WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:00.570 align:middle line:90% 00:00:00.570 --> 00:00:02.370 align:middle line:84% The following content is provided 00:00:02.370 --> 00:00:06.330 align:middle line:84% by MIT OpenCourseWare under a Creative Commons license. 00:00:06.330 --> 00:00:08.430 align:middle line:84% Additional information about our license, 00:00:08.430 --> 00:00:10.800 align:middle line:84% and MIT OpenCourseWare in general, 00:00:10.800 --> 00:00:12.740 align:middle line:90% is available at ocw.mit.edu. 00:00:12.740 --> 00:00:15.330 align:middle line:90% 00:00:15.330 --> 00:00:18.420 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Yeah, the internet-- 00:00:18.420 --> 00:00:21.330 align:middle line:90% I was really trying to-- 00:00:21.330 --> 00:00:24.600 align:middle line:84% push is not the word, but something close to push, 00:00:24.600 --> 00:00:29.950 align:middle line:84% Doctor Ing to do something on that. 00:00:29.950 --> 00:00:31.810 align:middle line:84% So one of the things about the internet 00:00:31.810 --> 00:00:47.587 align:middle line:84% is that we've produced a generation, 00:00:47.587 --> 00:00:48.670 align:middle line:90% and the "we" is the world. 00:00:48.670 --> 00:00:51.250 align:middle line:90% 00:00:51.250 --> 00:00:53.400 align:middle line:84% Let me tell you what I mean by that. 00:00:53.400 --> 00:00:59.840 align:middle line:84% Now, I don't know if I ever told you I was in South Africa, 00:00:59.840 --> 00:01:03.630 align:middle line:90% and I was up in Lesotho. 00:01:03.630 --> 00:01:12.920 align:middle line:84% And I'm riding down this road and it's total desolation, 00:01:12.920 --> 00:01:13.420 align:middle line:90% total. 00:01:13.420 --> 00:01:16.480 align:middle line:84% We're up in the mountains-- total desolation. 00:01:16.480 --> 00:01:18.070 align:middle line:84% And all of a sudden, there's this guy 00:01:18.070 --> 00:01:22.710 align:middle line:84% walking along the side of the road with a cellphone. 00:01:22.710 --> 00:01:27.210 align:middle line:84% And I asked my driver, said, who is he talking to, somebody back 00:01:27.210 --> 00:01:27.880 align:middle line:90% at his village? 00:01:27.880 --> 00:01:29.297 align:middle line:84% He said, no, he's probably talking 00:01:29.297 --> 00:01:30.675 align:middle line:90% to a relative in France. 00:01:30.675 --> 00:01:33.540 align:middle line:90% 00:01:33.540 --> 00:01:36.330 align:middle line:84% So when I say "we" and I mean the world, 00:01:36.330 --> 00:01:45.810 align:middle line:84% I really mean we have produced a generation that is probably 00:01:45.810 --> 00:01:51.870 align:middle line:84% in some ways wired into the internet and other things 00:01:51.870 --> 00:01:55.440 align:middle line:84% that I am not wired into, and that you all are probably 00:01:55.440 --> 00:01:57.330 align:middle line:90% just-- 00:01:57.330 --> 00:02:00.240 align:middle line:84% I don't even know if I count you all in it. 00:02:00.240 --> 00:02:03.220 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: We didn't have it in our childhood. 00:02:03.220 --> 00:02:06.130 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] happen after hours. 00:02:06.130 --> 00:02:08.974 align:middle line:84% So I think that must be different [INAUDIBLE].. 00:02:08.974 --> 00:02:14.442 align:middle line:90% 00:02:14.442 --> 00:02:17.730 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: And what I've gotten from students 00:02:17.730 --> 00:02:26.290 align:middle line:84% is a basic moral sensibility about the internet 00:02:26.290 --> 00:02:30.520 align:middle line:84% that I don't have, and that I can argue against. 00:02:30.520 --> 00:02:34.550 align:middle line:84% But they have a basic sentimentality about it, 00:02:34.550 --> 00:02:36.220 align:middle line:84% which I think gives rise to all ethics. 00:02:36.220 --> 00:02:38.160 align:middle line:90% You have to have a sentiment. 00:02:38.160 --> 00:02:39.990 align:middle line:84% You have to have a passion about something. 00:02:39.990 --> 00:02:41.700 align:middle line:90% You have to feel something. 00:02:41.700 --> 00:02:44.812 align:middle line:84% And one of them is that no matter what 00:02:44.812 --> 00:02:46.770 align:middle line:84% the law says, whatever you can get from the net 00:02:46.770 --> 00:02:47.400 align:middle line:90% belongs to you. 00:02:47.400 --> 00:02:53.100 align:middle line:84% It's like free water out past the 12-mile limit. 00:02:53.100 --> 00:02:56.160 align:middle line:84% There's a sensibility they have that no matter what 00:02:56.160 --> 00:02:58.980 align:middle line:84% you put up there, once it gets up there, 00:02:58.980 --> 00:03:01.390 align:middle line:90% it's in public domain. 00:03:01.390 --> 00:03:02.003 align:middle line:90% And I say, no. 00:03:02.003 --> 00:03:04.420 align:middle line:84% You know what I mean, I'm able to argue all of that stuff. 00:03:04.420 --> 00:03:06.210 align:middle line:84% And they, OK, they believe what I-- but I 00:03:06.210 --> 00:03:08.490 align:middle line:84% look at them in their faces after I've argued. 00:03:08.490 --> 00:03:11.570 align:middle line:90% They're not buying it. 00:03:11.570 --> 00:03:15.560 align:middle line:84% And the only argument that I can give to them that confuses them 00:03:15.560 --> 00:03:19.880 align:middle line:84% is the one where I say that I ran 00:03:19.880 --> 00:03:24.140 align:middle line:84% into this undergraduate student one day at Howard. 00:03:24.140 --> 00:03:25.670 align:middle line:84% It was a Chemical Engineering major. 00:03:25.670 --> 00:03:28.022 align:middle line:84% I hadn't had him in the class, but I knew him. 00:03:28.022 --> 00:03:29.730 align:middle line:84% He's walking down the hall with a guitar. 00:03:29.730 --> 00:03:31.480 align:middle line:84% I said, I didn't know you play the guitar. 00:03:31.480 --> 00:03:32.970 align:middle line:84% He said, well I play at the guitar. 00:03:32.970 --> 00:03:34.845 align:middle line:84% I'm not really good at it, but I write songs. 00:03:34.845 --> 00:03:35.960 align:middle line:90% I said, oh, really? 00:03:35.960 --> 00:03:37.910 align:middle line:84% So he opens up his guitar and pulls out, 00:03:37.910 --> 00:03:42.020 align:middle line:84% shows me this little sheet of paper, about that much of it, 00:03:42.020 --> 00:03:43.700 align:middle line:90% as a song. 00:03:43.700 --> 00:03:45.260 align:middle line:90% I said, oh, how nice. 00:03:45.260 --> 00:03:46.880 align:middle line:90% He sold it to Prince. 00:03:46.880 --> 00:03:49.680 align:middle line:84% So I said, how much did you make for that? 00:03:49.680 --> 00:03:52.100 align:middle line:84% And it was about twice the salary 00:03:52.100 --> 00:03:58.030 align:middle line:84% I make in a year, what he got from that, royalties and all. 00:03:58.030 --> 00:04:01.060 align:middle line:90% 00:04:01.060 --> 00:04:06.400 align:middle line:84% So I say now, if you wrote a song and it's yours, 00:04:06.400 --> 00:04:10.030 align:middle line:84% I don't care if you spent 12 years on it or 12 minutes 00:04:10.030 --> 00:04:12.100 align:middle line:90% on it. 00:04:12.100 --> 00:04:17.079 align:middle line:84% Do you want everybody downloading your song? 00:04:17.079 --> 00:04:18.940 align:middle line:90% And they will sit and think. 00:04:18.940 --> 00:04:22.600 align:middle line:84% And they've got problems with that. 00:04:22.600 --> 00:04:25.420 align:middle line:84% But I still think that there's a possibility 00:04:25.420 --> 00:04:33.190 align:middle line:84% we have to contend with a sensibility about the net 00:04:33.190 --> 00:04:37.540 align:middle line:84% that my generation was developing about robots. 00:04:37.540 --> 00:04:40.000 align:middle line:84% So my generation was about willing to say 00:04:40.000 --> 00:04:44.710 align:middle line:84% that a robot was sentient, not really that the robot was 00:04:44.710 --> 00:04:48.700 align:middle line:84% sentient, but that we could have feelings for a machine. 00:04:48.700 --> 00:04:52.030 align:middle line:90% 00:04:52.030 --> 00:04:55.300 align:middle line:84% And I don't think we ever quite got there, mainly because we're 00:04:55.300 --> 00:04:57.880 align:middle line:90% dying off first. 00:04:57.880 --> 00:05:03.180 align:middle line:84% But I don't know, if you ever meet somebody 00:05:03.180 --> 00:05:06.660 align:middle line:84% my age or older, ask them what they feel about their car. 00:05:06.660 --> 00:05:10.010 align:middle line:90% 00:05:10.010 --> 00:05:11.742 align:middle line:90% They might feel that-- 00:05:11.742 --> 00:05:13.470 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: What do you predict? 00:05:13.470 --> 00:05:16.040 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Well, I mean, some people feel about a car, 00:05:16.040 --> 00:05:19.040 align:middle line:84% they get out and kiss the engine if you let them, it wasn't hot. 00:05:19.040 --> 00:05:23.390 align:middle line:84% I mean, they feel sentimentality about it. 00:05:23.390 --> 00:05:25.190 align:middle line:84% So I don't know it's an interesting thing 00:05:25.190 --> 00:05:26.630 align:middle line:90% to speculate about. 00:05:26.630 --> 00:05:30.650 align:middle line:84% The important thing for this class is to speculate about it. 00:05:30.650 --> 00:05:31.700 align:middle line:90% Keep it in mind. 00:05:31.700 --> 00:05:32.570 align:middle line:90% Watch people. 00:05:32.570 --> 00:05:35.030 align:middle line:84% Ask them questions, because your arguments may not 00:05:35.030 --> 00:05:38.000 align:middle line:84% sink in with them past the rational level. 00:05:38.000 --> 00:05:42.090 align:middle line:90% 00:05:42.090 --> 00:05:44.310 align:middle line:84% What I want to do today is go into some depth 00:05:44.310 --> 00:05:47.250 align:middle line:84% on these codes of ethics, but I want to entertain Q&A first. 00:05:47.250 --> 00:05:50.550 align:middle line:90% 00:05:50.550 --> 00:05:52.725 align:middle line:84% Any burning issues, outstanding stuff? 00:05:52.725 --> 00:05:59.480 align:middle line:90% 00:05:59.480 --> 00:06:01.850 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: Related to the codes of ethics? 00:06:01.850 --> 00:06:03.810 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Related to anything, 00:06:03.810 --> 00:06:06.440 align:middle line:84% so that I can start into the code of ethics 00:06:06.440 --> 00:06:08.482 align:middle line:90% with a clear conscience. 00:06:08.482 --> 00:06:10.065 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: I have to show you something, 00:06:10.065 --> 00:06:13.180 align:middle line:84% I brought this to show you Professor, 00:06:13.180 --> 00:06:16.885 align:middle line:84% because [INAUDIBLE] were studying the legal applications 00:06:16.885 --> 00:06:18.220 align:middle line:90% of genetic engineering. 00:06:18.220 --> 00:06:20.610 align:middle line:90% It's like, I'm showing him-- 00:06:20.610 --> 00:06:23.040 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Ethics, as I believe most engineers 00:06:23.040 --> 00:06:26.420 align:middle line:90% understand and practice it-- 00:06:26.420 --> 00:06:30.620 align:middle line:84% hot dog-- involves the carefully calculated, responsible 00:06:30.620 --> 00:06:35.420 align:middle line:84% application of well-understood principles in accordance 00:06:35.420 --> 00:06:38.630 align:middle line:84% with established public and professional standards 00:06:38.630 --> 00:06:44.760 align:middle line:84% to produce results that are both safe and beneficial to society. 00:06:44.760 --> 00:06:47.270 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: But this man's argument is actually you cannot call 00:06:47.270 --> 00:06:48.020 align:middle line:90% genetic-- 00:06:48.020 --> 00:06:50.540 align:middle line:84% what's done with gene, genetic engineering. 00:06:50.540 --> 00:06:54.020 align:middle line:84% These people who manipulate the genetic material of organisms, 00:06:54.020 --> 00:06:55.890 align:middle line:90% they can't assume-- 00:06:55.890 --> 00:06:58.118 align:middle line:84% they can't say this is a safe way. 00:06:58.118 --> 00:06:58.910 align:middle line:90% And no [INAUDIBLE]. 00:06:58.910 --> 00:07:00.493 align:middle line:84% There's so much uncertainty you really 00:07:00.493 --> 00:07:02.820 align:middle line:84% can't call it engineering was his main argument. 00:07:02.820 --> 00:07:04.513 align:middle line:84% But I thought it was interesting. 00:07:04.513 --> 00:07:06.680 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Could you write down the source for me? 00:07:06.680 --> 00:07:07.263 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: Yeah. 00:07:07.263 --> 00:07:11.000 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: [INAUDIBLE] engineering implies ethical responsibility. 00:07:11.000 --> 00:07:14.370 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: Exactly, so [INAUDIBLE] interesting. 00:07:14.370 --> 00:07:18.695 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Yeah, that's an argument, if you'll recall-- 00:07:18.695 --> 00:07:20.070 align:middle line:84% you have no reason to recall this 00:07:20.070 --> 00:07:22.950 align:middle line:84% because it was the very, very, very last thing I said, 00:07:22.950 --> 00:07:31.950 align:middle line:84% but when we went to the Norwegian lecture, 00:07:31.950 --> 00:07:38.860 align:middle line:84% my very last recommendation was that we think about competency. 00:07:38.860 --> 00:07:43.930 align:middle line:84% We define competency in terms of the good, not competent, 00:07:43.930 --> 00:07:48.150 align:middle line:84% and then ask whether it's good, but it is not competent 00:07:48.150 --> 00:07:51.060 align:middle line:90% unless it is also good. 00:07:51.060 --> 00:07:55.260 align:middle line:84% And the group didn't seem to want to spend 00:07:55.260 --> 00:07:56.400 align:middle line:90% much time on that part. 00:07:56.400 --> 00:08:01.930 align:middle line:84% They wanted to spend time on the character development. 00:08:01.930 --> 00:08:11.428 align:middle line:84% But that part was significant because-- 00:08:11.428 --> 00:08:12.345 align:middle line:90% well, for two reasons. 00:08:12.345 --> 00:08:17.928 align:middle line:90% 00:08:17.928 --> 00:08:19.470 align:middle line:84% Well, let me just say for one reason, 00:08:19.470 --> 00:08:21.760 align:middle line:84% if I want to put the [INAUDIBLE] in that way. 00:08:21.760 --> 00:08:27.320 align:middle line:84% And that is that if you take the ethics out 00:08:27.320 --> 00:08:29.270 align:middle line:84% of the definition of competency, what you 00:08:29.270 --> 00:08:36.460 align:middle line:84% have is a lower-order standard for competence. 00:08:36.460 --> 00:08:38.350 align:middle line:84% You don't have to be really good at what 00:08:38.350 --> 00:08:45.080 align:middle line:84% you do because let's say, for example, three children come 00:08:45.080 --> 00:08:48.080 align:middle line:84% in here and one of them has got a disease that we'll all 00:08:48.080 --> 00:08:50.630 align:middle line:90% catch in 10 minutes. 00:08:50.630 --> 00:08:52.130 align:middle line:84% Well, one way to solve the problem-- 00:08:52.130 --> 00:08:53.960 align:middle line:90% kill all the children. 00:08:53.960 --> 00:08:57.860 align:middle line:90% I wouldn't call that competent. 00:08:57.860 --> 00:09:01.190 align:middle line:84% OK, so I want to say that competency really 00:09:01.190 --> 00:09:06.650 align:middle line:90% includes ethics as a condition. 00:09:06.650 --> 00:09:11.690 align:middle line:84% Because it not only means that you have to be really highly 00:09:11.690 --> 00:09:16.370 align:middle line:84% competent, but you build in competence into the culture, 00:09:16.370 --> 00:09:21.410 align:middle line:84% that people do not look for the one that's not ethical. 00:09:21.410 --> 00:09:25.160 align:middle line:84% And I guess I put the other one in there because it actually 00:09:25.160 --> 00:09:26.190 align:middle line:90% means the same thing. 00:09:26.190 --> 00:09:29.600 align:middle line:84% It goes back to my lecture, again, about Faust-- 00:09:29.600 --> 00:09:31.520 align:middle line:84% that if you leave out the ethics part, 00:09:31.520 --> 00:09:34.340 align:middle line:84% you're going to get what you call a competent solution, 00:09:34.340 --> 00:09:38.240 align:middle line:84% but it would be something you don't want. 00:09:38.240 --> 00:09:41.360 align:middle line:90% The monkey's paw again-- 00:09:41.360 --> 00:09:45.260 align:middle line:84% so I think the monkey's paw really defines competency 00:09:45.260 --> 00:09:47.840 align:middle line:90% without ethics. 00:09:47.840 --> 00:09:51.830 align:middle line:84% And that's something that nobody wants, 00:09:51.830 --> 00:09:57.132 align:middle line:84% even though you have agreed a priori 00:09:57.132 --> 00:09:58.340 align:middle line:90% on the terms of the contract. 00:09:58.340 --> 00:10:00.880 align:middle line:90% 00:10:00.880 --> 00:10:04.970 align:middle line:84% So those are my arguments about that. 00:10:04.970 --> 00:10:07.580 align:middle line:84% So yeah, I'd like to see that paper. 00:10:07.580 --> 00:10:09.460 align:middle line:84% And I'd like to-- actually, I'm trying 00:10:09.460 --> 00:10:13.090 align:middle line:84% to get Stephanie Bird in here to talk. 00:10:13.090 --> 00:10:17.380 align:middle line:90% She does ethics and science. 00:10:17.380 --> 00:10:20.110 align:middle line:84% So she wants to talk about those kinds of issues, too. 00:10:20.110 --> 00:10:22.810 align:middle line:84% And I want to bring her in here to talk about these issues 00:10:22.810 --> 00:10:27.085 align:middle line:84% because I think when you say what something is, you clarify 00:10:27.085 --> 00:10:30.080 align:middle line:90% it by saying what it is not. 00:10:30.080 --> 00:10:32.170 align:middle line:84% So we're not talking about ethics and science, 00:10:32.170 --> 00:10:33.450 align:middle line:90% but how do we know? 00:10:33.450 --> 00:10:37.510 align:middle line:84% Well, let's have a lecture on ethics and science. 00:10:37.510 --> 00:10:42.630 align:middle line:84% So what you'll find in ethics and science 00:10:42.630 --> 00:10:48.870 align:middle line:84% is two categories of issues, basically. 00:10:48.870 --> 00:10:52.440 align:middle line:90% One is ethics in research. 00:10:52.440 --> 00:10:54.930 align:middle line:84% Research ethics, which is what I talked about, 00:10:54.930 --> 00:10:57.930 align:middle line:84% is today almost always considered 00:10:57.930 --> 00:11:00.270 align:middle line:84% research ethics in sciences, even though it 00:11:00.270 --> 00:11:02.200 align:middle line:90% can include anything else. 00:11:02.200 --> 00:11:04.170 align:middle line:84% But all of the issues have come up 00:11:04.170 --> 00:11:09.720 align:middle line:84% with big scientists making gross violations 00:11:09.720 --> 00:11:13.830 align:middle line:90% of your basic sense of ethics. 00:11:13.830 --> 00:11:16.710 align:middle line:84% The other category has to do with what 00:11:16.710 --> 00:11:20.400 align:middle line:90% I would call political issues-- 00:11:20.400 --> 00:11:22.493 align:middle line:90% abortion-- 00:11:22.493 --> 00:11:24.076 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: Should we be doing it at all? 00:11:24.076 --> 00:11:24.909 align:middle line:90% [INTERPOSING VOICES] 00:11:24.909 --> 00:11:26.030 align:middle line:90% TAFT BROOME: --stem cells. 00:11:26.030 --> 00:11:30.830 align:middle line:84% That's right, should we be doing it at all. 00:11:30.830 --> 00:11:33.890 align:middle line:84% And some people will tell you if you 00:11:33.890 --> 00:11:38.500 align:middle line:84% get four philosophers in this room, one of them 00:11:38.500 --> 00:11:46.920 align:middle line:84% will say that those issues really aren't ethical issues, 00:11:46.920 --> 00:11:49.170 align:middle line:90% they are scientific issues. 00:11:49.170 --> 00:11:53.843 align:middle line:84% Because we want a scientific definition of a human being. 00:11:53.843 --> 00:11:56.010 align:middle line:84% We all agree that we shouldn't be doing these things 00:11:56.010 --> 00:12:02.680 align:middle line:84% to human beings, but is that a human being, that fetus 00:12:02.680 --> 00:12:04.240 align:middle line:90% or whatever? 00:12:04.240 --> 00:12:08.550 align:middle line:84% And so that person will say, I'm done, walk out of the room-- 00:12:08.550 --> 00:12:10.300 align:middle line:84% not that he doesn't want to talk about it, 00:12:10.300 --> 00:12:12.160 align:middle line:84% but it's not ethics for him or her. 00:12:12.160 --> 00:12:16.170 align:middle line:90% 00:12:16.170 --> 00:12:21.910 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: And others will say [INAUDIBLE] 00:12:21.910 --> 00:12:26.290 align:middle line:84% is a matter of definition, not just science. 00:12:26.290 --> 00:12:28.082 align:middle line:84% That's the other side of that [INAUDIBLE].. 00:12:28.082 --> 00:12:29.832 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: That's on the other side is-- 00:12:29.832 --> 00:12:31.344 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: That's why it doesn't-- 00:12:31.344 --> 00:12:36.280 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] the definition [INAUDIBLE].. 00:12:36.280 --> 00:12:37.530 align:middle line:90% TAFT BROOME: There got to be-- 00:12:37.530 --> 00:12:41.610 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: [INAUDIBLE] Yeah, I mean, I think so. 00:12:41.610 --> 00:12:43.350 align:middle line:90% I would say that it's not-- 00:12:43.350 --> 00:12:46.370 align:middle line:90% 00:12:46.370 --> 00:12:49.475 align:middle line:84% science has to agree upon, scientists as a community 00:12:49.475 --> 00:12:52.197 align:middle line:84% have to agree upon the definition and the starting 00:12:52.197 --> 00:12:54.930 align:middle line:90% point [INAUDIBLE]. 00:12:54.930 --> 00:12:58.570 align:middle line:84% There's not a series of experiments that can be done. 00:12:58.570 --> 00:13:03.419 align:middle line:84% I mean, it all involves [INAUDIBLE] 00:13:03.419 --> 00:13:09.310 align:middle line:84% about what possibly [INAUDIBLE] I definitely 00:13:09.310 --> 00:13:15.760 align:middle line:84% have not [INAUDIBLE] beginning of [INAUDIBLE].. 00:13:15.760 --> 00:13:20.120 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Well, that takes time, right? 00:13:20.120 --> 00:13:21.640 align:middle line:84% I mean, you have to sit out, and you 00:13:21.640 --> 00:13:23.860 align:middle line:90% have to think about that one. 00:13:23.860 --> 00:13:28.790 align:middle line:84% Actually, what I say is, first of all, 00:13:28.790 --> 00:13:31.148 align:middle line:84% it is a philosophical argument because it belongs 00:13:31.148 --> 00:13:32.440 align:middle line:90% to the category of metaphysics. 00:13:32.440 --> 00:13:37.480 align:middle line:84% You're talking about how are you going to divide the world up. 00:13:37.480 --> 00:13:44.200 align:middle line:84% And the scientific definition can only 00:13:44.200 --> 00:13:45.910 align:middle line:90% contribute one part of that. 00:13:45.910 --> 00:13:52.470 align:middle line:90% 00:13:52.470 --> 00:13:56.690 align:middle line:84% The other thing about it is that the affected parties are not 00:13:56.690 --> 00:13:59.225 align:middle line:90% only the fetus. 00:13:59.225 --> 00:14:01.100 align:middle line:84% You've got the mother, you've got the father. 00:14:01.100 --> 00:14:02.960 align:middle line:84% You've got a whole bunch of other people 00:14:02.960 --> 00:14:04.760 align:middle line:84% who are concerned about all that. 00:14:04.760 --> 00:14:09.770 align:middle line:84% Then the more you step into the political domain on this issue, 00:14:09.770 --> 00:14:12.440 align:middle line:84% the more you get into the religious domain. 00:14:12.440 --> 00:14:14.440 align:middle line:84% So you've got to start dividing the house there. 00:14:14.440 --> 00:14:15.982 align:middle line:84% What are we going to talk about here? 00:14:15.982 --> 00:14:21.770 align:middle line:84% We're going to use faith as an appeal, a legitimate source 00:14:21.770 --> 00:14:22.270 align:middle line:90% of appeal? 00:14:22.270 --> 00:14:25.270 align:middle line:84% Or we're going to stay with reason? 00:14:25.270 --> 00:14:27.250 align:middle line:84% So you've got to continue to divide the house. 00:14:27.250 --> 00:14:29.710 align:middle line:84% And once you do that, still haven't solved the problem. 00:14:29.710 --> 00:14:32.770 align:middle line:90% 00:14:32.770 --> 00:14:37.180 align:middle line:84% So I think that having her in here-- 00:14:37.180 --> 00:14:40.450 align:middle line:84% I owe her a paper by the way, one 00:14:40.450 --> 00:14:43.300 align:middle line:84% that I'm reading for her, not one that I've written. 00:14:43.300 --> 00:14:46.240 align:middle line:84% So that would be helpful, and I hope you all have the stomach 00:14:46.240 --> 00:14:49.440 align:middle line:90% for one lecture on this. 00:14:49.440 --> 00:14:49.980 align:middle line:90% You might. 00:14:49.980 --> 00:14:52.992 align:middle line:90% 00:14:52.992 --> 00:14:55.200 align:middle line:84% And then, we'll talk about whether or not any of it's 00:14:55.200 --> 00:15:00.830 align:middle line:84% genetic engineering, or whether it's really bioengineering. 00:15:00.830 --> 00:15:05.070 align:middle line:84% Because you are making something, 00:15:05.070 --> 00:15:08.280 align:middle line:84% like you take clay and make bricks, or like 00:15:08.280 --> 00:15:10.380 align:middle line:90% you take iron and make steel. 00:15:10.380 --> 00:15:11.430 align:middle line:90% You're making something. 00:15:11.430 --> 00:15:13.762 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: There's a design process. 00:15:13.762 --> 00:15:15.720 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: There's a design process involved. 00:15:15.720 --> 00:15:18.813 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: [INAUDIBLE]. 00:15:18.813 --> 00:15:20.730 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: It's not very well understood, maybe, 00:15:20.730 --> 00:15:26.788 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] It's not based on sound science yet. 00:15:26.788 --> 00:15:28.371 align:middle line:84% No one really quite understands what's 00:15:28.371 --> 00:15:33.030 align:middle line:84% going to happen when [INAUDIBLE].. 00:15:33.030 --> 00:15:37.110 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: The [? grid ?] building isn't well understood, then. 00:15:37.110 --> 00:15:38.850 align:middle line:84% There's lots of engineering practices 00:15:38.850 --> 00:15:43.971 align:middle line:84% that are not standard [INAUDIBLE] totally uncertain. 00:15:43.971 --> 00:15:46.070 align:middle line:84% So I wonder if the author of that article 00:15:46.070 --> 00:15:51.290 align:middle line:84% would say that wasn't engineering until [INAUDIBLE].. 00:15:51.290 --> 00:15:53.524 align:middle line:84% Because that goes against a lot of the definition 00:15:53.524 --> 00:15:55.015 align:middle line:90% that we discussed in this class. 00:15:55.015 --> 00:15:56.009 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] 00:15:56.009 --> 00:16:04.460 align:middle line:90% 00:16:04.460 --> 00:16:08.090 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Well, I'm giving consideration 00:16:08.090 --> 00:16:10.610 align:middle line:84% to all of this in my research work. 00:16:10.610 --> 00:16:13.020 align:middle line:90% And I haven't finished it. 00:16:13.020 --> 00:16:17.848 align:middle line:84% But where I am now is that it goes back 00:16:17.848 --> 00:16:18.890 align:middle line:90% to the Manhattan Project. 00:16:18.890 --> 00:16:21.140 align:middle line:84% Actually, it goes back before the Manhattan Project. 00:16:21.140 --> 00:16:25.550 align:middle line:90% It goes back, really, to radar. 00:16:25.550 --> 00:16:30.700 align:middle line:84% And that's when scientists were doing engineering. 00:16:30.700 --> 00:16:35.750 align:middle line:84% So if you get a scientist who is doing engineering, 00:16:35.750 --> 00:16:37.790 align:middle line:84% basically they might not do it right. 00:16:37.790 --> 00:16:42.080 align:middle line:84% So you can call it engineering, I think, 00:16:42.080 --> 00:16:45.710 align:middle line:84% but it's not what I would call sophisticated engineering. 00:16:45.710 --> 00:16:49.670 align:middle line:84% Because it's like when engineers sometimes do science. 00:16:49.670 --> 00:16:54.170 align:middle line:84% I think a good example of that is the invention 00:16:54.170 --> 00:16:56.540 align:middle line:90% of thermodynamics. 00:16:56.540 --> 00:17:01.240 align:middle line:84% If you're looking at the history of thermodynamics, engineers, 00:17:01.240 --> 00:17:08.890 align:middle line:84% boilers, and boilers for trains, developed 00:17:08.890 --> 00:17:13.040 align:middle line:84% a science using what scientists would call herky jerky methods. 00:17:13.040 --> 00:17:16.849 align:middle line:90% 00:17:16.849 --> 00:17:20.550 align:middle line:84% And so that's what I'm trying to reconcile now. 00:17:20.550 --> 00:17:22.790 align:middle line:84% And I think I'll have it reconciled 00:17:22.790 --> 00:17:27.589 align:middle line:84% before the month is out, but what happens to a thing 00:17:27.589 --> 00:17:32.520 align:middle line:84% when it is practiced by a non-practitioner. 00:17:32.520 --> 00:17:34.350 align:middle line:90% Here's is a good example. 00:17:34.350 --> 00:17:35.560 align:middle line:90% I'll tell you a good example. 00:17:35.560 --> 00:17:40.340 align:middle line:84% I was getting on the elevator with this researcher 00:17:40.340 --> 00:17:47.730 align:middle line:84% here at MIT who is doing research on systems. 00:17:47.730 --> 00:17:49.730 align:middle line:84% Actually, I was getting on the elevator with him 00:17:49.730 --> 00:17:50.360 align:middle line:90% at the airport. 00:17:50.360 --> 00:17:52.430 align:middle line:84% We ran into each other at the airport. 00:17:52.430 --> 00:17:56.850 align:middle line:84% And he's going to this conference on systems. 00:17:56.850 --> 00:17:59.610 align:middle line:84% There's another person here at MIT who's the president 00:17:59.610 --> 00:18:03.400 align:middle line:84% of the organization, named Pat Hale, H-A-L-E. 00:18:03.400 --> 00:18:06.480 align:middle line:84% Don't know if you know [INAUDIBLE].. 00:18:06.480 --> 00:18:13.310 align:middle line:84% And we were discussing that, and he had organized a session. 00:18:13.310 --> 00:18:18.930 align:middle line:84% And so I said, what did you organize your session on? 00:18:18.930 --> 00:18:24.700 align:middle line:84% And really what he said was that he 00:18:24.700 --> 00:18:28.240 align:middle line:84% belongs to the first generation of systems engineers. 00:18:28.240 --> 00:18:29.395 align:middle line:90% I said, hold up-- 00:18:29.395 --> 00:18:30.520 align:middle line:90% what are you talking about? 00:18:30.520 --> 00:18:33.280 align:middle line:84% Systems engineering had been around before you were around. 00:18:33.280 --> 00:18:39.880 align:middle line:84% He says, no, they were all this engineer, or that business 00:18:39.880 --> 00:18:43.330 align:middle line:84% person, or the other doing systems. 00:18:43.330 --> 00:18:46.750 align:middle line:84% But we are the first ones who are really systems engineers. 00:18:46.750 --> 00:18:50.320 align:middle line:84% Everybody who was my teacher, my faculty advisor, all 00:18:50.320 --> 00:18:53.810 align:middle line:84% of these people were people who were doing engineering, 00:18:53.810 --> 00:18:56.020 align:middle line:84% but they mainly had it from this perspective 00:18:56.020 --> 00:18:57.950 align:middle line:90% of another discipline. 00:18:57.950 --> 00:19:00.640 align:middle line:84% And so we want to organize the young people 00:19:00.640 --> 00:19:05.780 align:middle line:84% to start developing a purely systems idea. 00:19:05.780 --> 00:19:09.370 align:middle line:84% And so I think that tells a story about a lot of things. 00:19:09.370 --> 00:19:10.870 align:middle line:84% It tells it about engineering ethics 00:19:10.870 --> 00:19:18.300 align:middle line:84% because the people involved were basically mostly philosophers, 00:19:18.300 --> 00:19:21.000 align:middle line:84% and they got some engineers, and half of the engineers 00:19:21.000 --> 00:19:22.830 align:middle line:90% were practicing engineers. 00:19:22.830 --> 00:19:24.900 align:middle line:84% Many of them had been whistleblowers. 00:19:24.900 --> 00:19:29.080 align:middle line:84% Half of them were academic engineers. 00:19:29.080 --> 00:19:32.590 align:middle line:84% So who becomes the first engineering ethicist? 00:19:32.590 --> 00:19:36.087 align:middle line:90% 00:19:36.087 --> 00:19:37.670 align:middle line:84% Well, I felt that way when I came out. 00:19:37.670 --> 00:19:39.253 align:middle line:84% I felt that I was in a generation that 00:19:39.253 --> 00:19:41.470 align:middle line:90% was the first person-- 00:19:41.470 --> 00:19:44.020 align:middle line:84% not the first person, but in the first generation at least-- 00:19:44.020 --> 00:19:47.410 align:middle line:84% not the first age generation, but 00:19:47.410 --> 00:19:50.410 align:middle line:84% in the first academic generation, 00:19:50.410 --> 00:19:57.650 align:middle line:84% who was doing engineering ethics with a combined approach 00:19:57.650 --> 00:20:01.400 align:middle line:84% that on occasion developed something 00:20:01.400 --> 00:20:04.820 align:middle line:84% that was different from the two things that made it. 00:20:04.820 --> 00:20:08.240 align:middle line:84% And you can do that by adding to or violating 00:20:08.240 --> 00:20:14.570 align:middle line:84% one of the principles of one of the participating disciplines. 00:20:14.570 --> 00:20:16.370 align:middle line:84% And an example of that is the one 00:20:16.370 --> 00:20:20.060 align:middle line:84% where I talk about the virtue ethics 00:20:20.060 --> 00:20:22.100 align:middle line:84% from the standpoint of what I had first 00:20:22.100 --> 00:20:25.010 align:middle line:84% called African ethics, but now I have realized 00:20:25.010 --> 00:20:27.000 align:middle line:90% that it's all around the world. 00:20:27.000 --> 00:20:30.730 align:middle line:84% There's this whole other point of view that non-Western. 00:20:30.730 --> 00:20:34.090 align:middle line:84% And so the question is, and my colleagues at Howard 00:20:34.090 --> 00:20:37.690 align:middle line:84% are debating me, is this an extension 00:20:37.690 --> 00:20:44.157 align:middle line:84% of Greek ethics, Western ethics, or is this something different? 00:20:44.157 --> 00:20:51.540 align:middle line:90% 00:20:51.540 --> 00:21:00.050 align:middle line:84% So I think that one makes a big mistake when 00:21:00.050 --> 00:21:03.740 align:middle line:84% one defines competency in a manner that does not 00:21:03.740 --> 00:21:06.030 align:middle line:90% have a moral dimension. 00:21:06.030 --> 00:21:08.540 align:middle line:84% And scientists argue-- this used to be a big issue, 00:21:08.540 --> 00:21:14.890 align:middle line:84% then I get on to the point of the codes of ethics-- 00:21:14.890 --> 00:21:18.820 align:middle line:90% 00:21:18.820 --> 00:21:23.200 align:middle line:84% there were big debates in the '70s and '80s 00:21:23.200 --> 00:21:28.900 align:middle line:84% over the question, is science value free? 00:21:28.900 --> 00:21:31.075 align:middle line:84% Then it got narrowed down to truth. 00:21:31.075 --> 00:21:33.970 align:middle line:90% 00:21:33.970 --> 00:21:35.620 align:middle line:90% Squirrel got a nut-- 00:21:35.620 --> 00:21:40.910 align:middle line:84% is there value in that, somebody would argue. 00:21:40.910 --> 00:21:46.370 align:middle line:84% So truth can be separate from values. 00:21:46.370 --> 00:21:51.020 align:middle line:84% You have to ask yourself, if truth was not 00:21:51.020 --> 00:21:52.520 align:middle line:84% separate from values, why would we 00:21:52.520 --> 00:21:56.600 align:middle line:84% need two different words, truth and value? 00:21:56.600 --> 00:22:02.929 align:middle line:90% 00:22:02.929 --> 00:22:04.012 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: That makes sense. 00:22:04.012 --> 00:22:08.520 align:middle line:90% 00:22:08.520 --> 00:22:13.230 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: So my take on it has come out-- since you all 00:22:13.230 --> 00:22:14.760 align:middle line:90% got me on this road. 00:22:14.760 --> 00:22:17.460 align:middle line:90% I didn't ask for this. 00:22:17.460 --> 00:22:30.910 align:middle line:84% My take on it is that truth is value free. 00:22:30.910 --> 00:22:37.220 align:middle line:84% You can think about a truthful statement 00:22:37.220 --> 00:22:42.320 align:middle line:84% and then make a value judgment about it separately. 00:22:42.320 --> 00:22:45.770 align:middle line:84% But then I come back and say, what is scientific truth? 00:22:45.770 --> 00:22:49.740 align:middle line:90% 00:22:49.740 --> 00:22:53.590 align:middle line:90% What is scientific truth? 00:22:53.590 --> 00:22:58.000 align:middle line:84% And then there's a book, two books, three books-- 00:22:58.000 --> 00:23:00.850 align:middle line:90% 00:23:00.850 --> 00:23:01.725 align:middle line:90% well, let's say two-- 00:23:01.725 --> 00:23:05.070 align:middle line:90% 00:23:05.070 --> 00:23:09.210 align:middle line:84% that I hadn't intended to lecture about, but why not? 00:23:09.210 --> 00:23:17.370 align:middle line:90% 00:23:17.370 --> 00:23:48.690 align:middle line:84% One is called Patterns of Discovery by Hanson. 00:23:48.690 --> 00:23:51.765 align:middle line:90% And the other is called-- 00:23:51.765 --> 00:24:00.420 align:middle line:90% 00:24:00.420 --> 00:24:03.117 align:middle line:84% let me start talking, then it'll come to my mind. 00:24:03.117 --> 00:24:04.200 align:middle line:90% I didn't prepare for this. 00:24:04.200 --> 00:24:07.483 align:middle line:90% 00:24:07.483 --> 00:24:08.421 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: Is it Kuhn? 00:24:08.421 --> 00:24:10.230 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Kuhn, Thomas Kuhn, The Nature 00:24:10.230 --> 00:24:12.344 align:middle line:90% of Scientific Revolutions. 00:24:12.344 --> 00:24:17.570 align:middle line:90% 00:24:17.570 --> 00:24:19.570 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: I think it might even be the structure. 00:24:19.570 --> 00:24:22.785 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Structure of Scientific Revolution. 00:24:22.785 --> 00:24:24.725 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: Still haven't finished it, but-- 00:24:24.725 --> 00:24:39.480 align:middle line:90% 00:24:39.480 --> 00:24:40.972 align:middle line:90% now 00:24:40.972 --> 00:24:42.930 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Both, of them talk about something 00:24:42.930 --> 00:24:44.970 align:middle line:90% called worldview. 00:24:44.970 --> 00:24:51.630 align:middle line:84% Both of them talk about something called gestalt. 00:24:51.630 --> 00:25:06.140 align:middle line:84% So both of them will talk about this figure, 00:25:06.140 --> 00:25:14.620 align:middle line:84% and you would not believe that this figure has 00:25:14.620 --> 00:25:16.645 align:middle line:90% a name called the Necker cube. 00:25:16.645 --> 00:25:19.210 align:middle line:90% 00:25:19.210 --> 00:25:23.930 align:middle line:84% Because a Swedish psychologist studied it. 00:25:23.930 --> 00:25:27.530 align:middle line:84% I mean, we do it in engineering from day one, 00:25:27.530 --> 00:25:31.040 align:middle line:84% this thing here, if for no other reason than you'll 00:25:31.040 --> 00:25:33.725 align:middle line:84% extend this out, call that x, extend this up, call that y, 00:25:33.725 --> 00:25:36.980 align:middle line:84% extend this out and call that z, won't you? 00:25:36.980 --> 00:25:38.540 align:middle line:90% If for no other reason. 00:25:38.540 --> 00:25:41.840 align:middle line:90% 00:25:41.840 --> 00:25:46.880 align:middle line:84% Now, what they'll do is they'll ask if A is in front of B, 00:25:46.880 --> 00:25:48.190 align:middle line:90% or is B in front of A? 00:25:48.190 --> 00:25:51.550 align:middle line:90% 00:25:51.550 --> 00:25:53.086 align:middle line:90% Your mind can switch them. 00:25:53.086 --> 00:25:59.900 align:middle line:90% 00:25:59.900 --> 00:26:01.020 align:middle line:90% You can get both. 00:26:01.020 --> 00:26:04.200 align:middle line:90% It takes a minute. 00:26:04.200 --> 00:26:08.280 align:middle line:84% Is this thing coming out of the board and down to the right, 00:26:08.280 --> 00:26:10.905 align:middle line:84% or is it coming out of the board and up to the left? 00:26:10.905 --> 00:26:15.630 align:middle line:90% 00:26:15.630 --> 00:26:20.570 align:middle line:84% Well, the point is that we're dealing with gestalt here. 00:26:20.570 --> 00:26:27.230 align:middle line:84% And the whole range of a choice of gestalts 00:26:27.230 --> 00:26:29.190 align:middle line:90% is called world view. 00:26:29.190 --> 00:26:31.490 align:middle line:84% So if you choose to see that A is in front of B, 00:26:31.490 --> 00:26:33.290 align:middle line:84% and then you see a lot of different things 00:26:33.290 --> 00:26:37.130 align:middle line:84% with the same kind of choice, that whole thing 00:26:37.130 --> 00:26:39.030 align:middle line:90% forms your world view. 00:26:39.030 --> 00:26:42.200 align:middle line:84% And somebody coming in the door may 00:26:42.200 --> 00:26:46.490 align:middle line:84% have a different or overlapping world view. 00:26:46.490 --> 00:26:49.250 align:middle line:84% Now, what they say is that every learned discipline 00:26:49.250 --> 00:26:54.340 align:middle line:90% has its world view. 00:26:54.340 --> 00:26:58.020 align:middle line:84% And that you can walk into a class and get 00:26:58.020 --> 00:27:03.492 align:middle line:84% lost when you are right, but you're just looking at it 00:27:03.492 --> 00:27:04.450 align:middle line:90% from a different point. 00:27:04.450 --> 00:27:06.880 align:middle line:84% You're looking at B as being behind A. 00:27:06.880 --> 00:27:10.750 align:middle line:84% Everybody else is looking at A in front of B 00:27:10.750 --> 00:27:12.610 align:middle line:84% because that's the worldview associated 00:27:12.610 --> 00:27:14.175 align:middle line:90% with this learned discipline. 00:27:14.175 --> 00:27:21.390 align:middle line:90% 00:27:21.390 --> 00:27:29.240 align:middle line:84% So what they say, then, is that when you talk about the truth, 00:27:29.240 --> 00:27:29.970 align:middle line:90% that's one thing. 00:27:29.970 --> 00:27:31.790 align:middle line:84% But when you talk about scientific truth 00:27:31.790 --> 00:27:36.930 align:middle line:84% in the context of a scientific world view, 00:27:36.930 --> 00:27:40.870 align:middle line:84% you're talking about looking at it this way as opposed 00:27:40.870 --> 00:27:42.460 align:middle line:90% to another way. 00:27:42.460 --> 00:27:45.490 align:middle line:84% You're not talking about always looking at the truth. 00:27:45.490 --> 00:27:48.840 align:middle line:84% And so therefore, you have put a value judgment 00:27:48.840 --> 00:27:52.460 align:middle line:84% on why you want to look at it that way as opposed 00:27:52.460 --> 00:27:53.430 align:middle line:90% to the other. 00:27:53.430 --> 00:27:58.500 align:middle line:84% And that value judgment has moral implications. 00:27:58.500 --> 00:28:02.240 align:middle line:84% So I go before these people and say, yeah, truth is value free, 00:28:02.240 --> 00:28:08.200 align:middle line:84% but scientific truth isn't because you have chosen, then, 00:28:08.200 --> 00:28:10.060 align:middle line:84% to look at it a certain way when you could 00:28:10.060 --> 00:28:14.740 align:middle line:90% have looked at it another way. 00:28:14.740 --> 00:28:17.410 align:middle line:84% And then what Kuhn comes along and says 00:28:17.410 --> 00:28:21.550 align:middle line:84% is, that's how we get paradigm shifts in the disciplines. 00:28:21.550 --> 00:28:24.220 align:middle line:84% Somebody says we all better look at it the other way. 00:28:24.220 --> 00:28:29.500 align:middle line:90% 00:28:29.500 --> 00:28:32.170 align:middle line:84% And when everybody starts changing their worldview, 00:28:32.170 --> 00:28:36.040 align:middle line:84% when they look at the same thing and actually see 00:28:36.040 --> 00:28:42.165 align:middle line:84% something different, then you've got a paradigm shift. 00:28:42.165 --> 00:28:43.540 align:middle line:84% And now you talk about why people 00:28:43.540 --> 00:28:51.120 align:middle line:84% get Nobel Prizes, why people write dissertations, 00:28:51.120 --> 00:28:51.810 align:middle line:90% Master's theses. 00:28:51.810 --> 00:29:08.640 align:middle line:90% 00:29:08.640 --> 00:29:09.930 align:middle line:90% Thomas Kuhn was actually here. 00:29:09.930 --> 00:29:16.832 align:middle line:90% 00:29:16.832 --> 00:29:18.311 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: There was [INAUDIBLE]. 00:29:18.311 --> 00:29:21.270 align:middle line:90% 00:29:21.270 --> 00:29:24.990 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: He wrote it back in the '40s. 00:29:24.990 --> 00:29:26.680 align:middle line:90% He was a historian. 00:29:26.680 --> 00:29:27.839 align:middle line:90% He was a historian. 00:29:27.839 --> 00:29:43.260 align:middle line:90% 00:29:43.260 --> 00:29:49.120 align:middle line:84% And he uses that thesis to do history of science. 00:29:49.120 --> 00:29:52.090 align:middle line:84% And that thesis then tells him how 00:29:52.090 --> 00:29:55.930 align:middle line:84% to break up the errors, and that between this error 00:29:55.930 --> 00:29:58.090 align:middle line:84% and that there was a paradigm shift. 00:29:58.090 --> 00:30:00.400 align:middle line:84% And the paradigm shift was like that. 00:30:00.400 --> 00:30:03.960 align:middle line:90% 00:30:03.960 --> 00:30:06.780 align:middle line:84% And this stuff is very interesting. 00:30:06.780 --> 00:30:08.940 align:middle line:84% We look at it, and everybody agrees 00:30:08.940 --> 00:30:10.230 align:middle line:90% that this, in fact, is a cube. 00:30:10.230 --> 00:30:11.980 align:middle line:84% I don't care how many people you get. 00:30:11.980 --> 00:30:13.563 align:middle line:84% I mean, you ask them what do they see, 00:30:13.563 --> 00:30:16.530 align:middle line:84% and everybody will agree that it's a cute. 00:30:16.530 --> 00:30:19.290 align:middle line:90% Just think about. 00:30:19.290 --> 00:30:23.160 align:middle line:90% And this is what Hanson does. 00:30:23.160 --> 00:30:24.450 align:middle line:90% He says, just think about it. 00:30:24.450 --> 00:30:26.670 align:middle line:90% I asked you what did you see? 00:30:26.670 --> 00:30:29.115 align:middle line:84% I didn't ask you what this represents. 00:30:29.115 --> 00:30:31.950 align:middle line:84% I asked you, what do you actually see? 00:30:31.950 --> 00:30:34.158 align:middle line:90% Everybody says, "a cube." 00:30:34.158 --> 00:30:34.825 align:middle line:90% it's not a cube. 00:30:34.825 --> 00:30:37.660 align:middle line:90% 00:30:37.660 --> 00:30:41.260 align:middle line:90% It's 12 lines on a flat surface. 00:30:41.260 --> 00:30:44.410 align:middle line:84% Actually, what your brain sees is not even a line, 00:30:44.410 --> 00:30:46.370 align:middle line:90% it's a bitmap. 00:30:46.370 --> 00:30:49.670 align:middle line:84% You've got white dots and black dots in there. 00:30:49.670 --> 00:30:53.030 align:middle line:84% So your brain is doing all of this work 00:30:53.030 --> 00:30:57.650 align:middle line:84% to organize what you experience so that you can understand it, 00:30:57.650 --> 00:31:00.877 align:middle line:84% so you can get meaning out of it. 00:31:00.877 --> 00:31:02.585 align:middle line:84% Well, basically, this is not even a cube. 00:31:02.585 --> 00:31:09.010 align:middle line:90% 00:31:09.010 --> 00:31:12.550 align:middle line:84% Now, there's an artist that deals with this issue. 00:31:12.550 --> 00:31:19.470 align:middle line:90% 00:31:19.470 --> 00:31:22.270 align:middle line:84% Now I'm going to tell you who this artist is. 00:31:22.270 --> 00:31:28.520 align:middle line:84% And I'm going to tell you that only one or two 00:31:28.520 --> 00:31:32.070 align:middle line:84% pieces of his work come through to me, 00:31:32.070 --> 00:31:33.300 align:middle line:90% but maybe you see Mondrian. 00:31:33.300 --> 00:31:40.400 align:middle line:90% 00:31:40.400 --> 00:31:44.090 align:middle line:84% Because Mondrian knows how to draw and color a Necker 00:31:44.090 --> 00:31:57.020 align:middle line:84% cube so that looks flat, whereas Picasso can use 6 to 10 of them 00:31:57.020 --> 00:31:57.785 align:middle line:90% to draw your face. 00:31:57.785 --> 00:32:07.483 align:middle line:90% 00:32:07.483 --> 00:32:08.477 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: [INAUDIBLE]? 00:32:08.477 --> 00:32:16.960 align:middle line:90% 00:32:16.960 --> 00:32:18.780 align:middle line:90% Completely different? 00:32:18.780 --> 00:32:22.510 align:middle line:84% And they always use the example, if you're on a train moving, 00:32:22.510 --> 00:32:24.510 align:middle line:84% and you throw a ball in the air, it looks to you 00:32:24.510 --> 00:32:26.718 align:middle line:84% like it goes straight up and down when actually, it's 00:32:26.718 --> 00:32:29.390 align:middle line:84% taking the shape of a parabola, like in a different 00:32:29.390 --> 00:32:31.070 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE]. 00:32:31.070 --> 00:32:32.160 align:middle line:90% TAFT BROOME: Right. 00:32:32.160 --> 00:32:33.830 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: So I think a lot about that, 00:32:33.830 --> 00:32:38.700 align:middle line:84% what is [INAUDIBLE] if it's real to you that it goes straight up 00:32:38.700 --> 00:32:41.102 align:middle line:84% and down, for me looking at it from a distance-- 00:32:41.102 --> 00:32:45.040 align:middle line:90% 00:32:45.040 --> 00:32:47.290 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Well, that's the kind of thinking that we 00:32:47.290 --> 00:32:48.340 align:middle line:90% need to do in this class-- 00:32:48.340 --> 00:32:50.090 align:middle line:84% I mean, not that we haven't been doing it. 00:32:50.090 --> 00:32:55.860 align:middle line:90% But what is truth? 00:32:55.860 --> 00:32:57.383 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: [INAUDIBLE]. 00:32:57.383 --> 00:32:59.050 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Well, let's play with that. 00:32:59.050 --> 00:33:02.260 align:middle line:90% What do you mean absolute? 00:33:02.260 --> 00:33:06.985 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: Is there one universal truth for everyone? 00:33:06.985 --> 00:33:08.860 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: What does the word "truth" mean? 00:33:08.860 --> 00:33:11.860 align:middle line:90% 00:33:11.860 --> 00:33:12.430 align:middle line:90% All right. 00:33:12.430 --> 00:33:15.460 align:middle line:90% 00:33:15.460 --> 00:33:21.180 align:middle line:84% Well, Aristotle played around with that question. 00:33:21.180 --> 00:33:26.010 align:middle line:84% Plato did, too, and they went very far. 00:33:26.010 --> 00:33:28.840 align:middle line:90% They went at least-- 00:33:28.840 --> 00:33:32.230 align:middle line:84% accomplished 50% of the question. 00:33:32.230 --> 00:33:35.290 align:middle line:84% And the rest of us have accomplished, added to that. 00:33:35.290 --> 00:33:39.010 align:middle line:90% Maybe we're at 90%, 95%. 00:33:39.010 --> 00:33:40.150 align:middle line:90% Let's speculate on that. 00:33:40.150 --> 00:33:42.750 align:middle line:90% 00:33:42.750 --> 00:33:44.310 align:middle line:90% What do we mean by that? 00:33:44.310 --> 00:33:48.697 align:middle line:90% Plato said one thing about it. 00:33:48.697 --> 00:33:49.530 align:middle line:90% You want me to talk? 00:33:49.530 --> 00:33:51.513 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: I want you to talk. 00:33:51.513 --> 00:33:52.180 align:middle line:90% TAFT BROOME: OK. 00:33:52.180 --> 00:33:58.370 align:middle line:84% [INAUDIBLE] Plato said-- we're talking about what is truth. 00:33:58.370 --> 00:34:00.790 align:middle line:84% And I don't consider that a diversion. 00:34:00.790 --> 00:34:05.030 align:middle line:84% I wanted to talk about codes of ethics today. 00:34:05.030 --> 00:34:06.820 align:middle line:84% Frankly, the question of what is truth 00:34:06.820 --> 00:34:10.172 align:middle line:84% is more interesting than codes of ethics. 00:34:10.172 --> 00:34:11.380 align:middle line:90% But I'm looking at the clock. 00:34:11.380 --> 00:34:13.310 align:middle line:90% We've got time. 00:34:13.310 --> 00:34:14.020 align:middle line:90% We've got time. 00:34:14.020 --> 00:34:18.250 align:middle line:84% This is what a philosophy class is supposed to be-- 00:34:18.250 --> 00:34:20.290 align:middle line:90% supposed to be 75% ad hoc. 00:34:20.290 --> 00:34:23.250 align:middle line:90% 00:34:23.250 --> 00:34:25.335 align:middle line:84% I wouldn't say that about a math class. 00:34:25.335 --> 00:34:29.100 align:middle line:90% 00:34:29.100 --> 00:34:34.210 align:middle line:84% OK, let me start talking, but I want you all 00:34:34.210 --> 00:34:42.090 align:middle line:84% to take over the conversation if you can get to it. 00:34:42.090 --> 00:34:43.230 align:middle line:90% Let me start with Plato. 00:34:43.230 --> 00:34:49.100 align:middle line:84% Plato said, well, let's not talk about truth first. 00:34:49.100 --> 00:34:52.280 align:middle line:84% Let's talk about something else first. 00:34:52.280 --> 00:34:53.420 align:middle line:90% Let's talk about knowledge. 00:34:53.420 --> 00:34:54.560 align:middle line:90% What is knowledge? 00:34:54.560 --> 00:34:59.510 align:middle line:90% 00:34:59.510 --> 00:35:07.020 align:middle line:84% And Plato said, well, knowledge is a statement-- that is, 00:35:07.020 --> 00:35:12.190 align:middle line:84% a sentence that's either true or false, 00:35:12.190 --> 00:35:17.220 align:middle line:84% and that there are two kinds of knowledge, statements. 00:35:17.220 --> 00:35:28.960 align:middle line:84% One is a statement that agrees with other knowledge statements 00:35:28.960 --> 00:35:31.300 align:middle line:84% according to the rules of logic and reason. 00:35:31.300 --> 00:35:39.250 align:middle line:90% 00:35:39.250 --> 00:35:43.730 align:middle line:84% And that's called rational knowledge. 00:35:43.730 --> 00:35:48.710 align:middle line:84% The other one is a statement that agrees 00:35:48.710 --> 00:35:51.170 align:middle line:90% with observation or experience. 00:35:51.170 --> 00:35:53.940 align:middle line:84% I'll put observation, but I don't mean just the eye. 00:35:53.940 --> 00:35:55.190 align:middle line:90% I mean all of the five senses. 00:35:55.190 --> 00:36:02.260 align:middle line:90% 00:36:02.260 --> 00:36:05.790 align:middle line:84% So there's a cup of coffee on the table. 00:36:05.790 --> 00:36:07.123 align:middle line:90% That's a statement of knowledge. 00:36:07.123 --> 00:36:11.760 align:middle line:90% 00:36:11.760 --> 00:36:13.427 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: Isn't that a statement of fact? 00:36:13.427 --> 00:36:15.718 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: No, it's the same thing as a [INAUDIBLE].. 00:36:15.718 --> 00:36:17.640 align:middle line:90% It's an observation of a fact. 00:36:17.640 --> 00:36:21.200 align:middle line:84% It's a statement that describes an observation of a fact, 00:36:21.200 --> 00:36:26.300 align:middle line:84% or it is a fact because it is information 00:36:26.300 --> 00:36:29.390 align:middle line:84% that is coming to my brain of the type 00:36:29.390 --> 00:36:31.220 align:middle line:90% that I call sensory information. 00:36:31.220 --> 00:36:34.650 align:middle line:90% 00:36:34.650 --> 00:36:36.440 align:middle line:84% And then what I would speculate on 00:36:36.440 --> 00:36:38.960 align:middle line:84% is that that sensory information comes 00:36:38.960 --> 00:36:44.720 align:middle line:84% from someplace outside of the mind, call it "real world." 00:36:44.720 --> 00:36:47.500 align:middle line:90% 00:36:47.500 --> 00:36:50.680 align:middle line:90% So a knowledge statement-- 00:36:50.680 --> 00:36:53.110 align:middle line:84% well, you might come along and say, 00:36:53.110 --> 00:36:55.440 align:middle line:90% I said this was a cup of coffee. 00:36:55.440 --> 00:36:56.057 align:middle line:90% I analyze it. 00:36:56.057 --> 00:36:57.640 align:middle line:84% There's some coffee in it, but there's 00:36:57.640 --> 00:36:59.920 align:middle line:90% really strychnine in there. 00:36:59.920 --> 00:37:04.000 align:middle line:84% Pretty soon, [INAUDIBLE] the room. 00:37:04.000 --> 00:37:08.600 align:middle line:84% So Plato doesn't have any problems with that. 00:37:08.600 --> 00:37:14.450 align:middle line:84% Plato says that you can improve upon your knowledge statements, 00:37:14.450 --> 00:37:23.100 align:middle line:84% and in the limit, you get the truth. 00:37:23.100 --> 00:37:29.900 align:middle line:84% That's why Plato was very happy to say we pursue the truth, 00:37:29.900 --> 00:37:33.770 align:middle line:90% but we make knowledge claims. 00:37:33.770 --> 00:37:40.370 align:middle line:84% You do the same thing when it comes to value judgments. 00:37:40.370 --> 00:37:43.490 align:middle line:84% You make a value judgment and in the limit, you get the good. 00:37:43.490 --> 00:37:48.210 align:middle line:90% 00:37:48.210 --> 00:37:53.990 align:middle line:84% So now, this is called rational knowledge, 00:37:53.990 --> 00:38:06.810 align:middle line:84% and this is called empirical knowledge. 00:38:06.810 --> 00:38:12.380 align:middle line:84% You can also say values, value judgments, and get the good. 00:38:12.380 --> 00:38:16.790 align:middle line:90% 00:38:16.790 --> 00:38:24.370 align:middle line:84% And then Plato says that if you put these two together, 00:38:24.370 --> 00:38:35.020 align:middle line:84% and imagine that this limit does exist, what do you think Plato 00:38:35.020 --> 00:38:38.778 align:middle line:84% or what do you think pretty much 90% of the philosophers that 00:38:38.778 --> 00:38:40.570 align:middle line:84% are out here-- what do you think they would 00:38:40.570 --> 00:38:43.975 align:middle line:90% call the truth and the good? 00:38:43.975 --> 00:38:48.600 align:middle line:90% 00:38:48.600 --> 00:38:53.010 align:middle line:84% If there's something out there that is perfect-- 00:38:53.010 --> 00:38:55.500 align:middle line:90% yes, that's Plato's theology. 00:38:55.500 --> 00:38:58.240 align:middle line:90% He calls this God. 00:38:58.240 --> 00:39:00.540 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: [INAUDIBLE] in there somewhere, too? 00:39:00.540 --> 00:39:03.510 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Values, that's aesthetic value. 00:39:03.510 --> 00:39:11.891 align:middle line:90% 00:39:11.891 --> 00:39:16.155 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: I have a question about rational knowledge. 00:39:16.155 --> 00:39:28.490 align:middle line:84% So rational knowledge, we said, agrees with other [INAUDIBLE].. 00:39:28.490 --> 00:39:31.250 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Well, it's hard to put in words. 00:39:31.250 --> 00:39:33.920 align:middle line:84% Let me give you a starting point. 00:39:33.920 --> 00:39:37.110 align:middle line:84% Mathematics is rational knowledge. 00:39:37.110 --> 00:39:41.910 align:middle line:84% It makes no reference to experience or to objects. 00:39:41.910 --> 00:39:45.090 align:middle line:90% 00:39:45.090 --> 00:39:45.900 align:middle line:90% You ready for this? 00:39:45.900 --> 00:39:50.540 align:middle line:90% 00:39:50.540 --> 00:39:53.630 align:middle line:90% Can you see this up at the top? 00:39:53.630 --> 00:39:54.777 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: [INAUDIBLE]. 00:39:54.777 --> 00:39:56.110 align:middle line:90% TAFT BROOME: I'll tell you what. 00:39:56.110 --> 00:40:03.082 align:middle line:90% 00:40:03.082 --> 00:40:04.400 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: That's good. 00:40:04.400 --> 00:40:06.705 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] my mind [INAUDIBLE]. 00:40:06.705 --> 00:40:11.610 align:middle line:90% 00:40:11.610 --> 00:40:18.612 align:middle line:84% So like math, saying that the derivative of the natural log 00:40:18.612 --> 00:40:27.040 align:middle line:84% is whatever it is, is knowledge, but it makes no sense 00:40:27.040 --> 00:40:30.573 align:middle line:84% unless you know what "derivative" means 00:40:30.573 --> 00:40:31.740 align:middle line:90% or what "natural log" means. 00:40:31.740 --> 00:40:33.720 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: You've got definitions. 00:40:33.720 --> 00:40:36.610 align:middle line:90% Start with definitions. 00:40:36.610 --> 00:40:38.518 align:middle line:90% You've got symbols. 00:40:38.518 --> 00:40:40.310 align:middle line:84% You've got rules for putting them together. 00:40:40.310 --> 00:40:43.580 align:middle line:90% You call that syntax. 00:40:43.580 --> 00:40:48.800 align:middle line:84% And then you have rules for deducing other symbols. 00:40:48.800 --> 00:40:50.460 align:middle line:90% You call that semantics. 00:40:50.460 --> 00:40:53.660 align:middle line:84% So now we're talking about deducing a theorem 00:40:53.660 --> 00:40:56.750 align:middle line:90% from an axiom. 00:40:56.750 --> 00:40:59.390 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: [INAUDIBLE] but it's not-- it can't just be 00:40:59.390 --> 00:41:00.800 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE]. 00:41:00.800 --> 00:41:04.250 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Right, or I'm going to be a little bit more-- 00:41:04.250 --> 00:41:05.540 align:middle line:90% it is not empirical. 00:41:05.540 --> 00:41:08.350 align:middle line:90% 00:41:08.350 --> 00:41:10.750 align:middle line:84% I don't want to say that it can or possibly. 00:41:10.750 --> 00:41:12.070 align:middle line:90% We throw that all out. 00:41:12.070 --> 00:41:16.756 align:middle line:84% It's all mental, and it's all reason. 00:41:16.756 --> 00:41:19.588 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: I also think of Einstein's paper [INAUDIBLE]?? 00:41:19.588 --> 00:41:22.420 align:middle line:90% 00:41:22.420 --> 00:41:24.190 align:middle line:84% He talks about Euclidean geometry, 00:41:24.190 --> 00:41:26.680 align:middle line:84% and how you talk about a lot [INAUDIBLE] exists. 00:41:26.680 --> 00:41:27.964 align:middle line:90% Can you observe a line? 00:41:27.964 --> 00:41:29.428 align:middle line:90% Because it's infinitely small-- 00:41:29.428 --> 00:41:30.220 align:middle line:90% TAFT BROOME: Right. 00:41:30.220 --> 00:41:31.130 align:middle line:90% [INTERPOSING VOICES] 00:41:31.130 --> 00:41:33.115 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: So it's not something that you can really observe. 00:41:33.115 --> 00:41:34.703 align:middle line:90% And a point is the same thing. 00:41:34.703 --> 00:41:37.912 align:middle line:84% You can't really observe, empirically measure a point. 00:41:37.912 --> 00:41:40.173 align:middle line:84% It doesn't really exist [INAUDIBLE].. 00:41:40.173 --> 00:41:45.678 align:middle line:90% 00:41:45.678 --> 00:41:46.470 align:middle line:90% TAFT BROOME: Right. 00:41:46.470 --> 00:41:48.330 align:middle line:84% I could put a rock here, and then 00:41:48.330 --> 00:41:51.930 align:middle line:84% a smaller rock, and a smaller one, and a smaller one. 00:41:51.930 --> 00:41:56.520 align:middle line:84% We could even go down to an atomic particle, 00:41:56.520 --> 00:41:57.290 align:middle line:90% and keep going. 00:41:57.290 --> 00:41:58.950 align:middle line:90% We still haven't got a point. 00:41:58.950 --> 00:42:01.575 align:middle line:84% But we can still talk about a point. 00:42:01.575 --> 00:42:02.200 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: Right. 00:42:02.200 --> 00:42:03.850 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] 00:42:03.850 --> 00:42:05.350 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: And all kinds of stuff. 00:42:05.350 --> 00:42:08.188 align:middle line:90% 00:42:08.188 --> 00:42:08.730 align:middle line:90% That's right. 00:42:08.730 --> 00:42:12.670 align:middle line:90% 00:42:12.670 --> 00:42:15.970 align:middle line:84% So what Kant wanted to do is take that kind of thinking out 00:42:15.970 --> 00:42:20.200 align:middle line:84% of the scientific realm, and say, 00:42:20.200 --> 00:42:26.670 align:middle line:84% I want to base a value judgment strictly off 00:42:26.670 --> 00:42:30.630 align:middle line:84% of the rational process, strictly mental. 00:42:30.630 --> 00:42:35.700 align:middle line:84% And Mill said, I want to make a rational judgment strictly out 00:42:35.700 --> 00:42:41.380 align:middle line:84% of the empirical thinking-- knowledge, statements. 00:42:41.380 --> 00:42:43.170 align:middle line:84% So they took all of this stuff and put it 00:42:43.170 --> 00:42:44.280 align:middle line:90% into the value domain. 00:42:44.280 --> 00:42:49.190 align:middle line:90% 00:42:49.190 --> 00:42:53.410 align:middle line:84% Now, let's talk some more about empirical knowledge. 00:42:53.410 --> 00:43:04.130 align:middle line:90% 00:43:04.130 --> 00:43:06.200 align:middle line:90% Let's talk some more. 00:43:06.200 --> 00:43:15.600 align:middle line:84% There is a genre of story that all start the same way. 00:43:15.600 --> 00:43:21.065 align:middle line:84% They end slightly differently, but they all start the same, 00:43:21.065 --> 00:43:22.440 align:middle line:84% and we can get a lot out of this. 00:43:22.440 --> 00:43:25.850 align:middle line:90% 00:43:25.850 --> 00:43:30.340 align:middle line:90% You're driving along someplace. 00:43:30.340 --> 00:43:35.940 align:middle line:84% Look down, something looks funny about your car 00:43:35.940 --> 00:43:39.330 align:middle line:84% or for whatever reason, you get off 95, the main highway. 00:43:39.330 --> 00:43:43.290 align:middle line:84% You get on some little road, going down this little road. 00:43:43.290 --> 00:43:49.817 align:middle line:84% And then there are no houses, no gas stations, just driving down 00:43:49.817 --> 00:43:50.525 align:middle line:90% this little road. 00:43:50.525 --> 00:43:54.018 align:middle line:84% It's getting dark, the car stops, 00:43:54.018 --> 00:43:56.060 align:middle line:84% and the road comes to an end, and there's nothing 00:43:56.060 --> 00:43:59.030 align:middle line:90% there but the woods. 00:43:59.030 --> 00:44:02.300 align:middle line:84% And for some reason, you decide to get out of your car 00:44:02.300 --> 00:44:03.440 align:middle line:90% and walk through the woods. 00:44:03.440 --> 00:44:07.760 align:middle line:84% You've got to run into something-- shopping center. 00:44:07.760 --> 00:44:09.260 align:middle line:90% You run into a monastery. 00:44:09.260 --> 00:44:12.100 align:middle line:90% 00:44:12.100 --> 00:44:16.290 align:middle line:84% And you knock on the door, and hear a voice 00:44:16.290 --> 00:44:19.140 align:middle line:84% on the other side talking to you. 00:44:19.140 --> 00:44:22.490 align:middle line:84% And there's a little window in the door, a little window where 00:44:22.490 --> 00:44:24.150 align:middle line:90% you can basically pass. 00:44:24.150 --> 00:44:28.780 align:middle line:84% And everybody can speak the same English. 00:44:28.780 --> 00:44:31.470 align:middle line:90% 00:44:31.470 --> 00:44:33.900 align:middle line:84% Now, all of the stories start the same way. 00:44:33.900 --> 00:44:36.060 align:middle line:90% I'm going to tell two of them. 00:44:36.060 --> 00:44:39.420 align:middle line:90% 00:44:39.420 --> 00:44:45.058 align:middle line:84% Now, one of them is that they tell you to go away at first. 00:44:45.058 --> 00:44:47.100 align:middle line:84% You say you're hungry, you need a place to sleep. 00:44:47.100 --> 00:44:48.360 align:middle line:90% And they tell you to go away. 00:44:48.360 --> 00:44:51.840 align:middle line:84% You keep knocking on and banging on the door. 00:44:51.840 --> 00:45:00.090 align:middle line:84% And all of a sudden, that little window falls open by itself. 00:45:00.090 --> 00:45:01.660 align:middle line:84% Nobody opened it, it just falls open, 00:45:01.660 --> 00:45:02.743 align:middle line:90% and you get a peek inside. 00:45:02.743 --> 00:45:05.410 align:middle line:90% 00:45:05.410 --> 00:45:14.150 align:middle line:84% And you look in there, and everything is yellow-- 00:45:14.150 --> 00:45:22.190 align:middle line:84% floor, walls, the ceiling, chairs, the desk, their food, 00:45:22.190 --> 00:45:25.430 align:middle line:84% their skin, their eyes, their hair. 00:45:25.430 --> 00:45:26.945 align:middle line:90% Everything is yellow. 00:45:26.945 --> 00:45:30.870 align:middle line:90% 00:45:30.870 --> 00:45:32.340 align:middle line:90% Everything is yellow. 00:45:32.340 --> 00:45:35.040 align:middle line:90% 00:45:35.040 --> 00:45:39.040 align:middle line:84% Then you say, why is everything yellow? 00:45:39.040 --> 00:45:42.683 align:middle line:84% They don't have the word "yellow" in their vocabulary. 00:45:42.683 --> 00:45:46.850 align:middle line:90% 00:45:46.850 --> 00:45:50.240 align:middle line:84% Then you reach in your hand, and let's say 00:45:50.240 --> 00:45:52.200 align:middle line:84% you had a pen that had red ink in it. 00:45:52.200 --> 00:45:54.620 align:middle line:84% So you squirt some red ink in there. 00:45:54.620 --> 00:45:57.530 align:middle line:84% All of a sudden, two words comes into their vocabulary 00:45:57.530 --> 00:45:59.330 align:middle line:84% at the same time-- "red" and "yellow." 00:45:59.330 --> 00:46:04.710 align:middle line:90% 00:46:04.710 --> 00:46:06.690 align:middle line:84% Then they get to talk, and then they 00:46:06.690 --> 00:46:09.090 align:middle line:84% find the word "color" to account for both of them, 00:46:09.090 --> 00:46:11.490 align:middle line:84% and to distinguish color from other things. 00:46:11.490 --> 00:46:14.820 align:middle line:84% But they had yellow in front of them all along, 00:46:14.820 --> 00:46:16.470 align:middle line:90% but they couldn't see it. 00:46:16.470 --> 00:46:21.407 align:middle line:84% Or they could see it, couldn't distinguish it. 00:46:21.407 --> 00:46:23.490 align:middle line:84% Only when that got that other color in there could 00:46:23.490 --> 00:46:24.323 align:middle line:90% they distinguish it. 00:46:24.323 --> 00:46:27.360 align:middle line:84% But then red and yellow come in their language 00:46:27.360 --> 00:46:28.320 align:middle line:90% at the same time. 00:46:28.320 --> 00:46:32.980 align:middle line:90% 00:46:32.980 --> 00:46:35.860 align:middle line:84% So now, that's what Kuhn is talking about when 00:46:35.860 --> 00:46:39.190 align:middle line:90% he says a new paradigm. 00:46:39.190 --> 00:46:41.690 align:middle line:84% He's not saying that somebody is going to show you something 00:46:41.690 --> 00:46:44.040 align:middle line:90% that you've never seen before. 00:46:44.040 --> 00:46:47.600 align:middle line:84% What he's going to say is you're going to say, 00:46:47.600 --> 00:46:51.200 align:middle line:84% I don't know what word to use about my experience 00:46:51.200 --> 00:46:51.980 align:middle line:90% with this thing. 00:46:51.980 --> 00:46:59.490 align:middle line:84% It was here all along, but did I see it? 00:46:59.490 --> 00:46:59.990 align:middle line:90% No. 00:46:59.990 --> 00:47:01.907 align:middle line:84% Then you have to find a lot of different words 00:47:01.907 --> 00:47:04.130 align:middle line:90% to describe what you did see. 00:47:04.130 --> 00:47:05.805 align:middle line:90% And you still won't. 00:47:05.805 --> 00:47:07.430 align:middle line:84% And you'll wind up speaking with people 00:47:07.430 --> 00:47:09.175 align:middle line:90% call "tongues," very abstract. 00:47:09.175 --> 00:47:11.300 align:middle line:84% It's only when the other one came in there that you 00:47:11.300 --> 00:47:12.258 align:middle line:90% could see both of them. 00:47:12.258 --> 00:47:20.280 align:middle line:90% 00:47:20.280 --> 00:47:23.310 align:middle line:90% Now let's get to Einstein-- 00:47:23.310 --> 00:47:26.250 align:middle line:90% same story. 00:47:26.250 --> 00:47:28.500 align:middle line:90% You're at the monastery. 00:47:28.500 --> 00:47:31.710 align:middle line:90% The monks won't let you in. 00:47:31.710 --> 00:47:34.730 align:middle line:90% The door opens up. 00:47:34.730 --> 00:47:41.170 align:middle line:84% This time, you look in there and all of the monks are blind. 00:47:41.170 --> 00:47:45.980 align:middle line:90% 00:47:45.980 --> 00:47:48.590 align:middle line:84% You don't ask them a question about generations. 00:47:48.590 --> 00:47:51.230 align:middle line:90% 00:47:51.230 --> 00:47:52.462 align:middle line:90% They've always been blind. 00:47:52.462 --> 00:47:53.420 align:middle line:90% Everybody's been blind. 00:47:53.420 --> 00:47:56.160 align:middle line:90% 00:47:56.160 --> 00:48:04.710 align:middle line:84% So what you do is you finally talk them into letting you in. 00:48:04.710 --> 00:48:08.780 align:middle line:84% And when you get in there, you find 00:48:08.780 --> 00:48:12.425 align:middle line:84% that there's a rack in a closet, a rack of t-shirts. 00:48:12.425 --> 00:48:16.300 align:middle line:90% 00:48:16.300 --> 00:48:22.200 align:middle line:84% Now, all of the t-shirts are the same size, smell the same way, 00:48:22.200 --> 00:48:24.810 align:middle line:90% made out of the same material. 00:48:24.810 --> 00:48:26.970 align:middle line:84% They are all the same except that they 00:48:26.970 --> 00:48:29.220 align:middle line:84% have different colors, but the blind man can't see it. 00:48:29.220 --> 00:48:32.750 align:middle line:90% 00:48:32.750 --> 00:48:35.488 align:middle line:84% The blind man cannot distinguish one from the other. 00:48:35.488 --> 00:48:36.280 align:middle line:90% He's sitting there. 00:48:36.280 --> 00:48:38.447 align:middle line:84% He knows he pulls out one, and they're all the same. 00:48:38.447 --> 00:48:41.430 align:middle line:90% 00:48:41.430 --> 00:48:47.490 align:middle line:84% You can tell that half of them are dark red and the other half 00:48:47.490 --> 00:48:48.030 align:middle line:90% are white. 00:48:48.030 --> 00:48:50.630 align:middle line:90% 00:48:50.630 --> 00:48:54.560 align:middle line:84% They can't see it, but there's one thing the blind men know, 00:48:54.560 --> 00:49:00.260 align:middle line:84% and that is that when they put on some t-shirts 00:49:00.260 --> 00:49:02.030 align:middle line:84% and sit out in the sun, they get warm. 00:49:02.030 --> 00:49:04.295 align:middle line:84% And when they put on other t-shirts, 00:49:04.295 --> 00:49:06.420 align:middle line:84% they sit out under the sun and they don't get warm. 00:49:06.420 --> 00:49:09.250 align:middle line:90% They stay a little bit cool. 00:49:09.250 --> 00:49:12.578 align:middle line:84% You go in there and say, well, wear the red ones 00:49:12.578 --> 00:49:14.620 align:middle line:84% when you want to get warm and wear the white ones 00:49:14.620 --> 00:49:15.703 align:middle line:90% when you want to get cool. 00:49:15.703 --> 00:49:18.310 align:middle line:84% They don't know what you're talking about. 00:49:18.310 --> 00:49:21.850 align:middle line:84% Einstein calls that "hyperspace," 00:49:21.850 --> 00:49:27.070 align:middle line:90% says that we have five senses. 00:49:27.070 --> 00:49:31.940 align:middle line:84% If we had a sixth one, we could perceive other things. 00:49:31.940 --> 00:49:34.250 align:middle line:84% With our five senses, we can still 00:49:34.250 --> 00:49:37.820 align:middle line:84% perceive some of those things, but their behaviors 00:49:37.820 --> 00:49:43.200 align:middle line:84% don't fit in the patterns, like these traces of particles 00:49:43.200 --> 00:49:45.620 align:middle line:84% they see, these particle physicists 00:49:45.620 --> 00:49:47.630 align:middle line:90% see even to this day. 00:49:47.630 --> 00:49:49.730 align:middle line:84% They know that they're there, but they 00:49:49.730 --> 00:49:55.010 align:middle line:84% don't behave according to Newton's laws, 00:49:55.010 --> 00:49:57.830 align:middle line:84% to Einstein's special theory of relativity. 00:49:57.830 --> 00:50:01.160 align:middle line:84% As a matter of fact, there's no pattern that you can see. 00:50:01.160 --> 00:50:03.680 align:middle line:84% And so what they say is that a pattern 00:50:03.680 --> 00:50:06.350 align:middle line:84% would exist if some alien came down 00:50:06.350 --> 00:50:11.760 align:middle line:84% here with a sixth sense who could perceive something 00:50:11.760 --> 00:50:12.510 align:middle line:90% like that. 00:50:12.510 --> 00:50:14.190 align:middle line:90% We don't have the sixth sense. 00:50:14.190 --> 00:50:18.940 align:middle line:84% We know that this thing is behaving like this. 00:50:18.940 --> 00:50:22.950 align:middle line:84% So here's what Einstein and these physicists try to do-- 00:50:22.950 --> 00:50:28.140 align:middle line:84% what they try to do is write a position vector, 00:50:28.140 --> 00:50:33.150 align:middle line:84% not just in x, y, z, and say that these are dependent 00:50:33.150 --> 00:50:36.450 align:middle line:84% variables, and they're all dependent on time. 00:50:36.450 --> 00:50:43.020 align:middle line:84% Einstein comes back and says, let's put in alpha, 00:50:43.020 --> 00:50:46.560 align:middle line:84% call it the fourth dimension, do our arithmetic, 00:50:46.560 --> 00:50:50.070 align:middle line:84% and we will be able to account for that behavior 00:50:50.070 --> 00:50:51.870 align:middle line:84% even though we don't belong or can't 00:50:51.870 --> 00:50:54.060 align:middle line:84% sense the rest of this hyperspace, 00:50:54.060 --> 00:50:57.930 align:middle line:84% just like the blind men can account 00:50:57.930 --> 00:51:03.530 align:middle line:84% for the difference in t-shirts by going out in the sun, 00:51:03.530 --> 00:51:07.580 align:middle line:84% but can't see the difference or otherwise perceived it. 00:51:07.580 --> 00:51:10.920 align:middle line:90% So that's what hyperspace is. 00:51:10.920 --> 00:51:12.810 align:middle line:84% It's an attempt to account for something 00:51:12.810 --> 00:51:17.490 align:middle line:84% you can't fully perceive-- you can't perceive but you 00:51:17.490 --> 00:51:20.710 align:middle line:90% can perceive the effects. 00:51:20.710 --> 00:51:24.210 align:middle line:84% So what you say is that in order to understand this position 00:51:24.210 --> 00:51:29.710 align:middle line:84% vector, you have to speculate another dimension. 00:51:29.710 --> 00:51:34.310 align:middle line:84% And if you do your math right, you'll get right answers. 00:51:34.310 --> 00:51:36.020 align:middle line:84% Better stated, you will find a pattern. 00:51:36.020 --> 00:51:38.800 align:middle line:90% 00:51:38.800 --> 00:51:41.830 align:middle line:84% And then you use this alpha to fit in so 00:51:41.830 --> 00:51:44.240 align:middle line:90% that you fit into the pattern. 00:51:44.240 --> 00:51:51.590 align:middle line:84% And if that has a predictive quality, then you've got a law. 00:51:51.590 --> 00:51:54.890 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: [INAUDIBLE] 00:51:54.890 --> 00:51:56.830 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: You just have to live with it, 00:51:56.830 --> 00:51:59.470 align:middle line:84% like the blind men just have to live with the fact. 00:51:59.470 --> 00:52:01.757 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: [INAUDIBLE]. 00:52:01.757 --> 00:52:03.340 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: And they're not even sure 00:52:03.340 --> 00:52:07.035 align:middle line:84% before they go out which ones are. 00:52:07.035 --> 00:52:08.410 align:middle line:84% So you take two or three of them, 00:52:08.410 --> 00:52:11.630 align:middle line:84% you go out you put them on, take a chance that one of them will. 00:52:11.630 --> 00:52:13.655 align:middle line:84% But you've tied down things a bit. 00:52:13.655 --> 00:52:14.530 align:middle line:90% You've got a science. 00:52:14.530 --> 00:52:19.200 align:middle line:84% They've got a science in there, in that monastery. 00:52:19.200 --> 00:52:22.530 align:middle line:90% 00:52:22.530 --> 00:52:26.190 align:middle line:84% So that's where you get a lot of this abstract thinking coming 00:52:26.190 --> 00:52:33.390 align:middle line:84% along later, with people like Kierkegaard and Sartre. 00:52:33.390 --> 00:52:36.000 align:middle line:84% Let me see if I can get my French right. 00:52:36.000 --> 00:52:38.730 align:middle line:84% I qualified in French, but I don't count myself as a person 00:52:38.730 --> 00:52:42.030 align:middle line:84% who knows French, but "Sahrt," S-A-R-T-R-E. 00:52:42.030 --> 00:52:44.092 align:middle line:84% I feel more comfortable in saying "Sar-tre." 00:52:44.092 --> 00:52:47.190 align:middle line:90% 00:52:47.190 --> 00:52:53.040 align:middle line:84% Sartre won the Nobel Prize twice. 00:52:53.040 --> 00:52:56.160 align:middle line:84% I think he won it three times, but he turned it down one time. 00:52:56.160 --> 00:52:58.960 align:middle line:90% 00:52:58.960 --> 00:53:04.930 align:middle line:84% These are people who talk about existentialism. 00:53:04.930 --> 00:53:13.170 align:middle line:90% 00:53:13.170 --> 00:53:19.410 align:middle line:84% And if you go talk to a Zen Buddhist, 00:53:19.410 --> 00:53:21.825 align:middle line:84% he or she will talk about Nirvana. 00:53:21.825 --> 00:53:26.260 align:middle line:90% 00:53:26.260 --> 00:53:29.500 align:middle line:84% And if you talk to Einstein, or any 00:53:29.500 --> 00:53:34.780 align:middle line:84% of his intellectual descendants, he will talk about hyperspace. 00:53:34.780 --> 00:53:37.970 align:middle line:90% 00:53:37.970 --> 00:53:48.530 align:middle line:84% There's a lot of similarity in those concepts, 00:53:48.530 --> 00:53:50.360 align:middle line:84% a lot of similarity in those concepts. 00:53:50.360 --> 00:53:57.650 align:middle line:84% And there is Kierkegaard who'll talk about existentialism, 00:53:57.650 --> 00:54:02.690 align:middle line:84% and then he does the same thing that these two guys did, 00:54:02.690 --> 00:54:08.150 align:middle line:84% when they looked at knowledge and truth, values and the good, 00:54:08.150 --> 00:54:09.590 align:middle line:84% and you look at knowledge in terms 00:54:09.590 --> 00:54:11.720 align:middle line:84% of empirical knowledge and rational knowledge, 00:54:11.720 --> 00:54:15.860 align:middle line:84% these people talk about actually empirical values 00:54:15.860 --> 00:54:19.220 align:middle line:90% and rational values. 00:54:19.220 --> 00:54:21.410 align:middle line:84% So Kierkegaard comes along and says, 00:54:21.410 --> 00:54:24.110 align:middle line:90% let's stretch out hyperspace. 00:54:24.110 --> 00:54:26.930 align:middle line:84% Can we talk about good and bad in hyperspace? 00:54:26.930 --> 00:54:29.780 align:middle line:84% In other words, not just the real world, 00:54:29.780 --> 00:54:32.750 align:middle line:84% but things that you cannot totally observe but that are 00:54:32.750 --> 00:54:35.510 align:middle line:90% there anyway? 00:54:35.510 --> 00:54:38.180 align:middle line:84% And you get a lot of sympathy from that if you go over 00:54:38.180 --> 00:54:39.646 align:middle line:90% to the Art Department. 00:54:39.646 --> 00:54:42.492 align:middle line:90% 00:54:42.492 --> 00:54:44.450 align:middle line:84% You don't have to go to the School of Religion. 00:54:44.450 --> 00:54:49.460 align:middle line:84% You go to the Art Department, Ballet. 00:54:49.460 --> 00:54:51.890 align:middle line:84% They'll tell you there's a hyperspace out there. 00:54:51.890 --> 00:54:55.850 align:middle line:84% There's a hyper world out there, and that some people are 00:54:55.850 --> 00:54:58.430 align:middle line:84% in touch with it, and most of the rest of us aren't. 00:54:58.430 --> 00:55:04.300 align:middle line:90% 00:55:04.300 --> 00:55:07.480 align:middle line:84% And they don't know what it is out there, 00:55:07.480 --> 00:55:11.650 align:middle line:84% but they know when you've got it, like the monks did. 00:55:11.650 --> 00:55:15.268 align:middle line:84% They knew when you had the red shirt, 00:55:15.268 --> 00:55:18.675 align:middle line:84% but they didn't know about red and white shirts. 00:55:18.675 --> 00:55:20.050 align:middle line:84% But they know when you've got it, 00:55:20.050 --> 00:55:22.630 align:middle line:84% and those are the ones you call the geniuses. 00:55:22.630 --> 00:55:24.070 align:middle line:84% Not genius in terms of intellect, 00:55:24.070 --> 00:55:27.680 align:middle line:84% but just people who've just got it. 00:55:27.680 --> 00:55:29.950 align:middle line:84% Some people just got it, and they 00:55:29.950 --> 00:55:32.800 align:middle line:90% can touch that other world. 00:55:32.800 --> 00:55:34.405 align:middle line:84% Ancient people knew about this stuff. 00:55:34.405 --> 00:55:39.855 align:middle line:90% 00:55:39.855 --> 00:55:41.230 align:middle line:84% Tell you how they knew about it-- 00:55:41.230 --> 00:55:44.240 align:middle line:90% 00:55:44.240 --> 00:55:47.740 align:middle line:84% they knew it in a way that we call it very concrete. 00:55:47.740 --> 00:55:49.600 align:middle line:84% They knew about it in terms of consciousness 00:55:49.600 --> 00:55:50.940 align:middle line:90% and unconsciousness. 00:55:50.940 --> 00:55:54.440 align:middle line:90% 00:55:54.440 --> 00:55:56.510 align:middle line:90% They knew about the dream state. 00:55:56.510 --> 00:56:01.520 align:middle line:90% 00:56:01.520 --> 00:56:07.770 align:middle line:84% And when I say "ancient," I'm talking about beyond way back. 00:56:07.770 --> 00:56:16.350 align:middle line:84% I'm talking about 10,000 years ago. 00:56:16.350 --> 00:56:18.870 align:middle line:84% I'm talking about even probably before that, 00:56:18.870 --> 00:56:24.110 align:middle line:84% but when human beings began to have dreams. 00:56:24.110 --> 00:56:26.630 align:middle line:84% They say some animals have dreams-- 00:56:26.630 --> 00:56:27.560 align:middle line:90% dogs. 00:56:27.560 --> 00:56:30.760 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: Wait, they know a particular point in time when 00:56:30.760 --> 00:56:32.760 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE]? 00:56:32.760 --> 00:56:34.800 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: I don't know, but they speculate-- 00:56:34.800 --> 00:56:37.880 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: [INAUDIBLE] first start recording. 00:56:37.880 --> 00:56:43.490 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: They know when dreams became a factor 00:56:43.490 --> 00:56:46.850 align:middle line:90% in your daily life. 00:56:46.850 --> 00:56:48.380 align:middle line:84% They know that, because they were 00:56:48.380 --> 00:56:54.320 align:middle line:84% able to see what we call religious artifacts and burial. 00:56:54.320 --> 00:56:58.760 align:middle line:84% I think burial was what the cultural archaeologists say 00:56:58.760 --> 00:57:05.940 align:middle line:84% is the first, then cave drawings on walls, art, but burial-- 00:57:05.940 --> 00:57:13.140 align:middle line:84% the notion that somebody deserves some kind of ceremony 00:57:13.140 --> 00:57:15.540 align:middle line:84% after they died, and have to be buried, 00:57:15.540 --> 00:57:18.030 align:middle line:84% and something goes into the grave with them 00:57:18.030 --> 00:57:20.970 align:middle line:84% to notice the notion that there is another world. 00:57:20.970 --> 00:57:22.590 align:middle line:84% And the other world that they thought 00:57:22.590 --> 00:57:26.190 align:middle line:84% was that you are just going to the dream state, 00:57:26.190 --> 00:57:30.880 align:middle line:84% and you'll never get out of it now, 00:57:30.880 --> 00:57:32.410 align:middle line:84% and that the dream state was just 00:57:32.410 --> 00:57:36.700 align:middle line:90% as valid as a conscious state. 00:57:36.700 --> 00:57:41.380 align:middle line:84% The price we pay for saying that the dream state is not 00:57:41.380 --> 00:57:46.390 align:middle line:84% worth anything unless you've got a real mental problem-- 00:57:46.390 --> 00:57:49.420 align:middle line:84% the price we pay for that is that we forget the obvious, 00:57:49.420 --> 00:57:53.920 align:middle line:84% and that is that our conscious minds can't be entirely trusted 00:57:53.920 --> 00:57:56.170 align:middle line:84% because there are a lot of truths that are in our mind 00:57:56.170 --> 00:57:58.045 align:middle line:84% that our conscious minds do not want to face. 00:57:58.045 --> 00:57:59.830 align:middle line:84% And we put them in our unconscious 00:57:59.830 --> 00:58:02.650 align:middle line:84% and they come out in dreams in the forms of dragons, 00:58:02.650 --> 00:58:06.050 align:middle line:90% and trolls, and all that. 00:58:06.050 --> 00:58:08.480 align:middle line:90% So there is truth down there. 00:58:08.480 --> 00:58:11.650 align:middle line:84% That's what the mythic hero has got to do. 00:58:11.650 --> 00:58:13.920 align:middle line:90% He's got to kill that dragon. 00:58:13.920 --> 00:58:14.700 align:middle line:90% That's the symbol. 00:58:14.700 --> 00:58:18.870 align:middle line:84% That is the metaphor for solving your biggest problems in life. 00:58:18.870 --> 00:58:20.610 align:middle line:84% You have to say that you've got all 00:58:20.610 --> 00:58:22.540 align:middle line:84% of the truth necessary to solve this problem. 00:58:22.540 --> 00:58:25.310 align:middle line:84% But some of it you have hidden, so you 00:58:25.310 --> 00:58:26.780 align:middle line:84% have to go down in the unconscious, 00:58:26.780 --> 00:58:31.580 align:middle line:84% get it, bring it up to consciousness, and make it fit, 00:58:31.580 --> 00:58:33.180 align:middle line:90% mostly morally. 00:58:33.180 --> 00:58:35.180 align:middle line:84% Because a lot of the things you have hidden down 00:58:35.180 --> 00:58:37.010 align:middle line:84% there don't fit because you don't 00:58:37.010 --> 00:58:40.070 align:middle line:84% want to accept the moral truth of it. 00:58:40.070 --> 00:58:43.558 align:middle line:90% Notice I said "moral truth." 00:58:43.558 --> 00:58:44.850 align:middle line:90% So there are truths down there. 00:58:44.850 --> 00:58:50.410 align:middle line:84% So what the primitive-- that's the word I'm looking for-- 00:58:50.410 --> 00:58:55.620 align:middle line:84% beyond ancient-- primitive human beings 00:58:55.620 --> 00:58:59.220 align:middle line:84% understood the two different worlds 00:58:59.220 --> 00:59:01.800 align:middle line:84% and they believed that both were valid. 00:59:01.800 --> 00:59:06.270 align:middle line:84% And that whatever was down in one, some of them 00:59:06.270 --> 00:59:10.710 align:middle line:84% had mirror images of what was up in the other. 00:59:10.710 --> 00:59:12.720 align:middle line:84% But there were other things, and you had 00:59:12.720 --> 00:59:15.300 align:middle line:90% to learn how to live in both. 00:59:15.300 --> 00:59:19.130 align:middle line:84% And there was always one individual 00:59:19.130 --> 00:59:23.612 align:middle line:90% that understood both of them. 00:59:23.612 --> 00:59:26.337 align:middle line:90% You know what they called them? 00:59:26.337 --> 00:59:27.170 align:middle line:90% Go ahead and say it. 00:59:27.170 --> 00:59:29.090 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: I've heard you say "shaman" before. 00:59:29.090 --> 00:59:30.770 align:middle line:90% TAFT BROOME: Yeah, the shaman. 00:59:30.770 --> 00:59:34.370 align:middle line:90% 00:59:34.370 --> 00:59:39.140 align:middle line:84% Shaman understands those two different worlds 00:59:39.140 --> 00:59:43.640 align:middle line:90% and can navigate them. 00:59:43.640 --> 00:59:55.317 align:middle line:84% And so hyperspace-- let's take this thing one more time, 00:59:55.317 --> 00:59:57.150 align:middle line:84% and then we'll try one or two of these codes 00:59:57.150 --> 00:59:59.800 align:middle line:90% before we get out of here. 00:59:59.800 --> 01:00:03.650 align:middle line:84% Hyperspace-- let's go back to knowledge in the first place. 01:00:03.650 --> 01:00:04.785 align:middle line:90% Go back to knowledge. 01:00:04.785 --> 01:00:07.700 align:middle line:90% 01:00:07.700 --> 01:00:15.220 align:middle line:84% We're talking now about there's a term of art in philosophy, 01:00:15.220 --> 01:00:16.555 align:middle line:90% and it's called-- 01:00:16.555 --> 01:00:20.090 align:middle line:84% I'm putting it in quotes because I want you to memorize this-- 01:00:20.090 --> 01:00:26.455 align:middle line:84% it's called the "mind-body problem." 01:00:26.455 --> 01:00:34.570 align:middle line:90% 01:00:34.570 --> 01:00:37.880 align:middle line:84% Now, the mind-body problem is this-- 01:00:37.880 --> 01:00:40.040 align:middle line:84% we know that there exists a mind. 01:00:40.040 --> 01:00:41.230 align:middle line:90% Does there exist the body? 01:00:41.230 --> 01:00:44.590 align:middle line:90% 01:00:44.590 --> 01:00:48.700 align:middle line:84% Or is the mind just telling you that things 01:00:48.700 --> 01:00:52.080 align:middle line:84% are going on, and somehow or another, 01:00:52.080 --> 01:00:55.350 align:middle line:84% you believe that there's a physical world out here that 01:00:55.350 --> 01:00:57.030 align:middle line:84% will be there even if you're dead? 01:00:57.030 --> 01:01:00.417 align:middle line:90% 01:01:00.417 --> 01:01:02.500 align:middle line:84% Believe it or not, there's a lot of serious debate 01:01:02.500 --> 01:01:05.680 align:middle line:84% about all that right now, whether or not 01:01:05.680 --> 01:01:07.480 align:middle line:90% there's only the mind. 01:01:07.480 --> 01:01:11.998 align:middle line:90% 01:01:11.998 --> 01:01:13.790 align:middle line:84% The thing that you've got to take seriously 01:01:13.790 --> 01:01:16.730 align:middle line:84% about it is some of the best thinkers, at least 01:01:16.730 --> 01:01:19.930 align:middle line:84% that the Western world has ever had, 01:01:19.930 --> 01:01:23.020 align:middle line:90% have tried to tackle this thing. 01:01:23.020 --> 01:01:26.100 align:middle line:90% Descartes tried to tackle it. 01:01:26.100 --> 01:01:27.405 align:middle line:90% He got a big chunk of it. 01:01:27.405 --> 01:01:29.155 align:middle line:90% You remember what it was? 01:01:29.155 --> 01:01:30.530 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: I think, therefore I am. 01:01:30.530 --> 01:01:32.780 align:middle line:90% TAFT BROOME: There it is. 01:01:32.780 --> 01:01:35.210 align:middle line:84% He said there is one world for sure, 01:01:35.210 --> 01:01:38.210 align:middle line:84% and that you do exist because it's in your mind. 01:01:38.210 --> 01:01:40.110 align:middle line:90% Your mind exists now. 01:01:40.110 --> 01:01:40.610 align:middle line:90% Why? 01:01:40.610 --> 01:01:43.250 align:middle line:90% Because you think. 01:01:43.250 --> 01:01:44.337 align:middle line:90% Do you think? 01:01:44.337 --> 01:01:44.920 align:middle line:90% Yeah, I think. 01:01:44.920 --> 01:01:48.260 align:middle line:90% 01:01:48.260 --> 01:01:52.550 align:middle line:84% Then they start playing games with you. 01:01:52.550 --> 01:01:53.990 align:middle line:90% Well, what about this desk? 01:01:53.990 --> 01:01:56.360 align:middle line:84% How do you know you're not just dreaming it? 01:01:56.360 --> 01:01:58.610 align:middle line:84% How do you know that this isn't, in fact, the desk? 01:01:58.610 --> 01:02:00.267 align:middle line:84% Because I can play a game with you, 01:02:00.267 --> 01:02:02.990 align:middle line:84% and I can make this thing out of water, 01:02:02.990 --> 01:02:05.990 align:middle line:84% and you just won't know the difference until you touch it. 01:02:05.990 --> 01:02:08.640 align:middle line:90% 01:02:08.640 --> 01:02:12.830 align:middle line:90% So I can manipulate your world. 01:02:12.830 --> 01:02:14.720 align:middle line:90% What do you know? 01:02:14.720 --> 01:02:21.650 align:middle line:84% Is this valid, this business of observation, 01:02:21.650 --> 01:02:23.570 align:middle line:90% or is it just you and your mind? 01:02:23.570 --> 01:02:26.280 align:middle line:90% 01:02:26.280 --> 01:02:30.380 align:middle line:84% There is some other thinking that the only valid statement 01:02:30.380 --> 01:02:37.640 align:middle line:84% you can make about knowledge is your mind, but not your mind, 01:02:37.640 --> 01:02:40.370 align:middle line:84% because what you say is yours is only part of a whole. 01:02:40.370 --> 01:02:54.240 align:middle line:90% 01:02:54.240 --> 01:02:58.120 align:middle line:90% All of this has to do with-- 01:02:58.120 --> 01:03:01.540 align:middle line:84% this finds its way into ethical thought one way or another. 01:03:01.540 --> 01:03:04.300 align:middle line:90% 01:03:04.300 --> 01:03:15.880 align:middle line:84% And like I said, if you read Kierkegaard, A-A-R-D, 01:03:15.880 --> 01:03:26.610 align:middle line:84% some of these other people dealing with that hyperspace. 01:03:26.610 --> 01:03:29.070 align:middle line:84% There any artists that deal with hyperspaces and all 01:03:29.070 --> 01:03:29.790 align:middle line:90% of this stuff. 01:03:29.790 --> 01:03:33.030 align:middle line:90% 01:03:33.030 --> 01:03:35.127 align:middle line:84% Can you imagine a fourth dimension? 01:03:35.127 --> 01:03:44.173 align:middle line:90% 01:03:44.173 --> 01:03:45.840 align:middle line:84% I thought I couldn't imagine one until I 01:03:45.840 --> 01:03:48.540 align:middle line:84% met-- until I had this discussion 01:03:48.540 --> 01:03:51.420 align:middle line:90% with a cousin of mine. 01:03:51.420 --> 01:03:56.130 align:middle line:84% Well, this cousin of mine has the same mentality as a shaman. 01:03:56.130 --> 01:03:59.230 align:middle line:90% 01:03:59.230 --> 01:04:03.770 align:middle line:84% He was diagnosed as schizophrenic, long time, 01:04:03.770 --> 01:04:07.810 align:middle line:90% 20, 30 years ago, 40 years ago. 01:04:07.810 --> 01:04:10.320 align:middle line:90% 01:04:10.320 --> 01:04:16.980 align:middle line:84% He had all of the makings of a shaman. 01:04:16.980 --> 01:04:21.890 align:middle line:84% He had a terrible experience as a child, 01:04:21.890 --> 01:04:26.890 align:middle line:90% and he never had a job. 01:04:26.890 --> 01:04:28.140 align:middle line:90% Lives at home with his mother. 01:04:28.140 --> 01:04:34.060 align:middle line:90% 01:04:34.060 --> 01:04:36.100 align:middle line:90% I was sitting there. 01:04:36.100 --> 01:04:39.123 align:middle line:84% His mother asked me to go talk to him one day. 01:04:39.123 --> 01:04:40.790 align:middle line:84% I went, and sat down, and talked to him. 01:04:40.790 --> 01:04:44.618 align:middle line:84% I said, we don't have to talk if you don't want to. 01:04:44.618 --> 01:04:45.410 align:middle line:90% He said, I want to. 01:04:45.410 --> 01:04:49.970 align:middle line:84% I said, well, everybody says you've got a problem. 01:04:49.970 --> 01:04:52.620 align:middle line:90% What's your problem? 01:04:52.620 --> 01:05:00.150 align:middle line:84% He said, sometimes he goes to sleep 01:05:00.150 --> 01:05:03.610 align:middle line:84% and he doesn't wake up for a month. 01:05:03.610 --> 01:05:05.402 align:middle line:84% And he's not laying in the bed for a month. 01:05:05.402 --> 01:05:07.027 align:middle line:84% He's walking around, talking it, but he 01:05:07.027 --> 01:05:08.290 align:middle line:90% said he's in the dream state. 01:05:08.290 --> 01:05:13.260 align:middle line:90% 01:05:13.260 --> 01:05:14.820 align:middle line:90% Then he comes out of it. 01:05:14.820 --> 01:05:16.700 align:middle line:84% He only knows that he was in the dream state 01:05:16.700 --> 01:05:18.690 align:middle line:90% when he comes out of it. 01:05:18.690 --> 01:05:20.450 align:middle line:90% It's like the yellow. 01:05:20.450 --> 01:05:22.883 align:middle line:90% He only knows there's red-- 01:05:22.883 --> 01:05:26.270 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: [INAUDIBLE]. 01:05:26.270 --> 01:05:29.510 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: People tell him he has 01:05:29.510 --> 01:05:31.115 align:middle line:90% a distorted concept of time. 01:05:31.115 --> 01:05:34.640 align:middle line:90% 01:05:34.640 --> 01:05:41.090 align:middle line:84% But there are some talents that he has. 01:05:41.090 --> 01:05:43.790 align:middle line:84% And one of those talents is the talent that-- 01:05:43.790 --> 01:05:50.300 align:middle line:90% 01:05:50.300 --> 01:05:53.120 align:middle line:84% I got the what was his name problem again. 01:05:53.120 --> 01:05:56.900 align:middle line:90% 01:05:56.900 --> 01:06:08.080 align:middle line:84% The book and the movie is called "The Picture of Dorian Gray." 01:06:08.080 --> 01:06:09.487 align:middle line:90% What's the author's name? 01:06:09.487 --> 01:06:10.362 align:middle line:90% STUDENT: Oscar Wilde. 01:06:10.362 --> 01:06:13.550 align:middle line:90% 01:06:13.550 --> 01:06:16.700 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: Oscar Wilde, yes, yeah, Oscar Wilde. 01:06:16.700 --> 01:06:21.980 align:middle line:90% 01:06:21.980 --> 01:06:26.770 align:middle line:84% There's a movie that I've gotten also, that's written in French. 01:06:26.770 --> 01:06:28.473 align:middle line:90% I haven't looked at it. 01:06:28.473 --> 01:06:29.890 align:middle line:84% I looked at it once on television, 01:06:29.890 --> 01:06:31.832 align:middle line:90% and I went and ordered it. 01:06:31.832 --> 01:06:35.490 align:middle line:90% It's got subtitles. 01:06:35.490 --> 01:06:40.740 align:middle line:84% And there's this young artist who falls 01:06:40.740 --> 01:06:44.330 align:middle line:90% in love with this young girl. 01:06:44.330 --> 01:06:50.580 align:middle line:84% And he tries to paint her and he can't get it right. 01:06:50.580 --> 01:06:54.502 align:middle line:84% He says he just can't bring out her inner beauty. 01:06:54.502 --> 01:06:55.960 align:middle line:84% Every time he paints her, she looks 01:06:55.960 --> 01:07:01.720 align:middle line:84% like "Picture of Dorian Gray--" it looks like something else. 01:07:01.720 --> 01:07:07.080 align:middle line:84% So he says he knows of this old man that 01:07:07.080 --> 01:07:11.310 align:middle line:84% lives up in the hills who's a famous artist. 01:07:11.310 --> 01:07:13.950 align:middle line:84% And he's an artist who's just got it. 01:07:13.950 --> 01:07:16.290 align:middle line:84% Everybody says there's artists, and then there's 01:07:16.290 --> 01:07:17.710 align:middle line:90% some people just got it. 01:07:17.710 --> 01:07:20.160 align:middle line:84% So he says, he's a friend of mine. 01:07:20.160 --> 01:07:22.710 align:middle line:84% I'm going to take you up to his house 01:07:22.710 --> 01:07:26.300 align:middle line:84% and I'm going to ask him to paint you. 01:07:26.300 --> 01:07:30.200 align:middle line:84% So he goes up to this man's house, small villa. 01:07:30.200 --> 01:07:32.210 align:middle line:90% Man's there with his wife. 01:07:32.210 --> 01:07:34.610 align:middle line:84% And the old man is very reluctant 01:07:34.610 --> 01:07:38.640 align:middle line:84% to take on this job of painting this girl. 01:07:38.640 --> 01:07:41.400 align:middle line:84% And there's a real nice line in there 01:07:41.400 --> 01:07:47.210 align:middle line:84% where the old man says, well, if when I start painting her, 01:07:47.210 --> 01:07:51.680 align:middle line:84% I don't know what the paint on my brush 01:07:51.680 --> 01:07:54.650 align:middle line:84% is going to do when it hits the canvas. 01:07:54.650 --> 01:07:56.090 align:middle line:90% You may not like what you see. 01:07:56.090 --> 01:07:58.860 align:middle line:90% 01:07:58.860 --> 01:07:59.770 align:middle line:90% And it goes on. 01:07:59.770 --> 01:08:04.230 align:middle line:84% And at the end, the last scene, he's completed the painting. 01:08:04.230 --> 01:08:07.320 align:middle line:84% He puts the cover over the painting. 01:08:07.320 --> 01:08:10.800 align:middle line:84% He takes a sledgehammer, and he breaks 01:08:10.800 --> 01:08:13.347 align:middle line:90% a hole in the brick wall. 01:08:13.347 --> 01:08:15.930 align:middle line:84% He takes the painting-- we never see the painting-- he puts it 01:08:15.930 --> 01:08:18.240 align:middle line:84% in the hole, and he got some water, 01:08:18.240 --> 01:08:20.189 align:middle line:90% and he covers the hole back up. 01:08:20.189 --> 01:08:25.939 align:middle line:84% In other words, he was able to capture her "true self," 01:08:25.939 --> 01:08:28.640 align:middle line:90% and she looked like a beast. 01:08:28.640 --> 01:08:31.580 align:middle line:84% And he just could not give that picture to that young boy 01:08:31.580 --> 01:08:33.649 align:middle line:84% because it would tear his heart out. 01:08:33.649 --> 01:08:35.149 align:middle line:84% That's the whole point of the thing. 01:08:35.149 --> 01:08:37.670 align:middle line:84% The whole point of the thing is that some people, 01:08:37.670 --> 01:08:42.450 align:middle line:84% like my cousin, can see that inner you. 01:08:42.450 --> 01:08:44.450 align:middle line:84% And I don't like the [INAUDIBLE] because I don't 01:08:44.450 --> 01:08:47.420 align:middle line:90% want him to see [INAUDIBLE]. 01:08:47.420 --> 01:08:50.640 align:middle line:84% But we got along, so I guess it's not so bad. 01:08:50.640 --> 01:08:55.729 align:middle line:84% But he doesn't have the skill to put brush 01:08:55.729 --> 01:08:59.540 align:middle line:90% to paint and paint to canvas. 01:08:59.540 --> 01:09:03.229 align:middle line:84% And I tried to tell him, he developed poetic skills. 01:09:03.229 --> 01:09:05.560 align:middle line:90% And all poetic skills-- 01:09:05.560 --> 01:09:06.560 align:middle line:90% you don't have to rhyme. 01:09:06.560 --> 01:09:09.109 align:middle line:90% 01:09:09.109 --> 01:09:12.560 align:middle line:84% But if he can see those things in people, then he is special. 01:09:12.560 --> 01:09:16.109 align:middle line:90% He's got a special talent. 01:09:16.109 --> 01:09:18.120 align:middle line:84% And a lot of artists are like that-- 01:09:18.120 --> 01:09:21.040 align:middle line:90% 01:09:21.040 --> 01:09:21.880 align:middle line:90% Jackson Pollock. 01:09:21.880 --> 01:09:26.550 align:middle line:90% 01:09:26.550 --> 01:09:28.890 align:middle line:84% STUDENT: Does he see the world differently? 01:09:28.890 --> 01:09:31.050 align:middle line:84% TAFT BROOME: I would not go to an ice cream parlor 01:09:31.050 --> 01:09:32.279 align:middle line:90% with Jackson Pollock. 01:09:32.279 --> 01:09:35.490 align:middle line:90% 01:09:35.490 --> 01:09:42.600 align:middle line:84% But in other words, what I think is healthy for us to say 01:09:42.600 --> 01:09:45.420 align:middle line:84% is that so far as our senses are concerned, some of these people 01:09:45.420 --> 01:09:47.055 align:middle line:90% are in hyperspace. 01:09:47.055 --> 01:09:48.430 align:middle line:84% They're perceiving things that we 01:09:48.430 --> 01:09:52.569 align:middle line:84% could perceive if we could purge our unconsciousnesses 01:09:52.569 --> 01:09:55.360 align:middle line:84% of their demons, and reconcile all that's 01:09:55.360 --> 01:09:59.020 align:middle line:84% down there with our conscious, and our reason, and our morals. 01:09:59.020 --> 01:10:02.110 align:middle line:84% And that's what's supposed to happen when you become wise, 01:10:02.110 --> 01:10:05.230 align:middle line:84% that you're supposed to be able to purge 01:10:05.230 --> 01:10:07.720 align:middle line:84% your unconscious of all of his demons. 01:10:07.720 --> 01:10:09.610 align:middle line:90% Carl Jung said that. 01:10:09.610 --> 01:10:12.250 align:middle line:84% And he said it happens only in the old, 01:10:12.250 --> 01:10:15.790 align:middle line:84% because in order for the rest of us, the non-shaman, 01:10:15.790 --> 01:10:20.290 align:middle line:84% for the rest of us to do it and remain healthy, 01:10:20.290 --> 01:10:23.200 align:middle line:90% we have to see death. 01:10:23.200 --> 01:10:26.290 align:middle line:84% And when we see the Grim Reaper not far away, 01:10:26.290 --> 01:10:30.190 align:middle line:84% then these demons just don't mean that much. 01:10:30.190 --> 01:10:35.475 align:middle line:84% And if we can find a moral way to accept them-- 01:10:35.475 --> 01:10:36.850 align:middle line:84% you know what I mean by moral way 01:10:36.850 --> 01:10:38.433 align:middle line:84% to accept the stuff that's down there? 01:10:38.433 --> 01:10:41.475 align:middle line:90% 01:10:41.475 --> 01:10:42.850 align:middle line:84% Well, one that's unforgettable is 01:10:42.850 --> 01:10:46.780 align:middle line:84% Freud when he talked about how a boy can 01:10:46.780 --> 01:10:48.460 align:middle line:84% have a sexual attraction to his mother. 01:10:48.460 --> 01:10:51.052 align:middle line:90% 01:10:51.052 --> 01:10:52.760 align:middle line:84% Well, that's kept down in the unconscious 01:10:52.760 --> 01:10:56.840 align:middle line:84% because that's morally unacceptable. 01:10:56.840 --> 01:10:58.940 align:middle line:90% So there's a demon down there. 01:10:58.940 --> 01:11:01.462 align:middle line:84% But if you're getting old, and the Grim Reaper 01:11:01.462 --> 01:11:02.920 align:middle line:84% is right over there, you don't know 01:11:02.920 --> 01:11:06.668 align:middle line:84% when you're going, that becomes no longer significant. 01:11:06.668 --> 01:11:08.960 align:middle line:84% You could bring that to consciousness and deal with it. 01:11:08.960 --> 01:11:12.280 align:middle line:84% So a wise person is purged, is unconscious of all 01:11:12.280 --> 01:11:15.910 align:middle line:84% these demons, and takes on some of these skills of the shaman, 01:11:15.910 --> 01:11:20.500 align:middle line:84% and can see into certain kinds of hyperspace. 01:11:20.500 --> 01:11:32.610 align:middle line:90% 01:11:32.610 --> 01:11:35.110 align:middle line:84% In this class-- I wouldn't say this in an engineering class, 01:11:35.110 --> 01:11:36.943 align:middle line:84% but in this class, I'm no longer in the mood 01:11:36.943 --> 01:11:38.361 align:middle line:90% to talk about codes of ethics. 01:11:38.361 --> 01:11:40.950 align:middle line:90% 01:11:40.950 --> 01:11:43.860 align:middle line:84% So I have to make that an assignment. 01:11:43.860 --> 01:11:45.030 align:middle line:90% We have a surprise. 01:11:45.030 --> 01:11:46.350 align:middle line:90% Did you read your email? 01:11:46.350 --> 01:11:48.120 align:middle line:84% We have a visitor coming on Tuesday. 01:11:48.120 --> 01:11:52.060 align:middle line:90% 01:11:52.060 --> 01:11:57.070 align:middle line:84% What is definite is that apparently, he had 01:11:57.070 --> 01:11:59.350 align:middle line:90% asked about a class like this. 01:11:59.350 --> 01:12:04.990 align:middle line:84% This is a visitor from the Netherlands, chairman 01:12:04.990 --> 01:12:09.580 align:middle line:84% of a department, of an Engineering Department, 01:12:09.580 --> 01:12:15.490 align:middle line:84% apparently part of this whole reconstruction of education 01:12:15.490 --> 01:12:17.440 align:middle line:90% in Europe. 01:12:17.440 --> 01:12:22.960 align:middle line:84% And engineering ethics is getting on everybody's agenda 01:12:22.960 --> 01:12:24.750 align:middle line:90% over there.