WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.922 align:middle line:90% [MUSIC PLAYING] 00:00:02.922 --> 00:00:15.590 align:middle line:90% 00:00:15.590 --> 00:00:18.320 align:middle line:84% LARRY SUSSKIND: The idea is to take 00:00:18.320 --> 00:00:22.580 align:middle line:84% some hypothetical situations that you've either 00:00:22.580 --> 00:00:25.860 align:middle line:84% seen in the movies, read about, or been in, 00:00:25.860 --> 00:00:29.150 align:middle line:84% depending on your experience in the public sector. 00:00:29.150 --> 00:00:35.180 align:middle line:84% I ask you at tables to think of your best advice to the people 00:00:35.180 --> 00:00:38.630 align:middle line:84% in this situation in each hypothetical. 00:00:38.630 --> 00:00:43.530 align:middle line:84% Effective leadership in the public sector, we are asserting, 00:00:43.530 --> 00:00:49.310 align:middle line:84% requires different strategies, behaviors, and qualifications 00:00:49.310 --> 00:00:53.280 align:middle line:84% than effective leadership in the private sector. 00:00:53.280 --> 00:00:57.620 align:middle line:84% The key difference is being able to facilitate 00:00:57.620 --> 00:01:01.790 align:middle line:84% consensus-building, decisions made by all, 00:01:01.790 --> 00:01:03.920 align:middle line:90% not just by the leader. 00:01:03.920 --> 00:01:06.310 align:middle line:84% They know how to provide direction 00:01:06.310 --> 00:01:09.970 align:middle line:84% without taking control, empowering others 00:01:09.970 --> 00:01:14.080 align:middle line:84% to make decisions and helping to resolve conflict 00:01:14.080 --> 00:01:16.700 align:middle line:84% among stakeholders and interest groups. 00:01:16.700 --> 00:01:22.100 align:middle line:84% And we talked about doing those things as a form of service. 00:01:22.100 --> 00:01:26.680 align:middle line:84% We alluded to but didn't get into much detail 00:01:26.680 --> 00:01:31.400 align:middle line:84% about facilitation responsibilities, 00:01:31.400 --> 00:01:37.540 align:middle line:84% both at the table, where you're trying to work with a group, 00:01:37.540 --> 00:01:42.340 align:middle line:84% and away from the table on behalf of the group. 00:01:42.340 --> 00:01:45.160 align:middle line:84% Before the group comes together, there 00:01:45.160 --> 00:01:48.500 align:middle line:84% are things that the facilitative leader can do, 00:01:48.500 --> 00:01:52.090 align:middle line:84% must do, to make the chances of succeeding when they are 00:01:52.090 --> 00:01:55.420 align:middle line:90% together at the table increase. 00:01:55.420 --> 00:01:58.490 align:middle line:84% At the table and away from the table-- 00:01:58.490 --> 00:02:03.990 align:middle line:84% we'll be using that phraseology the next several sessions. 00:02:03.990 --> 00:02:10.009 align:middle line:84% And we talked about facilitative leaders who both encourage 00:02:10.009 --> 00:02:14.900 align:middle line:84% advocacy on the part of the people they're working with 00:02:14.900 --> 00:02:20.070 align:middle line:84% and inquiry on the part of participants. 00:02:20.070 --> 00:02:23.430 align:middle line:90% And that's not easy to do. 00:02:23.430 --> 00:02:32.000 align:middle line:84% Some people find that their advocacy impedes their capacity 00:02:32.000 --> 00:02:33.240 align:middle line:90% to inquire. 00:02:33.240 --> 00:02:37.530 align:middle line:84% Enabling discussion of undiscussable issues-- 00:02:37.530 --> 00:02:41.120 align:middle line:84% you want to provide leadership in the public arena 00:02:41.120 --> 00:02:44.630 align:middle line:84% and you're assisting a group, there 00:02:44.630 --> 00:02:47.780 align:middle line:84% are things that they really need to talk about 00:02:47.780 --> 00:02:52.170 align:middle line:84% if they're going to reach any kind of informed agreement. 00:02:52.170 --> 00:02:57.120 align:middle line:84% When a facilitative leader seeks to bring a group 00:02:57.120 --> 00:03:01.150 align:middle line:84% into a conversation about things which, for some of the people, 00:03:01.150 --> 00:03:04.200 align:middle line:84% very uncomfortable, how do they do it? 00:03:04.200 --> 00:03:08.320 align:middle line:84% It's part of the facilitative service that they provide. 00:03:08.320 --> 00:03:13.090 align:middle line:84% They have to know how to make the undiscussable discussable. 00:03:13.090 --> 00:03:19.650 align:middle line:84% Any hope of working through and resolving their disagreements 00:03:19.650 --> 00:03:24.420 align:middle line:84% hinges on moving all of the participants 00:03:24.420 --> 00:03:30.400 align:middle line:84% in a public dialogue, from positions to interests-- 00:03:30.400 --> 00:03:33.990 align:middle line:84% not a guarantee that that's going to get you to agreement. 00:03:33.990 --> 00:03:40.440 align:middle line:84% But if all people are doing is repeating their demands, 00:03:40.440 --> 00:03:42.280 align:middle line:84% you're not going to get anywhere. 00:03:42.280 --> 00:03:46.830 align:middle line:84% A facilitative leader seeks unanimity but settles 00:03:46.830 --> 00:03:48.940 align:middle line:90% for overwhelming agreement. 00:03:48.940 --> 00:03:50.110 align:middle line:90% You don't vote. 00:03:50.110 --> 00:03:52.930 align:middle line:84% You're not interested in what the majority wants. 00:03:52.930 --> 00:03:56.330 align:middle line:84% And the reason-- if you say unanimity 00:03:56.330 --> 00:04:00.510 align:middle line:84% is the measure of the decision, you invite blackmail. 00:04:00.510 --> 00:04:04.370 align:middle line:84% You have some actors in the group whose primary objective 00:04:04.370 --> 00:04:08.480 align:middle line:84% is to sabotage the group, and they're happy with that. 00:04:08.480 --> 00:04:11.270 align:middle line:84% In many quarters of the world, people 00:04:11.270 --> 00:04:15.140 align:middle line:90% think of this as the UN problem. 00:04:15.140 --> 00:04:16.640 align:middle line:84% You're saying, we can't do anything 00:04:16.640 --> 00:04:18.269 align:middle line:90% unless everybody agrees. 00:04:18.269 --> 00:04:21.390 align:middle line:84% And some people say, oh, good, we're still on that. 00:04:21.390 --> 00:04:22.110 align:middle line:90% That's great. 00:04:22.110 --> 00:04:24.970 align:middle line:84% That'll mean nothing bad will happen that I don't like. 00:04:24.970 --> 00:04:28.250 align:middle line:90% [MUSIC PLAYING] 00:04:28.250 --> 00:04:31.050 align:middle line:90% So here's the first scenario. 00:04:31.050 --> 00:04:34.580 align:middle line:84% The mayor has appointed a blue ribbon committee 00:04:34.580 --> 00:04:39.680 align:middle line:84% to advise her on a new process of public budgeting, one 00:04:39.680 --> 00:04:43.310 align:middle line:84% that will ensure greater public engagement. 00:04:43.310 --> 00:04:47.930 align:middle line:84% The mayor named a leading corporate figure 00:04:47.930 --> 00:04:53.190 align:middle line:84% in the community, the CEO of the largest employer in the city, 00:04:53.190 --> 00:04:58.270 align:middle line:84% to chair or lead this advisory committee. 00:04:58.270 --> 00:05:01.240 align:middle line:84% There's an immediate backlash in the press. 00:05:01.240 --> 00:05:03.810 align:middle line:84% The community is convinced there was 00:05:03.810 --> 00:05:06.600 align:middle line:84% no way this person should have been named 00:05:06.600 --> 00:05:09.700 align:middle line:90% to be the leader of this group. 00:05:09.700 --> 00:05:17.250 align:middle line:84% Question to you-- what's your advice to the CEO regarding, A, 00:05:17.250 --> 00:05:21.150 align:middle line:84% how to introduce himself to the rest of the committee 00:05:21.150 --> 00:05:22.300 align:middle line:90% and the public? 00:05:22.300 --> 00:05:24.720 align:middle line:84% Secondly, how do you think the CEO 00:05:24.720 --> 00:05:29.290 align:middle line:84% should prepare for the first meeting of this committee? 00:05:29.290 --> 00:05:33.630 align:middle line:84% And third, how can the CEO establish credibility 00:05:33.630 --> 00:05:36.090 align:middle line:84% with the other members of the committee, let 00:05:36.090 --> 00:05:38.230 align:middle line:90% alone the community at large? 00:05:38.230 --> 00:05:44.950 align:middle line:84% So we're looking for your table's best advice to this CEO. 00:05:44.950 --> 00:05:51.950 align:middle line:84% How could this person be an effective leader? 00:05:51.950 --> 00:05:55.730 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Is it inappropriate to suggest that he resign as chair? 00:05:55.730 --> 00:05:57.272 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: That's what I was thinking. 00:05:57.272 --> 00:05:59.563 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: And not necessarily from the whole committee. 00:05:59.563 --> 00:06:00.600 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Just as chair. 00:06:00.600 --> 00:06:00.770 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah. 00:06:00.770 --> 00:06:03.020 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: But then are they still a leader after that? 00:06:03.020 --> 00:06:06.197 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I feel like that could be contentious. 00:06:06.197 --> 00:06:08.780 align:middle line:84% It feels like a little bit of a slap in the face to the mayor, 00:06:08.780 --> 00:06:09.830 align:middle line:90% then. 00:06:09.830 --> 00:06:12.410 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: And it is a budgetary committee. 00:06:12.410 --> 00:06:15.440 align:middle line:84% I do think there's a lot that the public sector can 00:06:15.440 --> 00:06:18.460 align:middle line:84% learn in some ways from the private sector. 00:06:18.460 --> 00:06:20.400 align:middle line:84% What is his commitment to the community? 00:06:20.400 --> 00:06:23.323 align:middle line:84% How has his business given back to the community? 00:06:23.323 --> 00:06:24.740 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Maybe taking a back seat 00:06:24.740 --> 00:06:28.880 align:middle line:84% on the next couple of meetings, kind of just saying, I'm here, 00:06:28.880 --> 00:06:32.240 align:middle line:84% everyone lay your ideas out on the table, maybe not 00:06:32.240 --> 00:06:35.870 align:middle line:84% dominating meetings as much as he could, or they could. 00:06:35.870 --> 00:06:37.910 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: But eventually he's the chair. 00:06:37.910 --> 00:06:38.720 align:middle line:90% I agree. 00:06:38.720 --> 00:06:42.270 align:middle line:84% He cannot dominate, but he will be asked to intervene at some 00:06:42.270 --> 00:06:42.770 align:middle line:90% point. 00:06:42.770 --> 00:06:45.050 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: If his role is a facilitator, 00:06:45.050 --> 00:06:48.300 align:middle line:84% at the end of the meeting, giving that unbiased summary 00:06:48.300 --> 00:06:49.150 align:middle line:90% of what's happening. 00:06:49.150 --> 00:06:52.530 align:middle line:84% It's not skewing anything or only pulling out 00:06:52.530 --> 00:06:54.990 align:middle line:84% the opinions he agrees with, but really giving 00:06:54.990 --> 00:06:57.360 align:middle line:84% a summary of everything that was covered. 00:06:57.360 --> 00:06:59.010 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: At this table, we threw out 00:06:59.010 --> 00:07:03.570 align:middle line:84% a couple of different options, mostly centered 00:07:03.570 --> 00:07:06.930 align:middle line:84% on the question of how does this person establish credibility 00:07:06.930 --> 00:07:07.800 align:middle line:90% right off the bat. 00:07:07.800 --> 00:07:09.820 align:middle line:84% In the first meeting, what can be done? 00:07:09.820 --> 00:07:11.620 align:middle line:84% And then Will here had a great idea, 00:07:11.620 --> 00:07:16.260 align:middle line:84% which was, what if the person sets up meetings beforehand 00:07:16.260 --> 00:07:18.810 align:middle line:84% with a representative sample from this committee 00:07:18.810 --> 00:07:20.460 align:middle line:84% so that when everyone does show up 00:07:20.460 --> 00:07:22.560 align:middle line:84% to this first initial meeting, those people 00:07:22.560 --> 00:07:27.180 align:middle line:84% can see that the CEO person has taken their advice on board 00:07:27.180 --> 00:07:31.120 align:middle line:84% and has listened to their concerns and their thoughts? 00:07:31.120 --> 00:07:34.200 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: We were discussing, and Bianchi spearheaded 00:07:34.200 --> 00:07:37.530 align:middle line:84% the idea of recognizing the backlash that 00:07:37.530 --> 00:07:42.370 align:middle line:84% is preceding this CEO, trying to not subvert the backlash, 00:07:42.370 --> 00:07:45.570 align:middle line:84% but address it head-on in a one-on-one setting that allows 00:07:45.570 --> 00:07:49.560 align:middle line:84% someone, in a structured format, to air their grievances, 00:07:49.560 --> 00:07:52.130 align:middle line:84% but also their interests, so that you aren't entering 00:07:52.130 --> 00:07:57.230 align:middle line:84% into the first committee meeting in a cacophonous room 00:07:57.230 --> 00:08:01.040 align:middle line:84% full of maybe misconceptions, stereotypes-- 00:08:01.040 --> 00:08:03.330 align:middle line:84% not only in the sense of establishing credibility, 00:08:03.330 --> 00:08:06.830 align:middle line:84% but also from a purely facilitative standpoint, 00:08:06.830 --> 00:08:08.580 align:middle line:84% I don't want to say control the narrative, 00:08:08.580 --> 00:08:11.450 align:middle line:84% but maybe set the record straight from where 00:08:11.450 --> 00:08:13.010 align:middle line:90% they intend to come in. 00:08:13.010 --> 00:08:14.510 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: We were talking along kind 00:08:14.510 --> 00:08:17.900 align:middle line:84% of similar lines about this role of transparency, specifically 00:08:17.900 --> 00:08:20.150 align:middle line:84% in the first meeting, for the CEO 00:08:20.150 --> 00:08:23.360 align:middle line:84% to go in and very clearly delineate what 00:08:23.360 --> 00:08:25.890 align:middle line:84% their expertise is within this setting 00:08:25.890 --> 00:08:29.340 align:middle line:84% and what their expertise is not, and so, in that sense, 00:08:29.340 --> 00:08:32.659 align:middle line:84% opening up space for the other members of the committee 00:08:32.659 --> 00:08:36.870 align:middle line:84% to take on leadership roles in sharing their own expertise, 00:08:36.870 --> 00:08:39.650 align:middle line:84% and also creates an opportunity as well for the CEO 00:08:39.650 --> 00:08:43.640 align:middle line:84% to express his own interest and true desire to learn 00:08:43.640 --> 00:08:46.080 align:middle line:84% from the other members of the council 00:08:46.080 --> 00:08:48.237 align:middle line:84% and from the community as a whole. 00:08:48.237 --> 00:08:50.320 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: One of the things we were talking about, 00:08:50.320 --> 00:08:53.862 align:middle line:84% not necessarily hearing from folks before the first meeting, 00:08:53.862 --> 00:08:55.320 align:middle line:84% but really using that first meeting 00:08:55.320 --> 00:08:58.860 align:middle line:84% to establish guidelines, checks and balances systems, 00:08:58.860 --> 00:09:01.740 align:middle line:84% and the process that's going to come about to really 00:09:01.740 --> 00:09:04.530 align:middle line:84% focus around trust-building and coalition-building, 00:09:04.530 --> 00:09:06.850 align:middle line:84% during that first meeting or first several meetings, 00:09:06.850 --> 00:09:10.170 align:middle line:84% really taking an unbiased view of taking notes 00:09:10.170 --> 00:09:12.420 align:middle line:84% and listening to all of the different people who 00:09:12.420 --> 00:09:15.540 align:middle line:84% are in that room and then giving a very unbiased feedback 00:09:15.540 --> 00:09:17.168 align:middle line:90% or recap of that. 00:09:17.168 --> 00:09:18.960 align:middle line:84% And so then people will begin to understand 00:09:18.960 --> 00:09:21.450 align:middle line:84% that they can voice their opinions, voice their thoughts, 00:09:21.450 --> 00:09:24.720 align:middle line:84% without anything being overlooked or brushed 00:09:24.720 --> 00:09:27.390 align:middle line:84% over because they're not in agreement with this leader-- 00:09:27.390 --> 00:09:29.280 align:middle line:84% identifying himself as a human being 00:09:29.280 --> 00:09:31.570 align:middle line:84% and not just this kind of powerful figure, 00:09:31.570 --> 00:09:34.290 align:middle line:84% and then being really clear about how 00:09:34.290 --> 00:09:38.880 align:middle line:84% he will be held accountable and how this process will work. 00:09:38.880 --> 00:09:41.350 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I'm curious to hear your thoughts on this, 00:09:41.350 --> 00:09:43.640 align:middle line:84% whether it would be appropriate, given 00:09:43.640 --> 00:09:48.260 align:middle line:84% how poorly the process started for this CEO 00:09:48.260 --> 00:09:53.000 align:middle line:84% in the first meeting, to offer voluntarily to resign as chair. 00:09:53.000 --> 00:09:54.300 align:middle line:90% I don't know. 00:09:54.300 --> 00:09:56.330 align:middle line:84% Say, anyone else in the room, we can come up 00:09:56.330 --> 00:09:58.622 align:middle line:84% with a new process for finding a new chair. 00:09:58.622 --> 00:10:00.080 align:middle line:84% But then we also talked about maybe 00:10:00.080 --> 00:10:02.580 align:middle line:84% that would be insulting to the mayor in this context. 00:10:02.580 --> 00:10:05.930 align:middle line:84% LARRY SUSSKIND: Resigning and leaving? 00:10:05.930 --> 00:10:08.870 align:middle line:84% That just confirms the fact that this was the wrong person 00:10:08.870 --> 00:10:13.020 align:middle line:84% to take on a leadership role in the public sector. 00:10:13.020 --> 00:10:20.060 align:middle line:84% But possibility is changed if they recognize 00:10:20.060 --> 00:10:22.820 align:middle line:84% the danger of proceeding in the way 00:10:22.820 --> 00:10:26.960 align:middle line:84% that people are immediately upset about, and they say, 00:10:26.960 --> 00:10:30.930 align:middle line:90% not an assistant, a co-chair. 00:10:30.930 --> 00:10:34.610 align:middle line:84% And they have to make sure, before they 00:10:34.610 --> 00:10:37.730 align:middle line:84% put the mayor in the position of announcing that, 00:10:37.730 --> 00:10:41.230 align:middle line:84% that the co-chairs will be able to work together. 00:10:41.230 --> 00:10:43.530 align:middle line:84% So then they're delivering to the mayor 00:10:43.530 --> 00:10:46.600 align:middle line:84% a proposal that's already been worked out. 00:10:46.600 --> 00:10:50.445 align:middle line:84% That's how I would respond to the resigning idea. 00:10:50.445 --> 00:10:53.070 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: It's interesting that it becomes about who the CEO is 00:10:53.070 --> 00:10:55.500 align:middle line:84% and why they were appointed rather than who the mayor is 00:10:55.500 --> 00:10:57.153 align:middle line:90% and why they appointed that way. 00:10:57.153 --> 00:10:59.070 align:middle line:84% And I think it's more reflective of, actually, 00:10:59.070 --> 00:11:00.690 align:middle line:84% what the mayor wants and how they 00:11:00.690 --> 00:11:03.700 align:middle line:84% wish to lead if they're going to appoint a CEO, theoretically, 00:11:03.700 --> 00:11:06.450 align:middle line:84% based on the fact that they think this person can operate 00:11:06.450 --> 00:11:09.203 align:middle line:84% the steering committee from a hierarchical point of view. 00:11:09.203 --> 00:11:11.370 align:middle line:84% How is it reflective of the mayor and what they want 00:11:11.370 --> 00:11:15.210 align:middle line:84% and how they wish to lead and what sort of leadership stance 00:11:15.210 --> 00:11:16.278 align:middle line:90% they prioritize? 00:11:16.278 --> 00:11:18.820 align:middle line:84% It actually makes me want to put the attention on that person 00:11:18.820 --> 00:11:20.730 align:middle line:84% versus the person who's appointed 00:11:20.730 --> 00:11:22.650 align:middle line:84% and how they need to then figure out 00:11:22.650 --> 00:11:26.310 align:middle line:84% what to do in order to deal with someone else's 00:11:26.310 --> 00:11:28.560 align:middle line:90% decision about them. 00:11:28.560 --> 00:11:30.330 align:middle line:84% LARRY SUSSKIND: If you ask, what's 00:11:30.330 --> 00:11:35.500 align:middle line:84% it take to be an effective leader in the public sector, 00:11:35.500 --> 00:11:40.070 align:middle line:84% I would argue more than whatever the skill is 00:11:40.070 --> 00:11:42.620 align:middle line:84% and the experience is that worked 00:11:42.620 --> 00:11:44.610 align:middle line:90% for you in the private sector. 00:11:44.610 --> 00:11:50.660 align:middle line:84% Some other additional ways of building trust 00:11:50.660 --> 00:11:53.400 align:middle line:84% as a way of establishing credibility, 00:11:53.400 --> 00:11:58.760 align:middle line:84% and not assuming you can count on your title and your history 00:11:58.760 --> 00:12:00.990 align:middle line:90% as a source of credibility. 00:12:00.990 --> 00:12:04.220 align:middle line:84% I had imagined we would be through several scenarios 00:12:04.220 --> 00:12:07.460 align:middle line:84% by now, and I don't want to keep you from dinner. 00:12:07.460 --> 00:12:09.320 align:middle line:84% While you're having dinner, I will 00:12:09.320 --> 00:12:13.460 align:middle line:84% ask you to talk about a second scenario. 00:12:13.460 --> 00:12:19.410 align:middle line:84% So I'm going to switch the context in this scenario. 00:12:19.410 --> 00:12:23.580 align:middle line:84% Scenario takes place in a different city, 00:12:23.580 --> 00:12:29.060 align:middle line:84% different metropolitan area, in one of the inner suburbs. 00:12:29.060 --> 00:12:34.020 align:middle line:84% The school committee-- being attacked from all sides. 00:12:34.020 --> 00:12:36.710 align:middle line:84% The teachers have voted no confidence 00:12:36.710 --> 00:12:38.470 align:middle line:90% in the superintendent. 00:12:38.470 --> 00:12:43.800 align:middle line:84% The teachers' union is demanding that the superintendent resign. 00:12:43.800 --> 00:12:48.060 align:middle line:84% The elected school committee is divided, 00:12:48.060 --> 00:12:52.470 align:middle line:84% some backing the superintendent and some supporting the teachers 00:12:52.470 --> 00:12:53.260 align:middle line:90% union. 00:12:53.260 --> 00:12:56.490 align:middle line:84% There are a whole raft of policies behind this that 00:12:56.490 --> 00:12:58.770 align:middle line:90% are dividing the community-- 00:12:58.770 --> 00:13:01.920 align:middle line:84% whether current efforts to ensure student safety 00:13:01.920 --> 00:13:04.530 align:middle line:84% in the buildings are adequate; who 00:13:04.530 --> 00:13:08.640 align:middle line:84% is to blame for the very low scores on statewide exams 00:13:08.640 --> 00:13:13.420 align:middle line:84% in this city as compared to other schools in nearby cities; 00:13:13.420 --> 00:13:17.670 align:middle line:84% the need for either more or less parental control 00:13:17.670 --> 00:13:20.980 align:middle line:84% over the content of the K-through-six curriculum; 00:13:20.980 --> 00:13:22.890 align:middle line:84% whether or not more investments should 00:13:22.890 --> 00:13:25.260 align:middle line:84% be made in advanced courses for the most 00:13:25.260 --> 00:13:29.460 align:middle line:84% gifted students; the desirability of mainstreaming 00:13:29.460 --> 00:13:33.490 align:middle line:84% versus or rather than separating special needs students. 00:13:33.490 --> 00:13:38.660 align:middle line:84% All these issues, this division, sharp division 00:13:38.660 --> 00:13:42.300 align:middle line:84% between teachers and the superintendent, 00:13:42.300 --> 00:13:48.660 align:middle line:84% between and amongst teachers, amongst family members-- 00:13:48.660 --> 00:13:52.100 align:middle line:84% what's your best advice to this superintendent 00:13:52.100 --> 00:13:55.670 align:middle line:84% under this circumstance, given all 00:13:55.670 --> 00:14:00.810 align:middle line:84% of this, all of this hostility, all of this difficulty? 00:14:00.810 --> 00:14:04.490 align:middle line:84% How would you help this person get things back 00:14:04.490 --> 00:14:10.940 align:middle line:84% on a useful track as the leader in the schools and education 00:14:10.940 --> 00:14:13.200 align:middle line:90% area in this community? 00:14:13.200 --> 00:14:15.920 align:middle line:84% So the idea is you have table discussion, 00:14:15.920 --> 00:14:17.990 align:middle line:84% and then we'll see where you come out 00:14:17.990 --> 00:14:19.790 align:middle line:84% and see if we get any differences. 00:14:19.790 --> 00:14:22.220 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: In my previous job, we talked a lot 00:14:22.220 --> 00:14:25.220 align:middle line:84% about making sure that we come in with a clear goal 00:14:25.220 --> 00:14:27.987 align:middle line:84% and what is actionable from this feedback, 00:14:27.987 --> 00:14:29.820 align:middle line:84% not just going in generally to get feedback, 00:14:29.820 --> 00:14:33.320 align:middle line:84% but coming in with concrete ways that the feedback can actually 00:14:33.320 --> 00:14:33.990 align:middle line:90% be used-- 00:14:33.990 --> 00:14:36.280 align:middle line:84% setting expectations like, this is what we can change, 00:14:36.280 --> 00:14:38.790 align:middle line:84% this is what we can't, here's how the conversation could 00:14:38.790 --> 00:14:39.365 align:middle line:90% impact that. 00:14:39.365 --> 00:14:40.740 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Probably better to just 00:14:40.740 --> 00:14:44.970 align:middle line:84% be upfront with what's in our realm of talent right now 00:14:44.970 --> 00:14:46.660 align:middle line:90% and even short-term monitoring. 00:14:46.660 --> 00:14:48.095 align:middle line:90% What could we change this year? 00:14:48.095 --> 00:14:49.860 align:middle line:84% What would we need to work on that 00:14:49.860 --> 00:14:51.310 align:middle line:90% will probably take 10 years? 00:14:51.310 --> 00:14:54.270 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: You have workers who are not believing in you. 00:14:54.270 --> 00:14:57.540 align:middle line:84% Their trust is completely lost in you. 00:14:57.540 --> 00:15:01.660 align:middle line:84% It depends on them for whatever plan you have to be successful. 00:15:01.660 --> 00:15:04.410 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: They're not feeling heard or they're not having 00:15:04.410 --> 00:15:08.220 align:middle line:84% vested trust in their, quote unquote, "leader" 00:15:08.220 --> 00:15:13.980 align:middle line:84% then creating mechanisms for distributing that leadership 00:15:13.980 --> 00:15:16.230 align:middle line:90% amongst the teachers. 00:15:16.230 --> 00:15:19.540 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I would first see what the problem [INAUDIBLE]. 00:15:19.540 --> 00:15:20.760 align:middle line:90% I would talk to people. 00:15:20.760 --> 00:15:23.940 align:middle line:84% After that, I'm going to be like, OK, now 00:15:23.940 --> 00:15:27.120 align:middle line:84% let me get a team of experts on the issues 00:15:27.120 --> 00:15:28.830 align:middle line:90% that were highlighted. 00:15:28.830 --> 00:15:32.420 align:middle line:84% And I would try to solve the issue [INAUDIBLE]. 00:15:32.420 --> 00:15:35.640 align:middle line:84% --and give that confidence to whoever cares about it. 00:15:35.640 --> 00:15:39.938 align:middle line:84% I'm going to use, say, the next six months to remedy this, 00:15:39.938 --> 00:15:41.480 align:middle line:84% and you will see this kind of change. 00:15:41.480 --> 00:15:44.450 align:middle line:84% And make these kind of short-term goals for people 00:15:44.450 --> 00:15:46.550 align:middle line:84% to gain confidence in them again. 00:15:46.550 --> 00:15:48.383 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think the makeup of those boards 00:15:48.383 --> 00:15:50.550 align:middle line:84% doesn't have to be like the people who brought it up 00:15:50.550 --> 00:15:51.240 align:middle line:90% at the time. 00:15:51.240 --> 00:15:55.010 align:middle line:84% It just should be whoever is most qualified to do that. 00:15:55.010 --> 00:15:59.840 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Yeah, what are the pivotal moments or places where 00:15:59.840 --> 00:16:01.730 align:middle line:90% change could be made? 00:16:01.730 --> 00:16:03.590 align:middle line:84% Are they the right person to do it? 00:16:03.590 --> 00:16:06.440 align:middle line:84% So what does [INAUDIBLE]-- it doesn't even have to necessarily 00:16:06.440 --> 00:16:07.610 align:middle line:90% be immediate. 00:16:07.610 --> 00:16:09.450 align:middle line:84% What does a succession plan look like? 00:16:09.450 --> 00:16:11.840 align:middle line:84% How can I have gotten someone else 00:16:11.840 --> 00:16:14.000 align:middle line:84% to be able to take this on or point out 00:16:14.000 --> 00:16:16.470 align:middle line:84% who I think should be able to succeed me 00:16:16.470 --> 00:16:18.218 align:middle line:90% if it's clear that, like-- 00:16:18.218 --> 00:16:19.760 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I suspect that it might not 00:16:19.760 --> 00:16:22.460 align:middle line:84% happen through a presentation or you telling people that, 00:16:22.460 --> 00:16:24.627 align:middle line:84% but that you actually need to get people in the room 00:16:24.627 --> 00:16:26.480 align:middle line:84% and then start guiding the conversation 00:16:26.480 --> 00:16:28.110 align:middle line:90% towards this common realization. 00:16:28.110 --> 00:16:29.818 align:middle line:84% We're all here for the same thing, right? 00:16:29.818 --> 00:16:31.260 align:middle line:84% We all want the same thing, right? 00:16:31.260 --> 00:16:32.730 align:middle line:84% The one thing you could actually do 00:16:32.730 --> 00:16:34.920 align:middle line:84% is to get representatives from this room 00:16:34.920 --> 00:16:37.960 align:middle line:84% and from these different subcommittees in one room, 00:16:37.960 --> 00:16:39.960 align:middle line:84% and then you start to get them to think together 00:16:39.960 --> 00:16:43.792 align:middle line:84% about solutions, like, oh, if we mainstream these kids, what's 00:16:43.792 --> 00:16:46.500 align:middle line:84% going to happen with these other resources that are going to come 00:16:46.500 --> 00:16:47.710 align:middle line:90% from mainstreaming them? 00:16:47.710 --> 00:16:49.530 align:middle line:90% Can we do something with that? 00:16:49.530 --> 00:16:52.385 align:middle line:84% Can you start to get them to collaborate with each other? 00:16:52.385 --> 00:16:53.760 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Interesting idea, maybe 00:16:53.760 --> 00:16:58.090 align:middle line:84% having representatives of each interest, part of the committee. 00:16:58.090 --> 00:17:03.390 align:middle line:84% It's not siloed by interest, but it's a representative committee 00:17:03.390 --> 00:17:04.371 align:middle line:90% of all the interests-- 00:17:04.371 --> 00:17:05.829 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Yeah, that's a good idea. 00:17:05.829 --> 00:17:08.280 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: --so that they're forced to talk with each other 00:17:08.280 --> 00:17:12.640 align:middle line:84% and that there isn't this arm wrestling between the silos. 00:17:12.640 --> 00:17:14.369 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: They would probably choose 00:17:14.369 --> 00:17:18.670 align:middle line:84% the one who has the largest voice, who's kind of a fighter. 00:17:18.670 --> 00:17:21.839 align:middle line:84% But these kind of people may not be 00:17:21.839 --> 00:17:26.732 align:middle line:84% good to put in a negotiation process. 00:17:26.732 --> 00:17:28.940 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think part of being a facilitative leader 00:17:28.940 --> 00:17:31.790 align:middle line:84% is also preparing each of these folks 00:17:31.790 --> 00:17:34.430 align:middle line:84% to be able to best advocate for themselves. 00:17:34.430 --> 00:17:37.058 align:middle line:84% So then you go back to that one-on-one relationship again. 00:17:37.058 --> 00:17:38.600 align:middle line:84% So before you have that meeting where 00:17:38.600 --> 00:17:40.100 align:middle line:84% you started to do the collaboration, 00:17:40.100 --> 00:17:42.290 align:middle line:84% you need to do preparations with them. 00:17:42.290 --> 00:17:45.200 align:middle line:84% But it's also kind of difficult because then, actually, 00:17:45.200 --> 00:17:48.750 align:middle line:84% you're not biased towards any specific concern. 00:17:48.750 --> 00:17:52.040 align:middle line:84% So let's say safety of the students in schools, 00:17:52.040 --> 00:17:55.490 align:middle line:84% K-to-6 curriculum, the mainstreaming of the special 00:17:55.490 --> 00:17:56.540 align:middle line:90% needs students-- 00:17:56.540 --> 00:17:58.980 align:middle line:84% you have to show you're not biased towards any single one. 00:17:58.980 --> 00:17:59.965 align:middle line:90% That's the hard part. 00:17:59.965 --> 00:18:00.590 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Yeah. 00:18:00.590 --> 00:18:01.965 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think that would also 00:18:01.965 --> 00:18:03.798 align:middle line:84% subvert the problem that you're bringing up, 00:18:03.798 --> 00:18:06.215 align:middle line:84% that you don't want to just bring the guy with the loudest 00:18:06.215 --> 00:18:07.050 align:middle line:90% voice to the table. 00:18:07.050 --> 00:18:08.900 align:middle line:84% You want to give others a chance. 00:18:08.900 --> 00:18:11.150 align:middle line:84% That's part of facilitating the process because you're 00:18:11.150 --> 00:18:13.730 align:middle line:84% helping everyone improve the mindset of being 00:18:13.730 --> 00:18:16.010 align:middle line:90% ready to collaborate. 00:18:16.010 --> 00:18:18.410 align:middle line:84% Essentially, a decision needs to be 00:18:18.410 --> 00:18:25.100 align:middle line:84% made that's in favor of one party instead of the other. 00:18:25.100 --> 00:18:27.750 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think that the part about preparing them and then 00:18:27.750 --> 00:18:31.230 align:middle line:84% letting them do the negotiation amongst themselves at the table 00:18:31.230 --> 00:18:33.990 align:middle line:84% kind of builds that trust that you're not 00:18:33.990 --> 00:18:36.930 align:middle line:84% biased because people are putting 00:18:36.930 --> 00:18:38.260 align:middle line:90% their own skin in the game. 00:18:38.260 --> 00:18:40.170 align:middle line:90% You're not advocating-- 00:18:40.170 --> 00:18:43.950 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: They bring order to the space 00:18:43.950 --> 00:18:48.120 align:middle line:84% and enforce rules and bring things to a vote. 00:18:48.120 --> 00:18:49.410 align:middle line:90% Yes. 00:18:49.410 --> 00:18:51.510 align:middle line:84% LARRY SUSSKIND: This hypothetical 00:18:51.510 --> 00:18:56.580 align:middle line:84% is what the vast number of people who see themselves 00:18:56.580 --> 00:19:01.570 align:middle line:84% as leaders in the public sector are dealing with day to day. 00:19:01.570 --> 00:19:04.590 align:middle line:84% These are the circumstances that people 00:19:04.590 --> 00:19:06.370 align:middle line:90% are being prepared to work in. 00:19:06.370 --> 00:19:11.790 align:middle line:84% And when conflict has overwhelmed whatever 00:19:11.790 --> 00:19:17.100 align:middle line:84% forward movement somebody who thinks they're the leader has, 00:19:17.100 --> 00:19:21.300 align:middle line:84% they have to have some idea, some strategy. 00:19:21.300 --> 00:19:27.200 align:middle line:84% What do you do when all this conflict has wrapped itself 00:19:27.200 --> 00:19:31.580 align:middle line:84% around whatever the functional responsibilities are? 00:19:31.580 --> 00:19:37.077 align:middle line:84% Were you trying to think of ways of resolving the conflict, 00:19:37.077 --> 00:19:39.410 align:middle line:84% telling the superintendent, you can do this, this, this, 00:19:39.410 --> 00:19:43.050 align:middle line:84% and this to resolve the conflict? 00:19:43.050 --> 00:19:45.920 align:middle line:84% Were you mostly thinking about talking 00:19:45.920 --> 00:19:49.610 align:middle line:84% to the superintendent about how to proceed 00:19:49.610 --> 00:19:54.450 align:middle line:84% with the work that needs to be done in spite of the conflict? 00:19:54.450 --> 00:19:57.080 align:middle line:84% Do you think that a leader in this position 00:19:57.080 --> 00:20:02.730 align:middle line:84% can do something to wipe the conflict away, to resolve it? 00:20:02.730 --> 00:20:06.500 align:middle line:84% If not, what are they supposed to do about the work that's 00:20:06.500 --> 00:20:08.960 align:middle line:84% supposed to get done that's completely 00:20:08.960 --> 00:20:13.800 align:middle line:84% frozen because everybody's at everybody else's throat? 00:20:13.800 --> 00:20:16.800 align:middle line:84% Are they supposed to mediate this, 00:20:16.800 --> 00:20:20.070 align:middle line:84% all these different disputes that they're the focus of? 00:20:20.070 --> 00:20:23.380 align:middle line:90% I know they can resign. 00:20:23.380 --> 00:20:24.600 align:middle line:90% You don't have to-- 00:20:24.600 --> 00:20:25.420 align:middle line:90% I know. 00:20:25.420 --> 00:20:27.480 align:middle line:90% [LAUGHTER] 00:20:27.480 --> 00:20:30.120 align:middle line:84% The number of years people are in positions 00:20:30.120 --> 00:20:33.280 align:middle line:84% is getting shorter and shorter in the public sector 00:20:33.280 --> 00:20:35.590 align:middle line:84% in the United States and in other countries. 00:20:35.590 --> 00:20:39.130 align:middle line:90% Conflict is omnipresent. 00:20:39.130 --> 00:20:41.760 align:middle line:84% People either don't know of a way 00:20:41.760 --> 00:20:45.330 align:middle line:84% to proceed in a leadership role and trying 00:20:45.330 --> 00:20:50.260 align:middle line:84% to resolve the conflict, so they walk away, 00:20:50.260 --> 00:20:54.180 align:middle line:84% or they're thrown out because they 00:20:54.180 --> 00:20:57.370 align:middle line:84% don't appear to be able to solve the conflict. 00:20:57.370 --> 00:20:59.590 align:middle line:84% Whether they leave voluntarily or not, 00:20:59.590 --> 00:21:07.830 align:middle line:84% their term is short because the conflict is overwhelming. 00:21:07.830 --> 00:21:11.910 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: So our group held that there is accountability 00:21:11.910 --> 00:21:14.910 align:middle line:84% to improving the system and accountability 00:21:14.910 --> 00:21:20.750 align:middle line:84% by the superintendent to either acknowledge their role in it, 00:21:20.750 --> 00:21:26.000 align:middle line:84% also to either facilitate or be adjacent to an ad 00:21:26.000 --> 00:21:30.180 align:middle line:84% hoc committee that can facilitate a discovery process 00:21:30.180 --> 00:21:32.990 align:middle line:84% or audit of what exactly has been going 00:21:32.990 --> 00:21:37.250 align:middle line:84% wrong within the school system, even making considerations 00:21:37.250 --> 00:21:42.050 align:middle line:84% for conducting investigations and interviewing 00:21:42.050 --> 00:21:45.830 align:middle line:84% with other parts of the school system and key stakeholders 00:21:45.830 --> 00:21:50.000 align:middle line:84% to help facilitate a transition process 00:21:50.000 --> 00:21:55.580 align:middle line:84% and inheritance of a better system where we understand 00:21:55.580 --> 00:21:59.540 align:middle line:84% the challenges that are going on and ways that we can adjust 00:21:59.540 --> 00:22:01.070 align:middle line:90% moving forward. 00:22:01.070 --> 00:22:04.730 align:middle line:84% The superintendent still would probably 00:22:04.730 --> 00:22:09.230 align:middle line:84% be recommended to leave at that point. 00:22:09.230 --> 00:22:12.440 align:middle line:84% However, I do think that their institutional knowledge 00:22:12.440 --> 00:22:16.250 align:middle line:84% of the issue is relevant to identifying 00:22:16.250 --> 00:22:18.510 align:middle line:90% the key issues of the system. 00:22:18.510 --> 00:22:21.120 align:middle line:84% LARRY SUSSKIND: Do you believe that if they could just 00:22:21.120 --> 00:22:24.840 align:middle line:84% solve one of these conflicts and have 00:22:24.840 --> 00:22:28.540 align:middle line:84% it clear that it was their doing that resolved it, 00:22:28.540 --> 00:22:32.910 align:middle line:84% and they'd be accepted in that role of trying to resolve them 00:22:32.910 --> 00:22:36.983 align:middle line:84% because they're resolved one thing first? 00:22:36.983 --> 00:22:38.400 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: Yeah, I mean, I think it 00:22:38.400 --> 00:22:42.600 align:middle line:84% seems to be a complex issue where there's 00:22:42.600 --> 00:22:48.840 align:middle line:84% pivot points, where there's the most upside if it is resolved. 00:22:48.840 --> 00:22:53.670 align:middle line:84% So potentially, solving one and finding out the positive impact 00:22:53.670 --> 00:22:56.830 align:middle line:84% from that might give a vote of confidence. 00:22:56.830 --> 00:22:59.310 align:middle line:84% LARRY SUSSKIND: So you would entertain that proposition, 00:22:59.310 --> 00:23:04.020 align:middle line:84% that if they can do something and actually take 00:23:04.020 --> 00:23:07.380 align:middle line:84% one of these clear conflicts in the community 00:23:07.380 --> 00:23:12.450 align:middle line:84% and get the people who are primarily the key actors 00:23:12.450 --> 00:23:16.230 align:middle line:84% and secret them away somewhere and help them work that 00:23:16.230 --> 00:23:19.860 align:middle line:84% out and then come out together with them and announce, look, 00:23:19.860 --> 00:23:23.430 align:middle line:84% we've solved this, and if we can solve this, 00:23:23.430 --> 00:23:27.480 align:middle line:84% we can solve all of our conflicts, trust me-- 00:23:27.480 --> 00:23:28.550 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: Not exactly. 00:23:28.550 --> 00:23:33.020 align:middle line:84% One, I think it requires a more comprehensive 00:23:33.020 --> 00:23:34.230 align:middle line:90% strategic approach. 00:23:34.230 --> 00:23:38.570 align:middle line:84% But solving a big issue first might be a first pillar of 00:23:38.570 --> 00:23:40.340 align:middle line:90% or milestone for that. 00:23:40.340 --> 00:23:41.900 align:middle line:84% LARRY SUSSKIND: What about setting 00:23:41.900 --> 00:23:44.240 align:middle line:84% a lot of different people in motion 00:23:44.240 --> 00:23:48.380 align:middle line:84% with responsibility for trying to resolve or mediate 00:23:48.380 --> 00:23:50.130 align:middle line:90% different disputes-- 00:23:50.130 --> 00:23:55.760 align:middle line:84% in other words, not being the one to resolve these disputes, 00:23:55.760 --> 00:23:58.650 align:middle line:90% but saying, I have this person. 00:23:58.650 --> 00:24:01.650 align:middle line:84% I don't know if they're loyal to me or not. 00:24:01.650 --> 00:24:06.920 align:middle line:84% But maybe they would accept responsibility over the next six 00:24:06.920 --> 00:24:10.040 align:middle line:84% weeks for this particular conflict 00:24:10.040 --> 00:24:11.940 align:middle line:84% between this group and this group 00:24:11.940 --> 00:24:14.850 align:middle line:84% because they're close to both sides. 00:24:14.850 --> 00:24:18.550 align:middle line:84% And I'm asking them to see what progress they can make, 00:24:18.550 --> 00:24:23.050 align:middle line:84% and I'm giving them authority to act on that. 00:24:23.050 --> 00:24:26.850 align:middle line:84% And then you've set a lot of different people, carefully 00:24:26.850 --> 00:24:28.860 align:middle line:84% chosen, on the grounds that there's 00:24:28.860 --> 00:24:33.550 align:middle line:84% no chance the superintendent can solve all these problems. 00:24:33.550 --> 00:24:35.680 align:middle line:84% They're the source of most of them, 00:24:35.680 --> 00:24:39.960 align:middle line:84% or at least the symbolic source of most of them. 00:24:39.960 --> 00:24:44.580 align:middle line:84% What I'm asking is, as you think about your personal theory 00:24:44.580 --> 00:24:48.270 align:middle line:84% of practice-- and you have one, whether you confront it 00:24:48.270 --> 00:24:52.000 align:middle line:84% regularly and build it or not, you have one-- 00:24:52.000 --> 00:24:55.500 align:middle line:84% what do you assume about the management of conflict 00:24:55.500 --> 00:24:57.760 align:middle line:90% and the role of leadership? 00:24:57.760 --> 00:25:01.710 align:middle line:84% There are sides, the unionists and the people 00:25:01.710 --> 00:25:04.930 align:middle line:90% who are managing the union. 00:25:04.930 --> 00:25:07.800 align:middle line:84% I found in real life, as a person assigned 00:25:07.800 --> 00:25:10.920 align:middle line:84% as a mediator from outside, they don't even 00:25:10.920 --> 00:25:13.210 align:middle line:84% know what they're fighting about. 00:25:13.210 --> 00:25:15.750 align:middle line:90% They're really, really angry. 00:25:15.750 --> 00:25:18.120 align:middle line:90% They'll tell me a topic. 00:25:18.120 --> 00:25:21.930 align:middle line:84% I'll sit with everybody privately, confidentially. 00:25:21.930 --> 00:25:23.610 align:middle line:90% I'm just an outsider. 00:25:23.610 --> 00:25:27.230 align:middle line:84% I'm just asked to see if there's any way to help. 00:25:27.230 --> 00:25:30.980 align:middle line:84% "There's no way we'll accept the librarians not having 00:25:30.980 --> 00:25:35.450 align:middle line:84% the final control of which books go in the library for K 00:25:35.450 --> 00:25:36.480 align:middle line:90% through six. 00:25:36.480 --> 00:25:40.940 align:middle line:90% That's it, no chance, no way." 00:25:40.940 --> 00:25:42.990 align:middle line:90% OK, why? 00:25:42.990 --> 00:25:45.200 align:middle line:90% "What do you mean, why?" 00:25:45.200 --> 00:25:47.900 align:middle line:84% Well, couldn't there be an occasion 00:25:47.900 --> 00:25:50.910 align:middle line:84% in which the librarians mostly do this, 00:25:50.910 --> 00:25:54.380 align:middle line:84% but if somebody has a concern, that the librarians 00:25:54.380 --> 00:25:57.540 align:middle line:84% and some other people have a conversation about it, 00:25:57.540 --> 00:26:02.060 align:middle line:84% and you can ask for a chance to discuss this 00:26:02.060 --> 00:26:05.300 align:middle line:84% without saying the only ones who make the decision are 00:26:05.300 --> 00:26:07.070 align:middle line:90% the librarians? 00:26:07.070 --> 00:26:09.740 align:middle line:90% "We never did it that way." 00:26:09.740 --> 00:26:11.970 align:middle line:84% I know that, but I'm trying to see 00:26:11.970 --> 00:26:17.310 align:middle line:84% whether it's possible to invent a way forward 00:26:17.310 --> 00:26:22.080 align:middle line:84% that meets your underlying interests differently 00:26:22.080 --> 00:26:24.370 align:middle line:84% from what's been done in the past. 00:26:24.370 --> 00:26:28.410 align:middle line:84% "Well, I don't know if my people will accept it if I were to be 00:26:28.410 --> 00:26:32.070 align:middle line:84% in a conversation where that was being discussed." 00:26:32.070 --> 00:26:34.420 align:middle line:90% Could we try it and see? 00:26:34.420 --> 00:26:39.460 align:middle line:84% Getting people to discuss what they think is undiscussable-- 00:26:39.460 --> 00:26:43.680 align:middle line:90% how can you facilitate that? 00:26:43.680 --> 00:26:46.800 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: We shifted to a different direction 00:26:46.800 --> 00:26:51.180 align:middle line:84% and thought about hiring experts or a technical advisory group 00:26:51.180 --> 00:26:55.440 align:middle line:84% of sorts to work alongside the superintendent on the issues 00:26:55.440 --> 00:26:59.310 align:middle line:84% that were identified because it's not 00:26:59.310 --> 00:27:01.030 align:middle line:84% that the superintendent can solve it all. 00:27:01.030 --> 00:27:03.300 align:middle line:84% I don't think the advisory group or the experts 00:27:03.300 --> 00:27:04.720 align:middle line:90% can solve it all as well. 00:27:04.720 --> 00:27:06.690 align:middle line:84% What we discussed was to have people 00:27:06.690 --> 00:27:10.190 align:middle line:84% who are more knowledgeable of those particular issues 00:27:10.190 --> 00:27:12.830 align:middle line:84% and could have a better understanding of how 00:27:12.830 --> 00:27:13.530 align:middle line:90% to solve them. 00:27:13.530 --> 00:27:15.410 align:middle line:84% And then we also talked about releasing 00:27:15.410 --> 00:27:20.840 align:middle line:84% a memo of sorts, which outlines the plan of how 00:27:20.840 --> 00:27:24.170 align:middle line:84% the superintendent and his team can tackle 00:27:24.170 --> 00:27:27.660 align:middle line:84% these issues because what you were saying about, oh, 00:27:27.660 --> 00:27:30.055 align:middle line:84% if the superintendent solves one issue, 00:27:30.055 --> 00:27:33.900 align:middle line:84% will that be enough for him to start working on others? 00:27:33.900 --> 00:27:37.310 align:middle line:84% And I think, in a lot of cases, that is true 00:27:37.310 --> 00:27:41.640 align:middle line:84% because to gain the trust back of these different stakeholders, 00:27:41.640 --> 00:27:43.430 align:middle line:84% even saying that, OK, I'm starting 00:27:43.430 --> 00:27:44.820 align:middle line:90% to solve this one issue-- 00:27:44.820 --> 00:27:49.250 align:middle line:84% I mean, not one in one issue, but starting small, I think, 00:27:49.250 --> 00:27:53.640 align:middle line:84% it's important to gain the trust back of these stakeholders. 00:27:53.640 --> 00:27:56.720 align:middle line:84% So I think even starting small definitely 00:27:56.720 --> 00:28:01.400 align:middle line:84% helps gain trust of communities and other union leaders 00:28:01.400 --> 00:28:02.220 align:middle line:90% and people. 00:28:02.220 --> 00:28:04.340 align:middle line:84% LARRY SUSSKIND: It's a high-risk strategy 00:28:04.340 --> 00:28:07.890 align:middle line:84% to assume that if I could just find the linchpin, 00:28:07.890 --> 00:28:11.250 align:middle line:84% solve this one quickly, then everything's 00:28:11.250 --> 00:28:13.300 align:middle line:90% going to fit together. 00:28:13.300 --> 00:28:18.130 align:middle line:84% My hunch is, in this particular kind of story, 00:28:18.130 --> 00:28:21.870 align:middle line:84% where the superintendent is supposedly 00:28:21.870 --> 00:28:25.290 align:middle line:84% the administrative leader, but also is 00:28:25.290 --> 00:28:29.220 align:middle line:84% the object of the conflict for many 00:28:29.220 --> 00:28:32.880 align:middle line:84% of the parties, that waiting for them 00:28:32.880 --> 00:28:37.230 align:middle line:84% to pick one of these disputes and resolve it 00:28:37.230 --> 00:28:41.280 align:middle line:84% through their interventions so they can wave a flag 00:28:41.280 --> 00:28:44.170 align:middle line:84% and say, you can all have confidence in me, look, 00:28:44.170 --> 00:28:45.430 align:middle line:90% I solved this-- 00:28:45.430 --> 00:28:53.520 align:middle line:84% probably a losing strategy, whereas, if the superintendent 00:28:53.520 --> 00:28:59.490 align:middle line:84% could have private conversations with a lot of the folks who 00:28:59.490 --> 00:29:02.340 align:middle line:84% are complaining about something that the superintendent is 00:29:02.340 --> 00:29:05.220 align:middle line:84% doing and say, well, would you be 00:29:05.220 --> 00:29:08.870 align:middle line:84% willing to take responsibility for the next period of time 00:29:08.870 --> 00:29:12.560 align:middle line:84% of getting this, this, this, and this together and coming up 00:29:12.560 --> 00:29:15.630 align:middle line:84% with your suggestion of what should be done together? 00:29:15.630 --> 00:29:19.970 align:middle line:84% I don't want to hear a summary of what you disagree about. 00:29:19.970 --> 00:29:23.700 align:middle line:84% I'm looking for you to produce positive proposals. 00:29:23.700 --> 00:29:27.090 align:middle line:84% And nobody's tried to convene these folks, 00:29:27.090 --> 00:29:30.240 align:middle line:84% and I think they would trust you to do that. 00:29:30.240 --> 00:29:32.340 align:middle line:84% They're not making final decisions. 00:29:32.340 --> 00:29:35.450 align:middle line:84% They're making suggestions together 00:29:35.450 --> 00:29:37.500 align:middle line:90% for ways of resolving issues. 00:29:37.500 --> 00:29:41.820 align:middle line:84% And if we could get a half-dozen different people, 00:29:41.820 --> 00:29:50.510 align:middle line:84% if the leader can facilitate the engagement of other participants 00:29:50.510 --> 00:29:55.350 align:middle line:84% and help build their role in leadership, 00:29:55.350 --> 00:29:59.760 align:middle line:84% I'm arguing that the leader's role is enhanced. 00:29:59.760 --> 00:30:01.610 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think, a lot of times, 00:30:01.610 --> 00:30:04.680 align:middle line:84% this strategy is used, the one you're describing. 00:30:04.680 --> 00:30:07.060 align:middle line:84% But my problem with this is that you're 00:30:07.060 --> 00:30:11.170 align:middle line:84% asking those people to do more labor who are already 00:30:11.170 --> 00:30:13.040 align:middle line:90% experiencing these problems. 00:30:13.040 --> 00:30:16.790 align:middle line:84% And in a lot of cases, when I worked with a community, 00:30:16.790 --> 00:30:19.382 align:middle line:84% especially, it's that they do not want to take responsibility, 00:30:19.382 --> 00:30:20.840 align:middle line:84% because they're already frustrated, 00:30:20.840 --> 00:30:21.800 align:middle line:90% all these stakeholders. 00:30:21.800 --> 00:30:24.080 align:middle line:84% And then me going in as a superintendent, 00:30:24.080 --> 00:30:27.280 align:middle line:84% for example, and saying, oh, maybe you 00:30:27.280 --> 00:30:31.210 align:middle line:84% can help me solve this-- and it's like, but that's your job. 00:30:31.210 --> 00:30:32.150 align:middle line:90% Do you understand? 00:30:32.150 --> 00:30:36.730 align:middle line:84% So I feel like it sometimes puts a lot of blame and a lot of work 00:30:36.730 --> 00:30:39.470 align:middle line:84% and a lot of labor on these different stakeholders. 00:30:39.470 --> 00:30:42.080 align:middle line:84% And my question is, how to address that, 00:30:42.080 --> 00:30:45.800 align:middle line:84% how to approach this in a way that it doesn't look like that. 00:30:45.800 --> 00:30:50.720 align:middle line:84% Instead, it looks like we are trying to co-create solutions. 00:30:50.720 --> 00:30:53.020 align:middle line:90% So how do you approach that? 00:30:53.020 --> 00:30:54.520 align:middle line:84% LARRY SUSSKIND: Next time, I'm going 00:30:54.520 --> 00:30:59.170 align:middle line:84% to give you a list of a dozen what I call microskills 00:30:59.170 --> 00:31:01.430 align:middle line:90% of facilitative leadership. 00:31:01.430 --> 00:31:07.730 align:middle line:84% One is, how do you convince someone to take responsibility 00:31:07.730 --> 00:31:11.420 align:middle line:84% for helping to solve the problem that they 00:31:11.420 --> 00:31:13.020 align:middle line:90% think you're the part of? 00:31:13.020 --> 00:31:14.940 align:middle line:84% You can either do that or you can't. 00:31:14.940 --> 00:31:18.600 align:middle line:84% It's not about how sweetly you talk. 00:31:18.600 --> 00:31:21.980 align:middle line:84% It's not about being smarter than the other. 00:31:21.980 --> 00:31:25.490 align:middle line:84% There's a set of principles for how 00:31:25.490 --> 00:31:30.900 align:middle line:84% you get someone who's opposed to you to agree, 00:31:30.900 --> 00:31:33.660 align:middle line:84% to help solve the problem with you. 00:31:33.660 --> 00:31:37.130 align:middle line:84% What does it take to develop your capacity 00:31:37.130 --> 00:31:44.060 align:middle line:84% to facilitate, to turn around a conflict situation, to set 00:31:44.060 --> 00:31:48.420 align:middle line:84% an agenda for a group that has no agenda, 00:31:48.420 --> 00:31:53.450 align:middle line:84% to set ground rules for how people in a raucous meeting 00:31:53.450 --> 00:31:55.260 align:middle line:90% are dealing with each other. 00:31:55.260 --> 00:31:59.360 align:middle line:84% The final session, I really want to ask 00:31:59.360 --> 00:32:04.620 align:middle line:84% you to assess your sense of yourself, your capacity, 00:32:04.620 --> 00:32:09.730 align:middle line:84% to become or to be a facilitative leader, or to say, 00:32:09.730 --> 00:32:10.930 align:middle line:90% I don't see it. 00:32:10.930 --> 00:32:12.700 align:middle line:90% That's not my role. 00:32:12.700 --> 00:32:15.070 align:middle line:84% I don't see myself in that capacity. 00:32:15.070 --> 00:32:18.990 align:middle line:84% I really want to get you to take the microskills, to take 00:32:18.990 --> 00:32:21.480 align:middle line:84% the things that we talked about last time and this time, 00:32:21.480 --> 00:32:24.450 align:middle line:84% and say, do I see myself functioning 00:32:24.450 --> 00:32:26.470 align:middle line:90% in this kind of situation? 00:32:26.470 --> 00:32:31.560 align:middle line:84% If you were in the role like the superintendent with lots 00:32:31.560 --> 00:32:34.050 align:middle line:84% of people mad at you, partly because 00:32:34.050 --> 00:32:36.880 align:middle line:84% of the symbolic positions you have, 00:32:36.880 --> 00:32:40.120 align:middle line:84% probably because of the things you've said and done, 00:32:40.120 --> 00:32:44.940 align:middle line:84% partly because they just believe different things from you, 00:32:44.940 --> 00:32:49.420 align:middle line:84% can you see yourself going to work or not? 00:32:49.420 --> 00:32:51.630 align:middle line:90% Can you deal with conflict? 00:32:51.630 --> 00:32:54.540 align:middle line:84% My sense is if you don't have a pathway 00:32:54.540 --> 00:32:57.990 align:middle line:84% in your mind for transforming those conflict 00:32:57.990 --> 00:33:05.040 align:middle line:84% situations into more workable forms of collaboration, 00:33:05.040 --> 00:33:09.100 align:middle line:84% then you're not going to be able to keep it up. 00:33:09.100 --> 00:33:10.290 align:middle line:90% It's too hard. 00:33:10.290 --> 00:33:13.570 align:middle line:90% You need to envision some path. 00:33:13.570 --> 00:33:17.820 align:middle line:84% You need to imagine that you have a half a dozen microskills 00:33:17.820 --> 00:33:22.300 align:middle line:84% that it takes to work effectively in that situation. 00:33:22.300 --> 00:33:24.540 align:middle line:90% So we will come to that. 00:33:24.540 --> 00:33:30.360 align:middle line:84% Before we stop, I want to come to the gender and race questions 00:33:30.360 --> 00:33:32.130 align:middle line:90% that people raised last time. 00:33:32.130 --> 00:33:34.540 align:middle line:84% In the case you were just looking at, 00:33:34.540 --> 00:33:40.720 align:middle line:84% were you imagining this superintendent male, female, 00:33:40.720 --> 00:33:42.820 align:middle line:90% one race, another race? 00:33:42.820 --> 00:33:47.410 align:middle line:84% Does it matter to your analysis of the situation? 00:33:47.410 --> 00:33:54.870 align:middle line:84% How should we see, how do we see gender and race intersecting 00:33:54.870 --> 00:33:58.410 align:middle line:84% with questions of leadership now that we're 00:33:58.410 --> 00:34:03.220 align:middle line:84% talking about facilitative leadership in the public arena? 00:34:03.220 --> 00:34:05.590 align:middle line:84% I mean, if you question yourself, 00:34:05.590 --> 00:34:09.239 align:middle line:84% do you imagine you were seeing things in a certain way 00:34:09.239 --> 00:34:12.630 align:middle line:84% because you were presuming the superintendent was 00:34:12.630 --> 00:34:16.300 align:middle line:84% male or female, and because it was female, 00:34:16.300 --> 00:34:20.489 align:middle line:84% you imagined there were certain options open to her? 00:34:20.489 --> 00:34:22.210 align:middle line:90% Male, no? 00:34:22.210 --> 00:34:24.540 align:middle line:84% We constantly say we should consider 00:34:24.540 --> 00:34:29.190 align:middle line:84% gender and race and a variety of other attributes 00:34:29.190 --> 00:34:31.840 align:middle line:90% as independent variables. 00:34:31.840 --> 00:34:34.350 align:middle line:84% Are they, in fact, relevant variables 00:34:34.350 --> 00:34:37.300 align:middle line:84% in any of the conversations that we've had? 00:34:37.300 --> 00:34:42.780 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I have personally witnessed women of color 00:34:42.780 --> 00:34:44.199 align:middle line:90% in positions of power. 00:34:44.199 --> 00:34:47.860 align:middle line:84% And I think if they were in this hypothetical situation, 00:34:47.860 --> 00:34:51.420 align:middle line:84% they would be forced to resign or there would be this almost 00:34:51.420 --> 00:34:52.810 align:middle line:90% witch hunt happening. 00:34:52.810 --> 00:34:55.750 align:middle line:84% And, I mean, I'm coming from a field of architecture. 00:34:55.750 --> 00:34:59.640 align:middle line:84% But I've seen it happen with leadership within that realm, 00:34:59.640 --> 00:35:03.000 align:middle line:84% faculty or deans of colleges in that same realm, 00:35:03.000 --> 00:35:04.860 align:middle line:90% and it happens very often. 00:35:04.860 --> 00:35:08.810 align:middle line:84% So, I mean, in my mind, I was just imagining 00:35:08.810 --> 00:35:10.740 align:middle line:90% a male in this situation. 00:35:10.740 --> 00:35:11.910 align:middle line:90% I didn't imagine a race. 00:35:11.910 --> 00:35:15.200 align:middle line:90% But I think that when it's-- 00:35:15.200 --> 00:35:18.560 align:middle line:84% specifically, I'll only speak to a person of color. 00:35:18.560 --> 00:35:22.460 align:middle line:84% I think the repercussions and the processes there 00:35:22.460 --> 00:35:25.250 align:middle line:90% are a lot different, oftentimes. 00:35:25.250 --> 00:35:27.230 align:middle line:84% LARRY SUSSKIND: Because of the expectations 00:35:27.230 --> 00:35:29.960 align:middle line:84% of the community around them or because 00:35:29.960 --> 00:35:31.860 align:middle line:84% of their own sense of themselves? 00:35:31.860 --> 00:35:36.770 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: I think it's because the expectations are higher 00:35:36.770 --> 00:35:38.700 align:middle line:90% from the community around them. 00:35:38.700 --> 00:35:41.720 align:middle line:84% And then, even if they're meeting 00:35:41.720 --> 00:35:46.880 align:middle line:84% the same kind of threshold as, potentially, a white male, 00:35:46.880 --> 00:35:48.680 align:middle line:84% the expectations are so much higher of them 00:35:48.680 --> 00:35:51.990 align:middle line:84% that it's almost impossible for them to succeed in that capacity 00:35:51.990 --> 00:35:57.060 align:middle line:90% because someone's only human. 00:35:57.060 --> 00:35:59.970 align:middle line:84% LARRY SUSSKIND: So can you think of a pathway 00:35:59.970 --> 00:36:05.310 align:middle line:84% or a set of steps that would make that diagnosis less 00:36:05.310 --> 00:36:06.880 align:middle line:90% likely to be the case? 00:36:06.880 --> 00:36:08.230 align:middle line:90% AUDIENCE: I have a question. 00:36:08.230 --> 00:36:10.350 align:middle line:84% Where is these scenarios located? 00:36:10.350 --> 00:36:11.160 align:middle line:90% In the US? 00:36:11.160 --> 00:36:12.280 align:middle line:90% And where exactly? 00:36:12.280 --> 00:36:14.400 align:middle line:84% Because, I mean, we keep referring 00:36:14.400 --> 00:36:16.810 align:middle line:84% about those cases in the previous session 00:36:16.810 --> 00:36:18.630 align:middle line:90% and in this session. 00:36:18.630 --> 00:36:19.770 align:middle line:90% Are they global? 00:36:19.770 --> 00:36:25.470 align:middle line:84% Because the mores, the values are completely different 00:36:25.470 --> 00:36:27.720 align:middle line:84% from country to country and, within a country, 00:36:27.720 --> 00:36:31.080 align:middle line:84% are completely different from region to region or from urban 00:36:31.080 --> 00:36:33.030 align:middle line:90% to rural. 00:36:33.030 --> 00:36:37.560 align:middle line:84% You mentioned in your case before in the first scenario, 00:36:37.560 --> 00:36:43.110 align:middle line:84% why you asked that question, why you choose a CEO of a company-- 00:36:43.110 --> 00:36:47.220 align:middle line:84% that, perhaps, here in the US, with the values 00:36:47.220 --> 00:36:49.810 align:middle line:84% in certain parts of this country, 00:36:49.810 --> 00:36:54.830 align:middle line:84% the values of competition or the value of trades 00:36:54.830 --> 00:36:58.880 align:middle line:84% from a meritocratic system or capitalist system, 00:36:58.880 --> 00:37:01.130 align:middle line:84% makes that that person is a person that 00:37:01.130 --> 00:37:04.280 align:middle line:84% eventually could be admired by the society and perhaps 00:37:04.280 --> 00:37:05.100 align:middle line:90% the mayor-- 00:37:05.100 --> 00:37:07.070 align:middle line:84% we don't know the hidden agenda of the mayor-- 00:37:07.070 --> 00:37:09.810 align:middle line:84% to the person to represent that committee. 00:37:09.810 --> 00:37:12.230 align:middle line:84% But in other parts of the world, people 00:37:12.230 --> 00:37:17.210 align:middle line:84% do not have that values of, whether it is a razor company 00:37:17.210 --> 00:37:19.550 align:middle line:84% or computer company or hiring people 00:37:19.550 --> 00:37:22.010 align:middle line:84% or lead people, because leadership 00:37:22.010 --> 00:37:23.540 align:middle line:84% is about completely different values 00:37:23.540 --> 00:37:26.437 align:middle line:84% than making money or having a big corporation. 00:37:26.437 --> 00:37:28.770 align:middle line:84% I'm not saying that those are the values here in the US. 00:37:28.770 --> 00:37:29.895 align:middle line:90% Please don't take me wrong. 00:37:29.895 --> 00:37:34.670 align:middle line:90% But I-- or take me wrong. 00:37:34.670 --> 00:37:35.490 align:middle line:90% [LAUGHTER] 00:37:35.490 --> 00:37:36.920 align:middle line:84% But the question-- I'm saying it's 00:37:36.920 --> 00:37:40.880 align:middle line:84% very important that we have a very specific context where 00:37:40.880 --> 00:37:43.770 align:middle line:84% this scenario happen in order to respond to those questions. 00:37:43.770 --> 00:37:46.550 align:middle line:84% And be aware as well that we have 00:37:46.550 --> 00:37:48.945 align:middle line:84% to understand the scenario before we 00:37:48.945 --> 00:37:51.070 align:middle line:84% take a decision because one decision in one country 00:37:51.070 --> 00:37:53.120 align:middle line:84% could be completely the opposite in another one. 00:37:53.120 --> 00:37:55.210 align:middle line:84% LARRY SUSSKIND: If you understand the scenario 00:37:55.210 --> 00:37:59.930 align:middle line:84% perfectly, are you empowered differently? 00:37:59.930 --> 00:38:03.830 align:middle line:84% I'm accepting the premise you would be more informed. 00:38:03.830 --> 00:38:08.350 align:middle line:84% In what ways are you empowered by being more informed? 00:38:08.350 --> 00:38:13.820 align:middle line:84% Does it make you more optimistic about the moves you're making 00:38:13.820 --> 00:38:18.010 align:middle line:84% and that likely increase your effectiveness? 00:38:18.010 --> 00:38:19.880 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: From a deontological perspective, 00:38:19.880 --> 00:38:23.050 align:middle line:84% I think that I will be more legitimate to provide advice. 00:38:23.050 --> 00:38:25.705 align:middle line:84% LARRY SUSSKIND: Your legitimacy because of the moves you make? 00:38:25.705 --> 00:38:27.580 align:middle line:84% AUDIENCE: [Inaudible] what I'm talking about. 00:38:27.580 --> 00:38:29.500 align:middle line:90% LARRY SUSSKIND: Yeah. 00:38:29.500 --> 00:38:35.470 align:middle line:84% I'm trying to convince myself that there's a way 00:38:35.470 --> 00:38:42.040 align:middle line:84% to talk about race and gender in the context of leadership that 00:38:42.040 --> 00:38:44.510 align:middle line:84% has nothing to do with personality 00:38:44.510 --> 00:38:47.680 align:middle line:84% and that has something to do with being 00:38:47.680 --> 00:38:53.660 align:middle line:84% able to use the same skills of facilitative leadership 00:38:53.660 --> 00:38:59.610 align:middle line:84% that another facilitative leader has in a situation 00:38:59.610 --> 00:39:03.480 align:middle line:84% because there's either a match or a mismatch-- 00:39:03.480 --> 00:39:04.610 align:middle line:90% I don't know which-- 00:39:04.610 --> 00:39:08.240 align:middle line:84% between the race and gender of the person who 00:39:08.240 --> 00:39:11.660 align:middle line:84% wants to act as a leader and the constituency 00:39:11.660 --> 00:39:14.880 align:middle line:84% or the context in which they're working. 00:39:14.880 --> 00:39:17.400 align:middle line:84% Either that or it doesn't matter. 00:39:17.400 --> 00:39:19.530 align:middle line:84% I'm too old to believe it doesn't matter. 00:39:19.530 --> 00:39:21.290 align:middle line:84% I've lived through too many things 00:39:21.290 --> 00:39:24.480 align:middle line:84% where race and gender have mattered 00:39:24.480 --> 00:39:28.350 align:middle line:84% to think that there could be a way that they don't matter. 00:39:28.350 --> 00:39:31.740 align:middle line:84% So now I'm trying to figure out, well, how do they matter? 00:39:31.740 --> 00:39:36.680 align:middle line:84% And how can instruction build on what it takes, 00:39:36.680 --> 00:39:38.970 align:middle line:90% given that they matter? 00:39:38.970 --> 00:39:42.170 align:middle line:90% But I don't see it yet clearly. 00:39:42.170 --> 00:39:47.160 align:middle line:84% What instruction, differently not differently, 00:39:47.160 --> 00:39:53.050 align:middle line:84% to females that want to take on a facilitative leadership role? 00:39:53.050 --> 00:39:55.930 align:middle line:84% Do they have to learn different things? 00:39:55.930 --> 00:39:59.650 align:middle line:84% Do they have to learn it with more confidence? 00:39:59.650 --> 00:40:04.270 align:middle line:84% Do they have to learn how they're seen? 00:40:04.270 --> 00:40:07.500 align:middle line:84% They learn the same thing, but what they've learned 00:40:07.500 --> 00:40:11.370 align:middle line:84% is seen by others, and so they can make adjustments 00:40:11.370 --> 00:40:14.550 align:middle line:84% before it's even necessary because 00:40:14.550 --> 00:40:16.565 align:middle line:90% of how others are viewing them. 00:40:16.565 --> 00:40:19.150 align:middle line:84% I'm not teaching anything different. 00:40:19.150 --> 00:40:24.030 align:middle line:84% I'm not assuming that anything different will play out in terms 00:40:24.030 --> 00:40:26.770 align:middle line:90% of the logic of leadership. 00:40:26.770 --> 00:40:31.680 align:middle line:84% But I believe that it makes a difference in terms 00:40:31.680 --> 00:40:36.630 align:middle line:84% of the perceptions you talked about, women of color 00:40:36.630 --> 00:40:40.020 align:middle line:84% in positions of responsibility who 00:40:40.020 --> 00:40:42.660 align:middle line:84% expect they're going to be judged 00:40:42.660 --> 00:40:47.750 align:middle line:84% more harshly than a white male counterpart 00:40:47.750 --> 00:40:50.280 align:middle line:84% would be in the exact same situation. 00:40:50.280 --> 00:40:56.210 align:middle line:84% And if I assume that's true, therefore, what can 00:40:56.210 --> 00:41:01.020 align:middle line:84% we do to help bolster the person? 00:41:01.020 --> 00:41:04.140 align:middle line:84% Maybe I can't do anything about bolstering the person. 00:41:04.140 --> 00:41:06.150 align:middle line:90% Maybe it's the context. 00:41:06.150 --> 00:41:11.120 align:middle line:84% And if I have no power to change the context, doing something 00:41:11.120 --> 00:41:16.130 align:middle line:84% different for, with, the person won't add up 00:41:16.130 --> 00:41:17.610 align:middle line:90% to a different outcome. 00:41:17.610 --> 00:41:20.190 align:middle line:84% I don't know which I believe it is. 00:41:20.190 --> 00:41:25.800 align:middle line:84% Think about the questions that came up about the scenarios. 00:41:25.800 --> 00:41:28.790 align:middle line:84% I will focus on microskills that I 00:41:28.790 --> 00:41:33.300 align:middle line:84% think an effective facilitative leader has to have. 00:41:33.300 --> 00:41:34.950 align:middle line:90% I will enumerate them. 00:41:34.950 --> 00:41:39.990 align:middle line:84% I will probably use a screen and talk about what those skills are 00:41:39.990 --> 00:41:42.200 align:middle line:84% and when I think they come into play 00:41:42.200 --> 00:41:49.300 align:middle line:84% and how you can learn them, perfect them, develop them. 00:41:49.300 --> 00:41:51.400 align:middle line:84% That's going to be the focus next time. 00:41:51.400 --> 00:41:55.050 align:middle line:84% I want to talk about those microskills of facilitating 00:41:55.050 --> 00:41:58.290 align:middle line:84% and empowering and turning a conflict 00:41:58.290 --> 00:42:02.280 align:middle line:84% situation into a joint problem-solving situation 00:42:02.280 --> 00:42:06.150 align:middle line:84% and shifting people from positions to interests, which 00:42:06.150 --> 00:42:10.710 align:middle line:84% I think is, as I said, essential as a step in the process 00:42:10.710 --> 00:42:14.800 align:middle line:84% of trying to be effective as a leader. 00:42:14.800 --> 00:42:16.140 align:middle line:90% I'll see you again next week. 00:42:16.140 --> 00:42:18.890 align:middle line:90% [MUSIC PLAYING] 00:42:18.890 --> 00:42:42.000 align:middle line:90%