01:22:44.690 --> 01:22:48.090 align:middle line:84% this internet-based application or to run 01:22:48.090 --> 01:22:51.162 align:middle line:90% Linux-based applications. 01:22:51.162 --> 01:22:52.370 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: I mean, we also-- 01:22:52.370 --> 01:22:55.290 align:middle line:84% keep in mind, you're looking at about eight years' 01:22:55.290 --> 01:22:58.410 align:middle line:84% worth of communications from a company that 01:22:58.410 --> 01:22:59.750 align:middle line:90% does an awful lot of stuff. 01:22:59.750 --> 01:23:03.197 align:middle line:84% So there were plenty of ads that we did that said, 01:23:03.197 --> 01:23:04.030 align:middle line:90% here's a new server. 01:23:04.030 --> 01:23:05.070 align:middle line:90% Here's why we made it. 01:23:05.070 --> 01:23:06.903 align:middle line:84% It's got this, it's got this, it's got this. 01:23:06.903 --> 01:23:09.690 align:middle line:84% I mean, you have to tell people-- 01:23:09.690 --> 01:23:12.310 align:middle line:84% there's a basic informational part of doing what we do, 01:23:12.310 --> 01:23:14.950 align:middle line:84% where you go, we made a new product, we have a new version, 01:23:14.950 --> 01:23:16.510 align:middle line:84% we have an upgrade, stuff like that. 01:23:16.510 --> 01:23:20.150 align:middle line:84% I didn't bring that because it's not as entertaining, frankly, 01:23:20.150 --> 01:23:22.430 align:middle line:84% to look at, and it's kind of what you would expect. 01:23:22.430 --> 01:23:25.650 align:middle line:84% I mean, the bigger thing for IBM was the change from, 01:23:25.650 --> 01:23:27.410 align:middle line:84% I don't think they get it, to, I think 01:23:27.410 --> 01:23:30.970 align:middle line:84% that they're one of the companies that's 01:23:30.970 --> 01:23:33.450 align:middle line:84% defining the way the world is going to work. 01:23:33.450 --> 01:23:36.250 align:middle line:84% And I mean, so that's really what this-- 01:23:36.250 --> 01:23:39.230 align:middle line:84% I brought mostly to just show that kind of thing. 01:23:39.230 --> 01:23:40.730 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So the reason I asked this 01:23:40.730 --> 01:23:43.650 align:middle line:84% is because there are other consulting companies like-- 01:23:43.650 --> 01:23:46.610 align:middle line:90% I don't know-- McKinsey, Bain. 01:23:46.610 --> 01:23:49.670 align:middle line:84% They never advertise their services this way. 01:23:49.670 --> 01:23:51.950 align:middle line:90% They're not selling technology. 01:23:51.950 --> 01:23:56.730 align:middle line:84% They're selling their people's skills and services and such. 01:23:56.730 --> 01:23:58.675 align:middle line:84% You were actually selling technology there, 01:23:58.675 --> 01:24:00.050 align:middle line:84% and through that, [? services. ?] 01:24:00.050 --> 01:24:00.650 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: [INAUDIBLE] 01:24:00.650 --> 01:24:02.490 align:middle line:90% we were selling [INAUDIBLE]. 01:24:02.490 --> 01:24:05.230 align:middle line:84% Also, IBM is much bigger [INAUDIBLE]. 01:24:05.230 --> 01:24:08.917 align:middle line:90% 01:24:08.917 --> 01:24:11.250 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: I mean, and those companies-- like McKinsey, 01:24:11.250 --> 01:24:15.194 align:middle line:84% I don't think, does any advertising. 01:24:15.194 --> 01:24:16.090 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE] 01:24:16.090 --> 01:24:16.390 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Yeah. 01:24:16.390 --> 01:24:17.050 align:middle line:90% I mean-- 01:24:17.050 --> 01:24:17.740 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah. 01:24:17.740 --> 01:24:18.983 align:middle line:90% Accenture does a lot. 01:24:18.983 --> 01:24:20.900 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Accenture does a lot. 01:24:20.900 --> 01:24:22.275 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Accenture does a lot. 01:24:22.275 --> 01:24:25.460 align:middle line:84% And it just depends because McKinsey has been around 01:24:25.460 --> 01:24:28.800 align:middle line:84% for forever, and they have all these personal relationships. 01:24:28.800 --> 01:24:31.340 align:middle line:84% It's not that big of a company, and it's 01:24:31.340 --> 01:24:34.540 align:middle line:84% a very personal, specialized-- it's like CAA or something 01:24:34.540 --> 01:24:35.040 align:middle line:90% like that. 01:24:35.040 --> 01:24:38.220 align:middle line:84% It's a very specialized business. 01:24:38.220 --> 01:24:43.420 align:middle line:84% And IBM is not really competing with McKinsey. 01:24:43.420 --> 01:24:44.920 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: No, they're not competing. 01:24:44.920 --> 01:24:49.040 align:middle line:84% It's just that they sell their people's skills also. 01:24:49.040 --> 01:24:52.320 align:middle line:84% But we never see them advertising anything. 01:24:52.320 --> 01:24:55.638 align:middle line:84% So you are definitely selling something different. 01:24:55.638 --> 01:24:57.180 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: We are selling all of it, 01:24:57.180 --> 01:25:01.580 align:middle line:84% and we are also trying to speak to a very big constituency 01:25:01.580 --> 01:25:05.780 align:middle line:84% of people, and including the people who work for IBM, 01:25:05.780 --> 01:25:06.780 align:middle line:90% kind of. 01:25:06.780 --> 01:25:10.460 align:middle line:84% So it was a very different problem. 01:25:10.460 --> 01:25:13.380 align:middle line:90% Let me tell you what this is. 01:25:13.380 --> 01:25:15.340 align:middle line:84% This is something completely different. 01:25:15.340 --> 01:25:17.500 align:middle line:84% And I brought this, and I'm not sure 01:25:17.500 --> 01:25:20.940 align:middle line:84% that you're even remotely interested in this. 01:25:20.940 --> 01:25:23.440 align:middle line:90% This is a rant that I did. 01:25:23.440 --> 01:25:30.220 align:middle line:84% It's about 20 minutes about the future of web marketing 01:25:30.220 --> 01:25:32.360 align:middle line:84% because right now, the advertising business, 01:25:32.360 --> 01:25:34.400 align:middle line:90% there's a lot of-- 01:25:34.400 --> 01:25:38.820 align:middle line:84% like everything to do with technology, there's a lot of-- 01:25:38.820 --> 01:25:42.900 align:middle line:84% everything in technology is set up as a war between A versus B. 01:25:42.900 --> 01:25:45.683 align:middle line:84% So Apple versus IBM, people want to write that story. 01:25:45.683 --> 01:25:47.100 align:middle line:84% So one of the stories right now is 01:25:47.100 --> 01:25:51.580 align:middle line:84% the internet versus television or old media versus new media. 01:25:51.580 --> 01:26:00.620 align:middle line:84% And so I did a version of this talk at a conference 01:26:00.620 --> 01:26:03.515 align:middle line:84% that we sponsor called Verge in New York last year. 01:26:03.515 --> 01:26:05.140 align:middle line:84% And then I did a cut-down version of it 01:26:05.140 --> 01:26:09.000 align:middle line:84% for Johnson & Johnson marketing conference 01:26:09.000 --> 01:26:12.340 align:middle line:84% that was all about new media and stuff like that. 01:26:12.340 --> 01:26:16.140 align:middle line:84% And so the beginning starts off here a little-- 01:26:16.140 --> 01:26:18.440 align:middle line:84% like, why did you start off this way? 01:26:18.440 --> 01:26:19.780 align:middle line:90% They basically said, come in-- 01:26:19.780 --> 01:26:21.100 align:middle line:84% one of the themes of this-- they had, 01:26:21.100 --> 01:26:23.100 align:middle line:84% like, 20 speakers, and everybody started with, 01:26:23.100 --> 01:26:25.580 align:middle line:84% as they walked on stage, with their favorite song, which 01:26:25.580 --> 01:26:27.300 align:middle line:90% I'm not going to play. 01:26:27.300 --> 01:26:29.240 align:middle line:84% But it's kind of where this thing starts. 01:26:29.240 --> 01:26:31.365 align:middle line:84% And I just literally pulled this out of my computer 01:26:31.365 --> 01:26:33.600 align:middle line:84% because I thought it might be of interest to you. 01:26:33.600 --> 01:26:36.660 align:middle line:84% So it's about 20 minutes, and it's just a rant. 01:26:36.660 --> 01:26:40.607 align:middle line:90% And I'm just going to read it. 01:26:40.607 --> 01:26:42.940 align:middle line:84% My assistant, Maria, came into my office a few weeks ago 01:26:42.940 --> 01:26:45.220 align:middle line:84% saying that she wanted my favorite song 01:26:45.220 --> 01:26:48.360 align:middle line:84% to play as I walked on stage for this presentation. 01:26:48.360 --> 01:26:50.860 align:middle line:84% And I said, I don't have a favorite song, a single song 01:26:50.860 --> 01:26:52.522 align:middle line:90% that stands above all others. 01:26:52.522 --> 01:26:54.480 align:middle line:84% And she said, you have to have a favorite song. 01:26:54.480 --> 01:26:55.608 align:middle line:90% Give me a song. 01:26:55.608 --> 01:26:57.900 align:middle line:84% And I said, well, how do you compare "Blue Suede Shoes" 01:26:57.900 --> 01:27:00.040 align:middle line:84% to "My Sharona" to Timbaland's greatest hits? 01:27:00.040 --> 01:27:02.980 align:middle line:84% And why should I pick one song when, in a digital world, 01:27:02.980 --> 01:27:04.200 align:middle line:90% I can have them all? 01:27:04.200 --> 01:27:06.080 align:middle line:84% And she said, give me a song, will you? 01:27:06.080 --> 01:27:06.800 align:middle line:90% So I said, OK. 01:27:06.800 --> 01:27:11.340 align:middle line:84% And my choice was "Peggy Sue" by Buddy Holly and The Crickets. 01:27:11.340 --> 01:27:13.580 align:middle line:84% And it's a good song for talking about storytelling 01:27:13.580 --> 01:27:16.280 align:middle line:84% in a digital age because, like a lot of great songs, 01:27:16.280 --> 01:27:18.140 align:middle line:84% there is actually a story behind it, 01:27:18.140 --> 01:27:20.100 align:middle line:90% or actually a number of stories. 01:27:20.100 --> 01:27:22.280 align:middle line:84% The first story is Peggy Sue herself, 01:27:22.280 --> 01:27:25.420 align:middle line:84% the Lubbock, Texas teenager who inspired the song-- 01:27:25.420 --> 01:27:27.440 align:middle line:84% well, OK, she didn't actually inspire the song. 01:27:27.440 --> 01:27:30.380 align:middle line:84% The song was originally called "Cindy Lou," 01:27:30.380 --> 01:27:33.280 align:middle line:84% but the drummer of Buddy Holly's band was dating Peggy Sue, 01:27:33.280 --> 01:27:36.060 align:middle line:84% and to impress her, he asked that the song be named after 01:27:36.060 --> 01:27:36.560 align:middle line:90% her. 01:27:36.560 --> 01:27:38.260 align:middle line:84% And that was before marketing really 01:27:38.260 --> 01:27:40.120 align:middle line:90% got involved in these things. 01:27:40.120 --> 01:27:42.200 align:middle line:90% And so Buddy Holly said, sure. 01:27:42.200 --> 01:27:44.660 align:middle line:84% And in fact, the drummer wound up marrying Peggy Sue, 01:27:44.660 --> 01:27:47.278 align:middle line:84% and she became Buddy Holly's biggest hit, 01:27:47.278 --> 01:27:49.820 align:middle line:84% eventually inspiring everyone from the Beatles and Beach Boys 01:27:49.820 --> 01:27:51.000 align:middle line:90% and a thousand others. 01:27:51.000 --> 01:27:54.060 align:middle line:84% The name Beatles, actually, was a John Lennon homage 01:27:54.060 --> 01:27:57.240 align:middle line:84% to the name of Buddy Holly's band, The Crickets. 01:27:57.240 --> 01:27:59.020 align:middle line:84% And that band influenced an awful lot 01:27:59.020 --> 01:28:00.403 align:middle line:90% of the music we listen to today. 01:28:00.403 --> 01:28:02.820 align:middle line:84% I mean, the Rolling Stones' first hit was a cover of Buddy 01:28:02.820 --> 01:28:06.060 align:middle line:84% Hollie's "Not Fade Away," which was also recorded by Dylan, 01:28:06.060 --> 01:28:09.020 align:middle line:84% by Bruce Springsteen, by the Grateful Dead, among others. 01:28:09.020 --> 01:28:12.780 align:middle line:84% And Holly's songs were covered by Marshall Crenshaw, Tanya 01:28:12.780 --> 01:28:16.800 align:middle line:84% Tucker, Link Wray, Santana, Elvis Costello, John Mellencamp, 01:28:16.800 --> 01:28:19.620 align:middle line:84% James Taylor, and, well, you've got the picture. 01:28:19.620 --> 01:28:22.340 align:middle line:84% The song, in fact, was such a hit that Holly wrote a sequel 01:28:22.340 --> 01:28:25.540 align:middle line:84% called "Peggy Sue Got Married," which led to the 1986 movie 01:28:25.540 --> 01:28:29.060 align:middle line:84% directed by Francis Ford Coppola. 01:28:29.060 --> 01:28:32.420 align:middle line:84% Buddy Holly was ranked number 13 on the list of the Greatest 01:28:32.420 --> 01:28:35.580 align:middle line:84% Artists of All Time by Rolling Stone, 01:28:35.580 --> 01:28:38.340 align:middle line:84% number 13 being appropriate because, like a lot of great 01:28:38.340 --> 01:28:40.660 align:middle line:84% stories, there's a huge element of tragedy, 01:28:40.660 --> 01:28:43.440 align:middle line:84% namely the plane crash on a cold February night in Clear Lake, 01:28:43.440 --> 01:28:46.540 align:middle line:84% Iowa that ended Holly's life at the age of 22 and inspired Don 01:28:46.540 --> 01:28:49.760 align:middle line:84% McLean to write one of the great storytelling songs of all time, 01:28:49.760 --> 01:28:55.060 align:middle line:84% "American Pie," in which he sang about the day the music died. 01:28:55.060 --> 01:28:57.235 align:middle line:84% So Chris, where are you going with this? 01:28:57.235 --> 01:28:59.360 align:middle line:84% I'd like to make a slight digression at this point. 01:28:59.360 --> 01:29:02.100 align:middle line:84% I am, after all, a marketing professional, 01:29:02.100 --> 01:29:04.820 align:middle line:84% and having been thinking about the whole digital discussion 01:29:04.820 --> 01:29:07.960 align:middle line:84% this year, the extraordinary change affecting our business, 01:29:07.960 --> 01:29:11.953 align:middle line:84% a revolution, a transformation, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, 01:29:11.953 --> 01:29:13.370 align:middle line:84% blah, blah-- you know what I mean. 01:29:13.370 --> 01:29:15.257 align:middle line:84% Most of the talk is about technology. 01:29:15.257 --> 01:29:16.090 align:middle line:90% What's the hardware? 01:29:16.090 --> 01:29:16.930 align:middle line:90% What's the software? 01:29:16.930 --> 01:29:18.630 align:middle line:84% What are the components and technologies 01:29:18.630 --> 01:29:20.130 align:middle line:90% and infrastructure issues? 01:29:20.130 --> 01:29:22.790 align:middle line:84% There is endless talk about click rates and page views 01:29:22.790 --> 01:29:24.910 align:middle line:90% and search engine optimization. 01:29:24.910 --> 01:29:26.150 align:middle line:90% I've blogged this, people. 01:29:26.150 --> 01:29:27.058 align:middle line:90% I know. 01:29:27.058 --> 01:29:29.350 align:middle line:84% Now, I've spent my whole career as a copywriter working 01:29:29.350 --> 01:29:31.790 align:middle line:84% on digital products, having been creative director for two 01:29:31.790 --> 01:29:34.910 align:middle line:84% decades on IBM, Apple, Microsoft, SAP, Lotus, AT&T 01:29:34.910 --> 01:29:37.885 align:middle line:84% Wireless, Motorola, and half a dozen other brands. 01:29:37.885 --> 01:29:40.510 align:middle line:84% And one of the techniques I have personally used over the years 01:29:40.510 --> 01:29:43.870 align:middle line:84% to sell stuff like this is to take ideas that have been around 01:29:43.870 --> 01:29:46.550 align:middle line:84% forever and storytelling and express it 01:29:46.550 --> 01:29:49.270 align:middle line:84% with a bunch of new lingo that alternately intimidates 01:29:49.270 --> 01:29:51.630 align:middle line:84% or excites an audience into action, which brings me 01:29:51.630 --> 01:29:54.510 align:middle line:90% to my topic today. 01:29:54.510 --> 01:29:57.550 align:middle line:84% This white paper will be downloadable at my website. 01:29:57.550 --> 01:29:59.773 align:middle line:84% That is, if you throw enough jargon at people, 01:29:59.773 --> 01:30:01.690 align:middle line:84% they start to think what you're talking about, 01:30:01.690 --> 01:30:03.750 align:middle line:90% whether or not you actually do. 01:30:03.750 --> 01:30:06.830 align:middle line:84% Enron virtualizing the sale and distribution of energy 01:30:06.830 --> 01:30:08.870 align:middle line:84% in the '90s-- who invested in that? 01:30:08.870 --> 01:30:11.390 align:middle line:84% GM talked about how they were going to use CAD/CAM 01:30:11.390 --> 01:30:14.310 align:middle line:84% and robotics to transform their companies in the '80s. 01:30:14.310 --> 01:30:15.470 align:middle line:90% That sure worked. 01:30:15.470 --> 01:30:17.270 align:middle line:84% Remember when everybody was afraid of being 01:30:17.270 --> 01:30:20.870 align:middle line:84% Amazoned by companies like Global Crossing and pets.com? 01:30:20.870 --> 01:30:24.910 align:middle line:84% The more things change, the more they stay the same. 01:30:24.910 --> 01:30:27.210 align:middle line:84% My name is Chris Wall, and I approve this message. 01:30:27.210 --> 01:30:28.550 align:middle line:90% [LAUGHTER] 01:30:28.550 --> 01:30:30.710 align:middle line:84% Today, everybody is talking about branded content 01:30:30.710 --> 01:30:31.810 align:middle line:90% as the next new thing. 01:30:31.810 --> 01:30:33.630 align:middle line:90% But is it new, really? 01:30:33.630 --> 01:30:36.830 align:middle line:84% Is there a better example of branded content than the Macy's 01:30:36.830 --> 01:30:38.430 align:middle line:90% Thanksgiving Day Parade? 01:30:38.430 --> 01:30:40.590 align:middle line:90% This started in the 1920s. 01:30:40.590 --> 01:30:42.230 align:middle line:90% That is 80 years ago. 01:30:42.230 --> 01:30:44.690 align:middle line:84% Or what about Miracle on 34th Street, 01:30:44.690 --> 01:30:47.190 align:middle line:84% the classic movie that cast Macy's as one of the central 01:30:47.190 --> 01:30:48.050 align:middle line:90% characters? 01:30:48.050 --> 01:30:50.150 align:middle line:90% It was made in 1947. 01:30:50.150 --> 01:30:53.150 align:middle line:84% That's a year before David Ogilvy started his advertising 01:30:53.150 --> 01:30:53.830 align:middle line:90% agency. 01:30:53.830 --> 01:30:57.070 align:middle line:84% Among the many brilliant things that David Ogilvy said 01:30:57.070 --> 01:30:59.790 align:middle line:84% about advertising way back then was the importance 01:30:59.790 --> 01:31:03.210 align:middle line:90% of story value in advertising. 01:31:03.210 --> 01:31:06.670 align:middle line:84% And over the years, marketers have tried all kinds of things 01:31:06.670 --> 01:31:08.830 align:middle line:84% to make their stories more valuable. 01:31:08.830 --> 01:31:11.470 align:middle line:90% People like stories. 01:31:11.470 --> 01:31:13.550 align:middle line:84% People are interested in stories. 01:31:13.550 --> 01:31:15.710 align:middle line:84% Branded content is just a new way of saying, 01:31:15.710 --> 01:31:17.790 align:middle line:84% we need more story value if anyone is going 01:31:17.790 --> 01:31:19.810 align:middle line:90% to pay attention to our brands. 01:31:19.810 --> 01:31:21.690 align:middle line:84% And if you think about brands as stories, 01:31:21.690 --> 01:31:24.470 align:middle line:84% I think it changes how you think about building brands. 01:31:24.470 --> 01:31:26.250 align:middle line:84% It affects process and structure, 01:31:26.250 --> 01:31:30.870 align:middle line:84% and it's a lot more important than technology and jargon. 01:31:30.870 --> 01:31:33.130 align:middle line:84% Big ideas, David Ogilvy called them. 01:31:33.130 --> 01:31:35.290 align:middle line:84% Unless your advertising contains a big idea, 01:31:35.290 --> 01:31:38.230 align:middle line:84% he said, it will pass like a ship in the night. 01:31:38.230 --> 01:31:40.170 align:middle line:84% When I was growing up in this business, 01:31:40.170 --> 01:31:43.190 align:middle line:84% there was an axiom that said, big brands do big things, 01:31:43.190 --> 01:31:45.910 align:middle line:84% and important brands do important things. 01:31:45.910 --> 01:31:48.350 align:middle line:84% And I don't really think that has changed. 01:31:48.350 --> 01:31:51.070 align:middle line:84% How you do it doesn't matter, but if you don't, your brand 01:31:51.070 --> 01:31:54.070 align:middle line:84% won't be big, and you won't be important. 01:31:54.070 --> 01:31:56.070 align:middle line:84% Anyway, forget about technology for a moment, 01:31:56.070 --> 01:31:57.990 align:middle line:90% and think about this. 01:31:57.990 --> 01:32:00.910 align:middle line:84% For the past five decades or so, the responsibility 01:32:00.910 --> 01:32:02.910 align:middle line:84% for attracting the large audiences 01:32:02.910 --> 01:32:05.510 align:middle line:84% we need to do big things went to the networks, the production 01:32:05.510 --> 01:32:08.050 align:middle line:84% companies, and the magazine and newspaper publishers. 01:32:08.050 --> 01:32:09.450 align:middle line:90% They were the storytellers. 01:32:09.450 --> 01:32:10.950 align:middle line:90% They brought the audience. 01:32:10.950 --> 01:32:12.990 align:middle line:84% We went to where the audience was and tried 01:32:12.990 --> 01:32:15.430 align:middle line:84% to deliver a compelling message in a few seconds here 01:32:15.430 --> 01:32:16.990 align:middle line:90% and a few seconds there. 01:32:16.990 --> 01:32:19.090 align:middle line:84% Because we only had a few seconds, 01:32:19.090 --> 01:32:20.590 align:middle line:84% we focused everything on perfectly 01:32:20.590 --> 01:32:23.470 align:middle line:84% refining our unique selling propositions and product 01:32:23.470 --> 01:32:24.050 align:middle line:90% benefits. 01:32:24.050 --> 01:32:27.910 align:middle line:84% We honed, and we tested, and we distilled, and we refined. 01:32:27.910 --> 01:32:29.450 align:middle line:84% That was our project for the year, 01:32:29.450 --> 01:32:31.630 align:middle line:90% those precious few impressions. 01:32:31.630 --> 01:32:34.610 align:middle line:84% Get the brand promise right and then perfect the execution. 01:32:34.610 --> 01:32:36.910 align:middle line:84% And we would literally spend months 01:32:36.910 --> 01:32:38.770 align:middle line:84% noodling and fiddling and testing, 01:32:38.770 --> 01:32:42.590 align:middle line:84% trying to get, say, the perfect depiction of the bristles 01:32:42.590 --> 01:32:46.550 align:middle line:84% of a toothbrush as it turned into the light or the beer pour 01:32:46.550 --> 01:32:47.410 align:middle line:90% or whatever it took. 01:32:47.410 --> 01:32:49.750 align:middle line:84% And the whole discussion of story value kind 01:32:49.750 --> 01:32:51.350 align:middle line:90% fell by the wayside. 01:32:51.350 --> 01:32:53.290 align:middle line:84% But when you talk about branded content, 01:32:53.290 --> 01:32:55.742 align:middle line:84% you're essentially saying that we, the marketers, 01:32:55.742 --> 01:32:57.950 align:middle line:84% are going to take at least part of the responsibility 01:32:57.950 --> 01:33:00.610 align:middle line:84% for attracting an audience and holding on to them. 01:33:00.610 --> 01:33:03.990 align:middle line:84% And that means story value is back with extreme prejudice. 01:33:03.990 --> 01:33:06.272 align:middle line:90% David Ogilvy was right. 01:33:06.272 --> 01:33:08.230 align:middle line:84% Now, much has been made over the past few years 01:33:08.230 --> 01:33:11.910 align:middle line:84% about the decline of mass media, and the primary reason cited 01:33:11.910 --> 01:33:15.590 align:middle line:84% is the rise of new media-- the internet, gaming, and so on. 01:33:15.590 --> 01:33:17.150 align:middle line:90% Technology is the reason. 01:33:17.150 --> 01:33:18.790 align:middle line:90% Technology is to blame. 01:33:18.790 --> 01:33:21.470 align:middle line:84% It's been reported so often that people just 01:33:21.470 --> 01:33:23.230 align:middle line:90% take it for granted as true. 01:33:23.230 --> 01:33:27.190 align:middle line:84% But I would like to offer an alternative theory. 01:33:27.190 --> 01:33:30.910 align:middle line:84% Now, I apologize if I get a little academic here. 01:33:30.910 --> 01:33:33.150 align:middle line:90% This is MIT. 01:33:33.150 --> 01:33:36.770 align:middle line:84% These are the Beverly Hillbillies, Uncle Jed, Granny, 01:33:36.770 --> 01:33:38.070 align:middle line:90% Elly May, and Jethro. 01:33:38.070 --> 01:33:41.190 align:middle line:84% This half-hour show about a family of Ozark rubes 01:33:41.190 --> 01:33:43.370 align:middle line:84% who strike oil and become petro-millionaires 01:33:43.370 --> 01:33:47.950 align:middle line:84% debuted on the CBS Television Network, September 26, 1962. 01:33:47.950 --> 01:33:51.430 align:middle line:84% And for two years, it was the number one show in America. 01:33:51.430 --> 01:33:53.210 align:middle line:84% At the height of its nine-year run, 01:33:53.210 --> 01:33:58.510 align:middle line:84% eight of the top 25 most viewed television programs of all time 01:33:58.510 --> 01:34:00.640 align:middle line:84% were episodes of The Beverly Hillbillies. 01:34:00.640 --> 01:34:04.560 align:middle line:84% And one program, entitled "The Giant Jackrabbit," 01:34:04.560 --> 01:34:08.120 align:middle line:84% was the single most viewed program ever and is reputed 01:34:08.120 --> 01:34:10.900 align:middle line:84% to have attracted 80 million viewers in one sitting, 01:34:10.900 --> 01:34:14.040 align:middle line:84% two and a half times more than the best episode of American 01:34:14.040 --> 01:34:15.400 align:middle line:90% Idol. 01:34:15.400 --> 01:34:18.240 align:middle line:84% Now, back in the '60s, the networks provided enormous 01:34:18.240 --> 01:34:21.420 align:middle line:84% amounts of content to a large and insatiable viewing public. 01:34:21.420 --> 01:34:24.480 align:middle line:84% There were only three networks, but they provided a whole lot 01:34:24.480 --> 01:34:26.880 align:middle line:84% more content over the course of a year 01:34:26.880 --> 01:34:28.600 align:middle line:90% than anybody provides now. 01:34:28.600 --> 01:34:31.480 align:middle line:90% What do I mean by that? 01:34:31.480 --> 01:34:34.760 align:middle line:84% In 1962, their first year on the air, The Beverly Hillbillies 01:34:34.760 --> 01:34:36.480 align:middle line:90% produced 36 episodes. 01:34:36.480 --> 01:34:38.920 align:middle line:84% That means from the premiere episode the last week 01:34:38.920 --> 01:34:41.040 align:middle line:84% in September, you could watch every week 01:34:41.040 --> 01:34:45.040 align:middle line:84% until the last week in May without seeing a single repeat. 01:34:45.040 --> 01:34:47.140 align:middle line:84% That means every week you got a new show, 01:34:47.140 --> 01:34:50.440 align:middle line:84% and there was no big deal about an all-new Beverly Hillbillies. 01:34:50.440 --> 01:34:52.760 align:middle line:84% That was just assumed by the audience. 01:34:52.760 --> 01:34:56.560 align:middle line:84% Contrast this with The Sopranos, which, in its last season, 01:34:56.560 --> 01:35:00.200 align:middle line:84% debuted a new season with just 12 episodes, one third 01:35:00.200 --> 01:35:02.820 align:middle line:84% of what The Beverly Hillbillies produced in its first year. 01:35:02.820 --> 01:35:05.600 align:middle line:84% And today, most new shows only produce between 18 and 22 01:35:05.600 --> 01:35:07.120 align:middle line:90% episodes in a season. 01:35:07.120 --> 01:35:09.960 align:middle line:84% The Beverly Hillbillies, though, produced another 36 episodes 01:35:09.960 --> 01:35:13.740 align:middle line:84% in 1963, year two, compared to Seinfeld, 01:35:13.740 --> 01:35:17.020 align:middle line:84% which produced only 180 episodes in nine years. 01:35:17.020 --> 01:35:19.103 align:middle line:90% That's just 20 per season. 01:35:19.103 --> 01:35:20.520 align:middle line:84% Now, The Beverly Hillbillies story 01:35:20.520 --> 01:35:22.740 align:middle line:90% was told in a different era. 01:35:22.740 --> 01:35:26.560 align:middle line:84% Here is a still shot from the opening sequence, in which you 01:35:26.560 --> 01:35:29.640 align:middle line:84% see the Winston cigarette truck driving past 01:35:29.640 --> 01:35:31.840 align:middle line:84% as they sing about Winston tasting 01:35:31.840 --> 01:35:34.160 align:middle line:90% good like a cigarette should. 01:35:34.160 --> 01:35:35.920 align:middle line:84% How many sponsors today are this tightly 01:35:35.920 --> 01:35:37.820 align:middle line:84% connected to the characters in a show? 01:35:37.820 --> 01:35:39.960 align:middle line:84% But back then, it was how the business worked. 01:35:39.960 --> 01:35:43.260 align:middle line:84% Actors did in-character pitches for products, 01:35:43.260 --> 01:35:45.000 align:middle line:84% so they became part of the story. 01:35:45.000 --> 01:35:46.960 align:middle line:84% Everybody had a vested interest in putting 01:35:46.960 --> 01:35:48.500 align:middle line:90% on a show for the audience. 01:35:48.500 --> 01:35:51.580 align:middle line:84% Sometime around the end of the '60s, something happened. 01:35:51.580 --> 01:35:53.960 align:middle line:84% The networks got cocky and started taking the audience 01:35:53.960 --> 01:35:56.480 align:middle line:84% for granted, or actors felt it was beneath them 01:35:56.480 --> 01:35:58.560 align:middle line:84% to shill for the product, or the advertisers 01:35:58.560 --> 01:35:59.740 align:middle line:90% started to get cheap. 01:35:59.740 --> 01:36:01.320 align:middle line:90% But something changed. 01:36:01.320 --> 01:36:04.440 align:middle line:84% In 1965, The Beverly Hillbillies produced 01:36:04.440 --> 01:36:10.200 align:middle line:84% only 34 episodes; in 1966, just 32; in 1967 01:36:10.200 --> 01:36:15.200 align:middle line:84% and '68, only 30; in 1969 and 1970, 26; 01:36:15.200 --> 01:36:18.400 align:middle line:84% and in 1971, they buried the Clampetts for good 01:36:18.400 --> 01:36:21.473 align:middle line:84% in a season that produced only 24 episodes. 01:36:21.473 --> 01:36:23.140 align:middle line:84% Now, at the same time this was going on, 01:36:23.140 --> 01:36:25.500 align:middle line:84% the number of ads in a program began to rise. 01:36:25.500 --> 01:36:27.880 align:middle line:84% In 1961, a typical hour-long program 01:36:27.880 --> 01:36:31.800 align:middle line:84% ran 51 minutes, with 9 minutes set aside for commercials. 01:36:31.800 --> 01:36:35.000 align:middle line:84% Today, an hour-long show runs 42 minutes with 18 minutes or more 01:36:35.000 --> 01:36:36.500 align:middle line:90% used for commercial breaks. 01:36:36.500 --> 01:36:37.680 align:middle line:90% Now, think about it. 01:36:37.680 --> 01:36:39.440 align:middle line:84% Viewers were getting more and more control 01:36:39.440 --> 01:36:41.400 align:middle line:84% of what they could watch and how easily they 01:36:41.400 --> 01:36:42.780 align:middle line:90% could change what they watched. 01:36:42.780 --> 01:36:44.240 align:middle line:84% At the same time, programmers were 01:36:44.240 --> 01:36:46.980 align:middle line:84% producing less and less of what people wanted to see 01:36:46.980 --> 01:36:49.680 align:middle line:84% and filling it up with more and more commercial messages 01:36:49.680 --> 01:36:51.800 align:middle line:84% broken into smaller and smaller parts. 01:36:51.800 --> 01:36:53.600 align:middle line:84% And the reward for being a loyal viewer 01:36:53.600 --> 01:36:55.520 align:middle line:84% got smaller, and smaller, and smaller, 01:36:55.520 --> 01:36:58.560 align:middle line:84% and smaller until there aren't any anymore. 01:36:58.560 --> 01:37:00.118 align:middle line:90% Technology my ass. 01:37:00.118 --> 01:37:02.160 align:middle line:84% Even in the final season, The Beverly Hillbillies 01:37:02.160 --> 01:37:04.618 align:middle line:84% produced more episodes than most of the programs on the air 01:37:04.618 --> 01:37:05.720 align:middle line:90% today. 01:37:05.720 --> 01:37:07.720 align:middle line:84% Now, if you look at most of the great properties 01:37:07.720 --> 01:37:09.760 align:middle line:84% in the history of all media, they 01:37:09.760 --> 01:37:12.280 align:middle line:84% have been mostly episodic in nature. 01:37:12.280 --> 01:37:14.120 align:middle line:84% Charles Dickens wrote A Tale of Two Cities 01:37:14.120 --> 01:37:15.940 align:middle line:90% to serialize in magazines. 01:37:15.940 --> 01:37:18.400 align:middle line:84% Sherlock Holmes was written in the same way. 01:37:18.400 --> 01:37:21.100 align:middle line:84% Star Wars, Halo, Doom-- you name it. 01:37:21.100 --> 01:37:22.760 align:middle line:90% It's a paradox. 01:37:22.760 --> 01:37:25.580 align:middle line:84% The audience wants things that are new and fresh, 01:37:25.580 --> 01:37:28.460 align:middle line:84% but they enjoy the comfort of regular characters, 01:37:28.460 --> 01:37:31.340 align:middle line:84% a narrative they know, a familiar music and themes, 01:37:31.340 --> 01:37:34.520 align:middle line:84% an expectation of the kind of content they are going to see-- 01:37:34.520 --> 01:37:37.840 align:middle line:90% in other words, story value. 01:37:37.840 --> 01:37:39.840 align:middle line:84% I mean, George Lucas got this way 01:37:39.840 --> 01:37:42.400 align:middle line:84% before anybody else started talking about new media 01:37:42.400 --> 01:37:45.040 align:middle line:84% when he took Star Wars from the big screen 01:37:45.040 --> 01:37:47.380 align:middle line:84% into toys, games, cartoons, books. 01:37:47.380 --> 01:37:49.320 align:middle line:84% What is a Star Wars toy, anyway, but a form 01:37:49.320 --> 01:37:53.173 align:middle line:84% of user-generated content, episodic content? 01:37:53.173 --> 01:37:54.840 align:middle line:84% And I think it applies to any media that 01:37:54.840 --> 01:37:56.020 align:middle line:90% has ever been invented. 01:37:56.020 --> 01:37:57.145 align:middle line:90% Think about the Beatles. 01:37:57.145 --> 01:37:58.520 align:middle line:84% They were a band in North America 01:37:58.520 --> 01:38:01.600 align:middle line:84% for only about six years, from January of 1964 01:38:01.600 --> 01:38:04.080 align:middle line:90% until the spring of 1970. 01:38:04.080 --> 01:38:06.260 align:middle line:84% But in that time, just six years, 01:38:06.260 --> 01:38:11.410 align:middle line:84% they put out 13 LPs, 17 EPs, and 45 single records. 01:38:11.410 --> 01:38:13.160 align:middle line:84% They put out a Christmas record every year 01:38:13.160 --> 01:38:14.740 align:middle line:90% for their official fan club. 01:38:14.740 --> 01:38:18.020 align:middle line:84% They put out four feature-length movies, an original TV special, 01:38:18.020 --> 01:38:20.960 align:middle line:84% and a cartoon show, as well as making dozens of TV appearances 01:38:20.960 --> 01:38:23.280 align:middle line:84% and mounting three worldwide concert tours. 01:38:23.280 --> 01:38:26.460 align:middle line:84% The Beatles built their popularity on episodic content. 01:38:26.460 --> 01:38:28.200 align:middle line:84% There was something new constantly 01:38:28.200 --> 01:38:29.880 align:middle line:90% coming out for the fans. 01:38:29.880 --> 01:38:31.900 align:middle line:84% Contrast this with Michael Jackson, 01:38:31.900 --> 01:38:34.140 align:middle line:84% the best-selling recording artist of the 1980s, 01:38:34.140 --> 01:38:38.000 align:middle line:84% who put out only five albums of original content between 1982 01:38:38.000 --> 01:38:39.380 align:middle line:90% and 2001. 01:38:39.380 --> 01:38:41.400 align:middle line:84% And I'm not counting the court TV stories. 01:38:41.400 --> 01:38:42.480 align:middle line:90% [LAUGHTER] 01:38:42.480 --> 01:38:44.560 align:middle line:84% Today, many bands wait two or three years or more 01:38:44.560 --> 01:38:46.140 align:middle line:90% before putting out a new record. 01:38:46.140 --> 01:38:48.380 align:middle line:84% Is it any wonder the music business is in trouble? 01:38:48.380 --> 01:38:49.530 align:middle line:90% Forget about technology. 01:38:49.530 --> 01:38:51.150 align:middle line:90% It's really about creativity. 01:38:51.150 --> 01:38:52.630 align:middle line:90% It's about story value. 01:38:52.630 --> 01:38:54.550 align:middle line:84% If you don't generate enough story, 01:38:54.550 --> 01:38:56.210 align:middle line:90% you will lose your audience. 01:38:56.210 --> 01:38:58.610 align:middle line:84% How many times have you gone to a website, realized 01:38:58.610 --> 01:39:00.690 align:middle line:84% you can't find what you want, or you go back, 01:39:00.690 --> 01:39:03.110 align:middle line:84% and it hasn't changed since the last time you were there? 01:39:03.110 --> 01:39:04.470 align:middle line:90% Do you ever go back again? 01:39:04.470 --> 01:39:06.650 align:middle line:90% Probably not. 01:39:06.650 --> 01:39:08.650 align:middle line:84% So many websites out there are just 01:39:08.650 --> 01:39:11.290 align:middle line:84% like enormous filing cabinets, like the last scene 01:39:11.290 --> 01:39:13.610 align:middle line:90% in Raiders of the Lost Ark. 01:39:13.610 --> 01:39:15.350 align:middle line:84% The technical problems are so daunting, 01:39:15.350 --> 01:39:16.970 align:middle line:84% I suppose you shouldn't be surprised 01:39:16.970 --> 01:39:19.630 align:middle line:84% that we spend so much time talking about them. 01:39:19.630 --> 01:39:22.230 align:middle line:84% But sooner or later, technical problems get solved. 01:39:22.230 --> 01:39:23.790 align:middle line:84% The bigger questions, it seems to me, 01:39:23.790 --> 01:39:26.510 align:middle line:84% is, how do you keep people engaged with your brands? 01:39:26.510 --> 01:39:29.410 align:middle line:84% And that's a creative problem, not a technical question. 01:39:29.410 --> 01:39:32.250 align:middle line:84% I want to throw one more thought at you. 01:39:32.250 --> 01:39:34.450 align:middle line:84% We are on the brink of a revolution. 01:39:34.450 --> 01:39:37.450 align:middle line:84% And keep in mind, you've all been nondisclosed. 01:39:37.450 --> 01:39:40.450 align:middle line:84% We have entered the era of AIWAC technology. 01:39:40.450 --> 01:39:43.690 align:middle line:84% AIWAC technology can now be found in cell phones, and PDAs, 01:39:43.690 --> 01:39:46.950 align:middle line:84% and BlackBerries, and dozens of other handheld devices, 01:39:46.950 --> 01:39:49.810 align:middle line:84% as well as everything from iBooks, to digital cameras, 01:39:49.810 --> 01:39:51.370 align:middle line:90% to predator drones. 01:39:51.370 --> 01:39:54.670 align:middle line:84% AIWAC technology is inexpensive, pervasive, and easy to use. 01:39:54.670 --> 01:39:57.070 align:middle line:84% It is cross-platform, based on open-source code, 01:39:57.070 --> 01:40:01.450 align:middle line:84% web-enabled, real time, full motion, 30 FPS, digital capture 01:40:01.450 --> 01:40:05.450 align:middle line:84% based on universal drag-and-drop AIWAC protocols. 01:40:05.450 --> 01:40:08.670 align:middle line:84% Unfortunately, AIWAC stands for Any Idiot With A Camera. 01:40:08.670 --> 01:40:10.510 align:middle line:90% [LAUGHTER] 01:40:10.510 --> 01:40:11.010 align:middle line:90% 01:40:11.010 --> 01:40:13.857 align:middle line:84% And just like digital publishing put fonts 01:40:13.857 --> 01:40:15.690 align:middle line:84% in the hands of people who immediately tried 01:40:15.690 --> 01:40:18.273 align:middle line:84% to squeeze as many as possible onto a page, 01:40:18.273 --> 01:40:19.690 align:middle line:84% there are plenty of people running 01:40:19.690 --> 01:40:22.610 align:middle line:84% around creating staggering amounts of content 01:40:22.610 --> 01:40:24.050 align:middle line:90% without much substance. 01:40:24.050 --> 01:40:27.730 align:middle line:84% There will come a time very soon when we will have to say, 01:40:27.730 --> 01:40:32.050 align:middle line:90% America, put the camera down. 01:40:32.050 --> 01:40:34.210 align:middle line:84% What a great time to be a lonely person. 01:40:34.210 --> 01:40:36.130 align:middle line:84% Never have so many people had so much ability 01:40:36.130 --> 01:40:37.810 align:middle line:84% to upload and share so much content 01:40:37.810 --> 01:40:40.010 align:middle line:90% that no one will ever see. 01:40:40.010 --> 01:40:41.652 align:middle line:84% Seven lonely people in the middle 01:40:41.652 --> 01:40:43.610 align:middle line:84% of the night watching a video of your boyfriend 01:40:43.610 --> 01:40:47.490 align:middle line:84% as he ties his shoes is no way to build a billion-dollar brand. 01:40:47.490 --> 01:40:49.830 align:middle line:84% If you look at the development of any major media, 01:40:49.830 --> 01:40:53.550 align:middle line:84% you will find that, as each media has matured-- movies, 01:40:53.550 --> 01:40:56.890 align:middle line:84% radio, TV, and recorded music-- the production costs of content 01:40:56.890 --> 01:40:58.390 align:middle line:90% have gone steadily up. 01:40:58.390 --> 01:41:00.810 align:middle line:84% The bar has been raised, not lowered. 01:41:00.810 --> 01:41:03.410 align:middle line:84% Edison's first recording was him singing "Mary Had a Little 01:41:03.410 --> 01:41:04.070 align:middle line:90% Lamb." 01:41:04.070 --> 01:41:06.802 align:middle line:84% The Beatles' first album was recorded in a single day. 01:41:06.802 --> 01:41:08.510 align:middle line:84% By the time "Sergeant Pepper" came along, 01:41:08.510 --> 01:41:11.290 align:middle line:84% it took months and months and millions of dollars. 01:41:11.290 --> 01:41:13.190 align:middle line:84% Production quality, when used properly, 01:41:13.190 --> 01:41:15.670 align:middle line:84% is an aspect of storytelling and story value, 01:41:15.670 --> 01:41:18.970 align:middle line:84% and storytelling is an art that is not easily mastered. 01:41:18.970 --> 01:41:21.470 align:middle line:90% But I digress. 01:41:21.470 --> 01:41:24.290 align:middle line:84% With multiple screens going simultaneously, 01:41:24.290 --> 01:41:26.230 align:middle line:84% and attention moving from screen to screen, 01:41:26.230 --> 01:41:28.270 align:middle line:84% we obviously have more ways to lose an audience, 01:41:28.270 --> 01:41:30.090 align:middle line:84% but at the same time, we have more ways 01:41:30.090 --> 01:41:33.630 align:middle line:84% to keep our episodic stories both evolving and involving. 01:41:33.630 --> 01:41:36.150 align:middle line:84% If you think about marketing as an episodic exercise, 01:41:36.150 --> 01:41:38.990 align:middle line:84% you very quickly get to issues of structure and process. 01:41:38.990 --> 01:41:39.990 align:middle line:90% Who does what? 01:41:39.990 --> 01:41:42.010 align:middle line:84% Where do you put the different roles? 01:41:42.010 --> 01:41:44.910 align:middle line:84% Some brands have taken editorial control in-house, 01:41:44.910 --> 01:41:46.970 align:middle line:84% and they engage agencies to do different tasks 01:41:46.970 --> 01:41:48.990 align:middle line:90% on a project-by-project basis. 01:41:48.990 --> 01:41:51.770 align:middle line:84% But it's hard to glue together a coherent story from a bunch 01:41:51.770 --> 01:41:53.570 align:middle line:90% of disparate sources. 01:41:53.570 --> 01:41:55.530 align:middle line:84% That's why I think brand journalism is also 01:41:55.530 --> 01:41:57.050 align:middle line:90% a way to think about this. 01:41:57.050 --> 01:41:58.890 align:middle line:84% Think about it as a newspaper or magazine. 01:41:58.890 --> 01:42:00.890 align:middle line:84% In those kinds of organizations, a publisher 01:42:00.890 --> 01:42:03.113 align:middle line:84% plays a different role than the editor in chief. 01:42:03.113 --> 01:42:05.530 align:middle line:84% The publisher runs the business, worries about production, 01:42:05.530 --> 01:42:07.365 align:middle line:90% controls costs, and so on. 01:42:07.365 --> 01:42:08.990 align:middle line:84% The editor in chief, on the other hand, 01:42:08.990 --> 01:42:10.750 align:middle line:84% usually comes from the creative side. 01:42:10.750 --> 01:42:13.450 align:middle line:84% A writer becomes a senior writer becomes an editor and so on up 01:42:13.450 --> 01:42:14.570 align:middle line:90% the ranks. 01:42:14.570 --> 01:42:16.810 align:middle line:84% So if your brand is a story, and your story has 01:42:16.810 --> 01:42:19.950 align:middle line:84% to be refreshed constantly, and you're the brand publisher, 01:42:19.950 --> 01:42:22.170 align:middle line:84% where are you going to put the editorial function? 01:42:22.170 --> 01:42:24.930 align:middle line:84% At a time when corporations are trying to shed overhead 01:42:24.930 --> 01:42:27.778 align:middle line:84% and outsourcing all kinds of things they used to do in-house, 01:42:27.778 --> 01:42:29.570 align:middle line:84% are you going to be allowed to build a cost 01:42:29.570 --> 01:42:31.430 align:middle line:84% center in the form of an editorial staff 01:42:31.430 --> 01:42:33.830 align:middle line:84% who can manage and creative direct your brand story? 01:42:33.830 --> 01:42:36.038 align:middle line:84% Are you going to be able to nurture it and protect it 01:42:36.038 --> 01:42:39.290 align:middle line:84% in a financial structure that runs quarter to quarter? 01:42:39.290 --> 01:42:42.590 align:middle line:84% Personally, I think agencies are better equipped to provide that, 01:42:42.590 --> 01:42:44.850 align:middle line:84% though they will have to stop being so project focused 01:42:44.850 --> 01:42:47.650 align:middle line:90% and become newsrooms for brands. 01:42:47.650 --> 01:42:50.950 align:middle line:84% The brand will be the plot, and the product may not be the hero. 01:42:50.950 --> 01:42:53.490 align:middle line:84% And our collective job will be to generate an ongoing stream 01:42:53.490 --> 01:42:56.230 align:middle line:84% of newsworthy content, regardless of media, 01:42:56.230 --> 01:42:58.410 align:middle line:84% but still held together by a consistent editorial 01:42:58.410 --> 01:42:59.650 align:middle line:90% point of view. 01:42:59.650 --> 01:43:01.470 align:middle line:84% We have a lot of work to do, all of us. 01:43:01.470 --> 01:43:05.170 align:middle line:84% Our timelines are too long, our decision processes are too slow. 01:43:05.170 --> 01:43:08.030 align:middle line:84% The New York Times comes out with 100 pages every single day. 01:43:08.030 --> 01:43:10.430 align:middle line:84% Half of tomorrow hasn't even happened yet, 01:43:10.430 --> 01:43:13.107 align:middle line:84% but it will be there in the morning. 01:43:13.107 --> 01:43:14.190 align:middle line:90% This is what I'm thinking. 01:43:14.190 --> 01:43:15.565 align:middle line:84% But having said all that, I still 01:43:15.565 --> 01:43:18.910 align:middle line:84% think there's room in the present for good, old-fashioned, 01:43:18.910 --> 01:43:20.930 align:middle line:84% strategically focused, classically executed 01:43:20.930 --> 01:43:22.362 align:middle line:90% creative communication. 01:43:22.362 --> 01:43:24.570 align:middle line:84% Consider the way the most significant digital product 01:43:24.570 --> 01:43:26.610 align:middle line:84% of the last 20 years got that way. 01:43:26.610 --> 01:43:28.730 align:middle line:84% I'm thinking about the iPod, of course. 01:43:28.730 --> 01:43:32.130 align:middle line:84% Did Steve Jobs engaged in a branded entertainment, 01:43:32.130 --> 01:43:34.510 align:middle line:84% wiki-based, alternative media strategy? 01:43:34.510 --> 01:43:35.010 align:middle line:90% No. 01:43:35.010 --> 01:43:37.330 align:middle line:84% He runs beautifully crafted TV commercials scored 01:43:37.330 --> 01:43:39.280 align:middle line:84% with hot new songs by famous bands. 01:43:39.280 --> 01:43:41.780 align:middle line:84% He puts up outdoor boards that have a picture of the product 01:43:41.780 --> 01:43:43.840 align:middle line:84% and say, 1,000 songs in your pocket, 01:43:43.840 --> 01:43:46.100 align:middle line:84% or 10,000 songs in your pocket, or videos, 01:43:46.100 --> 01:43:48.900 align:middle line:84% or whatever the benefit of the latest model is. 01:43:48.900 --> 01:43:52.300 align:middle line:84% He puts banners in places where people are interested in music 01:43:52.300 --> 01:43:55.300 align:middle line:90% and technology. 01:43:55.300 --> 01:43:56.900 align:middle line:90% He shows you the product. 01:43:56.900 --> 01:43:58.920 align:middle line:84% And on his website, he sells you the product. 01:43:58.920 --> 01:44:01.420 align:middle line:84% He helps you understand the difference between good, better, 01:44:01.420 --> 01:44:03.620 align:middle line:90% and best. 01:44:03.620 --> 01:44:07.580 align:middle line:84% The Macintosh platform failed to become the dominant computing 01:44:07.580 --> 01:44:11.900 align:middle line:84% platform because he didn't make it big enough, fast enough. 01:44:11.900 --> 01:44:13.317 align:middle line:90% I know because I was there. 01:44:13.317 --> 01:44:14.900 align:middle line:84% But then again, maybe that's the story 01:44:14.900 --> 01:44:16.240 align:middle line:90% of the value in the Apple story. 01:44:16.240 --> 01:44:17.740 align:middle line:84% The ups and downs of Apple have been 01:44:17.740 --> 01:44:21.020 align:middle line:84% part of the American business mythology for the past 25 years. 01:44:21.020 --> 01:44:23.680 align:middle line:84% His company has never been about just making products. 01:44:23.680 --> 01:44:26.660 align:middle line:84% It's about revolution and transformation, the overthrow 01:44:26.660 --> 01:44:28.120 align:middle line:90% of the established order. 01:44:28.120 --> 01:44:31.240 align:middle line:84% And Apple's story has been nothing if not episodic, 01:44:31.240 --> 01:44:32.980 align:middle line:84% sometimes even a soap opera, always 01:44:32.980 --> 01:44:37.260 align:middle line:84% with a villain, a story that has attracted attention vastly 01:44:37.260 --> 01:44:39.900 align:middle line:84% out of proportion to Apple's 4% market share 01:44:39.900 --> 01:44:41.160 align:middle line:90% in the computer business. 01:44:41.160 --> 01:44:42.780 align:middle line:84% It's not just a great story, it's 01:44:42.780 --> 01:44:45.480 align:middle line:84% a big story, which brings me back to my original point. 01:44:45.480 --> 01:44:47.040 align:middle line:90% Big brands do big things. 01:44:47.040 --> 01:44:48.920 align:middle line:84% Important brands do important things. 01:44:48.920 --> 01:44:50.700 align:middle line:84% It doesn't matter how you do them. 01:44:50.700 --> 01:44:52.240 align:middle line:90% You just have to do them. 01:44:52.240 --> 01:44:55.000 align:middle line:84% And with some tolerance for lack of political correctness, 01:44:55.000 --> 01:44:57.660 align:middle line:84% I find there to be no more powerful, more relevant, or more 01:44:57.660 --> 01:45:00.340 align:middle line:84% timely commentary on the importance of storytelling 01:45:00.340 --> 01:45:02.660 align:middle line:84% than the one David Ogilvy said so eloquently 01:45:02.660 --> 01:45:04.180 align:middle line:90% more than three decades ago. 01:45:04.180 --> 01:45:06.680 align:middle line:84% You cannot bore people into buying your product. 01:45:06.680 --> 01:45:08.360 align:middle line:90% You can only interest them. 01:45:08.360 --> 01:45:10.040 align:middle line:90% The consumer isn't a moron. 01:45:10.040 --> 01:45:12.660 align:middle line:90% She is your wife. 01:45:12.660 --> 01:45:14.740 align:middle line:90% That's it. 01:45:14.740 --> 01:45:17.120 align:middle line:90% [APPLAUSE] 01:45:17.120 --> 01:45:17.620 align:middle line:90% 01:45:17.620 --> 01:45:20.980 align:middle line:84% Anyway, I don't know if-- that's a little bit off of what I 01:45:20.980 --> 01:45:23.000 align:middle line:90% think you guys are looking for. 01:45:23.000 --> 01:45:26.200 align:middle line:90% But what else can I tell you? 01:45:26.200 --> 01:45:26.820 align:middle line:90% Anything? 01:45:26.820 --> 01:45:27.900 align:middle line:90% Yes? 01:45:27.900 --> 01:45:30.360 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So if we move out of the lineage of IBM, 01:45:30.360 --> 01:45:34.300 align:middle line:84% and we look at rebuilding a brand, 01:45:34.300 --> 01:45:36.660 align:middle line:84% I think one of the biggest challenges 01:45:36.660 --> 01:45:39.863 align:middle line:84% today is rebuilding a brand of an American car company. 01:45:39.863 --> 01:45:40.780 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: It's huge. 01:45:40.780 --> 01:45:41.900 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah, it is. 01:45:41.900 --> 01:45:44.900 align:middle line:84% I've never bought an American car in my life. 01:45:44.900 --> 01:45:49.980 align:middle line:84% But one of the Mercury brands, it seems to me 01:45:49.980 --> 01:45:51.840 align:middle line:90% that it's changing my mind. 01:45:51.840 --> 01:45:54.800 align:middle line:84% I mean, it seems like the advertising is working. 01:45:54.800 --> 01:45:57.300 align:middle line:84% And it's surprising to me-- it's just anecdotal, 01:45:57.300 --> 01:45:59.060 align:middle line:84% but it's surprising to me that I have 01:45:59.060 --> 01:46:01.660 align:middle line:84% this more favorable idea of Mercury 01:46:01.660 --> 01:46:04.263 align:middle line:90% right now, whereas I never did. 01:46:04.263 --> 01:46:06.180 align:middle line:84% Can you talk about the challenges of something 01:46:06.180 --> 01:46:11.380 align:middle line:84% like that, just changing that perception? 01:46:11.380 --> 01:46:12.323 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Yeah. 01:46:12.323 --> 01:46:13.740 align:middle line:84% Funnily enough, this summer, I was 01:46:13.740 --> 01:46:17.260 align:middle line:84% working on a project for Ford, who's grappling 01:46:17.260 --> 01:46:19.260 align:middle line:90% with that in a major way. 01:46:19.260 --> 01:46:30.975 align:middle line:84% And I mean, it's a monumental-- it's almost like the problems 01:46:30.975 --> 01:46:33.100 align:middle line:84% become so big they can't be solved because you have 01:46:33.100 --> 01:46:36.020 align:middle line:84% so many people working on them that you just confuse yourself. 01:46:36.020 --> 01:46:39.620 align:middle line:84% I mean, the reason that Apple was able to reverse itself 01:46:39.620 --> 01:46:42.180 align:middle line:84% was because Jobs came in, and he had a point of view, 01:46:42.180 --> 01:46:45.520 align:middle line:84% and he took a few people, and he went and did it. 01:46:45.520 --> 01:46:48.480 align:middle line:84% And they needed that because that's very efficient. 01:46:48.480 --> 01:46:50.360 align:middle line:84% But it was not based on research. 01:46:50.360 --> 01:46:53.380 align:middle line:84% It wasn't based on-- it was a very intuitive sense of, 01:46:53.380 --> 01:46:54.780 align:middle line:90% this is what we got. 01:46:54.780 --> 01:46:56.080 align:middle line:90% This is what I need. 01:46:56.080 --> 01:46:57.000 align:middle line:90% Let's go do it. 01:46:57.000 --> 01:46:59.760 align:middle line:84% And they kind of galvanized around things pretty quickly. 01:46:59.760 --> 01:47:01.740 align:middle line:84% I mean, that is the advantage of, when 01:47:01.740 --> 01:47:04.740 align:middle line:84% you've fallen so far from grace, is you can sometimes 01:47:04.740 --> 01:47:05.760 align:middle line:90% get that going. 01:47:05.760 --> 01:47:08.750 align:middle line:90% 01:47:08.750 --> 01:47:13.100 align:middle line:84% If you look at American car companies over the last 25 01:47:13.100 --> 01:47:19.240 align:middle line:84% years, it has been a steady, ridiculous, predictable decline, 01:47:19.240 --> 01:47:21.060 align:middle line:90% with a few exceptions. 01:47:21.060 --> 01:47:22.920 align:middle line:84% I mean, we were talking-- on the way in, 01:47:22.920 --> 01:47:24.780 align:middle line:84% we were talking about exactly the same thing 01:47:24.780 --> 01:47:29.180 align:middle line:84% because the thing that Mercedes did with the German guy who 01:47:29.180 --> 01:47:31.380 align:middle line:84% was kind of-- he was a real guy, but people thought 01:47:31.380 --> 01:47:32.740 align:middle line:90% he was like Colonel Sanders. 01:47:32.740 --> 01:47:34.780 align:middle line:90% With a German guy trying-- 01:47:34.780 --> 01:47:36.980 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: [INAUDIBLE] 01:47:36.980 --> 01:47:40.020 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: I mean, I think Detroit has-- 01:47:40.020 --> 01:47:42.980 align:middle line:84% my own personal feeling, if you compare 01:47:42.980 --> 01:47:50.240 align:middle line:84% Detroit to Toyota and Honda, the way 01:47:50.240 --> 01:47:53.100 align:middle line:84% Toyota and Honda talk about their cars 01:47:53.100 --> 01:47:57.300 align:middle line:84% is has very modern, California technology bent. 01:47:57.300 --> 01:48:00.780 align:middle line:84% If you look at the way Ford and Chevy and all these others talk, 01:48:00.780 --> 01:48:04.680 align:middle line:90% they are trying too hard. 01:48:04.680 --> 01:48:07.540 align:middle line:84% It always sounds like they're just-- like, 01:48:07.540 --> 01:48:10.620 align:middle line:90% their socks don't match. 01:48:10.620 --> 01:48:11.440 align:middle line:90% Something's wrong. 01:48:11.440 --> 01:48:13.100 align:middle line:90% Something doesn't quite work. 01:48:13.100 --> 01:48:15.007 align:middle line:84% And it's weird because the Ford problem-- 01:48:15.007 --> 01:48:16.840 align:middle line:84% I mean, at least from Ford's point of view-- 01:48:16.840 --> 01:48:18.382 align:middle line:84% I tend to agree with them-- was, they 01:48:18.382 --> 01:48:20.620 align:middle line:84% think their products are better than the perception. 01:48:20.620 --> 01:48:22.563 align:middle line:84% And until you reverse the perception, 01:48:22.563 --> 01:48:24.980 align:middle line:84% you're going to have a hard time selling the products away 01:48:24.980 --> 01:48:25.960 align:middle line:90% without giving them away. 01:48:25.960 --> 01:48:28.085 align:middle line:84% And if you give them away, it hurts the perception. 01:48:28.085 --> 01:48:31.701 align:middle line:90% 01:48:31.701 --> 01:48:33.165 align:middle line:90% And they don't know what to do. 01:48:33.165 --> 01:48:34.290 align:middle line:90% They don't know what to do. 01:48:34.290 --> 01:48:37.030 align:middle line:90% And I honestly think it's-- 01:48:37.030 --> 01:48:39.450 align:middle line:84% I always felt like they should look at cars-- 01:48:39.450 --> 01:48:40.770 align:middle line:90% there's so much technology. 01:48:40.770 --> 01:48:42.790 align:middle line:84% And this, of course, is my own personal bias. 01:48:42.790 --> 01:48:45.550 align:middle line:84% But there's so much technology in cars 01:48:45.550 --> 01:48:48.670 align:middle line:84% that what they need to do is to adopt a point of view 01:48:48.670 --> 01:48:49.890 align:middle line:90% that I'm not selling cars. 01:48:49.890 --> 01:48:50.810 align:middle line:90% I'm selling computers. 01:48:50.810 --> 01:48:52.067 align:middle line:90% And I'm selling you-- 01:48:52.067 --> 01:48:54.150 align:middle line:84% what I want to do is be part of the future instead 01:48:54.150 --> 01:48:55.395 align:middle line:90% of part of the past. 01:48:55.395 --> 01:48:57.270 align:middle line:84% What American car companies have tended to do 01:48:57.270 --> 01:49:01.570 align:middle line:84% is they go nostalgic a lot of times. 01:49:01.570 --> 01:49:02.790 align:middle line:90% That's one of those things-- 01:49:02.790 --> 01:49:04.870 align:middle line:84% there's a certain campaign that you will see. 01:49:04.870 --> 01:49:07.470 align:middle line:84% Whenever you see a company say, whatever 01:49:07.470 --> 01:49:11.410 align:middle line:84% the thing is, we invented it, it always means, we invented it. 01:49:11.410 --> 01:49:12.610 align:middle line:90% We lost control of it. 01:49:12.610 --> 01:49:15.405 align:middle line:84% Somebody is doing it better, and now we're completely irrelevant, 01:49:15.405 --> 01:49:17.530 align:middle line:84% because that's always the campaign when they do it. 01:49:17.530 --> 01:49:19.910 align:middle line:84% You usually see it in airports, where 01:49:19.910 --> 01:49:21.910 align:middle line:84% it's by Piedmont Airlines or something, 01:49:21.910 --> 01:49:25.830 align:middle line:84% like some nonplayer saying that they were good once 01:49:25.830 --> 01:49:28.550 align:middle line:90% as they fall into the grave. 01:49:28.550 --> 01:49:31.920 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Chris, let's say [INAUDIBLE] GM 01:49:31.920 --> 01:49:34.010 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] that higher [? up ?] [? look-- ?] 01:49:34.010 --> 01:49:35.270 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Right. 01:49:35.270 --> 01:49:38.000 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: --to go [INAUDIBLE]. 01:49:38.000 --> 01:49:40.160 align:middle line:84% They hired him from Chrysler, wasn't it? 01:49:40.160 --> 01:49:42.450 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Right, Chrysler. 01:49:42.450 --> 01:49:44.950 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: But I don't know what has come out. 01:49:44.950 --> 01:49:48.150 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Well, the problem is, engineering-- 01:49:48.150 --> 01:49:51.150 align:middle line:90% car manufacturing takes-- 01:49:51.150 --> 01:49:52.693 align:middle line:90% I mean, the problem is, if-- 01:49:52.693 --> 01:49:54.110 align:middle line:84% I think the hard thing about being 01:49:54.110 --> 01:49:56.030 align:middle line:84% a creative person in the car business 01:49:56.030 --> 01:49:59.660 align:middle line:84% is, if you lay an egg, it takes five, six years, 01:49:59.660 --> 01:50:01.410 align:middle line:84% if they give you another shot, to undo it. 01:50:01.410 --> 01:50:03.350 align:middle line:90% It's just, it takes a long time. 01:50:03.350 --> 01:50:06.710 align:middle line:90% 01:50:06.710 --> 01:50:11.110 align:middle line:90% So how do you get people-- 01:50:11.110 --> 01:50:14.110 align:middle line:84% they have not tended to attract-- 01:50:14.110 --> 01:50:17.150 align:middle line:84% a lot of the creative people who would have gone to the car 01:50:17.150 --> 01:50:21.630 align:middle line:84% companies in the '50s or '60s go to work in Google or Microsoft 01:50:21.630 --> 01:50:23.505 align:middle line:84% or someplace like that because that's seems-- 01:50:23.505 --> 01:50:25.005 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: None of you 01:50:25.005 --> 01:50:26.910 align:middle line:84% have worked in a car company, right? 01:50:26.910 --> 01:50:30.550 align:middle line:84% Everybody here was working for [INAUDIBLE]. 01:50:30.550 --> 01:50:32.758 align:middle line:90% Am I correct? 01:50:32.758 --> 01:50:34.550 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I used to work for a car company. 01:50:34.550 --> 01:50:35.090 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Which one? 01:50:35.090 --> 01:50:36.830 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I used to work for a car company. 01:50:36.830 --> 01:50:38.110 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Yeah, but actually, [INAUDIBLE] 01:50:38.110 --> 01:50:40.630 align:middle line:84% is trying to do something very creative, 01:50:40.630 --> 01:50:44.130 align:middle line:84% which is sell a car for-- how much money, did you say? 01:50:44.130 --> 01:50:46.470 align:middle line:90% [INTERPOSING VOICES] 01:50:46.470 --> 01:50:48.030 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: $2,500. 01:50:48.030 --> 01:50:49.530 align:middle line:90% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: $2,500. 01:50:49.530 --> 01:50:51.010 align:middle line:90% That's-- 01:50:51.010 --> 01:50:54.063 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: But in the United States or in north-- 01:50:54.063 --> 01:50:55.730 align:middle line:84% [? IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: ?] In India. 01:50:55.730 --> 01:50:56.897 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: In India, right. 01:50:56.897 --> 01:50:57.710 align:middle line:90% OK. 01:50:57.710 --> 01:50:59.750 align:middle line:90% I mean, the problem with-- 01:50:59.750 --> 01:51:03.110 align:middle line:84% I mean, the Detroit problem is Detroit 01:51:03.110 --> 01:51:05.990 align:middle line:84% because it's like, there are cars 01:51:05.990 --> 01:51:09.050 align:middle line:84% made in America, for example, that are doing just fine. 01:51:09.050 --> 01:51:12.190 align:middle line:84% But they're Toyotas and Hondas and BMWs 01:51:12.190 --> 01:51:16.930 align:middle line:84% and whatever that are at least assembled in the United States. 01:51:16.930 --> 01:51:19.790 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: It seems like every car commercial has the same shot 01:51:19.790 --> 01:51:22.130 align:middle line:90% of a car on a curvy road. 01:51:22.130 --> 01:51:25.230 align:middle line:84% And it's like, I think of how the Volkswagen 01:51:25.230 --> 01:51:27.350 align:middle line:84% ones have gone a totally different route, either 01:51:27.350 --> 01:51:28.670 align:middle line:90% with humor with-- 01:51:28.670 --> 01:51:30.610 align:middle line:84% I don't know-- [INAUDIBLE] or whatever 01:51:30.610 --> 01:51:34.535 align:middle line:84% in the the Jetta ones, or even the ones on their safety 01:51:34.535 --> 01:51:36.910 align:middle line:84% [? bent, ?] where the ones where people are just talking, 01:51:36.910 --> 01:51:39.268 align:middle line:84% and they get smacked, which are just so abrupt. 01:51:39.268 --> 01:51:40.810 align:middle line:84% I can't really decide if I like them, 01:51:40.810 --> 01:51:42.630 align:middle line:84% but they're definitely memorable. 01:51:42.630 --> 01:51:45.650 align:middle line:84% It's just so different from the way that Detroit [INAUDIBLE]. 01:51:45.650 --> 01:51:46.950 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Half the time, you can't even 01:51:46.950 --> 01:51:48.210 align:middle line:90% tell which car it was. 01:51:48.210 --> 01:51:54.170 align:middle line:84% It was some car, and there's no brand recognition [INAUDIBLE]. 01:51:54.170 --> 01:51:56.110 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: They hire great companies 01:51:56.110 --> 01:51:58.230 align:middle line:90% to do their ads, right? 01:51:58.230 --> 01:52:01.210 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Yeah, and then they put them through Detroit. 01:52:01.210 --> 01:52:05.510 align:middle line:84% I mean, clients can make good people-- 01:52:05.510 --> 01:52:10.313 align:middle line:84% I mean, some of it is, if you look at the-- 01:52:10.313 --> 01:52:11.730 align:middle line:84% I mean, at least, it's my opinion. 01:52:11.730 --> 01:52:14.150 align:middle line:84% If you look at the middle of what cars-- 01:52:14.150 --> 01:52:17.210 align:middle line:84% if you take the fuel economy and everything else, 01:52:17.210 --> 01:52:20.348 align:middle line:84% the cars tend to look the same because they're all kind of-- 01:52:20.348 --> 01:52:22.390 align:middle line:84% they go they go through the same physics process, 01:52:22.390 --> 01:52:24.950 align:middle line:84% and you have to do certain things in order to get the car 01:52:24.950 --> 01:52:26.690 align:middle line:90% to make 35 miles a gallon. 01:52:26.690 --> 01:52:28.570 align:middle line:84% That gives you a fleet mileage of whatever. 01:52:28.570 --> 01:52:32.630 align:middle line:84% But I think Detroit has a dated way of talking about what they 01:52:32.630 --> 01:52:36.130 align:middle line:90% do, dated way of presenting it. 01:52:36.130 --> 01:52:37.630 align:middle line:84% And I think that's a big part of it. 01:52:37.630 --> 01:52:40.130 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: You're saying no ad agency can crack-- 01:52:40.130 --> 01:52:41.030 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Well, nobody has. 01:52:41.030 --> 01:52:42.910 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: --a culture-- 01:52:42.910 --> 01:52:44.888 align:middle line:84% you're saying the culture won't let you? 01:52:44.888 --> 01:52:45.930 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: I don't know. 01:52:45.930 --> 01:52:46.890 align:middle line:90% I mean, I don't know. 01:52:46.890 --> 01:52:47.890 align:middle line:90% I enjoyed working on it. 01:52:47.890 --> 01:52:52.590 align:middle line:84% But Ogilvy has Ford in Europe, and we 01:52:52.590 --> 01:52:55.810 align:middle line:84% do projects for them in the United States from time to time. 01:52:55.810 --> 01:53:01.250 align:middle line:84% But we're not-- we don't have that big piece of the business. 01:53:01.250 --> 01:53:05.890 align:middle line:84% So I can't-- we were working on a project to try and save that, 01:53:05.890 --> 01:53:06.690 align:middle line:90% to change that. 01:53:06.690 --> 01:53:10.390 align:middle line:84% But somebody has to have a license to go do some stuff, 01:53:10.390 --> 01:53:13.230 align:middle line:84% and you have to have enough time to let it stick. 01:53:13.230 --> 01:53:17.590 align:middle line:84% And my two experiences with Ford is, they've never 01:53:17.590 --> 01:53:19.110 align:middle line:90% been able to pull the trigger. 01:53:19.110 --> 01:53:24.280 align:middle line:84% So it doesn't mean they won't, but just, they haven't. 01:53:24.280 --> 01:53:27.100 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So is that a willingness to change? 01:53:27.100 --> 01:53:29.720 align:middle line:90% I mean, IBM changed the brand. 01:53:29.720 --> 01:53:32.860 align:middle line:84% They took IBM, which meant one thing to a person, 01:53:32.860 --> 01:53:36.240 align:middle line:84% and now it means something very different. 01:53:36.240 --> 01:53:38.120 align:middle line:84% And there were some subbrands that 01:53:38.120 --> 01:53:43.100 align:middle line:84% made that transition [INAUDIBLE] business model. 01:53:43.100 --> 01:53:44.500 align:middle line:90% Is it that unwillingness? 01:53:44.500 --> 01:53:49.820 align:middle line:84% I mean, I see Detroit as hanging on to these Park Avenue 01:53:49.820 --> 01:53:53.800 align:middle line:84% things that have been made for 50 years or things 01:53:53.800 --> 01:53:57.040 align:middle line:84% that consumers see through, like the rebranding of the Taurus 500 01:53:57.040 --> 01:53:57.920 align:middle line:90% thing. 01:53:57.920 --> 01:54:01.160 align:middle line:84% It's just completely transparent, what they're doing. 01:54:01.160 --> 01:54:03.740 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Yeah, I couldn't figure out-- that, to me, 01:54:03.740 --> 01:54:05.080 align:middle line:90% was like-- 01:54:05.080 --> 01:54:06.778 align:middle line:90% I didn't really get that. 01:54:06.778 --> 01:54:07.820 align:middle line:90% I didn't get that at all. 01:54:07.820 --> 01:54:10.060 align:middle line:84% We named it the Ford 500, and then it didn't sell, 01:54:10.060 --> 01:54:12.185 align:middle line:90% so we renamed it the Taurus. 01:54:12.185 --> 01:54:14.060 align:middle line:84% Well, I don't think the name was the problem. 01:54:14.060 --> 01:54:17.280 align:middle line:84% It wasn't like, I could never drive a car called the 500. 01:54:17.280 --> 01:54:20.920 align:middle line:90% It was the car. 01:54:20.920 --> 01:54:23.760 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Are they too hung up on this historical reference, 01:54:23.760 --> 01:54:26.280 align:middle line:90% is what you're saying? 01:54:26.280 --> 01:54:28.660 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Well, I mean, here's the thing about IBM. 01:54:28.660 --> 01:54:30.200 align:middle line:90% Here's the thing about IBM. 01:54:30.200 --> 01:54:32.040 align:middle line:90% The people who came in to-- 01:54:32.040 --> 01:54:34.760 align:middle line:84% new people came into IBM who were completely 01:54:34.760 --> 01:54:36.480 align:middle line:90% outside the industry. 01:54:36.480 --> 01:54:42.920 align:middle line:84% And they looked at things from a different point of view. 01:54:42.920 --> 01:54:45.380 align:middle line:84% And then they engage with people within IBM. 01:54:45.380 --> 01:54:47.860 align:middle line:84% I wasn't there for all of this, so I'm just speculating. 01:54:47.860 --> 01:54:49.840 align:middle line:84% They engaged with people who were in IBM who-- 01:54:49.840 --> 01:54:52.340 align:middle line:84% because anytime, when a company starts going down like that, 01:54:52.340 --> 01:54:54.680 align:middle line:84% there are people within the company who say, 01:54:54.680 --> 01:54:57.940 align:middle line:90% holy moly, we got a problem. 01:54:57.940 --> 01:55:02.742 align:middle line:84% And so I talked to some very smart people at Ford 01:55:02.742 --> 01:55:04.200 align:middle line:84% who know they got a problem and who 01:55:04.200 --> 01:55:05.640 align:middle line:90% want to do something about it. 01:55:05.640 --> 01:55:11.200 align:middle line:84% But I mean, a company like that, it's got dealers. 01:55:11.200 --> 01:55:15.680 align:middle line:84% It's got all these established things. 01:55:15.680 --> 01:55:19.200 align:middle line:84% And somebody's got to have the license or the willingness 01:55:19.200 --> 01:55:21.853 align:middle line:84% to go and say, I don't care what they think. 01:55:21.853 --> 01:55:23.520 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Would you redesign that brand, 01:55:23.520 --> 01:55:24.780 align:middle line:90% if you had an option? 01:55:24.780 --> 01:55:25.280 align:middle line:90% I mean-- 01:55:25.280 --> 01:55:27.180 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: For me, I think it would be a-- 01:55:27.180 --> 01:55:31.360 align:middle line:84% I actually really enjoyed working on it because I thought 01:55:31.360 --> 01:55:33.940 align:middle line:84% it had about a 1 in 1,000 chance going through. 01:55:33.940 --> 01:55:35.920 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I guess what I mean is the logo. 01:55:35.920 --> 01:55:36.680 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Oh. 01:55:36.680 --> 01:55:38.513 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I see that logo, and I think, boy, 01:55:38.513 --> 01:55:39.700 align:middle line:90% that looks geriatric to me. 01:55:39.700 --> 01:55:40.420 align:middle line:90% I don't [INAUDIBLE]. 01:55:40.420 --> 01:55:40.720 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Yeah. 01:55:40.720 --> 01:55:42.420 align:middle line:84% I've never been a big fan of that logo. 01:55:42.420 --> 01:55:43.980 align:middle line:84% But that's always a religious issue. 01:55:43.980 --> 01:55:46.000 align:middle line:84% I don't know what I think because part of it 01:55:46.000 --> 01:55:51.240 align:middle line:84% is, I don't think it's the logo-- the logo isn't 01:55:51.240 --> 01:55:53.280 align:middle line:90% the problem. 01:55:53.280 --> 01:55:56.140 align:middle line:84% The logo acquires all of the other problems. 01:55:56.140 --> 01:56:00.620 align:middle line:84% So the question is-- and this is always a hard thing, which is, 01:56:00.620 --> 01:56:05.040 align:middle line:84% how do you change without throwing out everything? 01:56:05.040 --> 01:56:08.340 align:middle line:84% And what do you change, and what do you say, 01:56:08.340 --> 01:56:10.720 align:middle line:90% I can fix that-- that's fixable? 01:56:10.720 --> 01:56:13.760 align:middle line:84% Because there are-- I mean, Ford still sells an enormous amount 01:56:13.760 --> 01:56:15.640 align:middle line:90% of vehicles, and they still-- 01:56:15.640 --> 01:56:17.860 align:middle line:84% people who drive F-150s like them. 01:56:17.860 --> 01:56:19.880 align:middle line:84% I mean, if you go down to Dallas, 01:56:19.880 --> 01:56:22.080 align:middle line:84% and you drive around the suburbs of Dallas, 01:56:22.080 --> 01:56:25.318 align:middle line:84% you see all these guys with these big, shiny F-150s 01:56:25.318 --> 01:56:27.860 align:middle line:84% with their web addresses, like tradesman and stuff like that. 01:56:27.860 --> 01:56:32.400 align:middle line:84% There are people who love Ford in certain parts of the country. 01:56:32.400 --> 01:56:37.200 align:middle line:84% And you're probably better at building on top of that-- 01:56:37.200 --> 01:56:39.200 align:middle line:84% I mean, that's the neat trick is to try and make 01:56:39.200 --> 01:56:44.040 align:middle line:84% it embraceable by somebody else without alienating your core. 01:56:44.040 --> 01:56:48.720 align:middle line:84% And you probably would find the core 01:56:48.720 --> 01:56:50.880 align:middle line:90% is rooting for you to succeed. 01:56:50.880 --> 01:56:55.413 align:middle line:84% But there's a lot of subtlety and nuance to it. 01:56:55.413 --> 01:56:56.080 align:middle line:90% And some of it-- 01:56:56.080 --> 01:56:57.957 align:middle line:84% I mean, look, I think that, basically, 01:56:57.957 --> 01:56:59.540 align:middle line:84% if you look at American car companies, 01:56:59.540 --> 01:57:02.800 align:middle line:84% I think they pretty much, across the board, do everything wrong. 01:57:02.800 --> 01:57:08.412 align:middle line:84% They couldn't give away free food in a starving country. 01:57:08.412 --> 01:57:09.620 align:middle line:90% They don't know how to do it. 01:57:09.620 --> 01:57:10.860 align:middle line:90% They've lost their way. 01:57:10.860 --> 01:57:16.660 align:middle line:90% 01:57:16.660 --> 01:57:19.328 align:middle line:84% But it's a delicate thing because you-- 01:57:19.328 --> 01:57:21.120 align:middle line:84% if you can save the logo, because everybody 01:57:21.120 --> 01:57:23.028 align:middle line:84% knows the logo, that would be a good thing. 01:57:23.028 --> 01:57:25.320 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Well, it would be interesting. 01:57:25.320 --> 01:57:32.400 align:middle line:84% Chrysler has been taken over by private equity [INAUDIBLE]. 01:57:32.400 --> 01:57:34.540 align:middle line:84% That's an example of different people. 01:57:34.540 --> 01:57:37.400 align:middle line:84% Now, I don't know whether the narrative [INAUDIBLE]. 01:57:37.400 --> 01:57:40.520 align:middle line:84% Am I correct, it's the narrative? 01:57:40.520 --> 01:57:45.200 align:middle line:84% You got [? to think ?] from GE via Home Depot. 01:57:45.200 --> 01:57:49.000 align:middle line:84% And so it's totally different management. 01:57:49.000 --> 01:57:53.700 align:middle line:84% It will be very interesting to see what happens. 01:57:53.700 --> 01:57:55.600 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] have no idea. 01:57:55.600 --> 01:58:03.720 align:middle line:84% I find it amazing, when you see big companies 01:58:03.720 --> 01:58:08.800 align:middle line:84% with good management, how, over time, they 01:58:08.800 --> 01:58:10.960 align:middle line:90% screw up their brands. 01:58:10.960 --> 01:58:14.570 align:middle line:84% And when I say their brands, I mean their businesses. 01:58:14.570 --> 01:58:17.530 align:middle line:90% I've become convinced that-- 01:58:17.530 --> 01:58:20.310 align:middle line:90% 01:58:20.310 --> 01:58:22.650 align:middle line:84% and I think I've tried to communicate this in class 01:58:22.650 --> 01:58:27.570 align:middle line:84% sometimes-- if you are a company that's been around for a while, 01:58:27.570 --> 01:58:29.570 align:middle line:90% your destiny is to die. 01:58:29.570 --> 01:58:32.810 align:middle line:84% I mean, I know that sounds fatalistic. 01:58:32.810 --> 01:58:38.410 align:middle line:84% But the free marketplace doesn't care about an individual 01:58:38.410 --> 01:58:39.410 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE]. 01:58:39.410 --> 01:58:42.450 align:middle line:84% But the marketplace-- and there's 01:58:42.450 --> 01:58:46.410 align:middle line:84% almost an economic model that says, 01:58:46.410 --> 01:58:51.570 align:middle line:84% you're optimizing the overall goodness of the marketplace 01:58:51.570 --> 01:58:56.330 align:middle line:84% if the slower-moving [? tire ?] company dies, 01:58:56.330 --> 01:58:59.570 align:middle line:84% and new ones rise up, and they are vibrant. 01:58:59.570 --> 01:59:04.410 align:middle line:84% It's very Schumpeterian in this creative destruction. 01:59:04.410 --> 01:59:07.010 align:middle line:84% Do you think that could be true, that, 01:59:07.010 --> 01:59:10.010 align:middle line:84% for a company to keep going, after a while, boy, 01:59:10.010 --> 01:59:19.050 align:middle line:84% you're fighting as if you and I want to go [INAUDIBLE] like we 01:59:19.050 --> 01:59:20.290 align:middle line:90% were-- 01:59:20.290 --> 01:59:21.982 align:middle line:84% it's a little harder when you're older. 01:59:21.982 --> 01:59:23.190 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Well, it depends. 01:59:23.190 --> 01:59:24.870 align:middle line:84% I mean, it depends because if you-- 01:59:24.870 --> 01:59:26.570 align:middle line:84% I mean, a company like Ford has got 01:59:26.570 --> 01:59:29.170 align:middle line:84% all kinds of problems that are not related to-- it's not just 01:59:29.170 --> 01:59:30.210 align:middle line:90% an ad campaign. 01:59:30.210 --> 01:59:31.810 align:middle line:90% It's the design of the products. 01:59:31.810 --> 01:59:34.190 align:middle line:90% It's the health care burden. 01:59:34.190 --> 01:59:35.710 align:middle line:84% They have all these legacy problems. 01:59:35.710 --> 01:59:41.050 align:middle line:84% So Mulally, at Ford, has got a lot 01:59:41.050 --> 01:59:44.910 align:middle line:84% of problems that are not just the car advertising. 01:59:44.910 --> 01:59:48.690 align:middle line:84% The thing that the branding, like the top level of branding, 01:59:48.690 --> 01:59:51.450 align:middle line:84% does is it gives you permission to hope, 01:59:51.450 --> 01:59:55.262 align:middle line:84% and it sometimes buys you time to get your problems worked out. 01:59:55.262 --> 01:59:57.970 align:middle line:84% And for leadership of a company, you get a certain amount of time 01:59:57.970 --> 02:00:02.990 align:middle line:84% to work out complicated problems that can't be solved overnight. 02:00:02.990 --> 02:00:05.370 align:middle line:84% And yeah, I think the natural order of things 02:00:05.370 --> 02:00:08.210 align:middle line:90% is, reinvent or fail. 02:00:08.210 --> 02:00:09.110 align:middle line:90% And nobody cares. 02:00:09.110 --> 02:00:13.050 align:middle line:90% In Europe, they're much more-- 02:00:13.050 --> 02:00:14.427 align:middle line:90% I mean, it's very hard to be-- 02:00:14.427 --> 02:00:16.010 align:middle line:84% I mean, I worked in Paris for a while, 02:00:16.010 --> 02:00:17.470 align:middle line:84% and I worked in Amsterdam for a while. 02:00:17.470 --> 02:00:19.428 align:middle line:84% It's very hard to be an entrepreneur in Europe. 02:00:19.428 --> 02:00:23.110 align:middle line:84% To be a young person in Europe is really difficult 02:00:23.110 --> 02:00:27.410 align:middle line:84% because there are so many barriers to developing 02:00:27.410 --> 02:00:28.710 align:middle line:90% and starting an idea. 02:00:28.710 --> 02:00:33.050 align:middle line:84% It's just, they protect legacy industries. 02:00:33.050 --> 02:00:36.010 align:middle line:90% They just do, and we don't. 02:00:36.010 --> 02:00:38.730 align:middle line:90% And other places are even-- 02:00:38.730 --> 02:00:40.050 align:middle line:90% protect them even less. 02:00:40.050 --> 02:00:42.490 align:middle line:84% So you start with-- it's like a company that 02:00:42.490 --> 02:00:45.110 align:middle line:84% starts without any infrastructure for wired phones, 02:00:45.110 --> 02:00:50.410 align:middle line:84% but everybody can be wireless, so their wireless penetration 02:00:50.410 --> 02:00:52.610 align:middle line:90% is greater. 02:00:52.610 --> 02:00:54.010 align:middle line:90% It's a competition. 02:00:54.010 --> 02:00:56.090 align:middle line:84% So the companies have to adapt or-- 02:00:56.090 --> 02:00:59.292 align:middle line:84% I mean, I always think about it like-- because I played-- 02:00:59.292 --> 02:01:01.250 align:middle line:84% before I ran out of talent, I played basketball 02:01:01.250 --> 02:01:03.458 align:middle line:84% pretty seriously at Northwestern and stuff like that. 02:01:03.458 --> 02:01:07.930 align:middle line:84% And I'm like, you look at the American car companies. 02:01:07.930 --> 02:01:12.010 align:middle line:84% In 1960, they were in the third quarter with a 30-point lead. 02:01:12.010 --> 02:01:15.950 align:middle line:84% And they have blown it so many times. 02:01:15.950 --> 02:01:18.030 align:middle line:84% I mean, it's not like there's any surprise. 02:01:18.030 --> 02:01:20.810 align:middle line:84% I mean, the fact is, my father bought his first Volkswagen 02:01:20.810 --> 02:01:22.170 align:middle line:90% in 1964. 02:01:22.170 --> 02:01:24.050 align:middle line:84% All my friends when I was growing up 02:01:24.050 --> 02:01:28.130 align:middle line:84% in the north suburbs of Chicago drove Toyotas and Datsuns 02:01:28.130 --> 02:01:31.370 align:middle line:84% and stuff like that and VW Beetles. 02:01:31.370 --> 02:01:32.850 align:middle line:90% So there was this-- 02:01:32.850 --> 02:01:35.250 align:middle line:84% I remember reading something about how American 02:01:35.250 --> 02:01:37.130 align:middle line:84% car companies should stop making small cars 02:01:37.130 --> 02:01:39.650 align:middle line:84% and just make Cadillacs because they made a lot of money 02:01:39.650 --> 02:01:40.550 align:middle line:90% on Cadillacs. 02:01:40.550 --> 02:01:42.490 align:middle line:84% But the problem was that people who 02:01:42.490 --> 02:01:44.343 align:middle line:84% have driven German cars their whole lives 02:01:44.343 --> 02:01:46.010 align:middle line:84% are not all of a sudden going to junk it 02:01:46.010 --> 02:01:48.270 align:middle line:90% when they get some money. 02:01:48.270 --> 02:01:48.950 align:middle line:90% They're not. 02:01:48.950 --> 02:01:53.770 align:middle line:84% So you have to have a lifecycle product to take people through. 02:01:53.770 --> 02:01:56.530 align:middle line:84% I mean, I actually think one of the few success stories that 02:01:56.530 --> 02:01:58.890 align:middle line:84% was a brilliant success story for American car companies 02:01:58.890 --> 02:01:59.970 align:middle line:90% was Saturn. 02:01:59.970 --> 02:02:01.850 align:middle line:90% I mean, they took-- 02:02:01.850 --> 02:02:03.410 align:middle line:90% I mean, you think about Saturn. 02:02:03.410 --> 02:02:06.890 align:middle line:84% They proved that if you fix the things that 02:02:06.890 --> 02:02:09.970 align:middle line:84% weren't the car itself-- because the original Saturn car was just 02:02:09.970 --> 02:02:11.210 align:middle line:90% a Buick Skylark. 02:02:11.210 --> 02:02:12.650 align:middle line:90% It was nothing special. 02:02:12.650 --> 02:02:16.030 align:middle line:84% And people really liked it and really believed in the brand, 02:02:16.030 --> 02:02:17.670 align:middle line:84% and they really liked the things. 02:02:17.670 --> 02:02:19.030 align:middle line:90% I mean, they did it right. 02:02:19.030 --> 02:02:21.530 align:middle line:84% But then they didn't give them a new car to sell. 02:02:21.530 --> 02:02:24.610 align:middle line:84% And now they've lost all the character 02:02:24.610 --> 02:02:26.230 align:middle line:90% that they had in the beginning. 02:02:26.230 --> 02:02:28.310 align:middle line:90% It's just become another car. 02:02:28.310 --> 02:02:33.530 align:middle line:84% So it can be done, but I don't know if anybody has figured out 02:02:33.530 --> 02:02:36.852 align:middle line:90% how to do it. 02:02:36.852 --> 02:02:38.810 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE] mention that I [? went ?] 02:02:38.810 --> 02:02:40.810 align:middle line:84% to talk to the technical people of IBM, as well. 02:02:40.810 --> 02:02:42.602 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Well, [INAUDIBLE]. 02:02:42.602 --> 02:02:44.330 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: I know you guys are-- 02:02:44.330 --> 02:02:44.930 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] 02:02:44.930 --> 02:02:49.130 align:middle line:84% How much interaction do you guys do internally with IBM expert, 02:02:49.130 --> 02:02:51.810 align:middle line:84% and how much do you listen to the outside 02:02:51.810 --> 02:02:53.810 align:middle line:84% when you create something, whether it's 02:02:53.810 --> 02:02:56.530 align:middle line:84% a TV ad, whether it's advertising, 02:02:56.530 --> 02:02:58.490 align:middle line:90% any kind of media advertising? 02:02:58.490 --> 02:03:00.090 align:middle line:90% How much is this balance? 02:03:00.090 --> 02:03:03.020 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] listening such? 02:03:03.020 --> 02:03:04.660 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: I think you listen to both. 02:03:04.660 --> 02:03:06.378 align:middle line:90% I think you try and-- 02:03:06.378 --> 02:03:08.420 align:middle line:84% I mean, you listen-- you try and be aware of what 02:03:08.420 --> 02:03:09.920 align:middle line:90% consumers are interested in. 02:03:09.920 --> 02:03:12.820 align:middle line:84% You try and be aware of what the media is saying because there's 02:03:12.820 --> 02:03:17.940 align:middle line:84% a lot of stuff published, a lot of interesting opinions. 02:03:17.940 --> 02:03:19.940 align:middle line:90% I mean, what we-- 02:03:19.940 --> 02:03:21.860 align:middle line:84% I think when we are at our best within IBM 02:03:21.860 --> 02:03:26.280 align:middle line:84% is either when we anticipate things that IBM is doing, 02:03:26.280 --> 02:03:29.963 align:middle line:84% but we turn it into something, or you 02:03:29.963 --> 02:03:32.380 align:middle line:84% find somebody within IBM who's got a problem communicating 02:03:32.380 --> 02:03:32.880 align:middle line:90% something. 02:03:32.880 --> 02:03:36.100 align:middle line:84% Frequently, you'll have someone who has something that they want 02:03:36.100 --> 02:03:38.220 align:middle line:84% to do, a point that they want to get across, 02:03:38.220 --> 02:03:44.023 align:middle line:84% and they're stuck because you have the 20-minute story, 02:03:44.023 --> 02:03:46.440 align:middle line:84% but in order to get somebody to listen to 20-minute story, 02:03:46.440 --> 02:03:48.100 align:middle line:84% you've got to give them a two-minute story. 02:03:48.100 --> 02:03:50.060 align:middle line:84% You've got to give them a 30-second-- whatever. 02:03:50.060 --> 02:03:57.140 align:middle line:84% So it's a process of engagement, because if you ask somebody 02:03:57.140 --> 02:04:01.373 align:middle line:84% to weigh in to a complex story, they 02:04:01.373 --> 02:04:03.040 align:middle line:84% have to give something up of themselves. 02:04:03.040 --> 02:04:05.600 align:middle line:84% They have to believe that there's something in it for them 02:04:05.600 --> 02:04:10.460 align:middle line:84% if they sit down and listen to a sales pitch or a whatever it is. 02:04:10.460 --> 02:04:12.000 align:middle line:84% Go online and watch five minutes. 02:04:12.000 --> 02:04:12.280 align:middle line:90% Whatever. 02:04:12.280 --> 02:04:13.488 align:middle line:90% It doesn't matter what it is. 02:04:13.488 --> 02:04:16.100 align:middle line:84% As you go through, you go from short to long. 02:04:16.100 --> 02:04:19.620 align:middle line:84% And so we always try and think about how to give people 02:04:19.620 --> 02:04:22.620 align:middle line:84% the opportunity to engage in depth, 02:04:22.620 --> 02:04:27.460 align:middle line:84% while also trying to define the story up front in some way that 02:04:27.460 --> 02:04:29.540 align:middle line:84% says to people, ah-ha, IBM is up to something, 02:04:29.540 --> 02:04:31.100 align:middle line:90% or IBM's got something. 02:04:31.100 --> 02:04:33.060 align:middle line:84% And so, I mean, I have a lot of guys 02:04:33.060 --> 02:04:34.460 align:middle line:84% who worked on IBM for a long time 02:04:34.460 --> 02:04:36.900 align:middle line:84% because I believe it's not-- you can't just pull somebody 02:04:36.900 --> 02:04:39.318 align:middle line:84% off the Huggies account and put them on, 02:04:39.318 --> 02:04:40.360 align:middle line:90% what do we do with Linux? 02:04:40.360 --> 02:04:41.235 align:middle line:90% Because they're not-- 02:04:41.235 --> 02:04:42.300 align:middle line:90% [LAUGHTER] 02:04:42.300 --> 02:04:44.060 align:middle line:90% 02:04:44.060 --> 02:04:46.540 align:middle line:84% People come into IBM, and it takes them a year 02:04:46.540 --> 02:04:48.500 align:middle line:84% to really get up to speed on, oh, OK, I 02:04:48.500 --> 02:04:49.840 align:middle line:90% understand how this works. 02:04:49.840 --> 02:04:51.980 align:middle line:84% And there's different constituencies, 02:04:51.980 --> 02:04:55.000 align:middle line:84% and they're all real important, and they're all interrelated. 02:04:55.000 --> 02:04:57.900 align:middle line:84% And you have to have some intuition for how 02:04:57.900 --> 02:05:00.620 align:middle line:84% those people work together and interrelate so you 02:05:00.620 --> 02:05:03.700 align:middle line:90% know who you're talking to. 02:05:03.700 --> 02:05:05.500 align:middle line:84% And so I think, for us, what's really 02:05:05.500 --> 02:05:09.020 align:middle line:84% useful is to go in and talk to-- to just go into IBM and say, 02:05:09.020 --> 02:05:10.480 align:middle line:90% what problems are you having? 02:05:10.480 --> 02:05:11.780 align:middle line:84% And you'll find, well, somebody's going, well, 02:05:11.780 --> 02:05:13.322 align:middle line:84% here we think there's an opportunity, 02:05:13.322 --> 02:05:17.700 align:middle line:84% but I can't get the point distilled down to a simple, 02:05:17.700 --> 02:05:18.840 align:middle line:90% how do I tell the story? 02:05:18.840 --> 02:05:23.480 align:middle line:84% And sometimes you produce a commercial not really to run it, 02:05:23.480 --> 02:05:25.500 align:middle line:84% but to go to a meeting and play it. 02:05:25.500 --> 02:05:27.420 align:middle line:90% And then you run it somewhere-- 02:05:27.420 --> 02:05:32.300 align:middle line:84% IBM had the AS/400, which was a proprietary, very 02:05:32.300 --> 02:05:36.660 align:middle line:84% popular, fantastically profitable platform. 02:05:36.660 --> 02:05:39.360 align:middle line:84% And if you keep somebody-- they don't sell any new ones, really, 02:05:39.360 --> 02:05:40.777 align:middle line:84% but as long as they keep upgrading 02:05:40.777 --> 02:05:45.700 align:middle line:84% and keep the install base going, that's like printing money. 02:05:45.700 --> 02:05:47.825 align:middle line:84% So you have to reassure those people not only 02:05:47.825 --> 02:05:49.700 align:middle line:84% that you make a good product, but that you're 02:05:49.700 --> 02:05:51.238 align:middle line:90% committed to that product. 02:05:51.238 --> 02:05:52.780 align:middle line:84% And so when you produce a commercial, 02:05:52.780 --> 02:05:54.180 align:middle line:84% and you run it on the Super Bowl, 02:05:54.180 --> 02:05:55.840 align:middle line:90% that says you're not kidding. 02:05:55.840 --> 02:05:56.920 align:middle line:90% You're still there. 02:05:56.920 --> 02:05:58.860 align:middle line:84% And so even though it doesn't work 02:05:58.860 --> 02:06:00.440 align:middle line:84% in a conventional advertising way, 02:06:00.440 --> 02:06:02.060 align:middle line:84% like you're going to get leads on new people who 02:06:02.060 --> 02:06:04.018 align:middle line:84% are going to do it, it's still really important 02:06:04.018 --> 02:06:08.080 align:middle line:84% to do because, given the value of that install base, 02:06:08.080 --> 02:06:11.860 align:middle line:84% it's really good to do public things that reassure 02:06:11.860 --> 02:06:13.640 align:middle line:90% those people that you care. 02:06:13.640 --> 02:06:16.180 align:middle line:90% 02:06:16.180 --> 02:06:16.740 align:middle line:90% Yeah? 02:06:16.740 --> 02:06:18.620 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Do you think the business 02:06:18.620 --> 02:06:21.905 align:middle line:84% itself, like advertising business, is changing or not? 02:06:21.905 --> 02:06:22.780 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Oh, yeah. 02:06:22.780 --> 02:06:24.940 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: To me, it's like the storytelling 02:06:24.940 --> 02:06:28.340 align:middle line:84% seems to be very unidirectional, whereas a lot of things 02:06:28.340 --> 02:06:30.780 align:middle line:90% are changing in a way that-- 02:06:30.780 --> 02:06:34.180 align:middle line:84% for example, I was trying to buy a shaver this morning. 02:06:34.180 --> 02:06:37.460 align:middle line:84% And the first thing I did was trying to find some user 02:06:37.460 --> 02:06:39.700 align:middle line:90% comments on certain products. 02:06:39.700 --> 02:06:42.780 align:middle line:84% So it's not just the manufacturer 02:06:42.780 --> 02:06:44.780 align:middle line:84% giving out the information and trying 02:06:44.780 --> 02:06:47.540 align:middle line:90% to persuade the customers. 02:06:47.540 --> 02:06:51.020 align:middle line:84% It's more like customers trying to find information. 02:06:51.020 --> 02:06:53.640 align:middle line:84% And I think the changes are there, 02:06:53.640 --> 02:06:58.740 align:middle line:84% and I think the way that the traditional-- and the Google Ads 02:06:58.740 --> 02:07:02.620 align:middle line:84% are changing the advertisement world [? a lot. ?] 02:07:02.620 --> 02:07:07.100 align:middle line:84% So my question is, as a traditional advertisement 02:07:07.100 --> 02:07:10.900 align:middle line:84% agency, what kind of changes are there, 02:07:10.900 --> 02:07:14.460 align:middle line:84% and how do you incorporate those? 02:07:14.460 --> 02:07:16.720 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Well, I mean, first question-- 02:07:16.720 --> 02:07:19.460 align:middle line:84% to me, the thing about the thing about-- 02:07:19.460 --> 02:07:23.740 align:middle line:84% and I mean, Ogilvy does any kind of media you can think of. 02:07:23.740 --> 02:07:28.380 align:middle line:84% Our digital part of the company is exploding. 02:07:28.380 --> 02:07:32.540 align:middle line:84% I tend to be both a digital advocate and a digital skeptic 02:07:32.540 --> 02:07:35.960 align:middle line:84% because I think, if you talk about, OK, I go online, 02:07:35.960 --> 02:07:37.960 align:middle line:84% I get user comments, blah, blah, blah. 02:07:37.960 --> 02:07:42.497 align:middle line:84% There are all of these blogging units being 02:07:42.497 --> 02:07:44.580 align:middle line:84% formed in all kinds of advertising agencies, where 02:07:44.580 --> 02:07:50.780 align:middle line:84% people go on to websites and put in positive reviews of products. 02:07:50.780 --> 02:07:53.830 align:middle line:84% Now, how long is it going to take until people figure out 02:07:53.830 --> 02:07:57.190 align:middle line:84% that all the glowing reviews are written by people who are just 02:07:57.190 --> 02:07:58.690 align:middle line:90% shills for the companies? 02:07:58.690 --> 02:08:01.010 align:middle line:84% It's like, there was a thing a few years ago-- 02:08:01.010 --> 02:08:03.990 align:middle line:84% it's a couple of guys who worked in the marketing 02:08:03.990 --> 02:08:06.230 align:middle line:84% at Universal Pictures or something 02:08:06.230 --> 02:08:08.470 align:middle line:84% and got fired because they made up quotes 02:08:08.470 --> 02:08:11.150 align:middle line:84% of, greatest movie of all time, and it turned out 02:08:11.150 --> 02:08:13.210 align:middle line:84% to be by somebody who was completely nonexistent. 02:08:13.210 --> 02:08:14.252 align:middle line:90% I mean, the thing about-- 02:08:14.252 --> 02:08:17.820 align:middle line:90% 02:08:17.820 --> 02:08:19.210 align:middle line:90% I like guitars. 02:08:19.210 --> 02:08:20.530 align:middle line:90% I'm really into guitars. 02:08:20.530 --> 02:08:21.947 align:middle line:84% But if you go onto Google, and you 02:08:21.947 --> 02:08:23.670 align:middle line:84% search for certain models of guitar, 02:08:23.670 --> 02:08:25.972 align:middle line:84% it brings you paid search words for companies 02:08:25.972 --> 02:08:28.430 align:middle line:84% that have no stock of that guitar, who don't have anything. 02:08:28.430 --> 02:08:30.910 align:middle line:84% And it's always the same-- there's about six companies. 02:08:30.910 --> 02:08:31.930 align:middle line:90% It's always the same. 02:08:31.930 --> 02:08:33.790 align:middle line:84% And some of them have shadow companies 02:08:33.790 --> 02:08:37.950 align:middle line:84% that are a different name, but it's the same website. 02:08:37.950 --> 02:08:40.050 align:middle line:84% It's the same website, same price, 02:08:40.050 --> 02:08:42.970 align:middle line:84% same inventory clearly being shipped from the same place. 02:08:42.970 --> 02:08:46.790 align:middle line:84% So they create three brands that sell exactly the same thing. 02:08:46.790 --> 02:08:48.990 align:middle line:90% So once search stops to be-- 02:08:48.990 --> 02:08:51.810 align:middle line:90% 02:08:51.810 --> 02:08:53.690 align:middle line:90% search is very manipulable. 02:08:53.690 --> 02:08:56.310 align:middle line:84% So if it's manipulated, then at what 02:08:56.310 --> 02:08:59.430 align:middle line:84% point-- because the other thing, the thing about marketing 02:08:59.430 --> 02:09:00.790 align:middle line:90% is, it's very faddish. 02:09:00.790 --> 02:09:04.565 align:middle line:84% You can just hear people walking into their bosses and saying, 02:09:04.565 --> 02:09:05.690 align:middle line:90% we've got to be on YouTube. 02:09:05.690 --> 02:09:06.610 align:middle line:90% I'm going to go on YouTube. 02:09:06.610 --> 02:09:07.235 align:middle line:90% What's YouTube? 02:09:07.235 --> 02:09:09.630 align:middle line:84% It's a great story, internal companies. 02:09:09.630 --> 02:09:10.490 align:middle line:90% And I like YouTube. 02:09:10.490 --> 02:09:11.750 align:middle line:90% YouTube's a blast. 02:09:11.750 --> 02:09:13.110 align:middle line:90% But what happens when there's-- 02:09:13.110 --> 02:09:21.910 align:middle line:84% I mean, Ogilvy had probably the most successful viral product 02:09:21.910 --> 02:09:24.270 align:middle line:84% thing done through YouTube and other postings, which 02:09:24.270 --> 02:09:28.210 align:middle line:84% was this Dove film we did, the Campaign for Real Beauty-- 02:09:28.210 --> 02:09:31.330 align:middle line:84% I mean, something like hundreds of millions of downloads, 02:09:31.330 --> 02:09:32.370 align:middle line:90% which is really unusual. 02:09:32.370 --> 02:09:35.230 align:middle line:84% You hear a lot of anecdotal stuff in meetings where people 02:09:35.230 --> 02:09:39.050 align:middle line:84% say, oh, we got 300,000 page views, or we got 800,000. 02:09:39.050 --> 02:09:43.590 align:middle line:84% You go, well, that's not really enough to move a really-- 02:09:43.590 --> 02:09:45.130 align:middle line:84% I mean, that's not insignificant, 02:09:45.130 --> 02:09:46.570 align:middle line:90% but it's not enough. 02:09:46.570 --> 02:09:48.730 align:middle line:84% And so the Dove thing was monster. 02:09:48.730 --> 02:09:52.270 align:middle line:84% It was a real phenomenon thing that happened. 02:09:52.270 --> 02:09:54.870 align:middle line:90% But you can't guarantee that. 02:09:54.870 --> 02:09:58.470 align:middle line:84% I mean, one of the reasons you go to the Super Bowl 02:09:58.470 --> 02:10:01.550 align:middle line:84% is because 60 million people are going to show up. 02:10:01.550 --> 02:10:04.990 align:middle line:84% And the thing with YouTube is, right now, we 02:10:04.990 --> 02:10:08.843 align:middle line:84% figure there are about 70 million videos on YouTube. 02:10:08.843 --> 02:10:11.010 align:middle line:84% And so everybody posts their commercials to YouTube, 02:10:11.010 --> 02:10:13.670 align:middle line:84% and everybody makes these funny little fake commercials 02:10:13.670 --> 02:10:14.850 align:middle line:90% and posts them to YouTube. 02:10:14.850 --> 02:10:16.590 align:middle line:84% The problem is, what happens when there's 02:10:16.590 --> 02:10:17.758 align:middle line:90% a billion videos on YouTube? 02:10:17.758 --> 02:10:20.050 align:middle line:84% What happens when there's 10 billion videos on YouTube? 02:10:20.050 --> 02:10:21.630 align:middle line:84% It's going to happen in five years. 02:10:21.630 --> 02:10:26.190 align:middle line:84% I mean, it's an inexhaustible supply of stuff. 02:10:26.190 --> 02:10:29.830 align:middle line:84% But who's going to watch it, at some point? 02:10:29.830 --> 02:10:31.130 align:middle line:90% It's got to be really good. 02:10:31.130 --> 02:10:33.622 align:middle line:84% And the bar is going to go up on what people send around. 02:10:33.622 --> 02:10:35.830 align:middle line:84% I mean, people are always going to send around stuff, 02:10:35.830 --> 02:10:38.475 align:middle line:90% but the bar is going to go up. 02:10:38.475 --> 02:10:40.350 align:middle line:84% And at some point, there's just going to be-- 02:10:40.350 --> 02:10:43.150 align:middle line:90% 02:10:43.150 --> 02:10:47.790 align:middle line:84% the nature of it will change, as all digital media will change. 02:10:47.790 --> 02:10:50.630 align:middle line:90% Everything will change. 02:10:50.630 --> 02:10:51.430 align:middle line:90% Yeah? 02:10:51.430 --> 02:10:54.510 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think related to that, there's an issue of, then, 02:10:54.510 --> 02:10:56.170 align:middle line:84% so the story is still important there, 02:10:56.170 --> 02:10:58.170 align:middle line:84% and the quality of the story is still important, 02:10:58.170 --> 02:11:01.470 align:middle line:84% but maybe you change a little bit how you're delivering it. 02:11:01.470 --> 02:11:02.470 align:middle line:90% So I don't know. 02:11:02.470 --> 02:11:04.170 align:middle line:84% If you're selling music on iTunes now, 02:11:04.170 --> 02:11:07.410 align:middle line:84% you're selling more singles and less full albums, 02:11:07.410 --> 02:11:09.870 align:middle line:84% but maybe there's a way you could sell three songs together 02:11:09.870 --> 02:11:10.850 align:middle line:90% or something else. 02:11:10.850 --> 02:11:13.830 align:middle line:84% So maybe something like that works. 02:11:13.830 --> 02:11:17.070 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Well, I think the opportunity for experimentation 02:11:17.070 --> 02:11:18.473 align:middle line:90% is huge because I think-- 02:11:18.473 --> 02:11:19.890 align:middle line:84% I mean, the thing about branding-- 02:11:19.890 --> 02:11:22.790 align:middle line:84% I mean, again, the Ogilvy philosophy on branding 02:11:22.790 --> 02:11:24.290 align:middle line:90% is that it's not any one thing. 02:11:24.290 --> 02:11:26.810 align:middle line:84% It's the complete-- a brand is an experience, 02:11:26.810 --> 02:11:29.950 align:middle line:84% and it ranges from how you feel about the person at the desk 02:11:29.950 --> 02:11:33.292 align:middle line:84% when you walk into the hotel, to the logo on the hotel, 02:11:33.292 --> 02:11:34.250 align:middle line:90% to the bed in the room. 02:11:34.250 --> 02:11:35.850 align:middle line:90% I mean, everything is branding. 02:11:35.850 --> 02:11:41.030 align:middle line:84% And so if you look at the proliferation of different media 02:11:41.030 --> 02:11:43.590 align:middle line:84% choices, you have all these different things you can do. 02:11:43.590 --> 02:11:45.670 align:middle line:90% And it's very hard to compare-- 02:11:45.670 --> 02:11:49.830 align:middle line:84% the thing is, a lot of the metrics of advertising 02:11:49.830 --> 02:11:55.010 align:middle line:84% effectiveness have been done based on five channels. 02:11:55.010 --> 02:11:58.470 align:middle line:84% Here's how many rating points we buy. 02:11:58.470 --> 02:12:01.530 align:middle line:84% And they're measuring a fairly finite universe. 02:12:01.530 --> 02:12:05.370 align:middle line:84% When it becomes all this, how valid is any of that stuff? 02:12:05.370 --> 02:12:08.030 align:middle line:84% And then you throw in, well, what about the blogging group 02:12:08.030 --> 02:12:12.175 align:middle line:84% we've got in Sri Lanka who's writing positive-- 02:12:12.175 --> 02:12:14.550 align:middle line:84% they're all writing about how much they love the new Ford 02:12:14.550 --> 02:12:17.690 align:middle line:84% Fusion and how it's the best car ever, and the Ford Taurus-- 02:12:17.690 --> 02:12:21.350 align:middle line:84% and renaming the Ford Taurus fundamentally changes the way-- 02:12:21.350 --> 02:12:26.890 align:middle line:84% I mean, there's a lot of experimentation. 02:12:26.890 --> 02:12:28.830 align:middle line:84% There's a lot of interesting things going on. 02:12:28.830 --> 02:12:30.205 align:middle line:84% The music industry is interesting 02:12:30.205 --> 02:12:31.798 align:middle line:84% because it's a pure digital play. 02:12:31.798 --> 02:12:33.590 align:middle line:84% And in a weird way, it's kind of going back 02:12:33.590 --> 02:12:39.430 align:middle line:84% to-- if you think about, like, in 1850, in every city, 02:12:39.430 --> 02:12:41.190 align:middle line:84% there was a theater, and in every theater, 02:12:41.190 --> 02:12:43.030 align:middle line:90% there was a Jack Nicholson. 02:12:43.030 --> 02:12:45.820 align:middle line:84% There was a guy who was the Cincinnati Jack Nicholson. 02:12:45.820 --> 02:12:47.920 align:middle line:84% And he probably did pretty well for himself 02:12:47.920 --> 02:12:49.560 align:middle line:90% until movies came along. 02:12:49.560 --> 02:12:53.840 align:middle line:84% And then, all of a sudden, one Jack Nicholson 02:12:53.840 --> 02:12:57.640 align:middle line:84% became very wealthy, and a lot of bad Jack Nicholsons 02:12:57.640 --> 02:12:59.560 align:middle line:90% lost their jobs. 02:12:59.560 --> 02:13:03.640 align:middle line:84% And so now it's going back to, you can be local and have-- 02:13:03.640 --> 02:13:08.863 align:middle line:84% iTunes as a distribution and software system for-- 02:13:08.863 --> 02:13:11.280 align:middle line:84% or Myspace or anything else-- for a local artist is pretty 02:13:11.280 --> 02:13:13.120 align:middle line:90% good because you can take-- 02:13:13.120 --> 02:13:16.680 align:middle line:84% the cost of production of quality music has gone down. 02:13:16.680 --> 02:13:19.760 align:middle line:84% The amount of people you need to supervise it and distribute it 02:13:19.760 --> 02:13:21.123 align:middle line:90% has gone down. 02:13:21.123 --> 02:13:23.040 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: [INAUDIBLE] Netflix-- 02:13:23.040 --> 02:13:25.207 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: When we were talking about this earlier, 02:13:25.207 --> 02:13:29.840 align:middle line:84% most of-- when you paid $18 for a CD, $17 of that 02:13:29.840 --> 02:13:33.900 align:middle line:84% went to lawyers and accountants and everything else. 02:13:33.900 --> 02:13:37.560 align:middle line:84% And you were lucky, if you were a band in Los Angeles, 02:13:37.560 --> 02:13:41.260 align:middle line:84% to get $1, lucky to get $1 out of that. 02:13:41.260 --> 02:13:44.740 align:middle line:84% And plenty of the guys, after three or four records, 02:13:44.740 --> 02:13:47.140 align:middle line:84% wound up owing money that they never had to pay, 02:13:47.140 --> 02:13:49.540 align:middle line:84% but they basically were never going to make any money, 02:13:49.540 --> 02:13:51.960 align:middle line:84% so they quit and became copywriters or whatever. 02:13:51.960 --> 02:13:54.680 align:middle line:90% [LAUGHTER] 02:13:54.680 --> 02:13:56.000 align:middle line:90% 02:13:56.000 --> 02:13:57.640 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So speaking of brand things, 02:13:57.640 --> 02:13:59.720 align:middle line:84% the other thing that is being branded nowadays 02:13:59.720 --> 02:14:04.432 align:middle line:90% are the presidential candidates. 02:14:04.432 --> 02:14:05.140 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Yeah. 02:14:05.140 --> 02:14:07.600 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Does your firm do any of those things? 02:14:07.600 --> 02:14:09.160 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Does it-- 02:14:09.160 --> 02:14:13.205 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Does it with the different campaigns? 02:14:13.205 --> 02:14:14.580 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Oh, I think it works. 02:14:14.580 --> 02:14:16.162 align:middle line:90% I mean, I think the-- 02:14:16.162 --> 02:14:17.120 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Do you guys-- 02:14:17.120 --> 02:14:18.620 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Do you guys do [INAUDIBLE]? 02:14:18.620 --> 02:14:19.245 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: No. 02:14:19.245 --> 02:14:21.840 align:middle line:84% Political campaigns are very special. 02:14:21.840 --> 02:14:23.938 align:middle line:90% Political marketing is-- 02:14:23.938 --> 02:14:25.480 align:middle line:84% I'm really fascinated by it because I 02:14:25.480 --> 02:14:27.660 align:middle line:84% was a political science major, but I don't do it. 02:14:27.660 --> 02:14:32.000 align:middle line:84% I mean, political marketing is a really unique, 02:14:32.000 --> 02:14:32.940 align:middle line:90% specialized thing. 02:14:32.940 --> 02:14:38.880 align:middle line:84% And the reason why is because there-- 02:14:38.880 --> 02:14:42.160 align:middle line:84% it's very unusual because, basically, your marketing 02:14:42.160 --> 02:14:44.560 align:middle line:84% is dependent on behavior on a single day 02:14:44.560 --> 02:14:46.417 align:middle line:90% every two, four, or six years. 02:14:46.417 --> 02:14:48.500 align:middle line:84% You don't care about the rest of the time, really. 02:14:48.500 --> 02:14:51.160 align:middle line:84% And the other thing about political marketing 02:14:51.160 --> 02:14:52.800 align:middle line:84% that's interesting is, if you were 02:14:52.800 --> 02:14:55.677 align:middle line:84% inclined to vote for the other guy-- 02:14:55.677 --> 02:14:57.260 align:middle line:84% political marketing could be effective 02:14:57.260 --> 02:14:59.480 align:middle line:84% if it makes you so disillusioned that you don't even 02:14:59.480 --> 02:15:02.400 align:middle line:84% vote because a no vote for the other guy 02:15:02.400 --> 02:15:04.600 align:middle line:84% is just as good as a vote for our guy. 02:15:04.600 --> 02:15:06.400 align:middle line:84% If you can turn off all the people who 02:15:06.400 --> 02:15:10.812 align:middle line:84% would vote for the other guy, that's good, too. 02:15:10.812 --> 02:15:13.020 align:middle line:84% And the interesting thing about political marketing-- 02:15:13.020 --> 02:15:17.640 align:middle line:84% because I actually worked on a Ford project about two years ago 02:15:17.640 --> 02:15:18.783 align:middle line:90% with some guys who-- 02:15:18.783 --> 02:15:20.200 align:middle line:84% Ford decided political consultants 02:15:20.200 --> 02:15:22.000 align:middle line:90% were going to save them. 02:15:22.000 --> 02:15:25.460 align:middle line:84% And I did a project with them, and it was horrible, horrible. 02:15:25.460 --> 02:15:27.560 align:middle line:84% And they put Bill Ford on the air 02:15:27.560 --> 02:15:32.880 align:middle line:84% and basically tried to run him for the Comptroller of Boston 02:15:32.880 --> 02:15:33.640 align:middle line:90% or something. 02:15:33.640 --> 02:15:34.560 align:middle line:90% And it was just-- 02:15:34.560 --> 02:15:36.900 align:middle line:84% it was really awful, and he spent a whole lot of money. 02:15:36.900 --> 02:15:39.480 align:middle line:84% And it's like, if you look at-- and the problem 02:15:39.480 --> 02:15:41.360 align:middle line:84% with the political consultants is 02:15:41.360 --> 02:15:43.720 align:middle line:84% that if you look at their ability 02:15:43.720 --> 02:15:47.760 align:middle line:84% to get people elected by playing to people's worst self, 02:15:47.760 --> 02:15:49.680 align:middle line:90% it's actually quite effective. 02:15:49.680 --> 02:15:52.280 align:middle line:84% But if you look at the overall perception in America 02:15:52.280 --> 02:15:54.720 align:middle line:84% of the political system and respect 02:15:54.720 --> 02:15:58.920 align:middle line:84% for politicians in the last 30 years, it's gone down. 02:15:58.920 --> 02:16:00.800 align:middle line:84% It's gone down dramatically since the '60s. 02:16:00.800 --> 02:16:02.100 align:middle line:90% And the '60s were no picnic. 02:16:02.100 --> 02:16:04.100 align:middle line:84% I mean, we were in the middle of a terrible war. 02:16:04.100 --> 02:16:05.580 align:middle line:90% The company was very divided. 02:16:05.580 --> 02:16:08.320 align:middle line:84% But the belief that the political system could 02:16:08.320 --> 02:16:11.020 align:middle line:84% make things better existed there, 02:16:11.020 --> 02:16:12.542 align:middle line:84% and it doesn't exist there anymore. 02:16:12.542 --> 02:16:13.500 align:middle line:90% I don't think there's-- 02:16:13.500 --> 02:16:14.720 align:middle line:84% [? IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: ?] You think it's a result 02:16:14.720 --> 02:16:17.120 align:middle line:84% of negative campaigning that [INAUDIBLE]? 02:16:17.120 --> 02:16:21.280 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: Well, I think it's a result of campaigning 02:16:21.280 --> 02:16:25.160 align:middle line:84% that has elected people that aren't terribly inspiring 02:16:25.160 --> 02:16:26.840 align:middle line:84% and who people don't have a lot of trust 02:16:26.840 --> 02:16:32.740 align:middle line:84% in, regardless of whether you're liberal or conservative. 02:16:32.740 --> 02:16:36.559 align:middle line:90% It's just-- it's icky. 02:16:36.559 --> 02:16:38.480 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I mean, kind of related to that, 02:16:38.480 --> 02:16:40.400 align:middle line:84% on the technology side, you were earlier 02:16:40.400 --> 02:16:44.240 align:middle line:84% talking about this feeling that technology 02:16:44.240 --> 02:16:46.059 align:middle line:84% was going to make the future better 02:16:46.059 --> 02:16:49.459 align:middle line:84% and having the servers behind glass and everything. 02:16:49.459 --> 02:16:51.500 align:middle line:90% It's like, everything is great. 02:16:51.500 --> 02:16:53.000 align:middle line:90% It's all going to be better. 02:16:53.000 --> 02:16:55.900 align:middle line:84% I mean, it doesn't seem like we have that feeling anymore. 02:16:55.900 --> 02:16:58.379 align:middle line:90% 02:16:58.379 --> 02:16:58.879 align:middle line:90% Can you-- 02:16:58.879 --> 02:16:59.180 align:middle line:90% CHRIS WALL: Yeah, I do. 02:16:59.180 --> 02:17:00.440 align:middle line:90% I think we do, actually. 02:17:00.440 --> 02:17:01.219 align:middle line:90% I think we do. 02:17:01.219 --> 02:17:02.802 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: I don't think 02:17:02.802 --> 02:17:07.240 align:middle line:84% the internet came with this positive feeling of change. 02:17:07.240 --> 02:17:09.920 align:middle line:84% I think a lot of the reason people 02:17:09.920 --> 02:17:12.160 align:middle line:84% embrace the internet or Linux-- if you 02:17:12.160 --> 02:17:16.660 align:middle line:84% look at the energy behind Linux, it's very positive. 02:17:16.660 --> 02:17:17.940 align:middle line:90% That's my feeling. 02:17:17.940 --> 02:17:19.320 align:middle line:90% [INTERPOSING VOICES] 02:17:19.320 --> 02:17:20.139 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think a lot of times, 02:17:20.139 --> 02:17:22.379 align:middle line:84% though, it just becomes, I want the technology to work. 02:17:22.379 --> 02:17:24.837 align:middle line:84% I don't actually think it's going to revolutionize my life. 02:17:24.837 --> 02:17:26.980 align:middle line:84% I think if it works, I'm going to be happy, 02:17:26.980 --> 02:17:28.952 align:middle line:84% and a lot of the times, it's not going to work. 02:17:28.952 --> 02:17:31.160 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Isn't there a disillusionment kind of thing 02:17:31.160 --> 02:17:33.879 align:middle line:84% where you say, I don't want technology 02:17:33.879 --> 02:17:35.790 align:middle line:90% to invade every part of my life. 02:17:35.790 --> 02:17:42.010 align:middle line:84% I don't want a biotech [? neighborhood ?] produce 02:17:42.010 --> 02:17:43.530 align:middle line:90% and all that stuff? 02:17:43.530 --> 02:17:46.850 align:middle line:84% I'm guessing, back in the 1960s, people were really looking 02:17:46.850 --> 02:17:50.370 align:middle line:84% forward to the future where technology would make things 02:17:50.370 --> 02:17:52.809 align:middle line:84% very easy for you, where now they're thinking-- 02:17:52.809 --> 02:17:55.650 align:middle line:90% has that social change happened? 02:17:55.650 --> 02:17:58.930 align:middle line:84% I do think that, in India right now, a lot of people 02:17:58.930 --> 02:18:03.330 align:middle line:84% do look forward to technology coming in and making things 02:18:03.330 --> 02:18:06.309 align:middle line:84% easy for them because they're at a stage where probably US was. 02:18:06.309 --> 02:18:08.434 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Let me just say one thing. 02:18:08.434 --> 02:18:11.730 align:middle line:84% We're having a fascinating discussion about marketing 02:18:11.730 --> 02:18:15.969 align:middle line:84% strategy because, if you have a technology, 02:18:15.969 --> 02:18:18.490 align:middle line:84% you have to answer that question. 02:18:18.490 --> 02:18:20.010 align:middle line:90% No, no, I'm very serious. 02:18:20.010 --> 02:18:25.090 align:middle line:84% Regardless of what your product is, your service, 02:18:25.090 --> 02:18:29.370 align:middle line:84% you want to envelop it in a market strategy that's 02:18:29.370 --> 02:18:30.430 align:middle line:90% optimistic. 02:18:30.430 --> 02:18:33.450 align:middle line:90% That's what you want to do. 02:18:33.450 --> 02:18:38.809 align:middle line:84% And as you heard in talking in class, that's not easy. 02:18:38.809 --> 02:18:42.770 align:middle line:84% But that's often how you break through-- 02:18:42.770 --> 02:18:46.850 align:middle line:84% I mean, in some sense, the reason, let's say, in IBM, 02:18:46.850 --> 02:18:50.209 align:middle line:90% we embrace Linux so much-- 02:18:50.209 --> 02:18:53.170 align:middle line:90% we like the people doing Linux. 02:18:53.170 --> 02:18:57.610 align:middle line:84% I mean, this is a community that was viewed very positively. 02:18:57.610 --> 02:19:00.670 align:middle line:84% In my case, the people who said, Irving, look, you guys, 02:19:00.670 --> 02:19:03.049 align:middle line:84% you guys have to do Linux, were the people 02:19:03.049 --> 02:19:06.250 align:middle line:84% in the supercomputing community, the research community 02:19:06.250 --> 02:19:09.969 align:middle line:84% that we were working very closely with. 02:19:09.969 --> 02:19:17.290 align:middle line:84% And at some point, you align yourself with positive forces. 02:19:17.290 --> 02:19:21.290 align:middle line:84% And then the fact that David Boies doesn't 02:19:21.290 --> 02:19:23.170 align:middle line:90% like it-- well, screw it. 02:19:23.170 --> 02:19:25.770 align:middle line:90% 02:19:25.770 --> 02:19:32.770 align:middle line:84% So that's why this is such a fascinating field 02:19:32.770 --> 02:19:36.410 align:middle line:90% because there is no amount of-- 02:19:36.410 --> 02:19:38.129 align:middle line:84% I don't know what market research 02:19:38.129 --> 02:19:42.690 align:middle line:84% we could have done, whether we should embrace Linux or not. 02:19:42.690 --> 02:19:46.070 align:middle line:84% At some level, it was, are these good people-- 02:19:46.070 --> 02:19:50.870 align:middle line:84% that is, the people behind it tried to do something good? 02:19:50.870 --> 02:19:53.410 align:middle line:90% Is this software good? 02:19:53.410 --> 02:19:57.610 align:middle line:84% And the fact that people in supercomputing centers 02:19:57.610 --> 02:20:01.330 align:middle line:84% and universities were vouching for it-- boy, that's 02:20:01.330 --> 02:20:03.330 align:middle line:90% worth a huge amount. 02:20:03.330 --> 02:20:07.210 align:middle line:84% And that is part of what convinced us to go with it. 02:20:07.210 --> 02:20:09.690 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: And I think there is-- 02:20:09.690 --> 02:20:11.230 align:middle line:90% I think all these things-- 02:20:11.230 --> 02:20:13.730 align:middle line:84% I think there's a community of people 02:20:13.730 --> 02:20:15.410 align:middle line:84% who are jazzed by technology, and they 02:20:15.410 --> 02:20:17.868 align:middle line:84% do believe that technology makes the world more interesting 02:20:17.868 --> 02:20:19.250 align:middle line:90% and makes it better. 02:20:19.250 --> 02:20:21.330 align:middle line:84% And I think that's not everything 02:20:21.330 --> 02:20:25.810 align:middle line:90% because you can be both. 02:20:25.810 --> 02:20:30.110 align:middle line:84% We did this documentary for the web last year on IBM, 02:20:30.110 --> 02:20:32.690 align:middle line:84% and it's about how IBM is working 02:20:32.690 --> 02:20:35.230 align:middle line:84% with [? Scripps ?] in this project, 02:20:35.230 --> 02:20:38.730 align:middle line:84% where, basically, it's about the avian flu. 02:20:38.730 --> 02:20:43.990 align:middle line:84% And basically, the idea is that if the avian flu jumps species, 02:20:43.990 --> 02:20:45.470 align:middle line:90% it mutates really quickly. 02:20:45.470 --> 02:20:48.535 align:middle line:90% It's a low-fidelity-- 02:20:48.535 --> 02:20:49.910 align:middle line:84% I can't remember the whole story. 02:20:49.910 --> 02:20:51.690 align:middle line:90% It's like a low-fidelity virus. 02:20:51.690 --> 02:20:55.030 align:middle line:84% And so it changes very, very quickly, 02:20:55.030 --> 02:20:57.930 align:middle line:90% and it's very, very fatal. 02:20:57.930 --> 02:20:59.650 align:middle line:84% And so the question is-- what IBM 02:20:59.650 --> 02:21:05.553 align:middle line:84% was trying to do with these guys was to model the 02:21:05.553 --> 02:21:06.970 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Mutation. 02:21:06.970 --> 02:21:08.550 align:middle line:84% CHRIS WALL: --potential mutation-- 02:21:08.550 --> 02:21:11.610 align:middle line:84% not the actual mutation, but the potential mutation, 02:21:11.610 --> 02:21:14.850 align:middle line:84% so they could design a vaccine, essentially, 02:21:14.850 --> 02:21:16.830 align:middle line:84% for a disease that hadn't happened yet. 02:21:16.830 --> 02:21:19.030 align:middle line:84% Now you start going, how cool is that? 02:21:19.030 --> 02:21:22.450 align:middle line:84% And IBM-- one of my frustrations with IBM 02:21:22.450 --> 02:21:25.475 align:middle line:84% is, IBM does a lot of these really cool things. 02:21:25.475 --> 02:21:26.850 align:middle line:84% You sit and talk with these guys, 02:21:26.850 --> 02:21:29.350 align:middle line:84% and you go, oh, my God, that's so interesting. 02:21:29.350 --> 02:21:33.430 align:middle line:84% And my inner Worlds Fair wants to say, we should do something. 02:21:33.430 --> 02:21:34.650 align:middle line:90% We should tell that story. 02:21:34.650 --> 02:21:36.510 align:middle line:84% And yet, there's never enough money to tell the story, 02:21:36.510 --> 02:21:39.070 align:middle line:84% or there's somebody says, well, we won't actually sell it. 02:21:39.070 --> 02:21:40.910 align:middle line:84% But people are jazzed by technology. 02:21:40.910 --> 02:21:45.570 align:middle line:84% I mean, the fact that they can take a swab of your cheek 02:21:45.570 --> 02:21:49.970 align:middle line:84% and tell you where your family came from genetically, where 02:21:49.970 --> 02:21:54.490 align:middle line:84% you originated in Africa millions of years ago 02:21:54.490 --> 02:21:55.510 align:middle line:90% is amazing. 02:21:55.510 --> 02:21:57.413 align:middle line:84% And it costs you $100, and they'll 02:21:57.413 --> 02:21:59.330 align:middle line:84% send you the results in six weeks or whatever. 02:21:59.330 --> 02:22:03.770 align:middle line:84% And you go, like, that's really neat. 02:22:03.770 --> 02:22:06.870 align:middle line:84% And so if you really get into what technology can do, 02:22:06.870 --> 02:22:08.850 align:middle line:84% there's all this great, cool stuff 02:22:08.850 --> 02:22:10.570 align:middle line:90% that includes the new iPod. 02:22:10.570 --> 02:22:12.010 align:middle line:90% It's neat. 02:22:12.010 --> 02:22:13.030 align:middle line:90% I've got the iPhone. 02:22:13.030 --> 02:22:13.950 align:middle line:90% I had to have it. 02:22:13.950 --> 02:22:15.530 align:middle line:90% It's like, it's really cool. 02:22:15.530 --> 02:22:16.030 align:middle line:90% I love it. 02:22:16.030 --> 02:22:16.630 align:middle line:90% It's great. 02:22:16.630 --> 02:22:19.130 align:middle line:84% The only problem with it is, you use it for three months, 02:22:19.130 --> 02:22:20.730 align:middle line:84% and now you're like, OK, what's next? 02:22:20.730 --> 02:22:22.910 align:middle line:90% We all get bored fast. 02:22:22.910 --> 02:22:28.300 align:middle line:84% But it's but it's a great, fantastic piece that 02:22:28.300 --> 02:22:30.900 align:middle line:90% makes your life better. 02:22:30.900 --> 02:22:35.240 align:middle line:84% And who knows what other cool stuff is going to happen? 02:22:35.240 --> 02:22:36.960 align:middle line:84% So I think people do believe in it. 02:22:36.960 --> 02:22:40.580 align:middle line:84% At the same time, you go, well, yes, but there's-- 02:22:40.580 --> 02:22:42.780 align:middle line:84% I mean, we just did this new campaign for IBM, which 02:22:42.780 --> 02:22:44.020 align:middle line:84% I wanted to show you, which I don't even 02:22:44.020 --> 02:22:44.978 align:middle line:90% know if you've seen it. 02:22:44.978 --> 02:22:48.340 align:middle line:84% We have a spot here because one of the things that we-- 02:22:48.340 --> 02:22:50.880 align:middle line:90% IBM got involved in Second Life. 02:22:50.880 --> 02:22:53.020 align:middle line:84% And Second Life is a really neat idea. 02:22:53.020 --> 02:22:55.780 align:middle line:84% But at the same time, a lot of people who have gone into it 02:22:55.780 --> 02:22:58.442 align:middle line:84% commercially haven't found success there. 02:22:58.442 --> 02:23:00.900 align:middle line:84% And so it's a weird thing where you go, the potential of it 02:23:00.900 --> 02:23:01.740 align:middle line:90% is huge. 02:23:01.740 --> 02:23:03.560 align:middle line:90% It's a really interesting idea. 02:23:03.560 --> 02:23:07.460 align:middle line:84% But in version 1, the technology-- 02:23:07.460 --> 02:23:09.252 align:middle line:84% or the results, for whatever reason-- maybe 02:23:09.252 --> 02:23:11.502 align:middle line:84% because it hasn't been figured out, maybe because it's 02:23:11.502 --> 02:23:12.320 align:middle line:90% techno-- who knows? 02:23:12.320 --> 02:23:16.780 align:middle line:84% But it hasn't proven to be a commercial success yet. 02:23:16.780 --> 02:23:18.400 align:middle line:90% But it's interesting. 02:23:18.400 --> 02:23:20.980 align:middle line:84% So one of the things with IBM is trying 02:23:20.980 --> 02:23:25.080 align:middle line:84% to play both sides, on one hand say, enormous potential, 02:23:25.080 --> 02:23:29.030 align:middle line:84% and at the same-- gosh, this is really exciting, 02:23:29.030 --> 02:23:31.280 align:middle line:84% and play that possibility thing, and at the same time, 02:23:31.280 --> 02:23:33.200 align:middle line:84% be able to play the voice of, yeah, 02:23:33.200 --> 02:23:35.220 align:middle line:84% but it doesn't work, because what IBM is about, 02:23:35.220 --> 02:23:40.060 align:middle line:84% at the end of the day, is making the possible into the real. 02:23:40.060 --> 02:23:41.540 align:middle line:90% And so it's like-- 02:23:41.540 --> 02:23:43.420 align:middle line:84% and a lot of the companies are making it 02:23:43.420 --> 02:23:47.460 align:middle line:84% about a piece of the possible or just milking the hype. 02:23:47.460 --> 02:23:50.160 align:middle line:84% And so I was actually going to show you this commercial, 02:23:50.160 --> 02:23:53.900 align:middle line:84% which IBM is-- they're not sure-- 02:23:53.900 --> 02:23:56.900 align:middle line:84% I don't know if this is ever going to run. 02:23:56.900 --> 02:24:00.620 align:middle line:84% But this is about Second Life and IBM innovation. 02:24:00.620 --> 02:24:02.960 align:middle line:90% [BEEP] 02:24:02.960 --> 02:24:05.153 align:middle line:90% Anyway, but constantly-- 02:24:05.153 --> 02:24:06.820 align:middle line:84% I mean, actually, I think the neat thing 02:24:06.820 --> 02:24:08.780 align:middle line:84% I think we've been able to do with IBM 02:24:08.780 --> 02:24:15.418 align:middle line:84% as a company is talk legitimately to both sides. 02:24:15.418 --> 02:24:17.960 align:middle line:84% IRVING WLADAWSKY-BERGER: Well, let me thank Chris for coming. 02:24:17.960 --> 02:24:20.710 align:middle line:90% [APPLAUSE] 02:24:20.710 --> 02:24:22.000 align:middle line:90%